Top 100 Countdown – VILLAINS – Part 3 – #50-26

lisa's out there hey this is chuck and stacy

from vo buzz weekly and you are listening to

geekcast radio network yeah they are awesome

you're listening to the geekcast radio network

Unleash the geek in you. Mr. Joker, you're leading

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if you please. My dear sir, as the poet says,

on land you may command, at sea it is me. Now

hear this, now hear this. This is your captain

speaking. My fine pinioned pirates were approaching

the tricky boy. Sharpen your cutlasses, there

may be skullduggery ahead. Hello and welcome

to another special episode of the Geekcast Radio

Network as we continue our journey through the

top 100 fictional villains of all time. If this

is your first time tuning in... we would suggest

that you hit the pause button, hit the stop button,

back up a little bit, rewind this a little bit,

and go back and listen to the past two episodes

where we counted down numbers 100 through 76,

and then numbers 75 through 51. Yes, we've already

revealed half of the countdown. So today we're

getting into the top half, the top 50, 50 through

26. But I'm not alone to do that. I'm your host,

Optimus Solo, but joining me today is Steve Megatron

Phillips. Hello. Hello. movie revolt dan hi dan

hello also returning our special top 100 panel

here dj valentine from simplistic reviews and

the immortal words of one of my favorite villains

you have a wife or girlfriend because i'm gonna

find her and i'm gonna hurt her and i'm gonna

kill you right in front of her and he again has

backup with him matthew stewart from simplistic

reviews how you doing matt Pretty good. You know

how evil you are, DJ? That was the exact quote

I was going to go with today. That is eerie.

I am scared of you. You're a devil, man. You

don't have any idea what the hell's going on,

do you? It's all a part of the plan. To quote

my favorite villain, I knew it. I don't know.

It sounds like somebody's going to say something.

I knew it. I knew it. I knew it, Batman. Some

pointed villainy that came up. That's a task

for the listeners. Listeners, identify who said

that once upon a time. Who said I knew it? And

one thing I want to get out of the way right

off the bat here, I didn't do a good job last

episode. I did want to give a little bit of time

to all the people that helped contribute and

make this list possible. So I'm just going to

do a real quick roll call of most of them here.

Outside of those that are staples of the Geek

Cast Radio Network, they all know who they are,

and you guys all know who they are. But the outsiders

that helped us this time, Pop Culture Case Study,

so please check out Dave's podcast. We have Following

Films. We also have The Mild Man. and we'll see

you next time. To kind of set the stage for today,

give you guys a little bit of statistics as far

as what's been happening so far. So far through

our bottom half, the first 50, film is reigning

supreme so far. 13 film characters, and 12 novel

characters. So it's neck and neck between film

and novel. Then we have seven TV characters that

we've revealed so far, seven cartoon, four play

characters, one poem. I'm going to say three

folklore, two video game, one comic book. And

then if we want to break it down into a couple

different categories, we've had four... quote

-unquote Disney villains. And once again, don't

get mad because some of these had sources in

different things. I'm just saying Disney because

that's what they're best known for, so we do

realize that some of them existed in things prior

to that. We have had three characters that originated

in horror films. We've had four female characters,

one robot, one doll, and six beast monster animal

characters. So I got all the data for you guys

this week. Also, so far, we have had 12 characters

that predated the 1900s in that 50 chunk and

10 that were from the 2000s. So 12 pre -1900,

10 post the year 2000, everything else in the

1900s. So biggest surprise so far, DJ, and what

are your thoughts as we finally get to the top

half of this countdown? Well, I got my spectacles

and my cup of Earl Grey and my bookmarks because

apparently this is the... Logan! It's the same

person. Jean -Luc Picard. Jean -Luc Picard, make

it so. I'm very surprised that we're apparently

this is the library cast radio network and we've

gotten so many... literary villains here um now

this is i think it's gonna be make or break if

we don't get some comic book horror right away

then this list is just gonna i have no other

predictions if we don't get at least three uh

comic book characters in this um I'm going to

be stunned. And then you can just pretty much

chalk it up to, I don't know, Charles Dickens

or some shit. Well, we have been getting quite

a few comments on the website on both the first

episode post and the second episode post. We

actually have one contributor slash commenter

that is not surprised at the lack of horror comic

book villains and said that they think that there

would be even less. I don't know how you get

less than three in one, but that's what they

said. And I think one thing. That's interesting

because it goes into the kind of the criteria

that people use. And I understand that there's

some interesting characters out there. And he

was he was saying that maybe he would like some

more soap opera sitcom and stuff of that nature.

But I don't know how much I'm going to buy any

type of argument that says Archie Bunker is more

of a villain than somebody that kills people.

And there's you know, he's a product of his time.

Like, it's not even. you know he's not even a

villain he's just a dick i just think it's too

easy for us to for people to discount horror

villains as all you do is you know you mindlessly

kill people let's let's take a look at the real

world here for example is someone like george

carlin or someone that rubs people the wrong

way and is politically incorrect more villainous

than jeffrey dahmer or i mean like what are we

talking about here like that's a serial killer

is about as villainous as it gets i don't care

if you have bundy or louis ck Which one are you

guys going with? I don't care if you have no

interesting motive for what you're doing. If

you're just killing multiple people, you are

villainous. So, I mean, I don't know. I guess

it gets to how we all define it. We did get a

couple things calling us out on something we

thought we might get. There is a fine line sometimes

between an anti -hero or just an antagonist and

a villain, so it's interesting some of the comments

that we've had there. A very interesting comment

that I didn't realize either, we've had zero

Bond villains, and that's a franchise that's

been around. for a long time so we've seen zero

of them it'd be interesting to see if that's

going to make an appearance and also you know

that first episode we had some major franchises

that were represented like lord of the rings

star wars nothing like that in the second episode

so that's another interesting thing dan usually

when we get to the top 50, you know, this episode

where we kind of get through the 50 through 26.

It's no longer about any type of fringe character.

It's less and less about any type of niche character

that has just a cult following, and it becomes

more of these people are for sure top 100 worthy.

It's just about where they fell. Do you feel

like that's something that's going to stay true

today? I would think so, just because if you're

looking at, you know, the percentage of lists

that... characters will need to be on and the

fact that you're dealing with such a vast amount

of people in a list like this people who are

eligible that if you're getting you know above

30 40 whatever percentage 50 percentage of you

know over 20 some less um you're probably going

to be worthy the top 100 in some in some capacities

you know we may get a couple that have like you

know the three or four that made it because like

five people put them in the top 10 and no one

else ranked them or something like that i'm sure

maybe a doctor who villain or something like

that maybe snuck in here doing with uh something

of that nature um but i would be surprised just

based upon the the concept of the list if we

get something that's like completely not worthy

maybe not top 50 worthy but like something that'd

be like no that doesn't belong but right Another

interesting thing that starts happening here

is... we have less and less spots to go so people

start to get nervous because it's it's now people

start to question something that they felt like

was automatic is this something that's going

to all of a sudden be in the top 25 or something

or is it going to be something that's completely

not on the list because now you get those two

extremes it's either going to be at the top or

left off completely and interesting that you

bring up the percentages here because today's

episode mainly we're going to deal with characters

that are on 40 50 of the list so there's a few

a few still on the 30s and we do get One that's

on 60 % of the list, but a lot in the 40s and

50s today. So, Steve, what are your thoughts

so far and what are you anticipating for today?

Do you think, like DJ said, we're going to have

just a smattering of comic book and horror villains?

Or maybe are we wrong and there's going to be

a lot less representation from those two genres

than we expected at the beginning? I think we're

going to see a lot of comic book and horror.

You're going to see your Freddy Kruegers and

Jasons and those kind of characters showing up

either in this episode or in the next. And then

you're going to see more of the maybe the second

tier of comic book heroes. Or not heroes, villains.

Yeah, they're all heroes. They save the world

by killing everyone. We're going to see some

of those show up, I have a feeling, and you're

going to see some of the more popular ones show

up, but I still think that there's going to be

a grand majority of the superhero and horror

characters in the top 25. Matt, another interesting

thing here is as soon as this episode goes out

and people are able to listen to what... shows

up at 50 through 26, then all of the predictions

will start to fall as far as people trying to

predict number one or top 10 or stuff like that.

Another thing that we saw, obviously, that DJ

alluded to is we've had quite a few pre -1900

characters we talked about. Would we almost be

out of those? Would there be very few of those

left? Would there be very few Disney films left?

Have we already covered most of those? Things

like that. What are your thoughts kind of going

in today? are you rooting for somebody to show

up that you're not sure that they might show

up? Um, I mean, I think it's going to be time,

like when you're alluding to like percentages

and things like that, and things are starting

getting to the forties and fifties, that makes

a lot of sense. And just in terms of like being

in the top 50, uh, but I think Disney villains,

you still got quite a few, at least super memorable

ones in my opinion on the list. So they might

show up in the top 25. I mean, if there's like

a Disney bias where I think we all kind of grew

up as Disney kids and Disney villains are always.

Probably next to comic book villains, I would

say Disney villains are the second most popular

or most recognizable villains in the entire world,

I would think. Horror still needs to be represented

a little bit more. I'd say there's maybe about

another three, maybe. I can really point at the

other Mount Rushmore guys to go on there. But

I think it's going to be pop culture heavy going

forward. I can't really see a lot more. pre -1900

or literary villains, maybe some Stephen King

stuff still to go. That would be really interesting

to get some of that on the list because there's

definitely some memorable Stephen King villains

and all the work that he's done. So it'd be cool

to see some of that coming up on the list too.

Let's see if we go literary, but go a little

bit more current literary than old literary.

So we'll see what happens with that. Another

thing we'll have to kind of pay attention to

that we didn't as much last time to see if we

have some interesting performers that performed

with these guys or creators. We'll kind of venture

back in there and see what's going on with that.

Also, interesting note, last thing before we

kind of get into it. After we do this first pick,

after we do number 50, every other character

revealed today was in somebody's top 10. So every

single one. So that's interesting. We're also

going to see three number ones fall today. So

people can be nervous about that. And here we

go. Because there was two last episodes, two

number ones. We're going to get three more today.

That means five people's number ones will be

done after today. If that doesn't make you nervous

about if you're going to fall today or not, how

about this? Three people that contributed list

will not see their number one. in the countdown

at all so this countdown is a villain so nobody's

safe here so don't are they on the panel though

don't assume that one of your number ones is

automatically going to be on this list because

three people are going to be disappointed um

that's all i'm going to say about that but all

right let's get right into our first pick of

the day at number 50 here um 40 of the list so

a good portion here and a film villain And we're

starting somewhere that might not surprise too

many people. We're starting with a horror film

character. So our number 50 is none other than

Leatherface. So the only character today that

was not in somebody's top 10, the highest he

got was number 16. DJ, what do you think of the

first horror character film for today and joining

the ones that we've already mentioned in the

previous episodes? I get it. In terms of iconography,

the chainsaws, he turned a household item like

a chainsaw into the scariest. What house are

you in? I live in the woods. But no, I mean,

nobody looks at a chainsaw without thinking of

Leatherface. If you see a chainsaw, you watch

Ice Road Truckers and they got the chainsaws

cutting the things, you're thinking of Leatherface.

If you re -watched that movie, at least I watched

it recently, it's almost like he's Lagoon in

that movie. It's the family that's really evil.

I forget the name of it. Matt would be able to

help me. The sheriff, I forget his name. Well,

the Hewitt family. Yeah, the Hewitt family. They

seem like more of the calculating villainous

type, but I mean, I'm not going to be crapping

on anybody picking Leatherface because it's effing

Leatherface. He's wearing... People's skin for

a face. And he meat hooks people. So, I mean,

he is rather villainous. Though he's kind of

got the, he's the muscle of the family. The entire

family should probably be, like, included. Like,

he accepts it for the entire Hewitt family. Matt,

he fits in with some of the horror villain naming

schemes. You know, Pinhead and Leatherface. So,

I mean, we got that going on. What do you think?

Is he more worthy, or is he worthy to be higher

than the likes of what we saw? with um jigsaw

and um chucky and pinhead um i think it's just

so like the face is synonymous with horror and

the the chainsaw of course too so if anything

else it's more what he kind of stands what he's

like his total package versus like his villainy

because yeah at the end of the day he is more

like a goon he's more muscle he's the one that

you know and he's even even in the original texas

chainsaw massacre he's dressing like a woman

and things like that and you know it's it's kind

of goofy and certainly it's very disturbing but

it's still at the end of the day the family's

more fucked up than he is i mean between you

know grandpas and all i mean even though grandpa

didn't do anything in texas chains always he's

like no grandpa was the best killer in these

parts but you know uh everybody else was like

far more even the hitchhiker was far more evil

than um you know leatherface and the father was

too so but it's still not the iconography behind

it but i'm glad he isn't in front of some other

ones that are far more villainous than he is

but uh even looking back and like his story is

a little tragic depending on what texas chain

if you're looking at the remake and stuff like

that you know it's a little sad but he's still

just a mean bastard who kills people with chainsaws

and stuff like that at the end of the day so

he fits the bill and um it's him being uh an

icon in the horror um horror history it you know

i'm glad he's on the list i didn't think he would

but hey i mean go leatherface dan do you agree

i mean do you think this is a surprise that he

he's made it or was this a sure thing uh i think

someone of surprise it's i'm finding it odd just

the the way a lot of these horror villains have

kind of uh showed up so far on this list like

you know pinhead leatherface chucky you know

i i jigsaw uh like i would think you know jigsaw's

a little bit more recent maybe even a little

more popular than Leatherface, just because of

the amount of films and things of that nature.

Leatherface is certainly, I mean, he's wearing

legitimately a person's face on top of his own

face. So, I mean, in your Jeffrey Dahmer comparison,

he tops even Jeffrey Dahmer, I would assume.

Well, I guess eating or wearing, I guess it depends

on what your own vice is, but still. We've got

to check that list that we're compiling about

the most villainous things that you can do and

see where that falls. But, yeah, so, again, I

think he's certainly deserving. I'm just more

surprised based upon kind of the way that a lot

of the horror villains are ranking on this list

because, you know, once we got to, like, it makes

me wonder that, you know, like TJ mentioned,

comic book horror, comic book horror, if Leatherface

and Penhead have made it, That makes me think

that other ones are going to make it as well,

but much higher. All right. We will have to wait

and see. There we go. Horror represented right

away. Let's go to our next pick, which is going

to be also originating in a film. By the way,

Leatherface, the film that he originated in,

1974. So that is the first, I think, film character

that did not originate in the 80s or the 2000s.

But let's fix that and go to the year 2009 for

our next pick. and a creator that we're all very

familiar with. Let's go to the world of Quentin

Tarantino for our 49th pick, Hans Landa from

Inglourious Bastards. Now, if one were to determine

what attribute the German people share with a

beast, it would be the cunning and the predatory

instinct of a hawk. But if one were to determine

what attributes the Jews share with the beast,

it would be that of the rat. Played by Christoph

Waltz. So obviously a pretty memorable character

from the last decade. DJ, what do you think of

another Tarantino character? He might be his

most... It might be his best villain, if you

consider that he's essentially a Nazi Sherlock

Holmes. I mean, the guy is, you can't fool him.

The scene in the movie theater is almost like

a cat playing with a mouse, where he's just playing

with Brad Pitt and his crew. He's calculating.

He, spoiler alert, kills a woman with his bare

hands. He orders the murder of a family, and

then he, for some reason, I still don't understand

why, lets one of them escape out of pure... I

don't know, curiosity and joy. He is, and I still

think he knew who she was at the table. Shoshana,

I think that's her name. Shoshana. Yeah, because

in the script, she like wets herself. They didn't

put it in the movie. But yeah, Hans Landa, and

he's still, it's a bingo. He's quirky. I think

it's my favorite Christoph Waltz performance.

I mean, King Schultz, I think is fun. but I think

there's just more things going on with Hans Landa.

A role that was supposed to go to Leonardo DiCaprio,

I think, and I am so glad. I mean, I like Leonardo

DiCaprio, but I don't think he could have done

anything close to what Chris Love Waltz does

with this character. Another interesting thing

here, about half of the people that had him on

the list had him in the bottom 50, the other

half in the top 50. So, Dan, what do you think?

Where's the proper landing for Hans Landa? It's

hard to say without knowing where some of the

other classic movie villains land. I do think

he deserves to be much higher than, say, Calvin

Candy. He is deserving of a top 100. I mean,

he seems evil for Nazis, which is saying something.

not many characters can have a better introduction

into the world of film than he does. And it's

not, you know, it's a very just calculated and

kind of well thought out introduction into who

he is and his personality. It's such a captivating

character. Like, obviously you hate him because

he's, you know, this evil, evil guy, but you

can't help but just be completely interested

in, in what he's doing and like the way he is

able to really just like, somewhat have a charismatic

personality but underneath that knowing there's

like a viciousness to him as well but also seeing

that he may be not into this whole mantra as

much as others and at the end maybe looking out

for himself more than he lets on so i think there

are multiple layers to his character for sure

and it is propelled by like the coming out party

for for uh And Christoph Waltz, who became a

star because of this character and this role,

at least in, you know, in the in the West, for

sure. So, like, I think I agree with TJ's probably,

you know, he'd probably rank among one of the

best. Quentin Tarantino characters ever, and

probably his best pure villain, as there aren't

many pure villains in the world of Tarantino

films, but I'm happy to make him in the list.

I actually thought he'd probably be a little

higher, considering Calvin Kennedy made the list.

I thought he would be top 25. Matt, do we have

the right to Tarantino villains, and is there

any potential for a further one? It's hard to

tell. I mean, in the world of Tarantino, there

aren't really a lot of... pure villains who are

just evil i mean and what's so messed up about

is that all these villains are so likable too

like as much as you want to hate hans lander

you're still like Damn, this guy's smooth and

suave, but he's a fucking Nazi. This is not right.

Why am I liking this Nazi? I'm Jewish, and I

shouldn't be liking this Nazi guy. So it's such

a conundrum for me. But it's funny how we have

two dynamics of Nazis on the list. We have Omen

Goth from Schindler's List, who, in my opinion,

is far more fucked up and evil than Hans Landa.

But Hans Landa is way further up on the list.

probably because he's a likable villain in so

many ways. You love to hate him. But just in

terms of having Calvin Candy and Hans Lund on

the list, I don't really see where you can go

beyond those two, at least in Tarantino's world,

for a villain. I mean, I'm not going to put Marcellus

Wallace on the list. I know he's a badass, badass

drug dealer. You know, he fixes boxing matches,

and, you know, you've got to be pretty badass

to take a dick in the ass, too. But, you know...

I don't know where else you really go from there,

you know? So I think you kind of have it. Right

there with those two Tarantino villains right

there. Something our next villain has in common

with Hans Landa is they both got all the way

up to number four on somebody's list, and they're

both from a creator that we've already seen on

the countdown. So for our next pick, we're going

to go to a character that originated in a novel

from 1937, and we're going back to the world

of J .R .R. Tolkien. So our character here is...

Go on. The fake news media has never been so

wrong or so dirty, purposely incorrect stories

and phony sources to reach their agenda of hate.

Sad. Despite the constant negative press kerfuffing.

So we've already seen one Lord of the Rings character

or Hobbit character. Now we're going with another

one with Gollum. Reactions from that, starting

with you, Steve, what do you think? My precious.

Gollum is on the show. Master Frodo. Yeah, Master

Frodo. Master Frodo. Yeah, I'm not surprised

he's here, actually. You are the one that's not

surprised. Does someone wear a ring? At least

we don't need any clips for this section. Yeah,

I know. I've been doing that impression for years.

It used to get me in trouble, too, when I used

to work at McDonald's. Burgers or fries. I've

always wanted to do that fish song that he does

while he's sitting down there in the quarry.

Oh, God. That's like my ringtone. I never think

of Filet -O -Fish again the same way. Where he's

arguing with himself and singing to the fish.

But, no, I... I just love that the character's

on here and in the top 50 on top of that. Like,

I have him on my list. He's not in my top 50,

but still, the character's so memorable and the

fact that he's got this dual personality thing

going on because he literally killed either his

brother or cousin or something to get this ring.

And just, it drove him nuts to the point that

he's basically a slave to this ring. Right up

until the bitter end. DJ, do you think Gollum

is more villainous than our other Lord of the

Rings character that showed up so far in Saruman?

I think it's more of a... Saruman has too much

mystery to him. You don't really... He's more,

you know... There's more depth to Gollum. Because

the tragedy of Gollum is what makes you kind

of, you know... feel bad for him especially in

i think two towers is where he's like oh he's

fine he finally is kind of coming back around

but then that that one misunderstanding is like

oh and he's he's bad which we is that one glimmer

of hope there is no really glimmer of hope with

soraman so i think i think in terms of the pain

that golem being bad caused me and personally

it hurt more so am i being evil it's like oh

yeah he's Christopher Lee, of course. But I mean,

Golem was kind of like rude, but come on, come

on. And then, you know, right when he's leading

them into the spoiler alert, I guess for 20 years

ago, the spider Shalhoub cave, I'm like, oh,

you can't, there's no coming back from that.

So I think Golem, I think is a more interesting

character, a deeper character, especially. for

Lord of the Rings. Maybe not in the books. Again,

token book fans, I'm sorry, I have not read the

7 ,000 books. Soramai might be deeper in the

books, but in the movies, Gollum to me is just

a little bit more interesting. Dan, is this another

surprise for you? None of us had, none of the

rest of us besides Steve had Gollum even on the

countdown, so you said you might be a little

bit surprised as far as Leatherface and stuff

like that. Do you think Gollum's an interesting

choice here to be in the top 50? How much prize?

I didn't list him. I thought I did. So there

you go. I could have sworn. No, I get it. I think

Lord of the Rings is probably not the movie it

is. Like DJ, I have not read the books. Words

are hard, so it's easier to watch the movie.

What are words, Precious? True, true. But I don't

think Lord of the Rings is... what it is without

him i think there is it makes it like the adventures

of frodo or the story frodo that more compelling

because of this character that that's there and

he probably has what the only good scene in the

hobbit trilogy yeah i would say so so uh yeah

and a lot of that too is anti -circus and i know

like if you go back now and look at someone especially

that's this reflects years later what we're where

we come it doesn't look as good but still it's

impressive uh for what at the time and what it

led to and you do get invested in in kind of

seeing and you end up wanting to root for him

and see him kind of um you know overcome this

like need yeah and of course as steven has has

demonstrated certainly is iconic in his portrayal

and And probably one of the most memorable characters

for people when it comes to Lord of the Rings.

And most likely, my precious, everyone knows

what that is. And it's because of that character.

Absolutely. Matt, do you agree with DJ that Gollum

is a more interesting villain than Saruman? Yeah,

I think he's a little more layered. I mean, at

the end of the day, Saruman comes off as just

kind of like a mustache twirler a little bit.

Like he betrays his friend to join the dark side,

so to speak. You know, Gollum has gone to the

dark side over the course of years and years

and years, all because of a circular piece of

gold. Really, at the end of the day, I mean,

granted, it was made by elves or whoever made

the ring. Elves make it. I don't know. I didn't

read the book either. Nobody can read. We don't

read words. But he's a tragic character that

you feel bad for, but then when he just does

something really horrible to people that are

trying to treat him with dignity and pride and

try and take him on their adventure with him,

and he just dicks him over, and you're just like,

that bastard, that weaselly little bastard. And

you still feel bad for him because he's like

this pathetic creature, but he's... His whole

life's been run by a ring. And the other one

that sees through his facade is Samwise. Yeah,

and you're so frustrated. You're like, listen

to Fat Sam. Sam knows. And everybody's like,

and he's just playing Frodo against Sam. And

you're even more upset about that because it's

like they're best friends and he's like breaking

up the bromance and it's sad. But yeah. I love

the fact that after our last two episodes, we're

now trying to make up for the fact that we had

so many literary characters by claiming that

none of us read. It's out now, folks. Sorry.

Sorry, guys. Going to our next pick, it's going

to be the first and only tie for today. So we

did have a tie here at this spot. And also the

character that loses that tie is on the lowest

percentage of list for the whole episode. So

this is as low as we get, 32%. But the reason...

This high is because six people had him in the

top 25. So six people had this one in next week's

episode instead of this week's episode. We're

going to go to our first comic book character

of today. And that would be Ozymandias. So an

interesting choice here. Not obviously the standard

comic book character that some people may have

expected when I said comic book character. So,

Dan, what do you think of Ozymandias coming in

here? And I'm probably saying that wrong at the

first pick here. No, you're saying it right.

And I think, one, a lot of people, unfortunately,

when people think of Watchmen, they make me think

of the movie now before the actual graphic novel.

And I think there's a lot of debate within. readers

of Watchmen or comic book fans or fans of Watchmen

if Ozymandias is really a villain or not, and

not to spoil it or anything like that. I think

there's good debate regarding that idea, but

I also think that's what makes him such a great

character and a big reason why Watchmen is what

it is. It's tough when you look at something

like Watchmen that is known and kind of regarded

as the greatest comic book graphic novel of all

time. You're just... kind of setting it up for

expectations that won't live up to those. Like,

people will just want to be disappointed by it.

But I do think it is a story that you kind of

have to read a couple times, and especially going

back a second or third time and kind of seeing

what Alan Moore does with Ozymanias and the hints

he gives, and as you kind of understand who he

is as a character. And there's a lot of back

matter, too, to a lot of... the history of the

Watchmen and like how he fits into that. So,

you know, it's interesting because he's really

a villain. He's probably on this list due to

like the, you could, you could say one scene,

basically one, the ending of one, one story.

He's made it this far, but considering he's one

of the most notable characters and, you know,

one of the biggest comic graphic novels of all

time. I get why he's this high, and I guess the

question I would say is, is he technically a

villain? Maybe not, and that's where some people

could take issue. DJ, are you surprised that

he's on this side of the top 50 and that five

people had him in the top 25? I think, I am surprised

he's this high. I'm pleasantly surprised because

when I first read Watchmen, I was kind of like...

not into Ozymandias until the one part at the

end where even at this point I know he's the

villain and I'm like, yeah, okay, whatever. And

then he does this thing where he flips it on

its head where he's like, I think Night Owl and

Rorschach, spoiler alert for Watchmen if you

haven't read it or seen the movie, we're not

going to let you do it, Ozymandias. He goes,

do it? Do it? I did it 30 minutes ago. And I

was like, that's... Awesome. That is villainous.

And technically, unless somebody reads Rorschach's

journal, he wins. His plan is for a good purpose,

but it's very villainous what he does. I mean,

he murders so many people. He kills the comedian

straight off the bat. So, I mean, he's doing

the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the

few, but it's such a treacherous thing. great

thing about the book as compared to the movie

is in the movie matthew good plays it in a way

where you kind of knew he was slimy and i think

the book is better because it shows him it's

almost like if captain america did this because

when you're looking at azam and he's the thing

that it surprises you is that he looks like a

good guy in the book he's just like a nice unassuming

He might be a little eccentric, but he's non

-threatening with his powers. So when he becomes

evil and he realized, holy crap, it's Ozymandias

that's doing it, it caught me a little bit more

in the book. But yeah, I think he deserves to

be here. I'm just surprised that anybody... I

wouldn't even consider it because Watchmen is

very, I don't want to say polarizing, it's a

work of art book -wise, but a lot of people probably

don't even remember the book, they remember the

movie, and that was polarizing for people. For

sure, I remember that specifically. Matthew,

are you surprised to hear General Zod and Ozymandias

as the first two comic book characters to show

up? It's interesting that we're getting these

kind of, I wouldn't call Ozymandias a fringe

comic book. villain just I mean maybe for it's

funny how we don't read but we read graphic novels

so good job guys I like pictures in a few words

but it's interesting how we got Zod and now we're

getting Ozymandias so we're getting these like

kind of very high I don't know I don't want to

call Zod like high -minded but it's Ozymandias

I mean it's cool that he's on the list and he

is a character that you're kind of like There's

such a – the verdict still might be out of whether

you think what he did was wrong or whether you

think the thing that he did was right. I mean

it depends on what side of the coin you're on.

At its base level, if we're going to go back

to it again and again, murder is murder. Murder

is bad, but is murder with a purpose more easy

for us to forgive and accept than somebody who

just blindly murders people like that? So it's

an interesting kind of – thing that you have

to think in your head about what side of the

coin you're on with Ozymandias and and like to

your point DJ yeah Matthew Goode looks like a

scumbag so it was easy for us to be like oh yeah

this guy's bad something's wrong with this dude

yeah but in the book he has like a tiara looking

all cute and everything like that's like this

guy would have hurt anybody but then he unleashes

like hell upon earth so um I don't know I I like

that he's on the list though I mean it's a testament

to uh graphic novels and one of the best ones

you know arguably created um ever so um i'm glad

he's on the list it's a good good job guys read

books and graphic novels fantastic got it all

covered got it all covered no medium left unturned

all right breaking the tie there and taking over

the 46th spot because he was on 40 percent versus

32 percent technically probably most people will

know this character from a tv show technically

started in a novel first we had jrr tolkien how

about george rr martin um and i like saying that

because just you know saying the creator and

the writer of game of thrones does not give anything

away because that series has so many villains

so coming in here at number 46 would be ramsey

bolton Ramsey Bolton here at 46. DJ, you reacted

first, so what are your thoughts on that one?

I think the thing about, we've discussed this

before many times, that everybody goes to Joffrey

because people hate Joffrey because he's like

the snivelly, you know, whiny, I'm going to be

the king, you know, the Prince John character

in the George R .R. Martin's Game of Thrones.

Ramsey Bolton is a... capable joffrey if joffrey

wouldn't wasn't a punk knew how to fight people

was calculating played mind games was spoiler

alert kind of a rapist like a horrible horrible

horrible human being fed people to dogs just

he might be that to me it's between him and cersei

as the most evil i probably put him over cersei

the most pure black hearted evil person on the

show. The best part of him is that we kind of

feel for him. He just wants to be recognized

by his father, but later, that kind of gets thrown

to the wayside so fast to just make him pure

black evil. Joffrey is just a punk. I mean, he's

a punk that we all hate. We want to beat the

shit out of him. We're happy when he gets shit

thrown on him and slapped and stuff, but Ramsay

is evil i can take if joffrey and me were in

a room i'm knocking joffrey out if i'm in a room

with ramsey i don't know if i'm making it out

of that room i could have a bunch of my friends

i don't know if i'm making it out of there so

yeah ramsey i think if you were coming at me

with one of those if it was one of those two

that i have a feeling the other guy i'm mentioning

is going to be higher than for some weird reason

i would pick ramsey because he scares me Probably

wins for the most despicable acts that you didn't

think you were going to have to watch during

that show. And maybe the character you most want

to see killed. I don't know. Matt, we're all

over the place as far as where people ranked

him. We have a top 10. We have a couple in the

teens, 30s, 40s, 50s, 70s, and 90s as far as

where people ranked Ramsey Bolton. So he ends

up here in the top 50. Do you think that's right

or wrong? I mean, if you're just going to judge

it based on just George or Martin villains, I

mean, he's top of the heap. I mean, like you're

saying, DJ, I'll take him over Cersei just in

terms of just base evil. Cersei's calculating.

She's a really long game. Ramsay just wants to

get gratified at that moment by any means necessary,

whether it's cutting a guy's ding -dong off or...

No, ding dong. I didn't want to say the other

word. But feeding people dogs, you know, killing

your stepmother because he's going to have another

kid that's going to take your throne. Everything

that this guy, like Joffrey would, Joffrey might

even blush and be like, damn, I can learn some

shit from this motherfucker. So, I mean, but

Ramsay just at his base, like you said, rapist

and murderer and just everything horrible, skinning

people. pull alive for fun just having a good

time doing it um and yeah you just hated him

and then you know when the fall happens you're

like it could have been worse you could have

done so much something more fucked up to this

guy he didn't deserve something that good uh

but it's still a fitting end to him but yeah

i as a villain i think he's fan fucking tastic

he's great and you know he's a great villain

dan what do you think ramsay bolton here at 46

Yeah, I'll just pretty much echo everything that's

been said. I think he's definitely top 100 that

worthy. Maybe, I don't know, high. I mean, considering

everything he's done as a character, I can't

really say he... you could ever rank him maybe

too high as a villain and he's pretty much like

in the villain checklist of evil things to do

i can't think of a box he has not necessarily

checked minus like drop a nuclear bomb or something

like that that he's not physically able to do

but if he could he probably would have so yeah

i mean when you not when you think about the

way he he died and to not think that's enough.

Bad things had to happen. He got off easy. I'm

just happy that he's represented here because

it would have been easy for people to forget

because he's not necessarily the main cast character,

the popular name as far as the series goes. So

I'm happy that people realize. the villainy of

what he does, it does make him, I think deserving

of a placement somewhere. I'm not sure exactly

where, but I think he's definitely worthy. So,

all right, let's get on with our next pick and

let's go to our first character that was created

by one Stan Lee. Um, so let's go to another comic

book character and this time with what has been

represented by or put forward by a lot of people

as perhaps one of the best villains, at least

in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, Loki in our

next pick. Loki as our next comic book villain.

I am Loki of Asgard, and I am burdened with glorious

purpose. Loki, brother of Thor. We have no quarrel

with your people. An ant has no quarrel with

a boot. It's the unspoken truth of humanity that

you crave subjugation. You were made to be ruled.

In the end, you will always kneel. Dan, you had

him ranked a little bit higher than this. So

what do you think? A lot of people actually,

one, two, three, four, five, six, seven people

had him in the top 40. So do you think this is

not high enough or what do you think about Loki

showing up right here? Well, I mean, I guess

considering like when I – well, you know, that

Stanley didn't necessarily create him rather

than kind of took him from mythology and used

him in Marvel comics. Right, right, right. So

when I was writing him, I was considering that

too, just the fact that he is a character not

only used in pop culture today but one that has

been – basically was kind of a – religious figure

in a way that we've Disney -fied in our common

day society. But Loki, if you look at the Marvel

comics for sure, what he's been able to do in

that and why he's been such an effective character

and what Marvel's really good at is taking real

life or past mythological characters, even if

it's Loki, Thor, Hercules, and kind of... bringing

them into Marvel Comics and kind of getting what

works for them as core characters to work in

the comic book world. And Loki is that, at first,

it's just like this evil man who just wants to

seek revenge of his brother that he's jealous

of. there's always, like, something more to him.

You never know exactly the angle he's going to

take. He's got this complex relationship with

his mother, as well as being kind of an adopted

kid, in a way, and, like, the baggage he holds.

And in the realm of the comics, there's been

a lot of different approaches that have been

taken. Sometimes he has been even, like, viewed

as more of a hero in attempting to do good and

having it kind of all slip away. And when you're

looking at the movies, and he's been the linchpin

to make the movies work for at least the first

couple of phases of the film, especially when

people talk about Marvel villains and films not

working, they're like, well, except for Loki,

he was the one that did work. So I could see

why. So I think he should be hired, not just

because of what he's meant for Marvel Comics,

Marvel movies, but just as a character in a whole.

There's not many... characters on this list that

have kind of the the history or the impact culturally

as a character like loki yeah absolutely steve

what do you think of loki showing up at this

point um i don't necessarily have an issue with

it uh i think that more so where he's getting

his popularity and his pull from is the fact

that one he was uh from the the north norse mythology

and then two because he's been heavily featured

in the marvel cinematic universe over the recent

years. And so you've had him kind of pop up a

lot. And so that's part of where he's kind of

gotten this little part of the fandom on his

side between the three Thor films and the first

Avengers films. So I don't know. I don't have

necessarily an issue with him, but I think that

there are other villains that may deserve more

of a... front and center over Loki, but I don't

necessarily have an issue with him being here.

DJ, do you agree that it's maybe Tom Hiddleston's

performance and some of the way that they were

able to pull off one of their best villains so

far in that cinematic universe is giving him

an extra bump on this countdown? Yeah, I think

the movies get him high, but the fact that he's

low in terms of comic book characters is probably

because of the fact that Loki has now been, where

he was in Avengers, To where he is now, it's

almost like he's, I don't want to say comic relief,

he's not as evil as he was before. So I can see

him being lower than other comic book characters.

Though in the comic books, Loki's done some despicable

things as well. But yeah, I think it's just the

films that are just getting him this high. But

if I was going to think of people in the comic

books and comic realm or whatever who are...

evil, he would not be in my top ten. That's for

the simple fact that he I can think of people

who've done worse things. Loki's now become kind

of this just mischievous, causing problems that

lead to them fighting more evil threats. Again,

he is uber powerful. He's done dirty stuff, but

I think Tom Hiddleston's kind of hurting him

a little bit in the fact that he's kind of a

good guy in Thor Ragnarok. He's an anti -hero.

He's there, but he's not like... He's like Q

in Star Trek TNG. Right, exactly. That is a perfect

analogy. He's just there to cause problems and

enjoy to see how people get out of it. That's

essentially, he's the god of mischief. That's

perfectly, which is great because that's exactly

what his name entails. He just wants to cause

problems. And like this whole Marvel Cinematic

Universe is him being the antithesis for a bigger

villain, which is Thanos or something to that

effect. Or, you know, the Chitauri or whatnot.

So, yeah. yeah absolutely matt any last comments

on loki before we move on yeah it seems like

as time's gone on with that character he's just

become and even in avengers he was always like

the means to an end in a way like he was a villain

but i never saw him as like the biggest threat

in any at least at any of the mcu stuff i am

a god you dull creature and i will not be bullied

by Of course, in Greek mythology, he was just

a god of mischief, which, you know, it's cool

that, you know, something like we go back to

like Medusa and stuff like that, too. It's like

I don't know if people were voting for him as

far as Norse mythology versus MCU type stuff.

But I mean, it's he's fine. I've never thought

of him like, oh, man, this guy is evil. Maybe

because I don't really like the Thor movies that

much or anything like that, too. But I mean,

Tom Hiddleston. Yeah, I think he kind of maybe

hampers a little bit because he's. Pretty charming

guy, too. You're like, oh, this motherfucker's

suave. He's funny. And it's like even in Thor

Ragnarok, you're like, I can't take this guy

seriously as a villain anymore. Even though he

tries to dick his brother over one more time.

But guess what? Thor sees through it. So it's

like if Thor, who's an idiot, can see through

your machinations at this point, you're almost

kind of done as a villain. You might as well

be a good guy now. Absolutely. All right, moving

on to our next pick. You know, this is where

they all are trying to one -up each other because

I said that every character on the list was going

to appear at least on one person's top ten. This

next one appears on two people's top ten. And

if you don't count the Game of Thrones characters,

it'll be our first character today that is a

pure TV origin. Steve, interesting that you said

something about Q. It's not Q, but it's from

the same franchise. Let's go with the Borg. at

our next pick so from star trek the borg in any

of the forms or individuals or collective i guess

as you want to call it um appearing here and

this is an interesting one for sure i'd like

to get your guys's thoughts first because i had

it the highest out of everybody so it was in

my top five um so steve you're the star trek

genius out of all of us so let's start with you

what do you think about borg being here we are

the borg lower your shields and surrender your

ships We will add your biological and technological

distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will

adapt to service us. Resistance is futile. Oh,

I definitely think they deserve to be there because

they give no craps about any other life form

and all that matters is their one single unified

goal of assimilation and self -betterment for

their own race and to hell with everybody else.

And so they're quite possibly one of the single

greatest threats in Star Trek history, aside

from maybe the whole Dominion thing and the Undine

or various other species in that regard. But

I would say the Borg has been the most frequent

and painful one they've had to deal with throughout

the entire... star trek mythos i mean it even

made an appearance in enterprise so the only

series so far we haven't seen it in is discovery

in the original series at this point so i think

another thing that's interesting about the borg

is you have you know something like star trek

which was around for a lot of you know many years

and and they encounter so many different species

and and and creatures and villains and different

stuff like that but for the most part you know

a lot of the villains are more so you know exploring

or or trying to survive or you have like villains

that you're you have the dynamic of it's more

so trying to prevent an escalation to an all

-out war like with you know whatever the Romulans

or the Klingons or something like that and the

and the Borg is something that is a completely

different threat than those it's not about an

all -out war it's it's literally about just an

unstoppable force that's just going to destroy

your entire race and it's not necessarily in

a combat way it's more in this crazy you know

almost spec ops type way and i will always remember

the the episodes where they they finally get

to picard and stuff like that i mean this is

easily the biggest foe that at least the next

generation crew ever came across in my opinion

even even voyager heavy dealings with them even

right up to the last episode and i think another

thing about the borg is you can maybe draw some

similarities to other you know things that have

appeared in entertainment and fiction etc but

to me they're one of the most unique villains

that we've come across so far on this list i

mean it's just who else would you compare the

borg to so i mean i maybe gave it some anthill

i gave it some extra points for that dj or matt

any thoughts on on our first star trek villain

well i mean the borg is essentially Picard's

Moby Dick, another character that's been on this

list. And they did that in First Contact. The

line must be drawn here, this far, no further

than that crap. But no, I've always loved the

whole Locutus? Yeah, that whole storyline and

the fact that it just gnaws at Picard, that this

race is stuck in his subconscious. Yeah, and

the destruction that they cause, when you make

the Klingons look like pikers, you've essentially,

I mean, the Klingons were... Kirk's, you know,

Moby Dick, and the Borg essentially transcended

Picard's, and now they're everyone's Moby Dick.

You cannot take them for granted. The only thing

I kind of was weak, I didn't like about it, is

I like the mystery of them not having a queen.

I know it makes sense and all. When they had

the queen in first contact, I liked them more

when you didn't know anything about them. They

just come in like locusts, take over everything.

You can't reason with them, because the queen,

in the first contact, you can kind of almost

reason with her. I'm like, no, I don't want to

reason with you. The thing that makes them scary

for me is that they just keep coming. You can

beat them one time in the way you've used them.

They assimilate and they fix everything. That

scared me more than a more human face to it.

I know it makes sense with the queen drone theory,

but yeah, the Borg is awesome. I've always liked

the Borg ever since that episode. Yeah, absolutely.

And let me do something weird and put the Borg

and the Gremlins in the same sentence because

I had to do the same thing. So it didn't matter

if you rated Borg or Borg Queen or one of the

versions. I put them all together. So I just

thought that was the most fair. Matt, any last

thoughts? Borg versus Gremlins. I want to see

it. Borg versus Gremlins. I just watched two

ones yesterday. Matt, any thoughts? Just don't

feed them after midnight. You'll be okay. Or

assimilate them. Depending on what space -time

continuum you're in. Get them wet and assimilate

them. Yeah. I guess the thing with the Borg,

like, their look is pretty iconic, too. And,

of course, how Picard looks after he's assimilated

as well, too. It's, like, freaky as hell. But

it's a cool look. Borg Queen is, like, all slimy

looking and stuff like that, too. It's like,

ew, God, it's gross. But it's just, yeah, I mean,

in terms of all the villains and life forms that

the Enterprise has ever had to deal with, the

Borg is the scariest because it never stops.

They literally say resistance is futile. I mean

when you have something like that, it's like

you're not going to do too good, man, because

they're just going to keep coming at you. So

yeah, it's a cool villain, and it's a memorable

villain just the way they look and everything

too. So that's all I really have to say about

that. All right. absolutely um and like i said

we're one -upping things because now we had a

character that was on two people's top 10 how

about we go next to a character that was in two

people's top two um so our first number one pick

falls today and uh someone else had him ranked

at number two him i guess we'll say um originating

from a novel in the 1940s from george orwell

let's go with big brother the collective i guess

you could say interesting right next to the board

i guess in a way but uh big brother here coming

in next i had him at number two actually um i

just think that there's well i'll let you guys

talk first dan why don't you talk a little bit

about big brother i i'm afraid to actually i

wanted to throw you guys under the bus watching

i love big brother the tv show is amazing i love

cbs and uh no I wonder if anybody voted for Big

Brother as a villain because it's a bad reality

show. Is that what they meant? Or their actual

Big Brother. Everybody voted because they're

too scared of Big Brother. That's why. Big Brother,

it is one of those villains, I think, that maybe

has even surpassed the variety of the book it

comes from in a way, where you say Big Brother,

more people know what that means than actually

maybe even have read the book or are aware of

it. And I think it's obviously what it represents

and that overarching fear we have of basically

being controlled. And it's permeated so much

of... pop culture or fiction in general that

that that idea i mean thinking you know uh everywhere

from like microsoft commercials to uh many of

the you know villains that we've talked about

here certainly have had influence based upon

big brother and you know it's like the borg in

the sense of it's not this one specific character

but it's the the fear and not having that like

uh overall like person you can point to as the

character you're supposed to be afraid of so

i it's i i could see why like so many people

ranked it really high maybe some people didn't

because it's kind of hard to kind of see it in

the capacity of a villain since it's not necessarily

one specific character per se but but yeah i

think like in impactful or evilness when it comes

to villains i mean when you're basically taking

over the world and have complete control There

are not many villains that can kind of claim

that, and that's what Big Brother is able to

accomplish. DJ, are we going to get some flack

from this one? Because six people had Big Brother

in the top 25. I don't know. Again, we do have

some literary geniuses following the show, so

maybe they'll be like... Choose your words carefully.

I know. They'll call Big Brother. Yeah. I'm in

trouble. I just fixed my taxes. No. I think we'll

be all right. I think in the grand scheme, knowing

pop culture, knowing all this stuff, this is

pretty good for this, I believe, to be on this

list with all the other things considered. In

literary terms, I can see it being in the top

five, but you got to take into account movies,

all the stuff you guys got to take into account

to make this list for Big Brother to be here.

I don't think you can be too upset. I think for

me it was more of what it represents as far as

what Dan was kind of getting to. It's that villain

that's not just one character. You can't point

to one person or whatever. It's more an idea.

And I also give it credit for something that

was obviously – released back in 1949 that is

so relevant today. You know what I mean? As far

as our technology age and things like that. So

I thought from that, it got a few more points.

And it's just something that's just an overall

scary concept to consider and to think and not

knowing how real or not that is. So I guess that's

why I ranked it so high. Matt, what do you think

as far as where Big Brother should fall? And

is it top 100 worthy at least? Oh, absolutely,

because it's an unseen villain. You don't see

Big Brother. Big Brother sees you. So just the

thought of something watching every single one

of your moves, or even just with social media

today, everything we have in the palm of our

hands with Facebook or Snapchat or anything,

you're essentially telling on yourself every

single day and letting Big Brother collect all

this data to keep telling on yourself. When you're

on Snapchat and you're saying, Hey, man, I'm

this and this place and that place. It's like

you're tattling on yourself. You're ratting yourself

out all the time. And that's Big Brother right

there. It's something that's been created. And

Big Brother is like, I don't even have to do

anything anymore. You guys are idiots. You're

going to tell me everything. I don't have to

watch. You're telling me. I'm going to sit in

the corner and just be like, yo, what's up? You're

going to tell me what's going on? I'm Big Brother.

I'm your Big Brother. So it's just one of those

weird concepts. Orwell, 60 years later, over

60 years later now after 1984 came out, it's

like this guy knew that one day, I don't know,

that guy's a genius. He was already going up

to 1984. Think about it 33 years later and we're

even worse than we were in 1984 to certain degrees

with Big Brother watching us. It's scary that

you can't see Big Brother. You can see all these...

villains coming but big brother is always watching

you no matter what steve final word on big brother

no idea clean the fifth he doesn't he doesn't

want to get in trouble all right for the next

i love big brother for the next one let's go

to a film villain a film villain that originated

in the 90s um 1995 to be specific on 36 of the

list john doe from the film seven so um i guess

i propose here um uh dan let's start with you

you're the most politically correct out of all

of us i think oh jeez wow uh well there you go

um so you were you ever see an actor in a movie

and think wow that's evil then like oh the real

life version behind the curtain Right, right,

right. For the record, these lists were created

a while back. Wow. Looking at the character of

John Doe, it's interesting because I honestly

can't remember if I ranked him in my list. I

don't necessarily think I did. Mainly because...

as a villain and like it's more you're seeing

his work per se or your your kind of experience

you're not seeing him as a character but seeing

the results of who he is and until like kind

of the very end and uh um so i guess i'm a little

surprised in in that elm because like really

what he's on screen 15 five minutes maybe even

less than probably a villain that's gonna be

on here maybe uh much later that's also a film

villain that's not on screen much but like i

guess as a character personality wise uh and

uh character traits per se looking at john doe

there's really not much there but like it's really

just kind of understanding his mindset as you're

kind of following all the evil crimes he's committing

and the torture that he's eliciting. So I think

he's a captivating character, but for me, I don't

know if he's necessarily top 100 worthy. I think

there are some of my villains that you get to

learn a little bit more about and are a little

bit more vital to the overall telling of a story

than John Doe. I don't know if that's just recent

events that are clouding my judgment. It's possible.

For the record, six people, again, have this

character in their top 25. Matt, what do you

think of John Doe coming in right here compared

to maybe some of the other film villains we've

had? I mean, it's weird because, yeah, obviously

now the state of your opinion is kind of... definitely

clouded by recent events for kevin spacey but

uh just looking at the character at its base

i mean it's more of a horror villain in my opinion

at the end of the day he does horrible things

but it's you see the acts but at the same time

there's still no not a lot of frame of reference

to why he's doing things because it's just is

he psychotic i mean he there's a little bit of

a reason near the end but Like Dan was saying,

you're only getting about 15 minutes of him on

screen to do any explanation of why he's doing

the things. Is he a religious fanatic? Is he

just a psychopath? Is he a sociopath? Like what

is this guy's methodology? So if anything, I

think people may be probably judging and ranking

him that high just based on the acts of sadism.

that he does throughout the film and what he

does to two characters at the very end, or at

least one in particular that you've grown to

like, like and appreciate. And you're like, this

guy drove him to do that. So his end game is

pretty crazy. Not a lot of movies have done something

like that where, you know, the bad guy always

wins, you know, most, most of the time the bad

guy loses, but this time he wins by losing. But

I don't know. It's, it's hard to say now with

all the, you know, things that have come out

about, you know said actor so um but john doe

went into top 100 evil but i don't know um i

have to see who else goes above him and see if

there's anybody else i can think of that would

be a better villain than john doe to be honest

with you yeah he was one that i considered like

in a very early draft like he made the first

cut or whatever but you know after i i did some

counting and stuff like that i just never had

space for him in this countdown especially just

looking at some of the other film villains that

i wanted to to kind of make sure I include it.

I didn't have room for John Doe, but like I said,

a lot of people had him ranked pretty high. DJ,

last words on John Doe before we move on? His

acts are iconic. I mean, we keep throwing that

word around, but I mean, what's in the box is

a meme at this point. And this is kind of what

I was talking about, I think, on the first show,

that sometimes you want to carry a villain with

depth, and then sometimes you don't want a villain

with depth because it makes them even more...

scary we don't know much about John Doe but like

Dan was saying the things he does is just so

horrific that makes him just scarier because

you don't know his rhyme or reason and why until

kind of near the end but I mean it is horrific

the things he puts these people through. Jigsaw

got nothing on some of this stuff. I mean, I

don't know. Jigsaw's done some crazy stuff, but

I mean, there's a sex act done in this movie

where I don't know if it gets worse than that.

So yeah, Jigsaw... John Doe is... He's calculating.

I mean, the fact that if you haven't seen Seven,

he essentially walks up on the cops almost for

the thrill of... seeing if they'll catch him

kind of thing where he pretends to be the the

um the reporter right and he's like right there

and they did and why would he do that other than

the fact that he just he's just maniacal and

i i think the the fact that this movie it's just

hedging on the things he does it He becomes something

else and just a character with a story arc, essentially.

But yeah, John Doe has always kind of kept me

up at night. Ever since I first saw that movie,

he kind of put David Fincher on the radar for

me. So yeah, John Doe, I think, deserves to be

on this list. Interesting, too, the amount of

space that these characters are separated by.

Because by just going from our first character

today, Leatherface, to John Doe, we're only talking

about... about 60 points maybe. So it's not a

lot that separates these guys as far as the overall

point system. So just by the finest of margins,

John Doe is outranking a few of these characters.

So let's go to our next pick on the list on 40

% of the submitted list and another comic book

character. Let's go to Thanos. So Thanos showing

up here at our next pick, like I said, on 40

% of the list all the way up to number two on

one person's list. Not, though, like these last

two characters where we had a majority or six

people ranking them in the top 25 or something

like that. Only three people had them in the

top 25. So what do we think about Thanos showing

up now in relation to the other comic book characters?

Dan, I'll start with you. I think certainly he

does rank higher than that of Loki for a number

of reasons. I'm curious because Thanos is very

heavily influenced from another DC character

in Darkseid. I'm curious if Darkseid ends up

making that list as well. Though some could argue

the way Thanos has impacted Marvel Comics is...

probably bigger than that of DC and Darkseid

in DC. But Thanos as a character is interesting.

He kind of has all the tools you need in order

to be successful in what he wants to do. He's

a character that has legitimately kind of basically

conquered the universe on multiple occasions

just in order to kind of woo his love death,

basically, and that relationship he has. He's

kind of grown. out of that as of late as a character,

because what you have with comic book characters

is they develop and change and evolve into new,

especially with the most recent Thanos series

by Jeff Lemire. You got to see what happens to

him as a character when he's not as powerful,

and there's been some origin stories, so you

got an idea of where he came from, but he's also

a character talking about evil, who legitimately,

you know, went around the world, universes, and...

bear children in order to maintain his power

decided to make sure to eliminate them all. So

he decided that, yeah, I'm going to basically

kill babies all across the universe in order

to maintain his power of who he is. And he's

certainly capable of some truly evil acts. He

basically has no feeling whatsoever towards anyone

or anything. and is willing to do whatever it

takes to win. He can outsmart the smartest, he

can outpower the powerful, and goes against the

strongest of the strong when it comes to characters

in the Marvel Universe, and that's kind of, I

think, why he's been this backdrop character

in much of the Marvel films, the one they've

been leading up to since 2008, basically. So

I think, I know that's why, but then ultimately

he ends up being the character that he is. own

undoing on more than occasion or he just kind

of gets bored and wants to go back to doing other

things so yeah Steve, one thing that Dan had

mentioned last episode is he thought that comic

book characters that have appeared in movies

in the last decade or last couple of decades

might be getting a little bit more of a bump

than ones that are maybe strictly relegated to

the comics. Do you think that's something that

is helping Thanos as far as being one of the,

I guess, main villains in the Marvel Cinematic

Universe that we've been kind of led to believe

is going to be the big bad in the whole story?

I definitely believe it's because they've had

the limelight in being in the cinematic universes.

I think that that's only propelled a lot of these

characters that otherwise wouldn't have gotten

as much attention as they would have just being

a casual or full -on comic reader. I think that

what we're seeing is a lot of the... uh attention

being put on these characters just because they're

right in front of our face now instead of uh

trying to think of oh yeah who was that one guy

that did that one thing and uh you know it's

it's they're very much front and center now which

wasn't something that we had 10 15 years ago

uh you had your you know your your main rogues

gallery for that that hero and that was it because

we didn't have any of these uh combined universes

we didn't have a marvel cinematic universe we

we had pretty much you know batman superman spider

-man and x -men that was it dj are we not giving

enough credit to those that are you know faithful

comic book readers or maybe the fans of like

the animated series of some of these comics or

what do you think it is heavily influenced by

the film world i i don't know i mean thanos has

is a Pretty bad dude. I mean, I don't want to

go through his list of things here. I mean, the

guy has killed half of the population of the

universe. He's killed his own mother. He's blown

up his own planet. He's fallen in love with death.

He's killed death. He's given Deadpool immortal

life to keep him away from death. The guy has

done many, many, many, many, many horrible things.

And a lot of people don't know that. So, I mean,

because... even when he was in the comic book

realm, unless you're reading Silver Surfer, you're

not really aware of a lot of this stuff. So most

of you know about Deadpool, or sorry, Thanos

is the Marvel Cinematic Universe, which I think

people are going to realize in the next couple

of years, but they're never going to get as evil

as Thanos has been in these books, man. I mean,

Thanos has done horrific things. So I don't know.

I think... I think he should be higher in terms

of acts, but in terms of reach and people knowing

about him, not yet. I think maybe if you did

this list three years from now, he might be a

lot higher. Because I have a feeling he's going

to be dispatching the members of the Avengers

pretty handily. And Dan is right. The only thing

that really ever beats him is himself or his

own pride or his own ego or his own obsession

with the Lady Death. So, yeah, I think three

years from now he'd be way, way higher than he

is here. Matt, any thoughts on Thanos real quick?

Yeah, I think it's just – it is funny because

I would have to give people credit that they're

basing this on comic book acts as opposed to

the films because – Essentially in the films,

the longest you see him on screen is in Guardians

of the Galaxy. He's not even really doing much

anyway. He snaps at one guy on his neck. That's

not even him. That's not even him. That's the

accuser. So he's in his care in the MCU, to be

honest. So I would have to hope that a lot of

people are basing this on his acts in the Infinity

Gauntlet saga in the comic books. And, yeah,

I mean, he loves that. And he just kind of gives

up at a certain point. He's like, I'm bored.

I'm going to be a farmer. It's like he's like,

I'm going to be a farmer. And he's won so many

times. I'm done with this. Farming is the life

for me. All right. Let's move on then to our

number 40 pick for today. I like these ones where

I can name like the creator and it still gives

nothing away. So this character created by Ian

Fleming and appearing obviously in a novel first.

Let's go to something we haven't been to yet,

a Bond villain. And this number 40 pick is going

to Ernest Blofeld. So, Dan, you had him fairly

high in the top 25 on your list. So what do you

think of him showing up here at number 40? I

mean, when you think like evil science, like

evil terrorist type of characters, like Ernest

Blofeld kind of created the archetype for that

to be kind of copied throughout. I mean, think

of Austin Powers and Dr. Evil. Dr. Evil is. you

know, the comedic version of Blofeld. And he's

just, the look, the love of cats, weirdly, and

like the, like he is kind of the very first,

maybe super villain in a way. I mean, comics

existed before then, but they weren't necessarily

on the big screen. He very much is a comic book

character in all sense of the world. Over -the

-top personality, gigantic layers. He just doesn't

die. He always gets away. So he kind of... set

the tone, I think. And even, like, you know,

you see his influence in, like, comic book or

Saturday morning cartoons and, like, Inspector

Gadget, Dr. Claw, clearly is influenced by someone

like Bullfeld. So, you know, James Bond, you

know, is the biggest movie franchise ever in

terms of, like, how long it's been around and

things like that. And probably, you know, I have

seen it and he's been the character that has

been in the backdrop and even has been able to

return recently due to, like, all the crazy legality

when it comes to James Bond. That's why I had

him up really high. Is he, you know, in the realm

of evilness? Probably not nearly on the list

of a lot of people that are on here. He kind

of tends to fail at a lot of things he does.

But, you know, as a character that I find interesting,

I put him up this high. DJ or Matt, our first

Bond villain, is this the cream of the crop?

Is this the tip of the iceberg? What do you think

of Blofeld showing up here? I think it might

be the only one we get. I think it might be because

I don't know any Bond villain that would get

any more votes than Blofeld. Donald Pleasance

Blofeld. The thing I hated most about Spectre

is they had a great Christoph Waltz play him,

and they squandered it. Because he's such a cool

character. He's essentially his arch nemesis.

They had to, like Dan said, they spoofed him

with Dr. Evil. I mean, the closest I can think

is Scaramanga, but he's nowhere near as diabolical

and trope -heavy as Blofeld. I mean, most...

jokes about arch -villains come from things that

Blofeld has done in these movies. So yeah, I

think this might be... I'd be stunned there would

be another Bond villain above him. Matt, agree

to disagree. Yeah, I mean, he is the ultimate.

He's like the creme de la creme when it comes

to Bond villains. He's his arch -nemesis, and

he's unseen most of the time. He's only spoken

about. And yeah, when you have Donald Pleasance

playing him, then Max von Sadow playing him as

well, too. You have like two top -of -the -pops

guys playing uh blofeld you know even give christoph

waltz the only thing i'm kind of you know it

annoys me a little bit inspector is like hiding

the name it's like can we just help me stop doing

that stupid shit it's like i'm sick of because

it's like oh by the way i'm blofeld it's like

No shit. Thank you. But it's like just the iconic

look of Donald Pleasance in it and, you know,

the scar and the cat and just like bald head

and everything like that. And it's yeah, it doesn't

get much better. I mean, you said Sarah Monk.

I mean, I'm partial to Baron Samedi, but that's

because I'm an idiot. So you like voodoo. It's

OK. I like voodoo. I'm a voodoo practitioner.

He's cool in the video game. Anyways, we're in

top 40 territory now. Our next one on our list

is going to be all the way up to 48 % of the

list that this character appeared on. We haven't

really had a lot as far as robots or AI technology.

technological characters, I guess you could call

it. But we're going there now in a franchise

we haven't gone to yet. 1991 is the film origin

of this character. And maybe the biggest headache

for me, as someone who was compiling the list,

was revolving around this character. We're going

to go to the T -1000 from the Terminator franchise,

as played by Robert Patrick. Yeah, that was hard

to sort out with everybody's votes. But T -1000

here on 48 % of the list. A lot of people split

as far as that franchise. Who do you vote for?

Do you vote for multiple villains, just one?

Who's the villain of choice? DJ, we'll start

with you on this one. Is T -1000 the right representative

from the Terminator franchise? And any surprise

here, top 50 territory? I think in terms of him

being the unkillable nature of him, the calculating

thinking of him, and the fact that... The T -800

kind of is split between he's great as a bad

guy and he's great as a good guy, where the T

-1000 is just bad and, again, another villain

who doesn't really have a lot of depth, but you're...

fucking terrified of him. I think he might be

the... I think he's right, because when I think

of Terminator, and this is kind of split, because

a lot of people say, oh, Terminator 1 is better

than Terminator 2. I'm more of a Terminator 2

fan than Terminator 1, though they're kind of

two different genres. But when I think of Terminator,

I think of the T -1000. I think of him wagging

that finger at Sarah Connor. I think of all that

stuff. Murdering John Connor's foster parents.

Just... just horrible throwing the kid from salute

your shorts to the ground it's just great it's

great things great things but yeah i i think

he's the one i would pick if i had to pick a

one villain from the terminator franchise i'd

probably pick him interesting too people were

we had six people had him in the top 25 but we

also had four people that had him in the 90s

so it was either top 25 or it was barely in the

countdown steve what do you think of t1000 showing

up here Oh, I'm definitely in favor of it. That

character is just freaking downright evil. And

just the fact that he can squirm in between things

and turn his body into solid metal and decapitate

and tear cars open. And the fact that he's just

really freaking hard to kill in the films just

make him a very memorable. villain and to see

the villain of the first film go against the

villain of the second film it's just epic absolutely

uh matt any bonus points that this character

might have got for you know nude scenes i'll

be some robert patrick ass man would you say

robert patrick ass or arnie ass i don't know

which one's better you know what i mean they're

both up there for me so once mr come on then

i know cgs as we got later or cgs depending on

when you're going for it yes um but yeah um bonus

points for you know almost body slamming bobby

budnick so you know that gives you the evil points

there too um but yeah um at the end of the day

though you have to kind of question like have

this question in your mind like Are they more

evil or the people that are programmed to them

to do the acts? Because at the end of the day,

they're not autonomous beings or AI. They're

people that are programmed to do certain things.

So just more of a, I guess, metaphysical question

than anything else. But yeah, you can't kill

them easily. He keeps coming back. Finger wag.

And just what he's like blowing up and there's

holes in him and his face gets exploded. That's

like nightmare fuel. It's like I've never seen

anything like that when I was a kid. Like, oh,

my God, his head split in half and it looks like

this giant mutant. And it looked free. It's freaky

looking like it looks super freaky. And him,

you know, sliming in to with his liquid metal

form and turning into other people. And this

everything about that character is just unnerving.

And it's Robert Patrick does a great job. It's

just a scary killing machine. I agree with that,

for sure. Dan, is T -1000 the right one, or is

there room still on this countdown for two Terminator

villains? There's always room for more Terminators.

Come on, now. We can always do this once and

then go back in time and then do it with a different

Terminator. Good for you! I like it. I like it.

Any other thoughts, Dan? I guess I would say

We mentioned this, he's not the most complicated

character, but I think sometimes simplicity can

make a character that more evil or that more

threatening because he's just got one mission,

and that's it. That's what's driving him. It's

just complete drive in order to complete and

kill this character. So there's no bargaining.

There's no trying to talk your way out of it.

You just have this horse that's going to try

to kill you. You're going to try to find a way

to survive, and you don't know what. he's going

to look like, what it's going to look like, or

how to kill it. So that concept, I think, is

very frightening in the sense of creating stakes

or creating a character or an effective villain.

So I think I ranked T -100 a little bit, or the

first Terminator, a little bit more, but I think

it's just because I think as a villain, I feel

like he works better in the first movie, but

I think I, myself, and George Terminator 2 more

as a movie. But, yeah, I'm interested in seeing

if the other one shows up. And also, at the end

of the day, does Skynet actually end up being

a true villain? Should it be Skynet that's here

instead of Terminator? I guess you could make

that argument as well. Maybe they'll appear.

We'll have to wait and see. We're going to take

a quick break, though. We have 13 picks left

to reveal, so definitely pay attention to the

ads and check out these shows and these blogs,

etc. But we'll be right back with the last 13

picks for today after the break. Hello, everyone.

This is JD from the In Session Film Podcast.

Each week, we review the latest from Hollywood,

California. Well, yes, Brendan. We also give

top three lists. Okay. Yeah. Thanks again, Brendan.

Additionally, you can hear us talk other movie

news, trailers, varying movie series, or other

interesting film -related topics, and even rants

and raves of the week. On top of our main show

every Friday, you can also hear our extra film

podcasts. You can listen to the In Session Film

Podcast on iTunes, Stitcher, SoundCloud, or at

InSessionFilm .com. Listen to the In Session

Film Podcast every Monday and Friday. Subscribe

today and hear me verbally beat JD like a Cherokee

drum. No, no, no, no, no. That's not how this

works, sir. On the Simplistic Reviews Podcast,

we talk movies. We talk TV. We talked. Hello,

Julie. What the heck are you doing? Trying to

make our spot sound more exciting by adding explosions.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you could have got the

point across with sound effects. Not the real

thing. Come on. Come on. Download the show on

iTunes or at simplisticreviews .blogspot .com.

I'm sure your insurance company will cover that.

No, they won't. No, they probably won't. All

right. Thanks for sticking with us. And we have

13 characters left. So let's start with one that's

actually already been mentioned today. So our

next character. going back to the world of the

comic book guys so maybe we're making up for

some lost time dan you were wondering thanos

dark side um not too far away in the countdown

here dark side only three spots higher than thanos

here 44 of the list i believe the creator here

is jack kirby if i i don't know a lot of comic

book stuff so correct me if i'm wrong but dan

why don't you start here you thought maybe dark

side might appear a little bit higher are you

so you're not surprised here impressive No one

has ever avoided my Omega Beam. I wonder if the

other one is as agile. You still try to fight.

Can't you see that it's hopeless? That man won't

quit as long as he can still draw a breath. None

of my teammates will. Me? I've got a different

problem. I feel like I live in a world made of

cardboard. Always taking constant care not to

break something. To break someone. Never allowing

myself to lose control. Even for a moment, someone

could die. But you can take it, can't you, big

man? What we have here is a rare opportunity

for me to cut loose and show you just how powerful

I really am. I mean, it makes sense because you

don't get Thanos without Darkseid. Jim Starlin

pretty much was influenced by Jack Kirby and

took Darkseid and kind of marvelified him in

a way. You know, Darkseid is that ever -present

evil force from another planet, and, you know,

like, has a lot of similarities with that of

Thanos. I always saw in Thanos a more compelling

character, per se, personality -wise and things

like that, just because he has a lot of those

facets. But Curry basically made him into, you

know, a Satan for basically Satan or something

of that nature, if you want to put it down that

realm. And it's like a brilliant character design

and just everything about Darkseid and Apocalypse

and his stories and the characters that kind

of make up the new gods. It's some of the best

comics ever written. reason why he's had such

a big impact and you know looking at where justice

league is heading he's certainly going to be

probably more prevalent as well um but you know

i a lot of great dark side books i have not personally

read but he is always going to be the big bad

in the world of dc um so i certainly think he's

probably serving of a list like this Matt, your

guys' group here, Simplistic Review, is the highest

rankers of Darkseid all the way into the number

five spot. So are you upset that Darkseid's not

holding off a little bit and is already right

here? Or what do you think? I mean, like what

Dan was saying, like, yeah, without Darkseid,

you don't have Thanos. And it's hard to say.

I mean, Darkseid is more like a genocidal maniac.

I mean, Thanos is too, but... Darkseid doesn't

have the thing holding him back like Thanos has

death holding him back at times. So Darkseid's

all in it for himself, and all he wants to do

is kill, kill, kill. There's no real reasoning

with him or stopping him unless you're the Justice

League. So that's why I find him more of a kind

of bigger threat just in comic book history because

he has no moral. He has no kind of – compass

to stop him from just murdering millions upon

billions of people or billions upon millions

um dj you probably have more to say about this

than i do it's funny because i didn't i wasn't

really i was more i grew up with marvel and i

caught up on dc through the animated series which

made me go back to the books and michael ironside

is what sold oh yeah I mean, Michael Ironside

is the reason why I even gave a shit about Darkseid.

I was like, this guy is like, before I knew anything,

oh, this guy is just a ripoff of Thanos, which

is the complete opposite. And the fact that he's

going over, his Moby Dick essentially is the

anti -life equation. And the anti -life equation

is something that's fascinated me. It's an actual

equation that he wants to find. I found the actual

number, it's not numbers, it's words, that he

wants to use to essentially enslave the entire

universe. That's pretty freaking evil when it

comes to evil. Everything from his Omega beams

that always find their mark except for Batman

because he's Batman. It's just – he's just cool,

man. And the fact that – the only thing that

always rubbed me the wrong way about Darkseid

is he's awesome. He's cool. He's essentially

Thanos and Doctor Doom put together because he

runs Apocalypse. But his, like, subjects are

kind of dumb. They're all dumb. They're dumb.

I mean, what's his name? Granny Goodness. Granny

Goodness and the other one. What kind of name

is that? That's just a silly name. How do you

take that seriously? Because if I'm Darkseid,

I'm sitting in my throne room, and I got fire

in my eyes, essentially. And I'm putting together

an equation that has, like, three parts loneliness,

two parts alienage, all types of crazy stuff.

And then I look to my left, and there's this

woman, I think, called Granny Goodness. It's

just like it throws it off a little bit. With

that fierce voice. Yeah, it's just like, what

is going on here? But no, he, in a vacuum, he

is... Awesome. And he, when it comes to the way

he looks, he is essentially what intimidation

looks like. There's no way you're walking up

on Darkseid and you're talking shit. He just

looks, I mean, I don't know how Superman does

it, but I mean, he's the first person I've ever

seen step on Superman's face. I'm glad to see

growing up with high five. You make an old man

proud. But I won't let you or anyone else stand

in my way. Spare the rod. Any minute now, Brainiac

will explode. And guess what? You're going with

him. No, Darkseid. To get off... this rock you'll

have to go through me you really are a glutton

for punishment time and again i've beaten you

humbled you what makes you think today's outcome

will be any different because this time i won't

stop until you're just a greasy smear on my fist

let's go and say this is where you belong khalil

under my boot i mean this horrible thing this

guy's done he's a great character Steve, any

surprise that we see Darkseid here in the top

40? Oh, no. And I had him pretty much ranked

right around this anyway. But, no, I just loved

Darkseid in the DCAU Justice League cartoons

back in the early 2000s. And the character was

just freaking dark. And then the fact that not

only in the animated series. did he fail to hit

Batman with his Omega beams in the finale of

Justice League? Yep, yep, yep. He also managed

to hit Batman and send him back in time in the

comics. Didn't kill him. Sent him back in time

through this time travel thing where we're supposed

to end the universe when he hit modern day, and

of course they fixed that because, you know,

Batman. Survived the power of Batman. And then

again, another situation where the where Batman

got this Justice League space suit type thing

to go to Apocalypse to beat the crap out of Darkseid,

which had all the various powers of the entire

League built in it. So yeah, unless it's Batman

or on occasion Superman, Darkseid's unbeatable.

So everybody in favor of Darkseid showing up

here. Let's go to our next pick here. Down to

36 % of the list, appearing in a novel first,

maybe more popularly from a film. Another one

here where we can, I love it because I got to

say George R. R. Martin. Nobody knew what I was

talking about. I got to say Ian Fleming. Nobody

knew which character I'm going to talk about.

Let's say Stephen King and figure out what character

I'm going to talk about here. 1977, we're talking

about Jack Torrance. So all the way up at number

two on one person's list. I should just let him

introduce himself. Come out, come out, wherever

you are. Little pigs, little pigs, let me come

in. Not by the hair on your chinny -chin -chin.

Then I'll huff and I'll puff and I'll blow your

house in. Here's Johnny. DJ, what do you think?

Jack Torrance here. Next up on the list. I think

he's more... This is the book that Stephen King

and Stanley Kubrick... had falling out from,

I believe. If I remember correctly, because I

think they changed his character in the movie

more than they did in the book. He's more like

a victim to me. Though, because in the book,

I guess, spoiler alert for a 59 million year

old book, he's kind of fighting the hotel's control

over him. And then the hotel essentially... kills

him and then uses his body to chase over the

chase around the kid or whatever i i you people

remember jack torrance because of the damn axe

uh so i i but i think i never really of all the

all the stephen king stuff i i never really liked

jack torrance as much as everybody else i just

think it's because of you know the here's johnny

that stuff But I understand it being on here.

I think the house, the hotel is the villain in

that movie. Jack Torrance is a tool or a puppet

to the house. But, yeah, I understand it being

here because most people remember the movies.

Nobody reads, including me. You bring up a good

point. We'll have to see if any inanimate objects

make the list here for the rest of the way or

places or structures, homes, houses, churches,

things like that. Maybe something will steal

a spotlight here. Matt, what do you think of

Jack Torrance showing up right here? Well, it's

cool to see a Stephen King villain. If we're

putting Jack Torrance on the list, that gives

me maybe some hope for some stuff maybe later

on down the line because I think there's far

more villainous characters. Stephen King's rogue

gallery, so to speak, one in particular. But

yeah, at the end of the day, I think especially

in the film, I think it's more Grady and Lloyd

in the house that are definitely more of the

villains, especially Mr. Grady, who uses his

power of influence and almost like possesses

Jack at a certain point. But yeah, you. I guess

in the book you're supposed to feel some type

of sympathy for Jack, but in the film, well,

one Jack Nicholson on Coke you should never feel

bad for. That's just something you can't feel

bad for. That's a villain right there. There's

not a lot of redeemable stuff because you learn

more about him in the thing that he's a recovering

alcoholic, which can be redeemable at a certain

point. But he's broken his kid's arm, and he

falls back into alcoholism. There's a whole bunch

of things that are going on, and he wants to

kill Shelley Duvall. Just knowing what happened

during that film and how they treated Shelley

Duvall is screwed up anyway. It's cool seeing

him on there. I like seeing the Stephen King

villain on here. And if it's Jack Torrance to

maybe start a little bit of a trend going on,

I'm all for that. But, yeah, in the film he's

pretty maniacal and evil. And in the book, depending

on what kind of medium you're looking at Jack

Torrance from, will probably determine your opinion

a little bit more. Dan, six people had Jack Torrance

in the top 30, but you and I were not one of

them. We did rank him, though, however. So do

you feel like this is too high for him or is

this a good spot? I think it's a little too high,

as DJ mentioned. He's a character that, he's

a vice of something else, per se, really. In

the actual novel, his descent into evilness is

not as kind of a freefall as it is in the actual

movie. And I think he's certainly terrifying

and he's killing his... trying to kill his family

and a member performance from the shining but

i don't necessarily think i would looking at

some of the characters we talked about already

today or even last record i don't necessarily

think i would put him as that high i i don't

know if we're having other stephen king villains

but i can think of other stephen king villains

that i would think are more deserving of this

list and i feel like are more straightforward

evil characters And I guess I'm not – I like

The Shining, but I'm also – it's not, to me,

the all -time Kubrick film. I think there's things

to respect for that film, but I don't think I

love it as much as a lot of people do. So I probably

wouldn't have him as high as many others. Steve,

does a character automatically get a few bonus

points if they're portrayed by Jack Nicholson

in some form? Oh, yeah, because I've seen both

versions of The Shining. The Stephen King miniseries

and the Kubrick version. And I would say that

the Kubrick version is more terrifying just because

it's Jack Nicholson. And he looks creepy when

he's a character that's losing his mind. And

by comparison to the Stephen King version, the

Stephen King version was odd and very... disturbing

but it wasn't uh downright uh freaky like the

nicholson version right so i i would definitely

say that if you're judging it based on that of

course they renamed the characters in the stephen

king version so uh so there really isn't uh they

slightly changed the name so he's like john instead

of jack in the uh the stephen king version so

yeah i would say that just having Nicholson doing

it is helpful. Yeah. Beating Jack Torrance by

only one point for our next spot. We've already

had one film villain from 1995, so let's have

a second film villain from 1995. It doesn't get

any more odd than this, folks. How about Kaiser

Sose? oh boy so the thunk right we're on the

razor's edge on this one let's see what the list

would have turned out if we had done this like

a couple months later on i guess in time you

know sometimes you dj earlier you're talking

about like oh you know do this list Five years

from now or three years from now for Thanos.

How about do it three months from now? Three

weeks from now. We didn't know, people. We didn't

know. How are we going to have two Kevin Spacey

film villains from 1995 somehow show up today?

Kaiser Soce from Usual Suspects. Dan, what do

you think about that character's worthiness of

being on the list? It's interesting because there's

so much similarities with that of John Doe in

the sense of, I guess, spoiler alert for usual

suspects and how you don't know it's him until

the very end and how that's a big surprise. But

I feel like, in a way, it's much more of a surprise

at that time because Kevin Spacey isn't Kevin

Spacey, where it doesn't have nearly the impact

that it does in today's world. And without that

shock, without that... giant reveal is kaiser

soze this character that uh would make this list

i don't know i i don't know per se uh because

it's often you know it's just that uh a billion

kind of a kind of trick the audience where i

think people tend to really react towards it

in that that positive realm so i personally like

i think it's an interesting idea and and uh done

well unusual suspects but I guess I have a hard

time figuring out where I would rank him in a

list of actual villain characters. But I don't

know. I'm not saying he's not deserving. I have

a challenge to figure out how exactly you compare

him to other straightforward villains. Yeah,

I think the reason he didn't make my list is

more so because of how villainous is he. Pretty

villainous. Well, I don't know. Dewey is the

word criminal the same as the word villain. And

for me, I was just not necessarily sold on how

pure of a villain he was compared to some of

the other people I put on my list. So I did consider

him, but I didn't put him on there. DJ, you think

he's worthy, though? If you consider the spook

stories are true, the origin of Kaiser Soze is

one of the darkest, most evil things that I've

ever seen in film. His family is, let's just

say, attacked. I don't want to get into any vulgar

terms here. They're not killed. He kills them

because he doesn't want them to live knowing

what happened to them. Then he essentially kills

anyone who knows him. The whole film is about...

him spoiler alert i guess manipulating situations

so we can find the one man who knows who he is

and kill them if that's you know to be believed

the guy is And we still don't even know his ultimate

goal. And we still don't even know if any of

the things we've been seeing are true. That's

for the fact that he's manipulating all the characters

in the movie and including the audience. I think

he needs to be up there with Moriarty in terms

of manipulative, maniacal villains. And again,

I repeat, he killed his entire family. All right.

Fair enough. Matt, is that good enough to get

him here in the top 40? Exhibits of a tone on

this. killing or putting on a family murder and

things like that uh but but it's kind of interesting

because it's the whole movie is because a rogue

collective of bad guys anyway so he's just happens

to be the baddest guy in a film full of bad guys

to be honest so that's where it kind of blurs

the line a little bit i mean but yeah like dj

saying like between all the stories if everything

is said to be true and he no the the fiction

is you know everything is a fact as opposed to

fabrications yeah he is a bad bad horrible person

so but yeah i think like and even the dance point

it kind of gets lost where where do you rank

this guy i mean it depends on how kind of like

serious you're taking like all these other side

stories that people talk about kaiser jose whether

they're true or not um but yeah he's a he's a

master manipulator and if anything that deserves

him to be at least in the top 100 and i think

it's anything it's it's entered our like no pop

culture lexicon because people like to refer

to people as kaiser soze all day if it's something

that's mysterious and people don't understand

it's like oh man you're kaiser soze it's like

do you really know who kaiser soze is did you

kill did you kill your family i don't think so

get out of here didn't even you kill a whole

bunch of armenians no probably not i haven't

even met an armenian The range is crazy for Kaiser

Sosei, from 86 all the way up to number one on

one person's list. So Kaiser Sosei all over the

map, so to speak. Let's go to our next pick,

our 35th in the countdown, 35th spot, somewhere

we haven't gone today yet. On 40 % of the list,

let's go to a character that is most known for

being an animated character in a Disney film.

Let's go with a female. Maleficent. Maleficent

at number 35. Interesting here. All day without

one. And obviously we can reference some of the

Disney characters we've seen already. And maybe

this is the cream of the crop. This is the last

one we'll see. Maybe there's still more that

you guys will think will slide in here. Dan,

you had Maleficent just slightly on the other

side of the 50 mark. So what do you think? I

think this is a little too high for me. I always

felt like Cruella de Vil in the Realm of Evilness

is a little bit more than Maleficent. you know

i guess she's this evil witch and she does does

some awful things i i do wonder if like it's

a case where the fact that she has a movie in

which she is you know the hero per se does that

kind of take away some of her evilness where

you kind of see that maybe she isn't as evil

as portrayed in this one version of the story

but in the in the realm of like The character

design of animated characters, she's got to be

the best. Her design as a character is fantastic,

and even the growing green kind of orb that she

has still is just such a great look. So I certainly

get some points for that, but I guess I feel

like I would rank a number of other... animated

villains a little bit higher. I'm trying to think

if she ranked higher than Cruella Vild in the

last list or not. I can't remember, but yeah,

I think she's certainly one of the best Disney

villains, but I don't know if I would put her

this high on the list. Steve, is it cheating

because she has a trump card called a dragon?

It could possibly be that. It could also be because

she's got magical powers too, but I don't know.

I think that There are stronger Disney villains

over Maleficent. I think that's just kind of

the go -to one that everybody kind of throws

out there. Yeah, it could be. We'll have to wait

and see if people agree or not. DJ and Matt,

three people have Maleficent in their top 10.

So top 10, top 35, too high on the countdown.

Where do you guys fall on that debate? I think

I speak for Matt when I say she cursed a baby

to death. I forgot about that. Yeah, first effing

scene, the whole point of the movie. Hey, your

kid's going to fucking die if she touches a sewing

needle. Just talk about random. Very specific.

Yeah, and by the way, I look like the devil.

Oh, on another note, that horrible, atrocious.

I don't care what anybody says. Movie that came

out that essentially tried to essentially retcon

the entire thing. Maleficent is a villain. I

don't want to see good guy Darth Vader. No, I

don't want to see Darth Vader. Hey, Luke, Han,

I'm sorry I tortured you. Maleficent's a bad

guy, okay? She's evil. She flicks a bunch of

fairies, good fairies. She flicks them around

like flies. She's evil. As much as Angelina Jolie

looks amazing as that character, that movie essentially

was, I think, made to destroy that character

because she turned into an effing dragon. That's

why there's no prophet left in that. Matt, our

fifth female on the countdown. Is it just good

to get another one in there? I mean, I like seeing

more female villains. More representation is

always awesome. But it's like... I don't know.

It's like I would take the queen from Snow White.

She wanted the huntsman to bring Snow White's

heart back. That's fucked up. I'll water a heart.

What was she going to do with the heart? I don't

know. Do kinky things with it during bedtime?

I don't know what she's going to do with Snow

White's heart. And Cruella DeVille, I'll always

go back to Cruella DeVille. You're skinning puppies.

I'm sorry. I mean, that's the trump card right

there. Maleficent may have cursed somebody. and

dragons you're okay you care more about a puppy

than a baby well yeah you're a son of a bitch

you son of a where are my priorities like hey

babies had their shot puppies have no say in

the matter yeah it's like i'm a pro dog pro human

is overrated at this point But I don't know.

I mean it's good to see another female villain

on the list. It wouldn't be my pick. And of course

with the whole retconning of making – the whole

wicked syndrome. It's like, oh, let's make the

bad guy more likable as a person. It's like,

no, I'm not playing that crap. And Paul Dini,

you should be ashamed of yourself because you

wrote that screenplay for Millicent. He did?

Oh, no. He did. I love Paul Dini. Wow. It used

to be an animated series, man. It's all starting

to make sense for me now, though. Murder is not

as bad because it's dealing with humans. So I

got it now. All right. Got it. Got to feel sorry

for the poor people. Yeah, if it was something

else, it'd be worse. All right. Let's move on

to our next pick here, our number 34 pick. Back

to the world of TV slash novel. Let's say this

name again. George R .R. Martin. Let's go with...

Cersei from Game of Thrones. So Cersei, Lannister,

Baranthian, whatever you want to call it, because

I got both names submitted to me on the list.

One, two, three more people in the top ten as

high up as number three for my better half. Is

this a recency bias, or do we deserve to have

two Game of Thrones characters here in the top

50, Dan? Man, that's a good question. I'm certainly...

Recency bias certainly impacts it, because...

I don't necessarily know if... I don't know.

Game of Thrones may go down as known as one of

the greatest television shows of all time. So

perhaps even decades from now, these characters

would be listed. And maybe by the decade from

now, the other book gets written, maybe, per

se. Good chance. Who knows? But I do think both

of these characters are well -deserving, though.

I mean, Cersei certainly... I mean, she has the

evilness. I mean, the fact that she would basically...

In the most recent series, kind of saying, you

know what? I'm going to pick my family over maybe

the world all ending. And so that's – I mean,

I don't know. And she's good at what she does.

There's no doubt about that. So I think in a

realm of evilness, though, Ramsay might be worse,

might be a worse human being. I think she's probably

as capable of doing all the things that he did.

But I feel like she's a little bit more elegant

about it in a way, where Ramsay kind of enjoys

it more than he should, where she kind of at

least will distance herself or at least not revel

in it, which will put on a face, per se. But

she's a really great character, so I definitely

think she deserves the list. DJ, Ramsay Bolton's

down by the 46 mark, I think, is where it was.

Cersei at 34, so fairly close. But what do you

think as far as what we're doing here? Ramsey's

a sadist. Cersei's an opportunist. And the thing

about Cersei, she is evil. She does some evil

things. But she also makes big mistakes, more

so than I think Ramsey. I think Ramsey makes

one mistake. But Cersei, the whole High Sparrow

thing is her own damn doing because she was drunk

off her ass. just not paying attention to the

whole situation and overestimating her you know

reach but when she has her faculties as we are

seeing in the more later seasons she is diabolical

and the thing about her is she is more evil now

than she will ever be because the only thing

keeping her from being super evil was her children.

They say this many times. The only thing that

kept her from Tyrion is that whatever good is

in you is in those kids. And once those kids

are not around anymore, she has nothing to hold

her evil back anymore. Especially, I think we're

going to see in the newer season of Game of Thrones,

the most evil Cersei has been. And as Dan has

said, she is not... giving a shit about the apocalypse.

She doesn't care about that stuff. She just cares

about whatever is going to opportunity. Well,

you know, the apocalypse happens, they may be

winning and I'll just mop it up. She's not thinking

about anything other than herself. It's not,

she's not even thinking about her loved ones.

And again, I will preface you to the first episode

of the show where she forces her lover. To push

a child out of a window. A lot of child stuff

going on here. Yeah, man. Puppies and children.

She's not a nice person. That's a quick way to

get on a villain list. Do something wrong to

a puppy or a child. Or a child. Guaranteed. Matt,

what do you think? Is she definitely worthy of

being here in the top 50? I think so. And the

more I think about it, Cersei is pretty much

like a modern -day millennial. She does not give

a shit about anything but herself. She's narcissistic.

She'll play the result. It's like, oh, I fucked

up. Okay, well, I'll get it back. Except she's

genocidal and she kills thousands of people.

So you're saying this is what we would all be

like if we had lived in that time period. Yeah,

and she is a modern -day millennial at this point.

She does not care about her acts, and she only

plays the result, and she will do what she wants

to do. And narcissism rules the day. So, yeah,

good job. Millennials equals Cersei. There you

go. I like it. I like it. I want to see the reactions

from that comment. All right, let's get to our

next pick on the countdown somewhere we haven't

gone today. Let's go to a cartoon character or

maybe a toy character. I don't know how you want

to call it, but 44 % of the list listed this

individual. One of us had him in the top 10.

Actually, two of us had him in the top 10. Simplistic

Reviews and Steve Megatron Phillips. Oh, I just

said the name. Megatron coming in here at number

33. Most famously voiced by Frank Welker and

others, though, that have done it over time.

G1 Megatron? No! I'll crush you with my bare

hands! Transformers Prime Megatron. And one shall

fall. You, Optimus Prime! G1 Megatron. I would

have waited an eternity for this. It's over,

Prime. Transformers Prime Megatron. This is merely

the beginning. I now possess enough Dark Energon

to reanimate Unicron himself. Yes! I love you.

Shut up, bitch. I'm not done. Steve, you get

to go first because it's part of your name. Megatron

coming in here at number 33. Yes. Well, yeah,

as far as Megatron is concerned, I'm just glad

that he showed up in the top 50. I would have

preferred in the top 25, but again, I'm just

glad he showed up. Not that much farther off

than when Beast Wars showed up in the top 100

animated series either, so it's pretty close

to that number. But yeah, I'm pretty happy that

he showed up here. Megatron is notorious in whatever

version your... Going against, and I would say

probably some of his strongest portrayals were

in the 80s animated series, the Beast Wars Beast

Machines saga, and then the Transformers Prime

are some of the most solid Megatron performances,

not to mention if you're counting the Beast Wars

version, who continues the original Megatron's

endeavors and goes through Beast Machines, manages

to wipe out the entire planet. Cybertron single

-handedly by creating a virus and having his

own drone army of robots that take over anyone

who manages to come back to the planet. What

is this place? You might call it my throne room,

Optimus Primal. Megatron is now my domain. You

may bow before your new lord and master. The

only one that he can't stop is the planet itself.

So I would say he was the most successful Megatron

out of any of them, managing to tackle everyone

except for Primal and the planet. But yeah, he's

kind of stood the test of time reinventing himself

over the years. If you say screw all to the movie

universe where he's just another second -rate

villain on that, he's pretty solid if you go

animation. Yeah. Half the people that listed

him did not have him in the top 50. Half of the

people that listed him had him in the top 20.

So definitely a divide there. DJ, you ranked

him pretty high yourself. Why do you think Megatron

is so deserving? Because I love Optimus Prime,

and Optimus Prime does not work without Megatron.

and the thing about Megatron is other than the

fact that he's he's got an enemy of Starscream

to his left and he's always trying to take over

he's trying to destroy Optimus Prime but they

were brothers once it's just something about

that character is this always fascinated me and

the guy has a bazooka for an arm and I mean I'm

more lean toward the again I'm a huge huge huge

fan of the animated movie where essentially in

the first 10 minutes, he murders like 17 Autobots

that I grew up with, that I owned. So yeah, he's

bloodthirsty, he's calculating, he kind of has

a sense of humor. It's something about Megatron.

When we're comparing him to, let's say, Cobra

Commander, who I also love, it's just that Cobra

Commander is not as tactically capable as Megatron.

He's not as... vicious as Megatron. Megatron

will rip... His battle cries, I will crush you

with my bare hands. I will rip out your optics.

He's just a horrible, awesome villain. Matt,

obviously Optimus Prime being one of the first

notable cartoon characters to actually be a kid's

cartoon character that is killed. But I guess

we don't usually think about the fact that Megatron

is the one that does that. So Megatron is the

one that broke all of those children's hearts

and stuff like that. So does that give him bonus

points as far as being on a villain list? Oh,

yeah, absolutely. I mean, in full disclosure,

I've never been the biggest Transformer fan.

You son of a bitch. I'll put it out there. All

these years. All these years. I'm sorry. I'm

sorry. It's just training for a new host. Yeah,

you should be. I mean, hey, help wanted, not

this guy. But there's something that has to be

said that you put a movie out, and the movie

is so ballsy that it's like, hey, guess what?

We're going to kill the hero in the first 15

minutes. This guy is going to kill the villain,

and then the villain dies, and then you have

a whiny, snibbly little villain trying to take

his place, and it's like, oh, guess what? I'm

coming back better than ever, motherfucker. Megatron

turns into what? Galvatron. He's more of a badass

at that point. Until the animated series comes

back. And then he's like, It is my destiny! Then

he just became the... If he was a robot with

a mustache, he'd be twirling at that point. But

yeah, it's ballsy to have a film come out and

you just have the villain kill the hero. crazy

and destroy young kids hearts which is i love

that why are you laughing at my pain i love it

so good dan we had skeletor skeletor we had star

scream early on we had the back -to -back picks

with skeletor and cobra commander now we get

megatron is that the end of the cartoon characters

wow uh i mean you think saturday morning cartoon

yeah just like weekday afternoon or saturday

afternoon yeah man i would think so i don't i

don't know if there's someone like mom raw i

don't think would be making it i can't yeah i

like the reference yeah mummer on shredder any

of those but uh we can see i guess i i am perplexed

by this pick and i was surprised at the number

of ballots that had this guy's name on it because

i didn't think people would consider him a serious

uh option for this but apparently i am in the

minority so i'm gonna let you guys tell me why

uh next up our 32nd pick from a film from 1985

or a series of films Making the top 50 fictional

villains of all time, Biff Tannen. Oh, come on.

You're surprised. Biff Tannen. I just didn't

think. I didn't expect it. Maybe I was just not

on my radar, but Biff Tannen kept coming in.

Ballot after ballot, 44 % of people think Biff

Tannen is top 100 worthy. DJ, go. Hello? Hello?

Anybody home? Hey, think with flying feet. Since

you're new here. I'm going to cut you a break

today. So why don't you make like a tree and

get out of here? I'm going to get that son of

a bitch. Look at what we have here. What are

you looking at, butthead? Something very familiar

about us. Biff Tannen is essentially, if you

look up bully in the dictionary, Biff Tannen's

mug smiling face is there. He bullies Marty McFly.

Through time, through centuries, he's always

bullying him. He's murdering people. He almost

rapes his mother in the first fucking movie.

Biff Tannen is a piece of shit. He tries to kill

Marty in the second movie. He damn sure kills

Marty. I think he kills one of the McFlies in

the third movie. He tries to kill a bunch of

them. I think he killed the sheriff or something.

Biff Tannen, first off, if you're a part of Back

to the Future, which I think is a... perfect

movie, and you're the main antagonist, you're

going to get some votes, man. And again, if you

think of Bully, I think of Scott Farkas from

Christmas Story, and I think of Biff Tannen.

Those two people. Yeah, a lot of people would

agree with you. Eight people in the top 50 and

then two more in the 50 range. So almost, you

know, 10 people in the top 60, basically. Dan,

what do you think? Biff Tannen, more of a villain

than, you know, Cersei Lannister, Darkseid, Blofeld,

Big Brother, the Borg. I put it that way. I mean,

like, well, put it this way. He basically became

Trump in the second film. That's true. It is

100 % true. Johnny and Hitman. Yeah, he basically

beat the future properly. I mean, obviously,

if you look at the amount of evilness that he

accomplishes, it's not necessarily to the level

of Cersei. I mean, I'm assuming if Cersei had

the ability to travel through time, she would

do more than bet on sports games. I'm guessing

the world would probably function better under

her than it did under Tannen. Would Biff Tannen

wear somebody's skin as a face? I'm just asking

that question. George McFly? He'd wear George

McFly's skin as a face. Just like with Lorraine,

of course. Get the Lorraine? Oh, hell yeah. But

I mean, in the sense of a villain working in

a movie and you rooting for him to fail and enjoying

that failure, he's like... Back to the Future

does not work the way it does without Biff Tannen.

So I think he's good comedic relief, but at the

same time, he can be funny, but still somewhat

of a threat in a way, too. And I think that's

a hard thing that I really do. I think you really

haven't had a character like him that's been

effective since. A lot of people have tried to

replicate that, but none have. That movie has

Libyan terrorists in that movie, and they're

not as scary as Biff Tannen. Well, they're not

Libyan anymore. They filtered that part out.

What are they called? Terrorist terrorists? Yeah,

just terrorists. In front of the bill. They literally

cut that Libyan part out. Marty, there's some

sort of terrorist out there. Steve, what do you

think of Back to the Future being represented

on our countdown? Oh, I love it because Back

to the Future is one of the best trilogies ever.

And it's, you know, the whole thing. Like, I

really can't sum up any better than what the

panel has already come up with on Biff. Like,

he's just, he's like the ultimate jerk that just

follows you through time. Yeah, absolutely. All

right, let's go to our next pick here. Number

31, actually. 48 % of the list had this character,

and it's been a long time. I guess some people

may consider John Doe a horror film, but not

maybe as a traditional one. So we started with

Leatherface, and it's taken us this long to get

to another traditional horror film character.

Interested to see your guys' reaction on which

one is falling here. At number 31, we're going

with... Jason Voorhees. So Jason Voorhees here

at number 31 was on all the way up at one person's

number five in three people's top 10. We'll start

with DJ Leatherface to start the day. Now we

get Jason. What do you think? He's always been

my favorite. He's a victim. He has a right to...

His killing spree is almost justified in a certain

way where I was drowning in a lake and you guys

were banging. Nobody else gets to have sex. Nobody

else gets to have sex for the rest of eternity.

If I see you having sex or with the girlfriends

or having a good old time, you get the machete.

In terms of a look... No nookie at camp. I mean,

he starts off with the pillowcase, but I mean,

the hockey mask and the machete are essentially,

it comes on every year. Friday the 13th is now

essentially like, it's a wonderful life, but

for that. It's required. And I can hear it, but

yeah. So yeah, Jason Voorhees is awesome. Again.

And he's kind of a monster, so I kind of, my

heart goes out to him. He's less a villainous,

I think, in terms of a person as, you know. Chucky,

because Chucky was a scumbag who remained a scumbag

the entire time. But it's just the fact that,

you know, there's been 900 of those movies, and

I never get tired of seeing Jason cut somebody

in half with a machete over all these years.

It's great. Matt, a couple times during the episodes,

people have referenced the Mount Rushmore of

horror film villains. Is Leatherface on that

Mount Rushmore? Is Jason on that Mount Rushmore?

Because I'm not sure which had those. would be.

So is this one of them? Yeah, this is definitely,

this is the one that started the genre. I mean,

you could argue that, you know, Halloween was

the proto slasher film. There's even ones before

that, but this is the one that kind of perfected

the equation, if you will, with, you know, don't

do, don't do drugs, don't have sex. Don't do

a bunch of shit that you're going to regret because

it's avenging angel death is basically going

to murder you and your, all your friends. In

increasingly comical ways as the series went

on. But it is funny because, I mean, in terms

of like if I was going to have horror movie characters,

of course, I'm putting Jason in my top three.

But in terms of a villain, I mean. At the same

time, yeah, are we discounting murder? This guy

murders everybody. I mean, his body count is

insurmountable in the annals of horror film at

this point. But I just have a hard time calling

him a villain. I feel bad for him because he

was a kid that got fucked over by a bunch of

horny teenagers. And, hey, we've all been horny

teenagers. I get it. But we didn't leave a kid

out there drowning in the lake and then have

their mother. You don't know me. You don't know

what I've done. You're right. I don't. I don't

know where you went to camp. You're right. I

don't. You were probably that guy, and you're

the black guy, and the black guy should be dead

first. That's why he goes up to the black guy's

floor. See? It all makes sense. It all makes

sense, though. Dan or Steve, any comments on

Jason and his placement here? One of my favorite

things Jason's ever done was actually in Jason

X. I don't know. Jason in Space, I don't know,

which is an awful awesome movie. There's a sequence

in which they try to distract him by putting

naked coeds in a hologram, and he responds by

putting in a sleeping bag and bashing him against

the wall. It's the most wrong, hilarious thing

ever. A movie that's really unnecessary to watch,

that sequence is pretty fun. Regarding who would

be in the Matt Rushmore of horror, There is someone

I would like. I think Mike Myers is someone I

think I probably would put ahead of him because

I think he very much is a model of that character.

But you could argue that Jason's maybe become

more popular in a way just because of the hockey

mask and the look of the character. But I don't

know. I always preferred the Halloween films

over the Jason movies. does is a good point in

the sense of jason there is some sympathy there

where there isn't that really for michael myers

who he was just plainly evil so right right steve

any comments on jason i just what dan said i

like it jason was on arsenio hall That's pretty

bad. That is true. Our next character, 52 % of

the list. 52%. And interested to see if this

is a character that you guys were referencing

earlier or not, let's go back to the world of

Stephen King. So Stephen King making one more

appearance at least. And this time in the...

way of pennywise um interesting coming right

back to back with jason is this because of the

film that came out this year is that influencing

that uh dan what do you think pennywise ahead

of jason is that correct and then what do you

think i'm pennywise the dancing clown i think

the film this year certainly helped a lot i i

do know though that a lot of people are very

much have a special fear in their heart for Pennywise

due to that TV series from the 1990s and in the

book itself. So if we didn't have it come out

this year, would Pennywise be this high? Probably

not, but I still think Pennywise would make the

top 100. Being a clown, an evil clown that kills

children, that's a pretty good resume to have

to make this list. Though some people, if we've

seen murder in kids, maybe not as big of a deal

as other things. The kid thing continues. There

is one other Stephen King villain that I tend

to enjoy a little more. I'm a bigger fan of him,

but I think that may be in fact because I like

the book he's in further. Yeah, Pennywise, again,

evil clown. You can't really deny that. And not

to mention, if anyone that went out for Halloween,

I'm sure you saw like a trillion different Pennywise

costumes. Yeah, probably, especially this year.

Steve, what do you think? Is Pennywise a better

horror villain than the likes of Jason and Leatherface?

I mean, I would say so in the sense that he's

just, the creep factor is just notched up to

like... 100 % there compared to two dudes with

a mask and a machete. So that and just the mystical

abilities that he entails and the trauma that

he causes children and adults likewise. I would

say that also his character may have gotten that

added propulsion from the latest film to come

out. Definitely could see that being a thing.

DJ, is there a clown on your Mount Rushmore?

It's funny because I'm more Tim Curry than the

more recent Bill Skarsgård, though I think Bill

Skarsgård surprised me with how great he is.

Mount Rushmore, I just think because Pennywise

has just the one and the guy with the hat and

Jason and Myers have been doing it for years.

my entire life over and over again. I think he

would just... He might be like the little Mount

Rushmore gift shop. He might be there. But I

just think... He's the tour guide that takes

you up to the Mount Rushmore. Right, right. He's

like, hey, welcome to Mount Rushmore. My name

is Pennywise. Pennywise. Now we know each other.

But I think those guys on that Mount Rushmore

actually traumatized a large part of my childhood.

And Pennywise didn't. I was just more captivated

by how... awesome of a character he was where

those guys on the mount rush were the ones that

gave me nightmares pennywise never really gave

me nightmares i just thought he was a great great

villain all right fair enough pennywise making

it here at our number 30 picks everybody else's

top 30 material including our next pick which

was again on one person's number one amanda's

not going to be happy that he's already falling

um number one for her number 30 or yeah number

30 overall 29 overall i guess now 29 is character

from a film that was from 1987 on 52 percent

of the list the predator the predator as a top

30 villain here dj what do you think of the predator

showing up here at number 29 Okay. Again, I love

The Predator. The Predator is one of the greatest

action films of all time that essentially becomes

Dustal Dawn and twists into some horror film

near the end of it. Sci -fi horror. I love The

Predator, but for him to be, I think as a creature,

sure. On this list, I think it's a little high

for him. He is one of those creatures that did

give me nightmares, but I just don't think...

I don't know. Something about him, because, again,

when it comes to characters with lack of depth

and you don't really know anything about the

Predator, if I had to compare him to the T -1000,

where I say he didn't have depth either, the

Predator is... I don't know. He never really...

He never really compared to some of these other

guys. His intentions aren't as super evil as

you think. I mean, essentially, he's a hunter.

He's not like sadistically murdering people.

He just kills them. He doesn't like, you know,

tortures anybody like some of these other characters

that we're going to see on this list, like a

Jason Voorhees or Jigsaw or something like that.

I don't know if he should be this high. I understand

him being on the list. I just don't think he

should be this high. Steve, if we were framing

the criteria, if you went to put someone on the

list and every time you asked yourself what would

be the character you least want to be trapped

on an island with, would that make Predator rise

the ranks a little bit? Well, yeah, because I

wouldn't want something that could easily find

me as opposed to a Jason or a Michael Myers who

just kind of... exist and just wander really

slowly and that I could get away from. Whereas

the predator has all of his gear and his ability

to hunt you down unless you hide in mud. Like

Arnold. So I guess I would just have to sleep

in the mud. This is interesting. Two people,

two people, top 10, two people, 99 and 100. Dan,

you were at the one that had him at 100. Is he

more someone that should have been in the last

week or the week before his episode? I think

so. I think like, sorry, the hiccups. Oh, man.

I think so. I think he works as like. It works

well in the first film because there's that mystery

behind him as a character. You don't know what's

going to kill him. You don't know the... It's

not happening. Sorry. I'm going to go get some

water. The Predator has sensed that Dan did not

respect him enough and put him at number 100.

So he's doing something. He's messing with him.

Matt, take over Dan's spot here. Why Predator

or why not Predator? I mean, I personally wouldn't

even include him in the top 100. I mean, he's

an awesome character, very iconic. But the more

you know about the character, it's more like

he's doing everything by instinct. It's not by

some type of, like, I don't know. I mean, I guess

a hunter is still a bad person. Hold on. I want

all of you guys to remember these comments if

and when Jaws appears on this list. All right?

Oh, boy. Wait, wait, wait. Jaws tracked a person

down to the Caribbean. He was like, he had a

mind. Yeah, it was like the curse of Jaws at

that point. But isn't there that much difference

between the two characters? He was on the family.

He was going after a family. He was going after

Brody family at that point. Predator will kill

you if you're unarmed. He won't even attack you.

It's just a code of honor. That's the thing.

We're kind of like – it doesn't make him a villain

to me at all. It makes him just a person almost

doing his job in a certain way. I walked up to

Michael Myers and I had no – Mike, I don't have

a gun. You don't care. He'll stab me in the face.

But he's Joe Evil. The darkest eyes. The devil's

eyes. Predator still scares me more. Yeah, so

I don't know. I'd be scared of the Predator.

Of course he's – a fearsome uh combatant and

will dispatch me without thinking about it twice

um but yeah i mean i just don't think of him

as like a crazy villain i mean i don't think

of him in my in my top uh 100 villains i mean

characters yeah but villains If he would have

murdered more kids, would we have him? I would

probably put him higher just because it's like,

yeah, get him. He would never kill children because

he only kills people. He didn't kill – what's

her name? Because you had the baby inside of

her. You know Alonzo. He had an opportunity to

kill a kid right there. Didn't do it. Not even

a fetus. He wouldn't kill a fetus. But Cersei

will only kill people that aren't her direct

family. Good points. She didn't really give a

shit when her son jumped out a window. Yeah,

she thought about it for a minute when she was

like, oh. Biff Tannenworthy, predator not. I

got it. I got it. I'm glad we're stipulating

things. We have standards here. Bullying fits.

Hunting humans. No way. Enough. Only three more

picks today. We'll see what kind of debates we

can get in here the rest of the way because this

next character spawned a great debate on Twitter

when we were early on in the phases of kind of

talking to each other and debating amongst ourselves

certain genres and which characters were the

most worthy. DJ, you and Dan had a great discussion

about this character, and one of you definitely

thought more worthy than the other. So I'm interested

if the Predator's spell has worn off on Dan,

if we can re - with some of that debate here.

We're going to go with another comic book character,

and obviously played by different people in TV

shows, movies, etc. How about Ra's al Ghul for

our number... 28th pick, I think is where we're

at. I'll let you start, DJ, because like I said,

you and Dan had an interesting conversation about

the worthiness in the comic book genre of Ra's

al Ghul as far as your top five villains that

you guys were trying to come up with. Over the

ages, our weapons have grown more sophisticated.

With Gotham, we tried a new one, economics. But

we underestimated certain of Gotham's citizens,

such as your parents. Guns down by one of the

very people they were trying to help. Create

enough hunger, and everyone becomes a criminal.

Their deaths galvanized the city into saving

itself, and Gotham has limped on ever since.

We are back to finish the job. And this time,

no misguided idealists will get in the way. Like

your father, you lack the courage to do all that

is necessary. If someone stands in the way of

true justice, you simply walk up behind them

and stab them in the heart. A superstitious,

cowardly lot. You missed a great show. The music,

the action. What are you eating? It smells...

Gorgeous. Terry, this is Talia, an old friend.

Talia. I've been aware of Mr. McGinnis for some

time. With a new Batman in action, I knew he

had to be someone close to you. Terry was the

only candidate. I've heard about you, too. You're

the daughter of Raz Al Ghul, one of the old man's

worst enemies from way back. You helped the original

Batman fight Raz one last time in the near apocalypse

of 09. For the last couple of decades, you've

been putting your father's money to work cleaning

up the mess he made. Current residence is a 200

-acre estate on New Cuba. What? Did you think

I was down here playing vid games? Very thorough,

Terry. Though father's name was pronounced Rache,

not Raz. A common mistake. Fair enough. Now maybe

you'll clear up another mystery. Why are you

here? This dude walked into the Batcave and didn't

care. He knows who Batman is and doesn't care.

Oh, by the way, he trained Batman. He has a legion

of assassins. He essentially is 700 years old

and has been murdering empires to balance out

the world. And this kind of goes with the Ozymandias

thing where he kind of has somewhat in his mind

good intentions. But he doesn't care who he has

to destroy or manipulate to even get to that

point. I mean, he wants Batman to marry his daughter

even though they're enemies because he respects

him as a combatant. Ra's al Ghul is so Machiavellian

and, again, immortal. So he's always been one

of my favorite Batman villains just for the simple

fact that... When I grew up, it was almost like,

oh, my God, I hope the villains don't find out

who Batman is. And I watched the animated series

and Rachel goes like, hey, detective, he's like

right in the Batcave. He figures it out and he

doesn't care. That to me is like, what is this

guy's motivations? And his motivations are just

motivations I've seen from a villain that I've

never seen from any other villain. I mean, a

certain other clown characters is chaos, but

his is balance, which I just never. He almost

kind of wins you on his side work. Maybe Ra's

al Ghul was right. If a villain can do that and

make you think that way, and it's a Batman villain,

I just have a lot of respect for that because

he could have just been a mustache twirler. He

could have been, and most people always have

got, and by the way, his name means the demon's

head. That's his name. Okay, we're going to do

this high school debate style. Dan, you have

two minutes. Well, to be clear, when we were

talking online, it was ranking him against like

the other all -time villains in comics. And I

still like – to me, he isn't to the level of

other characters because I don't think – when

I look at the best comic book villains, I think

it's important that they are part of some of

the best comic book stories. that are ever told

and to me racial goal isn't to that level because

he he has some great comics behind him but not

to some of the level of some of the better comic

book villains with that being said he certainly

deserves to be on a list like this he certainly

i think you could argue could be higher i you

know i'm talking echelon of echelon i'm talking

top five and for me he wasn't there and he just

isn't because he doesn't have like it's the same

argument i make when people freak out over the

mandarin i'm like mandarin is not a good character

he at all because he's never really had great

stories about him you know rachel goal has some

i mean there's no doubt but he doesn't have the

level of the joker or magneto or or Thanos, but

he's right within that echelon. I would say top

five, top ten, maybe not top three. So with that,

I think he certainly, I mean, if you're looking

at the qualities of being evil and his capability,

certainly he's among the best, no doubt. And

I think that's why he should be ranking here.

I think he, by all means, has the ability to,

if you look at, like, where we're at in this

list. I think he could rank higher than perhaps

some characters that we'll probably talk about

in the future when it comes to comic book villains.

And he does have that element of the fact that

he can't die. Or he can at least come back from

so much. I get it. I think he's certainly a great

character. There's no doubt about that. And he's

one that he's been around for some time. And

I only wish that when he showed up in the movie,

they said his name correctly. That would have

been great. But you can't get out of the league

to call him Rache. And if you're not part of

the league, you call him Raz. But I just call

him Rache because that's what they call them

on the animated series. And that's law. Steve,

where do you fall in this debate? I think, well,

being that I listed him in my top 10, I think

that he's one of Batman's better villains in

the fact that he kind of plays by a certain code

of conduct when he's going against him. Yeah,

he knows who Batman is. Yeah, he could take him

down anytime he wants, really. I mean, there's

only so much Batman can take, but again, it's

Batman, so who knows? He can take Darkseid, so.

You always were the perfect specimen, detective.

Even old age has not softened you as much as

I had feared. I should have known you'd cheat

death again, Rache. I don't cheat death, I master

it. Though I assure you this time my longevity

comes at a price, most dear. Talia. I did indeed

survive our last battle, but my body was broken

far beyond the pit's powers to heal. In order

to save my life, I called upon Talia to undertake

the ultimate act of loyalty. You sacrificed her.

Your own daughter. I did what I had to do. At

the time, this computer could only imprint my

thoughts and memories on a close genetic match.

But now, this youthful form has served its purpose.

I must move on to a new host body. Yours. Sure,

Rache. Why not? Anything to hold off the Grim

Reaper another few seconds. I take it back. You

don't cheat death. You whimper in fear of it.

Silence! And you hit like a girl. But Rache is

also part of how we ended up with Damian Wayne,

how we've got Talia, how we've got... He wants

Batman to be the successor. He wants all these

different things from Batman, even though he

knows he's kind of a formidable adversary. He

respects him, but at the same time, he wants

his version of balance, and he wants Batman to

come to his side because he sees Batman being

this greatest weapon on his side of the force,

as it were. And so he's basically like... uh

the emperor with no power uh no physical power

but he he has all the time and money uh and rejuvenation

it is in the palm of his hands that he could

just kind of uh play around with and and take

over the world yeah matt quick comment on racial

ghoul before we move on yeah i think it uh bodes

well for more in batman's rogue gallery coming

up down the line because if we're getting race

at this point we know who we're going to get

down the line as well too um But yeah, it's kind

of an interesting thing that Ra's al Ghul's –

just kind of his dynamic with Batman and how

a family has been built around a person that

– like that, having – like you said, Steve, with

Damian Wayne and Talia Ghul and stuff like that.

And the fact – I mean I guess my one – kind of

downside to racial ghouls that he keeps coming

back to batman thinking that one day batman's

going to change his mind he's like come on man

join join the crew and he's like no i was like

okay i'm gonna fight you it's like damn i'm dead

again okay i'll crawl in this pit get out and

try again so you gotta you gotta you gotta give

a admiration to his chutzpah he's got a lot of

chutzpah that he's persistent he's persistent

i will give persistence he's old school he's

old school good for race he sacked rome folks

rome Yeah, Rome. And the round table. And the

round table. Get it all. So we will let the Ra's

al Ghul debate continue on the website and through

the comments, so you can take one side or the

other and say where exactly he should fit in

the realm of comic book villains. Is he top three?

Is he top five? Is he top ten? How many more

do we have still to go with this countdown? We'll

have to wait and see. We only have time for two

more picks, though, today. Number 27. Have I

said the name George R .R. Martin today? So interested

to see here. How about 60 % of the list? 60.

That's the highest we had all day today. Joffrey,

here you go. So 27 is Joffrey. So we've had Cersei,

we've had Ramsay, now Joffrey. Again, 60%. The

highest it got ranked was number 10, so this

was the closest we had of having a character

that didn't land in somebody's top 10. DJ, what

do you make of three Game of Thrones characters

showing up today? Well, Game of Thrones is, again,

as you said before, maybe one of the greatest

television shows ever made, and those books are

legendary at this point. Joffrey being above

Cersei and Ramsay, I think it's based on... hatred

not and one major deed i think because um in

the lexicon of the game of thrones universe he's

just he does not has not done as much stuff as

the other two that are on this list but the one

thing he has done is essentially what put this

show on the map so that's why he's this high

i think um but i think when it's all said and

done if when you compare accomplishments when

you compare evil i don't think he's near the

other two that are under him in terms of that

but i completely know i knew ahead of time oh

well joffrey's gonna be really really high because

everybody watched that video of tyrian slapping

him in the face for five minutes on a loop out

of joy because they hate this character so much

his hatred is the hatred of joffrey is so high

because of the one deed he did but afterwards

he was just kind of petulant and manipulated

by somebody who's under him on this list cersei

so yeah i i i can see why he's on this this high

But I think when it's all said and done at the

end of this series, I think he might be a little

bit lower. I blame all the cartoons we grew up

watching as kids that taught us to hate the kid

character. Matt, did we get the order right or

wrong here with Game of Thrones? It's hard to

tell because I guess if you look at it from a

broader perspective, it's like, yeah, he ends

up being manipulated by his mother in the beginning.

But then he kind of goes out on his own. But

then going out on his own. Brings him to his

doom eventually too. So it's like, oh, you should

have listened to the person who was more evil

than you, idiot. What's wrong with you? But,

I mean, we haven't really had a lot of snively,

whiny characters. I mean, I guess we had Frieza

back in the other quarter also being really like

a snively, bratty character. But this has to

be – I don't see another character coming on

the list that's going to be as bratty or as sniveling

as Joffrey. And, yeah, we hate him for very specific

acts in the – I mean – Once again, I think we've

already stipulated that we don't read books.

We only watch stuff on the TV, on the video box.

At least for today, at least. But yeah, I mean,

the way he treated Sansa and the way he did Ned

Stark as well, too, and the way he's done the

whole Stark family, because everybody loves the

Stark family, and everything he did was against

them almost at a certain point. And yeah, but

it will be interesting to me how it goes on,

where it's like we're putting this Snively character

so high up the list at this point now. I wonder

if this is going to be the end of that type of

thing or we're going to get more characters that

we love to hate so much. Because I feel like

on this list there are a lot of characters, at

least in this quarter, a lot of characters that

we kind of love to hate, to be honest with you.

Dan, any other things that need to be said about

Game of Thrones? I guess the difference I would

see between Joffrey and, say, Cersei is that

there's actually, I think, a level of respect

for Cersei because you feel like she kind of,

in a way, earned. Some of what she's gotten,

like she's putting the effort in and she is like

there's some intelligence behind what she's doing,

where Joffrey is just there's not a redeeming

quality behind him whatsoever. So like DJ mentioned,

you hate him a lot more. And as they say in wrestling,

he has a lot of heat. So I think he's he in that

realm, he works as a character because you do

hate him and you just, you know. I think episode

after episode, you were waiting for that moment

for him to get his comeuppance because of he,

and not, I feel bad for the actor, but he does,

he just has a very punchable face. It's true.

It's true. No character up to this point has

appeared on more lists than Joffrey. So 60 %

is the upper echelon so far. Let's do our last

pick of today. Actually about 40 points ahead

of Joffrey. So a good distance here. We're going

to go to a character. Well, let's preface this

by saying one thing we haven't done today. We

have not gone pre -1900s today. Oh, boy. And

we're not going to, but we're going to go right

up to the brink. How about a novel that appeared

in 1900? Let's go to a female character, and

let's update that tally. Pirates 2, Witches 2,

The Wicked Witch. So the wicked witch here from

Wizard of Oz etc Appearing here at the last spot

for today number 26 just missing out on being

top 25 interesting Steve you had 42, I had 42,

and Dan, you had 43. So we were in agreement

with where the Wicked Witch should appear, but

up here at number 26. Steve, you go first. How

do you feel about the Wicked Witch showing up?

This is the Wicked Witch of the West. She's worse

than the other one was. Who killed my sister?

Who killed the Witch of the East? Was it you?

No. No, it was an accident. I didn't mean to

kill anybody. Well, my little pretty, I can cause

accidents too. You stay out of this, Glinda,

or I'll fix you as well. Oh, rubbish. You have

no power here. Be gone before somebody drops

the house on you, too. Very well. I'll bide my

time. And as for you, my fine lady, it's true.

I can't attend to you here now as I'd like. I'm

glad that Sheely showed up in the top 50 because

I think this is, when you think of evil and magic

and kind of sorcerers and just kind of an iconic

film villain, this one would obviously come to

mind because The Wizard of Oz is such an old

and iconic film that still is watchable to this

day, and it's been redone in various shows and

films. Such as like Once Upon a Time and other

shows like that and other various continuations

thereof of this stuff. Even the Oz the Great

and Powerful that came out a few years back showing

kind of a little bit of the origin of the character.

But yeah, I mean, it's just such a spiteful,

evil, mean person in the films that is. just

bound on getting these ruby slippers and power.

Talk about archetype, too, with the look of a

witch, the sound of a witch, and what we picture

in our heads, I guess, when we think of a witch,

I guess, is all encapsulated in this character,

at least in the film version. Dan, what do you

think of the Wicked Witch here showing up? I'm

very glad that she did. I mean, I think, like

most, I actually think I've read uh the actual

book of wizard of oz but when i think it was

the wicked witch i think of the movie for sure

and as a kid she did freak me out a great deal

like it's like like it's just um you know when

i think of witches i think of the wicked witch

witch of the west uh the look the you know the

the voice is just you know nail scratching on

a chalkboard uh you know She may not have the

evil repertoire of some of the characters, and

her weakness kind of is like, really? Like, that's

the thing that takes you out? But whatever. But

I think in the sense of, like, you know, Wizard

of Oz is one of the greatest movies of all time,

and she's a big reason for that, and maybe one

of the characters that spoofed the most as well.

So I think you can make an argument maybe she

should be a little bit higher, but... I think

she's a simple villain, kind of almost a fairytale

villain in a straightforward film, and she's

just evil, and I think it works well for the

movie. the wicked witch is the source of maybe

I believe my earliest nightmares because I had

a door to my bedroom that we were not allowed

to have shut. So it was propped open and there

was something hanging on the back, like on a

hook, a coat hook or something that projected

the look of a witch's hat onto my wall as a shadow.

So that is what I could see when I was like looking

out from my bed at the doorway was a wicked witch

hat and, and it freaked the crap out of me. So

I had something about the wicked witch, the white

witch. I don't like witches. So, um, I think

that the wicked witches is very worthy of being

somewhere on the countdown. I'm happy. 26 is

a decent spot. What do you guys think, DJ? Um,

I, I luckily, I guess grew, I didn't see wizard

of also later in life. So I didn't traumatize

me in my youth, but, uh, she is a pioneer of

not just female villains, but villains in general.

So I, I completely understand. She's I'm surprised.

She's, I will consider this low because of how.

she's affected so many people every you say wicked

witch of the west and it's really hard to find

somebody who doesn't know what the hell that

is so uh but yeah i completely understand her

being this high and uh why did she have water

there the one weakness i would no water man get

away from the water why do you have water there

she needed a morton joe to police the water around

her matt what do you think of the wicked witch

um two things well one dope ass slippers so i

want the slippers too if i was the wicked witch

it's like i want the ruby slippers too and two

you dropped the house on my sister yeah yeah

that's kind of true i'd be a little pissed off

too but i Yeah, and he's got an army of flying

monkeys, and that's creepy. Tearing apart a scarecrow,

basically disassembling a tin man, scaring a

lion even more, doing a bunch of horrible shit.

Targeting a child? Yes. Targeting another kid.

Targeting a child. I thought we were over this,

people. Come on. No, kids must die, apparently.

Kids must die. But like you were saying, Kevin,

the whole – I remember if anybody's been to MGM,

the old MGM studios in Walt Disney World when

they had the great movie ride, one of the greatest

rides ever. And you had the scene with the –

I remember as a kid, I was probably about seven

or eight years old, and that whole ride scared

me, the whole alien scene, Indiana Jones. But

the Wicked Witch thing scared me too because

I had never seen Wizard of Oz at a certain point.

And you have this – Lightning happened, all the

munchkins were running away, and something coming

out of the ground and, like, yelling at the conductor.

I thought it was real. I'm like, oh, my God,

this witch is here to kill us. So it's something

that, I guess, harkens back to, like, you being

a kid and being scary and the prototypical green

witch with a wart on her nose. That's the iconic

look for everything. So, I mean, right sneaking

right before the last quarter mark, I mean, I

think it's a great. um area for this character

being because it's it's Right at the iconic part

of this entire list. Yeah, absolutely. So that's

it for the picks today. The 25 have been revealed.

That means there's only 25 spots. I know we've

gone kind of long here today with lots of cool

characters to talk about, but let's real quickly

do a little wrap -up here. Matt, you first here.

No pre -1900 characters, so maybe you were right

with that being done, but we still have 25 picks.

Also, mostly a split here. Nine film, nine novel,

one TV, one cartoon. That's basically it. No

plays, no poems, no folklore, no games. But we

did get five comic book characters, three horror

film characters, only one Disney. So what's your

makeup of what we saw today? I like the list

because you have girl power. So girls were –

women were nicely represented I think in this

list so far, at least in this quarter of the

list. And a lot to talk about. Like you're getting

into that pop culture element now where you're

getting a lot more well -known characters. A

few kind of like outliers aside, but overall

I think the list was really, really solid. And

like I said earlier in the show, I mean seeing

some Stephen King representation is pretty awesome.

So good overall quarter. I really dug this part.

Yeah, speaking of that, speaking of Stephen King

and stuff like that, DJ, last week we had the

Robert Louis Stevenson and the Shakespeare episode

and the Simpsons episode. I guess today would

be the Game of Thrones episode, the Stephen King

episode, and I guess maybe comic books taking

a little bit more of a center stage. So any surprises

as far as today's reveal? I'm just glad that

books are dead. No, I'm happy that they're dead.

I'm just happy that comic books are finally getting

representation because for a while then I'm like,

maybe there are no comic characters because we're

reaching the top. I mean, I haven't heard a lot

of characters who, I mean, the fact that we got

Thanos and Darkseid today, I was just like, okay,

okay, okay, they're coming. Because I thought

there was going to circumvent them and we're

going to get maybe... three but i think in this

next 25 now that we've seen with racial ghoul

thanos dark side and whatnot we are going to

get those characters that i was very scared that

weren't going to even be on this list now that

i think are going to be there and i i don't i

we were asking last time if they're going to

be any more literary you know i think there might

be one more One more. You're holding out for

one more? One more I'm holding out for, yeah.

Steve, turning our attention, I guess, to the

final 25, because that's where it gets kind of

iffy now, is your character on the list in the

top 25 or not even in the top 100? Whose number

ones are not going to show up? Do you think you

can start predicting what's going to show up

here in the top 25, or is the diversity of this

list making it impossible to know what's coming?

Well, I don't think that there's... I think that,

yeah, the diversity is there, but I think that

we've kind of whittled out quite a bit of them

at this point. And I think that we're going to

start seeing, you know, like characters like

possibly Khan, the Joker, Darth Vader, Lex Luthor,

you know, Hannibal Lecter, you know, a lot of

characters like that are going to start popping

up the closer we get. Freddy Krueger, you know,

a lot of these are. ones that you kind of expected

be there for a villains list, and they haven't

even been hit yet. And we've kind of hit the

tip of the iceberg with the comic book villains

and some of the horror icons. So I think that

we're getting very close to hitting some of the

heavy hitters at this point. Yeah, we'll have

to wait and see. Dan, last word for today. Any

biggest surprise for today or biggest thought

going into the last episode here? Oh, wow, biggest

surprise. I guess maybe Predator being as high.

That was a little surprising to me. And I felt

like this portion of it, we weren't as all over

the place, per se, like from, you know, something

from the... like year 600 to year 2010. So it

felt a little bit more stable in that realm.

i'm thinking of like uh some of the characters

that haven't shown up yet and some that i thought

would make the top 100 and it's more than 25

so some characters that i were pretty certain

would make this list aren't going to be making

the list and i do wonder if my number one is

gonna end up making it because i i i was kind

of thought oh for sure but now that i think about

it and i'm looking at kind of what what's ahead

and some of the characters that you feel like

will be here it's i don't know like There's a

lot of great comic book villains we haven't talked

about. There's a lot of great film villains we

haven't talked about. There's a lot of great

horror villains. And so it's going to get tricky.

There's not much room left. Yeah, that is for

sure. Just to give the quick rundown for today,

we had no pre -1900 characters, and we only had

one. 2000 character so every other character

besides hans landau was from the 1900s so that's

kind of where it went today we'll have some more

statistics at the beginning of next episode but

now it's time guys to get nervous to get worried

is your favorite character gonna make the list

at all or are you gonna be angry at this list

when all is said and done and whose number ones

aren't showing up so that's the stuff to think

about we will be back though next time to reveal

those 25 characters and then to get the ultimate

opinions on the overall list i can't wait to

see some of the reactions I don't think anybody's

going to be able to predict all top 25. That

would be almost impossible with me looking at

the list here. So we will see what happens there,

and then we'll see how it all boils down to as

far as sources and characters and creators and

actors who played them and all that kind of stuff.

So thanks for joining us today, Steve, Dan, DJ,

and Matt. You guys will all be back, so nobody's

done listening to you guys rant and rave about

these characters like we like to do. Keep the

comments coming. Go to geekcastradio .com and

leave your comments on the episode. post and

let us know what you like what you don't like

and what your predictions are for the final 25

you can also interact with us on Facebook and

Twitter we've given that information multiple

times so we won't do it again right now so that's

it for today tune in next time for numbers 25

through number one tune in next week for a much

better episode for now though courage and Stacy

from VO Buzz Weekly. And you are listening to

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