Superman: Doomsday Review

Beyond good, beyond evil, beyond your wildest

imagination. Welcome again to Animation Aficionados.

This is a special crossover episode we're doing

with Tooncast Beyond. We are going to be talking

about the DC animated movies. These are the direct

-to -DVD animated feature films that Warner Brothers

and DC Comics made in the late 90s into the 2000s,

into the 2010s. I'm your host Ben, and we're

joined by my co -host, TV's Mr. Neil. Fusion,

ha! And we also have Mike Blanchard here. Well,

what was that introduction? And we also have

Mike Blanchard here from Tooncast Beyond. Yes.

This was my idea, dammit. This is my show. You

only get to do the introduction. Now for Tooncast

Beyond Listeners, this will be episode 2. This

is starting our DC Universe animated movie spotlight.

We will be running this from episode 2 to episode

14. We're going to start with Superman Doomsday

and go all the way up to next, I think it's February,

next February's Justice League Doom feature.

uh... and these did not start in the late nineties

been the started uh... two thousand six i believe

two thousand six two thousand seven is when they

started a series of reviews they have to correct

you was two thousand seven september eighteen

two thousand right but you said that in the late

nineties two thousand twenty tens is what you

said originally and it was not done in the late

nineties i apologize for that oversight it's

uh... they made a lot of they made a lot of in

the future films in a very short amount of time

then Exactly. They're just like the Beatles.

They made a lot of albums in eight years and

then they lived on an infamy after that I Love

George Harrison's music but moving on with with

the Superman doomsday this is basically this

basically a distillation of what is one of the

most infamous comic storylines in the 90s, The

Death of Superman. It's a distillation, a simplification,

where they trim unnecessary characters, mix certain

characters together, and basically shorten the

entire storyline to fit better in a movie format.

And I gotta be honest, Was kind of underwhelmed

by this by this film. I I watched it. I tried

to find something I would like in it But overall

it was underwhelming for me Yeah, this movie

and it's funny that this movie basically as you

said takes What was death of Superman just wasn't

issue said the black issue 75 it was like a whole

series It was like a whole comic run, right?

It was it was about a year's worth of comics

from four separate titles because you have to

remember Superman ran in four different titles.

There was adventures of Superman Superman action

comics and the fourth one escapes me right now

basically back in the 90s they already sport

house, you know and Essentially if you can't

if when DC was really coordinating this with

the editor -in -chief They released one of these

comics every week and it's a different team with

each comic, but they like coordinated Well, they

had that they had that Tom Grummet and Carl Kessel

working on one title. I think it was adventures

it had Yeah, Dan Juergens working on I believe

it was and I'm probably wrong about this I believe

he was working on action comics Dan Juergens

It was either action or just Superman that he

was working on and and basically you had two

two other teams that were working on the other

two titles and they decided to make a you know,

a really long story called the death of Superman

and this is just for background what happened

is a Storyline was there's this alien that that

was buried in the earth that's called doomsday

that and by the way, there was a lot of playing

behind it because The version of the Justice

League, the dooms they fought were basically

the scrubs. Because there was no Wonder Woman,

there was no Green Lantern, there was no Flash,

there was no Martian Man Tether. Their team consisted

of Fire, Ice, Guy Gardner, not Green Lantern

at the time, that was back when he had the yellow

power ring, and a black guy called Blood Worn.

I know. There's Marvin and Wendy in there, too.

Oh, Maxima was there, too. I forgot Maxima. Oh,

yeah. You got the shit beat out of them. Oh,

my God. Maxima, don't even get me started. Oh,

yeah. Like I said, this was this is like the

loser version of the Justice League. And basically,

it was all these guys and Superman and. All of

them got trails, except for Superman and Superman

finally. at the end of the Death of Superman

story finally died. And then there was the funeral

for a friend story, which was a one issue story,

but it was a beautiful one where finally the

real Justice League is back and they're all wearing

the black armbands and they're having a funeral

for Superman. And then there was what they called

the Reign of the Superman, which was where there

were four people that came that said that they

were the new Superman. Actually three people

said they were the new Superman that there was

the eradicator They had the the yellow visor

there was there was steel what? Steel who who

actually when I was waiting to say he wasn't

Superman. He was just doing this in Superman's

honor there was cyborg Superman who turned out

to be a Hank Henshaw the villain from an earlier

story, which was actually a spoof of Fantastic

Four and And the fourth one was Connell Superboy,

who was a clone. Not a Superman, but a clone

of just a human clone with his genetic structure

to be modeled to be as Kryptonian as possible.

And essentially what happened was, it turns out

none of these guys were Superman. Because the

real Superman was being revived in the Fortress

of Solitude and was wearing a black costume and

had long hair. He had a mullet. Yeah, so begins

the saga of the super mullet. Essentially, there's

a lot of lead -in to this because this is back

when Lex Luthor was in a clone body and posing

as his own son, Alexander Luthor, and he had

an Australian accent and long flowing red hair

and a red beard. Oh yes, I remember those. So

they basically condensed a year's worth of comics

into a 70, 80 minute film. That's true, but like

I said, if you ever pick up the Death of Superman

trade paperback, you have to understand it's

more than just a year's worth of comics. Like

I said, the events that led to the scrub version

of the Justice League that was in this story

is an interesting one. And the story about everything

else is... is, you know, like the you know, the

story about Lex Luthor's clone body. It was another

story, you know, they say Lex Luthor's brain

was the name of the trade paperback for that

one. Oh, my God. Now, the way this came about,

if I remember correctly, is that you had these

four teams that would like meet every week and

discuss how they're going to connect all four

of the books. And every week, someone would just

jokingly say, let's kill them. Yeah. And finally,

finally, the editor in chief said. Okay, and

the idea was the four teams were saying were

were said, okay What was what would be your idea

of how you bring Superman back and the four teams

said four different ways and finally You know

the other says well, let's do all of them Yeah,

and like I said turns out that none of them were

the real silver man it's the one in the black

suit and and yes, this movie is basically a condensing

of it, but I think that's part of what makes

it lose its charm because because three you know

three out of the actually all four of the supermen

from the reign of the supermen stories are wildly

famous and popular in a big part of the superman

mythos to this day steel is a huge part of the

mythos superboy is a big part of the mythos eradicator

is was instrumental in a lot of the new Superman

stories as And and Hank Henshaw was an ongoing

Superman villain for the longest time it to just

condense it to just some random Superman clone

I Think was more of a disservice to the story

than this then then a strength of the story Yeah,

now this this movie in this entire series Comes

just off the heels of them ending Justice League

And this is what Bruce Tim and his his people

that he put together wanted to do Afterwards

they wanted to do direct to DVD films, and I

love that they're doing this I love the fact

that they're not for the most part in most of

these films. They're not pulling any punches

They don't honestly give a crap about censorship

because these are the very first ever PG -13

movies because of all the violence and and everything

else that's in them Yeah, Superman literally

puking up a bucket worth of blood. Yeah, and

and you know what that actually kind of turns

me off a bit because It just doesn't seem you

know, it seems like they did that just to do

it, you know that you know, they increase the

the increase the violence for the sake of just

increasing the violence versus doing it because

it was actually a perfect time to do it. And

like I said, I think this was the first step

to the other much better, in my opinion, later

direct to DVD movies. But this was a necessary

step. This was definitely a necessary step. Yeah,

this was a project that they wanted to launch

with. Most everyone in the world knows who Superman

is. He is very popular in culture these days.

And I love how they worked into a bunch of nods

to the other Superman projects. You've got stuff

from Superman the Animated Series in here, stuff

from the Fleischer Superman cartoons, the bullet

car from the Bulleteers. And you even have Kevin

Smith in a little special cameo. As much as I

like Kevin Smith's movies, I don't care that

he cameoed here. Well, it's based off of a speech

he made at a college when they asked him about

his experience with Superman Lives. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. I imagine everyone's familiar with that.

Giant freaking spider. Yeah. It's basically Kevin

Smith says did we really need to see him destroy

a giant mechanical spider and then he cups his

his hands over his mouth as a child lame Now,

one of my notes says, and I know this is factually

accurate, but the character of Mercy, Lex's assistant,

originally appeared, obviously, in Superman the

Animated Series in the 90s as his chauffeur slash

bodyguard. In this film, she's his corporate

assistant. Well, that also happened in Justice

League. She took, oh, well, she didn't take over

the company, but he left her in... Yeah, actually,

she kind of did. Well, he left her in Char. I

mean, who else is going to do it? She did kind

of, yeah, you're right, she kind of took it over,

but I mean... I like the fact that they're still

using the two very, you know, different versions

of Mercy. And of course, James Marsters, who

voiced Lex here, also portrayed the character

of quote unquote brainiac Milton Fine in Smallville.

As much as I like James Marsters, I just don't.

He did a pretty good performance except for the

part, except for the broke back scene. Yeah.

I don't know what else to say about that scene.

I don't know any other word to describe it. Why

can't I quit you? Yeah Yeah That's that's exactly

what it was. Yes, so let's talk about the other

cast I'm just gonna run them down really quickly

here You got Adam Baldwin as Clark Kent slash

Superman and Hayes as Lois Lane worse. Thank

you So you're in this huh was Maggie Sawyer in

this I don't think No, she is not to my knowledge.

No the lesbian joke Yeah You have Jimmy Olsen

with an earring Yeah, the other voice actors

you got John DiMaggio as as toy man Tom Kenny

is the robot Suzy Kurtz as Martha Kent Cree summer

as mercy graves ray wise is Perry White. I thought

that was interesting casting Adam Wiley as Jimmy

and then the rest of them are you know newscasters

and They made Toy Man, like, not creepy like

he was in the animated series, but kind of like,

you know, the other kind of creepy, like, lives

with his mom and drives around in a van creepy.

Let's see, I found Toy Man in the animated series

to be just funny. He wasn't creepy at all to

me. What? In Superman the Animated Series? You

didn't find that doll mask creepy? Not as creepy

as his appearance here No, no, like I said, but

this is this is full -on drives around in a van

lives of his mother's house And do you want to

see my puppy? Oh? Good lord Oh He went there

ladies and gentlemen, yes beyond does not endorse

the comments of Neil why do All right, so What

I want to talk about is Adam Baldwin and Anne

Heish. Alright, Adam Baldwin is great in anything

he does except voicing Superman. I did not believe...

He wouldn't be my fifth choice, that's for sure,

and... He's not the worst voice actor that has

voiced Superman, I'll give you that, but at the

same time, he's still not one of my favorites.

And I gotta be honest, this design for Lois Lane

in this movie did not do anything for me. It

was the most plain version of Lois Lane I've

ever seen. it yet it it doesn't have doesn't

have the awesome you know skirt from the enemy

series and didn't have the pure sexiness of all

-star that's dirt yet he had that skirts that's

all it used to be said is that skirt that skirt

and and and haze i'm sorry she's no fucking voice

actor she just isn't uh... you know as ben said

for me this was the blandest Version of Lois

animated ever This movie kept throwing me because

I kept expecting her to say something about lava

seeping up from beneath the city. Oh You also

have you also have like I said just some really

off scenes here like for instance the scene where

the clones of a man removes the the kill switch

from his brain now see that's the only scene

in the entire movie that i absolutely love i

thought that was hilarious uh see only only only

mike blanchard would think you know you know

lobotomizing yourself is hilarious hey well he

was already kind of lobotomized he really didn't

have any sort of moral plus he's a clone it doesn't

matter it's an actual human well he's not a human

he's a kryptonian so there You know what I meant?

You also have some really badly written dialogue,

like when they had the real Superman show up

in the black costume. It's like, bad Superman,

badder Superman. I'm like, oh god, Jimmy, shut

the fuck up. Yeah. I really did like Swoozie's

performance as Martha though. She's not the best

voice for Martha, but for this movie and this

feel of this animation, I liked it. I thought

she portrayed Martha very well. kill the clone

yeah yeah that's right it's no it is that there's

nothing there's nothing around there there's

no disney death in superman fucking kills the

clone yeah in i don't know that just seems wrong

to me it does it no i know i i agree i mean you

know even though it is a clone It should have

been maybe he should have done it off like just

slightly off -screen or something like that,

but I mean that's just a very unsettling visual

Even though these movies are pg -13 they are

mainly for you know People that are like us that

are fans of you know comics and animation and

stuff like that You know still you can't I wouldn't

even show this to a 13 year old. These are not

movies for kids. These are the creators, Bruce

Timm and his team. These are them going after

what they want to do because they are comic geeks.

For some people that have weak stomachs, some

of the scenes in this movie and as well as the

rest of the films that are in the spotlight here,

they're... People aren't gonna watch them because

of that or they might just skip over that scene

But still I mean overall this this movie this

is not one of my favorites out of the entire

ones that they've done so far I will actually

have to go on the limb and say this is actually

the worst of the ones because in you know Again,

you have to keep in mind that when I say worst

that doesn't mean that's necessarily terrible

as much as it's just the worst out of all the

DC originals because you have to also remember

You know, they actually have direct competition

for Marvel and Marvel's direct to DVD and made

films are a pile Yeah, I mean, you know if if

you're gonna do the DC versus Marvel comparison

granted You know DC has a couple of ones that

I don't care for but overall I would watch I

would watch this movie over any Marvel anime,

you know The Iron Man animated movie or the Avengers

animated movie I would watch this over those

any day next Avengers animated movie Seriously

Honey Stark is their mentor and he's like an

old man. Yes, and he's waiting for the world

to break I bet they use that theme song No, it's

it's it's well the sad thing is that it actually

has a better character design set than the Avengers

cartoon series, but we're digressing I just I

just Really didn't care for Superman Doomsday

and it's the one that I don't own because it

That tells you something. I don't own it and

I'm a big Bruce Tim fanboy and I don't know this

I think there's lots of missteps here. I think

a lot of missteps were based on the fact that

they wanted to do something more mature just

for the sake of saying it's more mature and That's

where the that's where the origin of these missteps

are like Superman puking that gal in the blood.

I mean god damn. You see how much blood that

was? Yeah. Yeah Here's what threw me it the movie's

called Superman doomsday, you know, I thought

it barely in it. Yeah. Yeah, he's I think he's

dead within the first 15 minutes. When it first

started, I was like, oh, man, they're getting

right into this. And then he dies. I'm like,

wait, this isn't the movie I thought it was going

to be. Wait. Oh, no. I kept thinking Doomsday

was going to come back for the end. No, that

didn't happen. And have the clone die fighting

Doomsday to get Superman a chance or something

like that. Superman's not a dirty murderer. And

as and what really throws me about this is the

fact that you basically have You know if in the

Lester cut Superman didn't you know reverse the

world We're in this movie Lois knows the secret.

She's sleeping at the fortress. That's just ah

That's not the way it's supposed to be like Like

Ben said, I know they were going for it. They

were going for the more mature. They were going

for, you know, starting off on a really good

movie didn't resonate so well with people. To

me, this almost, you know, diminishes what the

comic was. You know, this gives the comic a bad

name. You know and there are gonna be other of

these movies in the spa lie that I just don't

care for either Well, I think part of this is

when we when we did the interview with Marv Wolfman

And we asked them how crisis which is huge I

mean we talked about death of Superman being

huge and the reign of the Superman being huge

You know those those are pretty those are as

thick as the together There is about as thick

as a as a phone book, but crisis is even bigger

than that Yeah, crisis is just ever -spanning

and And basically, you know, could that be that

into a two -hour movie Marvel opens it? Absolutely,

but his idea was basically to distill to one

point of view and that's essentially what they

did here, but it didn't work because Like I said,

there is so much of the mythos of the current

Superman mythos Well, at least until after the

new 52 that that that was tied into death and

rain that Is lost here because they trimmed and

I think they trimmed too much without without

keeping some of the essence Yeah Yeah, I mean

I totally agree and this is coming from someone

who has never read those comics I've seen them

here and there But I've never actually had a

chance like like back when that happened in the

90s when you had the death of Superman I Remember

all the news news items all the you know everybody

lining up at their comic shops to get I never

had a chance to get a copy of it but Just from

you know looking online about stuff about that's

in the comics and stuff. It's just like This

movie is, like Ben said, they trim too much out

of it. And while the movie does have a beginning,

middle, and end story, the story isn't that great.

And the dialogue isn't very memorable. You know,

I have to be honest. I have to be honest. When

I can remember a line from fucking Brainiac Attacks

over this movie, that tells me something. Got

the tiki torches. Oh, yeah. Yeah, well actually

I do remember bad Superman and batter Superman

Because it was And because the whole idea was

Bruce Tim was playing on the image of Superman's

now in all black with a mullet with a gun Also,

he's basically solid snake with superpowers Yeah,

and he's fighting against the Superman's that's

dressed traditionally except for the fact he

has a hole in his head See that just made me

think of the clone Superman with like the exclamation

point above his head What he sees the real Superman

coming? Yeah, put in in post the Exclamation

sound from no gear solid. Oh Yeah, oh, yeah,

that's right I think that this movie just Was

a misstep. Let me put this way. This is definitely

better than brainiac attacks That's for damn

sure. This is better than Braniac Attacks, but

at the same time, you have two very different

movies there. I mean, Braniac Attacks, even though

it's not in the STAS continuity of the DCAU,

it's still the DCAU style, whereas this is something

completely different as far as the animation

goes. That's true. The one thing, I think it's

this movie, one thing that really pissed me off.

Understand that they wanted to design Superman

slightly different as far as the extra lines

on his face Dude Superman does not need a fucking

dent in his cheek It looks like somebody just

punched him and his skin never grew back. Well,

it was doomsday that punched him Regardless I'm

talking about before, dude. Well, part of the

problem is Bruce Timm's art style is so clean

that when he ever tried to add lines in for definition,

it's an experiment and this was a failed experiment.

Do you have anything else you want to say about

the actual movie or anything? No, not really.

Ben, do you have anything else you want to say

about the movie? Do we have anything we didn't

cover? Not really, but I do have to say whether

I recommend it or not. Okay, hold on. Hold that

thought. We here at Tooncast Beyond have, we

are the IGN replacement crew. Everything that

IGN ranks on their website, all of their top

lists, we at the Ecast Radio Network hate it.

So we have a one to four scale. Number one is

don't watch this even if it's free. Number two

is worth a watch if it's free on TV. Number three

is worth adding to the Netflix list, which...

It's one of the DC movies that actually isn't

even on the Netflix streaming It's DVD only for

that and number four is this is a must buy it

must add to your DVD collection. So Ben one to

four. What do you give it? I would say if you're

able to watch it not the TV cut but actually

watch the DVD cut for free watch it because I

think that everyone has to see this just to see

Just how damn bloody this gets just just for

the damn sake of it and Just sort of bask in

it and say okay wonder when there's fucking gold

now Neil what do you rank it? I'll give it a

number two An extra flush Oh I will also give

it a two. I actually, back when I was collecting

DVDs, I actually did buy it. I bought it for

the special features, because after I watched

the movie I was like, that kind of sucked. The

special features on the two disc edition are

very well done. You have four episodes from Superman

the Animated Series. You have a couple of behind

-the -scenes looks at how they made this movie.

So the special features on the DVD are nice,

but I don't... think that the special features

in this case rank you to buy the DVD. So I will

give it a two as well. And as I said, it is on

DVD. But before we get to that, we also talk

about what the movie has made. And I told Neil

this off air, and I sent him the link. I'll have

to send it to Ben as well. Out of all the DC

Universe animated original movies, Superman Doomsday,

I guess, people love bad movies. It is made the

most out of all of them. What the hell is wrong

with you people? Think about it like this. People

bought this without knowing what it is at first,

without even seeing it. They bought it, you know,

that's a sale. They count that as a sale. And

think about if the other ones don't perform as

well and this is the first one, that's the correlation.

Right, this one made $9 ,447 ,577 in gross. The

units were sold were $683 ,383. The other ones

we will talk about as we go along, but I will

just, I'm not gonna tell you guys in what order

these are in, but I'm gonna go ahead and go down

the line. One of them so far has made $1 ,355

,000. Others have made $2 ,436 ,658 ,678. and

five so you know stay tuned to these spotlight

episodes where we will tell you which ones made

what but none of them have eclipsed uh the nine

million dollars that this one has it's over nine

million it's over nine million what nine million

And as I said before, it is on DVD. It's on Blu

-ray. Actually, the Blu -ray was delayed. I don't

have any new information on the Blu -ray release.

Well, why do you want to watch crap in high density?

Yeah, high definition. Yeah, that's true. And

so we all gave it number two, so this is definitely

an upper -decker of a movie. Yeah, and with that,

Tooncast Beyond is gonna take a break, we're

gonna head to some ads, and we'll come back to

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when you register. We're back and as per tradition

for Mike, we will do some final thoughts. Yes.

Final thoughts is this one's all right. It's

not the worst PG -13 animated movie out there,

but... It still doesn't... it just... ugh. There's

just too much stuff that I just didn't like about

this. Like I said before, the only scene I really

kind of got a kick out of was the, you know,

haircut lobotomizing scene. I guess I'm just

a sick bastard like that. I don't know. Neil,

what are your final thoughts on Doomsday? Oh,

boy. This... This movie... Watch... watch anything

else. Don't... don't... Watch this if it's free

like I said when we rated it. Um, I didn't really

care for this watch at all I don't know. I got

nothing. How about you Ben? They lost me with

the bucket of blood And on that note, thank you

for joining us here on the Tooncast Beyond Animation

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-5821. We hope you enjoyed this episode of Tooncast

Beyond, an animation aficionados, and wish you'll

join us next time when we will be continuing

the DC Universe animated movie spotlight with

Justice League New Frontier. For now, I am TFG1Mike

with Ben, the host, and TVC Mr. Neal. Thank you

for listening. Until next time. Good night. Goodbye.

Uh, hello. Hello, Barry? Iris, I thought you

had to work tonight. I do, but I wanted to tell

you how much I miss you. You have no idea. Come

on, how could you miss me? I mean, you're in

Las Vegas. Interviewing all those singers and

movie stars? It's the fast line. There are lots

of potholes in that lane, let me tell you.