Captain America: Civil War Review

This is The Brain, and you're listening to the

GeekCast Radio Network. Yes! You are now on the

inside of what I like to call the Circle of Trust.

We are all connected in a great circle of life.

You know something, Bert? What? I think you and

I are going in circles. It feels like we're going

in circles. The circuit is now complete. When

I left you, I was but the learner. Now I am the

master. Because it's a circle. Yeah, we heard

about the circle. Yeah, I swear familiar with

shapes. Hi, this is Craig. This is Chuck. And

this is Dan. And we are talking in circles brought

to you by The K -Cash. Radio network podcast

that is undergoing its own Civil War as we discuss

the biggest movie in America and the world and

that of course is Captain America the Civil War

but before we get to that, how's the week been

for you guys? Week's been not too bad. I've actually

started working out again. So that's always fun.

I've realized I've gotten big enough. I need

to get to put a stop to it started You know,

working out and being pretty strict on my diet

and stuff, I've lost five pounds so far, so.

Nice, nice. Yeah, it's, but I'm like, sore as

hell. Cause like, I'm doing like the mix of like

weightlifting and cardio, which they say is like

the best way to burn fat. Like a perfect mix

of the two. It is better than either of them

by themselves, they say. So I'm doing that, but

I'm doing like. Legit tough like I'm doing squats

and deadlifts and all that stuff and like my

legs are just so sore like oh My gosh, they're

sore for like four days, which happens when you

first start It just takes a few weeks for you

to kind of get conditioned. So I'm You know waiting

for that break -in point to arrive so that I'm

not Nearly as sorry still will be a little bit

after workouts, but yeah those first few weeks

are the roughest Yeah, it's like when something's

like on the other side of the room. It's like

I I don't think i'm gonna get up So it's somehow

working out makes you lazier. It's just like

so much Yeah, they wanted me to the one day at

work. They wanted me to help them move tables

out of the conference room and they wanted to

take them downstairs and stuff. And I'm like,

yeah, I can't do stairs right now. I'm like,

it doesn't work. I could barely walk myself,

let alone carry a table. So it was kind of funny,

but it'll be worth it in the end. Greg, how's

things going with you? I'm also working out mine's

been going on and longer and nobody cares about

me working out But I've been trying I'm trying

out this new pen as we podcast It's this Pentel

brush pen that I I just got along with Deadpool

on blu -ray So I'm I'm playing with the pen since

I can't watch the Deadpool movie and podcast

at the same time I picked that up today as well

Deadpool blu -ray nice. I feel like we just talked

about that movie when it came in theaters and

started That one had quick turnaround. Usually

you're waiting forever for stuff to come out.

It's funny I ended up getting to that Walmart

because it was it was the blu -ray DVD combo

thing and it was only 20 bucks and The lady at

the checkout thing. She's like this thing's been

selling like crazy all week. She's like what

is a new PlayStation game? i was like no it's

a movie she's like oh really i don't even pay

attention i can tell like clearly the most oblivious

person in the world it's like what is this congratulations

you're one of the 12 people that never heard

of the deadbolt movie i know seriously wow that's

funny insane That's crazy. My week's been going

pretty well. We actually were off last week,

unfortunately. I went to Scranton, visited Chuck,

Greg, and a bunch of other people. We got to

see Civil War together, so it was a great bonding

experience. But I did find out something really

cool. I felt like this personal gift to me. I

don't know if you guys have watched any of those

or heard of the CinemaSins, everything wrong

with videos? Yes, and I saw your Facebook post.

Yeah, so someone I don't know how deep this is

gonna go but someone had Everything wrong with

everything wrong with videos and I loved it I'm

not a big fan of the cinema since things like

I just find that they're very overly nimpicky

and a lot of their nimpics aren't really correct

and they're just I can go on forever, but basically

I feel like it's purposely negative criticism

just to be negative and it's it's often Basically

making false critiques just for hollow jokes

and what this did was basically Obliterate a

lot of their complaints that they have which

I found very fascinating and I just I don't know

I kind of hate that type of like internet criticism

that exists anymore like just like the Let me

just do a video about what why everything sucks.

So but so that was when I was a lot of fun then

watching that and Would I like Greg mentioned

I put it on Facebook so you can check it out

and see if you also enjoy it So the one I posted

was on everything wrong with everything wrongs

with the age of Ultron So I'm just waiting for

the other one that's everything wrong with everything

wrong with everything wrong with see how deep

we can get get this to go so I Think it's only

starting but Today we know there's a lot to cover

and unpack with Captain America Civil War So

we're gonna take a quick break and when we come

back We're gonna do a nice general view review

for those 14 people who have not seen Civil War

one being the person that Chuck saw at Walmart

apparently probably has not seen this movie But

after that we'll then get into a spoiler spoiler

rific review So if don't worry if you have not

seen the movie We'll try to at least give you

something to listen to so we'll be back in just

a bit Hello, geeks. Want a podcast that covers

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Then check out Altered Geek Unlimited, where

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cover media news, TV, our favorite geek products,

and of course, your feedback. So get altered,

get geeky with the Altered Geeks every Friday

on the GeekCast Radio Network. All right, and

welcome back. So I figured let's start like I

mentioned we're gonna get into just some general

thoughts and similar to how we did a Batman v

Superman review after that we'll do a nice Spoiler

warning and get into the nitty -gritty details,

but starting on like the Batman versus Superman

review I think this will be a good review Perhaps

there's a good chance. I think I think you might

hear a few more positive comments than that one

But Greg I guess starting with you then overall

just general thoughts and feelings towards Captain

America Civil War. It was really great. I think

it's Top -tier Marvel movie. I think it's towards

the head of the line here Definitely better than

the last Avengers movie if you were a little

disappointed in that I think you will be better

off with this movie. It was done by the Russo

brothers who did Captain America Winter Soldier,

which was also another great movie. And they

continue in suit with this one. Got all your

characters in there and a lot of storyline, a

lot of characters. But unlike Batman versus Superman,

they know how to handle all those characters

and stories and get it into a formulation that

kind of fits together and makes sense and is

a lot of fun. Keeps you interested the whole

time. A lot of great action scenes going on they

stick true to the characters and their different

personas especially with Tony Stark and Captain

America you have all these characters I think

you had your review written up online somewhere

Dan and I read it so I'm kind of taking this

which I really liked that you could still focus

in on. It was definitely a Captain America movie

still and an Iron Man movie still. So it fit

in with that Civil War theme, even though there

are all these characters going around because

you could feel their sense of remorse going on

because of his ego. But you've got Cap who's

sticking to his guns and knows he's right going

on, which was really great that they stuck to

the characters like that. Black Panther comes

in. He's awesome. He's new into the storyline

here. And you've got Spider -Man, who was also

pretty great in here. He got an applause at our

movie theater, which I thought was kind of odd,

since we've only seen him in five other movies.

It's not like the first movie he's been in. So

that was kind of weird. Queens got an applause.

But then with the Queens, you saw, like, people

just break out in applause. Yeah. I didn't understand

that either. We're in Scranton. Why are people

applauding Queens? Wolverine's claws got an applause

in the apocalypse. trailer very bizarre we've

seen Wolverine multiple times before and a lot

of people don't like his movies for some reason

even though this last the last one out was pretty

decent with Wolverine in his solo but anyway

and we also got to see the hot It may the freaking

gorgeous Marissa Tomei in there doing a great

job Acting alongside I guess I won't say who

she was acting alongside in that scene because

I think that'll get saved for the spoiler section

I think but overall I thought it was really great

definitely in the top five maybe of Marvel movies

Great. Great. Yeah, I know Chuck, you know, Civil

War, you love the comics of awards, one of your

favorites. You've loved a lot of these films.

Cap's one of your favorite characters. So a lot

to live up to with this. Did it live up to your

high expectations? I did have high expectations

in this, like you mentioned. One time we did

a top five countdown. Civil War came in as my

number two all time favorite story. And I think

Cap is actually legitimately my favorite character.

But I would say absolutely it lived up to the

hype. This was one of the rare occasions where

I had huge expectations and it even blew past

those. I was extremely pleased with the film.

I think it was a perfect mix of, you know, they

did a great job mixing the action and the drama.

Like, even the down times I thought were really

intense and entertaining. Like, I really enjoyed

how they laid out the conflict. They set it up

beautifully. You know, they had some discussions

and some debates where they're sitting, sitting

down discussing, you know, the, the Sokovia Accords.

And, you know, it just kind of gave you a clear

understanding of why there are, there's this

rift in the team and there's people that disagree

and you can make points for each side. And it's

very clearly laid out and you kind of can understand

where each side is coming from. Unlike some other

movies, I think the conflict was clearly laid

out for you. He understood why they were fighting

which is a huge part of it because Coming into

it. That's all I heard from people is like why

are they fighting? Why they why they vendors

fighting? I've also heard that a lot especially

with older people. Yeah, and I'm like go to the

movie So I was glad they took the time to do

that and then it wasn't like campy like it was

It was very nice how they did it. They took some

careful steps to do that and it worked out great.

Like I mentioned, the action was sprinkled throughout.

Sounds delicious. I didn't think there was any

real lulls in the action. You sort of had a good

fight scene and then you had some intense...

backstory going on and then you kind of gently

roll into another fight scene and it was it was

a nice little roller coaster throughout. There

were no huge boring parts in it or anything like

that. Pretty much the norm that we've come to

expect from Marvel and especially the Russo brothers.

I'm really, really coming to like their stuff.

As I mentioned before, I think Winter Soldier

was possibly my favorite Marvel movie so far.

And I think this may have passed it out. So definitely.

Definitely very pleased when I walked out. I

guess it's kind of boring when you all agree,

but I think we might find some things we disagree

with with the movie. But when you're just talking

about general thoughts, I'll make it three for

three. And I really loved it as well. Going into

this, like I love the Marvel movies. You know,

Winter Soldier, I felt that was maybe going to

be the peak of the Marvel films. I know I liked

Age of Ultron I feel like I liked that more than

most but still it wasn't let down compared to

the Avengers and Ant -Man was good but you know

wasn't nearly on par I would think with like

Iron Man or something of that nature so I was

wondering if okay is Marvel just gonna get to

the point where you know they just simply can't

top themselves they're not gonna be able to do

another Avengers movie you're not gonna be able

to do another Winter Soldier and what they ended

up doing is kind of doing both with Civil War.

They took the spectacle that we got with the

Avengers and took, you know, the down -to -the

-earth, like, story -driven aspects of Winter

Soldier and put it all into this film. As Greg

mentioned, there's a lot here going on. There's

a lot of moving parts, a lot of characters, a

lot of things. It's like juggling wild, you know...

Basically just like juggling I guess tons of

different juggling is pretty tough just by itself,

Dan You don't need to add anything extra. That's

true. I can't juggle So I don't know why I try

to add an extra things to it I guess you could

ride a unicycle while you're doing it true on

top of a top of a trampoline. That's like on

a high wire what in high winds and I don't know

so just keep doing basically a Split on your

shoulder exactly, you know, we can go we keep

going and all that's trying to do what they're

doing, and I felt the Russo Brothers really handle

it well. It felt like everyone had a purpose

for the most part. No one felt forced in to a

great extent, and it just seemed to really just

all tie together very nicely. Ultimately, like

Greg mentioned, I think there's a lot going on

here, but at the heart of it, it's still, I think,

Captain America's story, and it's his dilemma

that he's facing. And yes, you know, Iron Man

has one too, but I feel... Steve Rogers is having

has a greater conflict to overcome because he

has these accords going on he certainly you there's

other aspects of Other surprises that occur that

thing affect his psyche and in a lot of ways

and then obviously he has The life of winter

soldier and what what that means and trying to

deal with all that so I think there's a lot for

him to deal with and I think that's good because

a lot of people tend to complain that Steve Rogers

or Captain America is a boring character. And

I don't think he is. I rally against that assessment.

And I think when you put him in a dilemma like

this, you can actually take some advantages of

having a guy who's very amoral and a boy scout

when you're putting him in a situation where

it's very difficult to figure out what is truly

the right thing to do. But yeah, so I again,

I loved it. I felt it was on par with the best

Marvel. So I still think I like Winter Soldier

a tad more, though I might enjoy it more on a

second watch because there's so much going on.

I feel like I probably missed a couple couple

action beats here and there. So it was it was

a good time. I just I just like how they were

able to keep so much focus on Captain America

with all these other characters in the movie.

I mean, that was astonishing to me. You have

essentially, I think there were like 16 major

characters in this. Obviously the two teams were

like 12 of them, but just to like balance it

out, like there was a huge focus on Cap and Bucky's

relationship, Cap and Pony, but it was like,

you really get inside Captain America's heart

kind of like to see like what makes him tick,

you know? You'll be in my heart I Feel like they

could have played they had an opportunity there

to play that song with it You get a chance to

see what makes him tick like he mentions about

his faith in people and Peggy's words kind of

echoing through Sharon and stuff like that and

you really start to see like how steadfast Steve

is in his beliefs and when he feels something

is right. And he always has his mind in the big

picture. Like, he knows things are going to work

out at the end as long as you stand up for what

you feel is right. And I think this more than

any other of the films he's appeared in has really

gotten down to the heart of the matter, I guess,

to phrase another song. Don't know that one.

I'm sorry. Been trying to get down. Okay. Never

mind. I think we touched upon this a little bit,

but we did see some huge new additions with this

film of Black Panther and Spider -Man, which

I haven't talked about. How do you guys feel

that they were incorporated within this movie?

Because you have some major characters there

with Spider -Man and Black Panther. maybe not

as major to the general audience as he is to

comic book fans. And with everything going on,

did you feel like they fit without it feeling

like a, you know, a forced tie -in where we had

with some of the other Marvel films, or did they

feel like they naturally flowed within the story

that was being told? I think Black Panther kind

of fit more than Spider -Man did, but they still

did a halfway decent job of getting them in there,

because I guess... Tony side just needed another

person on the team, I guess. I don't know. I

didn't feel like Iron Man or the Spider -Man's

appearance was as warranted as Black Panther's.

I felt like Black Panther was more intermeshed

within the movie with having his father in there

and everything and kind of his origin story in

there for the most part. Spider -Man, not really.

He was just kind of like, oh. Here's you fighting

a bad guy in an ugly costume. Let me help you

with that. Yeah. Yeah. Do you feel the same way,

Chuck? Yeah, I mean, I loved everything about

Spider -Man. Don't get me wrong, like huge geek

moments and everything. But when you actually

stop to think about it, it did kind of feel a

little forced. The guy and their team basically

to to kind of hold their own against Cap's team.

But Black Panther, I thought fit perfectly. Although

there were some things with this character I

could talk about later on I'll get into but I

thought he fit well overall and I guess one of

the reasons I liked him in there is because like

he provided sort of a different perspective for

the war that's going on like he wasn't really

on a side per se like he mentions he's against

the politics and everything but when you when

you see like the sort of the roundtable discussions

with the Avengers as they're debating these accords

and everything. You have you're able to watch

all those characters and their opinions unfold.

And it kind of it kind of makes it personal and

you could find at least one of the characters

to identify with. And if you can't, you kind

of have Black Panther there. Seeing this random

chaos that had this terrible tragedy that happened

to him and maybe you can kind of identify with

that. So there's sort of something for everybody

like you can kind of identify with this war and

what's going on. I think they pretty much have

it covered from it from every angle, even with

Spider -Man just being dragged in out of random.

Like, you know, he was kind of just sucked in

like, hey, come fight for us. And you don't even

know what you're fighting for. But. Most of the

bases were covered there and you could kind of

relate somehow, I think, at least unlike some

other movies that you really don't understand

why they're fighting. You can't put yourself

in that situation and say you would do the same

thing. Whereas this, it's giving you the liberty

to choose what you would do because there are

clear options and there's opinions to back up

those. Options and things like that. So I think

Having him in there just sort of added to all

of that and I love the art that he goes through

too. So Yeah, I think it's interesting you mentioned

clear options. I think there were clear options,

but it was In a sense, they're not clear because

they're There's no strong points on both sides

that it's hard to there's no clear right or wrong

answer, but I mean, there's the wrong Well defined

I think yeah, I get what you're saying. I would

but that's what I find sides, but kind of muddy

murky Decision. Yeah, you understood the motivations

behind why? Characters are making the choices.

They would even why someone like black widow

what side with Iron Man over Steve Rogers, you

know, she does kind of give an explanation of

the reasoning behind it and even though she chooses

that side, that conflict is still there, I think

with all of them in some way. And what's interesting

is that I felt with, oddly, with the registration

in the comic book, the Superhero Registration

Act, I was completely on the side of Cap. But

in this, I felt it even was better at giving

Iron Man legitimacy in what he was doing, more

so than in the comics. In the comics, I felt

like he was more, he was being... For lack of

a better word being a huge brick and here he

was a total asshole in the comics Yeah with here.

There's more of a sympathy behind it and As greg

mentioned in my review. I like about Tony. Sorry,

and I think what's russians understand about

Tony Stark is that He is an egomaniac, but he's

egomaniac in the sense of he takes as much credit

as he can, but he takes as much blame as he can,

which is why he will so drastically change his

opinions on things or make huge changes like

shutting down the weapons manufacturing of his

company when weapons are in the wrong hands or

while he'll be, you know, destroy all of his

armor when he feels like he's gone beyond that

or why he'll build Ultron to try to save the

world because he feels it's necessary after the

events of the Avengers and in this Although I

the moment itself. I didn't completely buy where

you see what kind of springboard boards his reaction

in his Agreement to signing these accords. I

felt like I understood it and I thought it was

a good way of making me like almost like in some

ways I backed him more than I did Cap though

I understood Cap's side I thought like okay like

this is making a lot of sense this is I get why

they're doing this but was that what I think

was interesting about this there was no minus

the villain that was there there was no like

overly villain side even General or I guess Secretary

of State General Ross when he was making his

proclamation of why they should do this He didn't

seem all that evil or he wasn't like the Ross

we saw in the Incredible Hulk film. He felt rather,

I thought he gave a good legitimate case and

I thought like, okay, yeah, that makes sense.

And I thought that made it even stronger and

I made the conflict felt earned when they actually

decided to finally start punching each other

in the face. You know, the big thing going into

this was team Iron Man or team Cap. Did you feel

like you felt more to one side or was it just,

you really just were enjoying the conflict as

- Was just enjoying the conflict as a whole but

I did kind of I was going towards cap Just cuz

I felt like Tony was being a little bit too critical

of himself and the people around him like you

can't save everybody It's impossible for everybody

even superheroes. So it's like He had to kind

of take a step back, which I think that's what

cap was doing. He understood understands that

with dangerous people around. You can't win all

the time. You can't win 100%. Even like, you

could win three quarters of the way of what you

want. Sometimes you could win a hundred percent,

but it's not always going to work out that way.

And it's still weighing on his conscience and

everything. But like, are we going to put soldiers

in jail that are over fighting wars for us when

they come back? Because it's just like, they're

doing the best they can. Yeah, well, that's why

that was a great moment with him and Scarlet

Witch, too. And I think when they were sitting

on the bed talking and, you know, he was kind

of talking about that. And like, you know, if

you sort of give up because you lost someone

and then, you know, maybe next time nobody gets

saved, which is which has a lot of weight. They

said it way more eloquent than I did. Right.

But it's you know, it's the same effect like

they. They definitely laid that out for you and

made it understood. I was definitely enjoying

the conflict for the most part. I wasn't quite

sure what was going to happen. I had some concerns

of what was going to happen at the end. But I

was pretty much all in for Team Cap because I

knew the circumstances for the most part, as

we all pretty much did. I was more, even in the

comic, I was... more on Cap's side and everything.

But like you mentioned, the comic was easier

to root for Cap because Tony was being a total

dick. But even in this movie, I thought like,

you know, he started out kind of for the right

reasons, but he really started coming off the

rails as it went on, I thought. And he started

acting more and more douchey as it went on, in

my opinion. So it was kind of easier as the movie

goes on to sort of root for Cap's team. Just

the fact that I love how well. I shouldn't say

that. That's a that's kind of a spoiler thing.

But I'll just say there is there's some some

switching that goes that goes on. And I love

everything behind that. And that's exciting,

too. So it just makes for makes for a great ride.

You know, it's interesting you say you felt that.

Tony Stark became more juicy as it went on because

I didn't I don't know maybe maybe I would see

that more in a second viewing but didn't get

that to start off with and what I thought was

interesting and I agree regarding like the the

blame for the collateral damage how it's it's

you're kind of blaming something that's inevitable

but I thought it was set up beautifully because

what you saw happen was were the Avengers vigilantes

as they say were they Too powerful or we know

with the acting do they need some oversight and

I think that was to me the most interesting debate

going on because it does make sense when you

think about it when would you really want this

force of you know super power being having complete

say in basically being able to go to wherever

they want whenever they want and we do see then.

Collateral damage that may have not have caused

if they weren't there yet Maybe they were trying

to solve a bigger problem and me perhaps saved

many more lives than they that were lost But

I do think that idea of having no control Over

them whatsoever can be problematic So I thought

that I thought was the key that made this one

work over say other movies and show and debates

and Superheroes fighting each other. Yeah, it's

definitely it's definitely Easy to see each side

of it, like I mentioned before, but it's tough

to disagree with Caps viewpoint as well about

how like, you know, if they don't want you to

go to a certain place, like, how can you just

turn your back on people dying and stuff like

that? And that's especially with him, like you

mentioned, why it was such a great focal point

of the movie for him. with this being such a

tough decision for him. Like that's what made

it so enjoyable because it's down to this like

extremely intense decision. It's like, you know,

you want to do the right thing and be sort of

governed and kept in line and check and everything,

whatever you want to call it. But you also you

don't want to turn your back on terrible situations.

And, you know, unfortunately, it reflects things

that happen in real life and that stuff happens

every day. So that's that's what makes it. Exciting

and it makes it so kind of Gut -wrenching or

whatever you want to say Yeah, I think that's

kind of the key difference between like Stark

in and see Rogers where I think Steve Rogers

is more of a realist where, you know, you have

Stark, who's more of the futurist where he wants

everything to work a specific way. And like he,

and if it doesn't, he wants to do everything

to fix it where Steve Rogers, I think he understands

that there's going to be bumps along the way

and some things are unavoidable. So because of

that, just that fundamental divide is just going

to, I think, be the key difference between them,

which makes them great when they're together,

but also why they can so Easily the part when

you when you when you put them in such a situation

like this Yeah, I think it's important not to

overlook the fact that you look at how many people

Cap has lost over the years. Yeah, and he's pretty

much lost everyone that he's known from his from

his old life All the howling commandos that he

fought with and everything he has a ton of respect

for all those guys that he fought with and All

his old war buddies and everything and he knows

the sacrifice that they that they gave For their

country and for the right thing. So like he's

kind of I don't want to say used it, not to ever

get used to it, but he respects that sacrifice.

And I think Tony's just like, he's a little bit

more fragile, sort of, and that he doesn't want

to lose anybody. He's so traumatized by the loss

of his parents, and he really can't stand the

weight on his conscience of another loss. That

sort of thing but cap has lost so many people

but he it's not in vain He knows what what they've

done and respects that and he moves on. Yeah,

I was sure like c rogers was someone who who

can't survive without war where Tony sarkis the

man always trying to end it though in a way maybe

not I think there's a great like I love one of

my favorite parts of the film is a conversation

that they have like right before The accords

and like they're in I think it's I guess not

shield headquarters, but they're in like almost

like a war room and they're just talking about

how basically both of them can't quit this lifestyle

even they're basically kidding themselves when

they try to say that they can which is I thought

was a good point that that they made when Stark

even references like Iron Man 3 and like how

like yeah he did that but it really he was just

he was just really kidding himself so anything

general you guys want to talk into before we

get into specifics and and spoil the hell out

of this movie what did you think about uh the

length i know they said this was the longest

marvin movie to date did you notice it being

longer because i certainly didn't no it was it

was it was super quick for me like i i did not

notice the length whatsoever i know about greg

if that that wasn't an issue for you at all it

went by in a flash wrong publisher sorry yeah

it went by really easy and really quick it felt

like we weren't in there very long at all At

no point did I question like I was just gonna

go over, you know wonder what time it is like

at no point did that even enter my mind so I'd

be totally fine if they Did that more often?

Every time I felt like I was maybe a small lag

like another huge thing when you come in and

like Completely reanalyze it like right when

spider -man comes into the film like it was I

think was that right at the right time because

it was getting super serious and it was like

You know, you needed some sort of reprieve and

that came and I think it just brought an entire

new life to it and then you had the the Airpoint

sequence shortly after that which I thought was

freaking amazing I think it goes down as one

of the best action sequences in all comic book

history It just the way it was handled and just

all the different powers were used in fun ways

It was funny and heartfelt and I don't know.

It was everything I would want in the Civil War

movie, basically Yeah All right. Well, I think

I think we want to get I think there's a lot

of stuff nipping at the bit that we want to get

into regarding specific so If you are that Walmart

cashier or the 13th of people have not seen Captain

America Civil War probably want to stop go back

and do something else because we're gonna get

into nifty -difty spoilers, so Nifty -difty nifty

-difty spoilers nifty -difty sat on a wall. So

he did he had a great fall It did it did so Chuck

you man. I think you were gonna bring something

up previously That was a spoiler, but you wanted

a hand back. Maybe we can start there Yeah, it

was in reference to somewhat characters Sort

of switching sides in a way And I wanted to talk

about specifically black widow and black panther.

I guess you could say I Mean they didn't switch

sides per se it's not like in the middle of the

fight. They stopped and was like wait, this is

wrong and then start fighting the other guy.

But you see Black Widow kind of stop Black Panther

and let Deve and Bucky take off in the Quinjet

so they can get to Moscow to stop Zemo. But you

kind of look at her scenes and the way she's...

really apprehensive about the fight to begin

with. Like even when they're at the airport and

they're running towards each other, she's kind

of the one that lets out this big sigh and she's

like, oh, this is going to be interesting, you

know, or something to that effect. And like she's

totally unsure about it. Like she's really not

sure what she wants to do yet. And like you could

obviously tell her closeness to Cap when she

on her way to Vienna, she stops at London and

she mentions to Cap about the signing and he

says, why are you here? And she's like, well,

I didn't want you to be alone. Like, so they

You know, they're clearly referencing how close

they've gotten since the missions they've run

together and the time they spent in Winter Soldier

and everything like that. So I liked, I liked

that dynamic a little bit and how they were kind

of working with their relationship a little bit.

And then obviously you see back at the Avengers

compound, you see Black Widow and Tony start

kind of having that little discussion. And she,

that's the moment she kind of like really like

gets ticked off at Tony and you know, sees that

he's kind of like, I don't know, in my opinion,

he's kind of getting a little, I don't want to

say crazy, but he's kind of getting a little

obsessive and stuff like that. And, you know,

she obviously tells him I'm not the one that

has to watch my back and stuff like that. So

whether anyone else felt like that or not, I

don't know. I think she did too, Chuck. Yeah.

I think she kind of just felt this, this loyalty

to Cap and like, you know, she just felt the

need to let him do what was right, what needed

to be done in the situation. obviously depended

on the situation, but they happen to be facing

the threat of five more even deadlier Winter

Soldiers. But also, Black Panther, at the end

of the film, we see him kind of give up his quest

for vengeance and everything, and in the post

-credit scene... he's sort of doing a favor for

Bucky and Steve by keeping Bucky there and protecting

him and everything and even vowing to really

buckle down and protect him if anyone should

come for him and if Ross sends anybody to find

them and you know He has the great line where

he says let them come or let them try something

like that. So I thought And also, I like the

part in there where he said both the Winter Soldier,

Bucky, and my father were victims. They were

both kind of taken advantage of. Yeah, I thought

that was interesting, you know, how he came around

and came to realize that and stuff. And I guess

at that point, it was I don't know if it was

like he's not into the politics like we discussed,

but he's noticing that there was a similarity

between Bucky and his father and they were caught

in this crossfire thing so he's kind of kind

of doing that as a courtesy because he believed

it was the right thing to do so he's kind of

more with cap at this Exact moment in time, but

that doesn't have to stay that way but I just

thought it was interesting how that kind of happened

and Obviously roadies with Stark till the end

And he kind of reaffirms his stance on it at

the end and he's you know He's not budging at

all. So you kind of have like Stark roadie and

vision left on their team because Spider -man

is even a question mark to me because he really

didn't even know why he was fighting Which I

thought was kind of funny because see the exchange

or he's like, oh, yeah He just told me that he

needed help and that you know We were doing the

right thing and it's like he he realized he has

no clue what this is about And he's what he's

fighting for and everything. He's just kind of

doing what he's told. He's trying to impress

Tony Stark Exactly that's kind of his like his

mentor that his guy he's looking up to he really

wants to impress him He has an interest in technology

just like him. They have a lot a lot of things

in common So yeah, that's understandable Yeah,

I like that that arc that that the panther does

have and You know someone important has to die

I feel like every Marvel character or every comic

book character parents don't last very long and

I thought it was intriguing watching him go through

this and in a way he felt almost like he felt

more Batman and Batman didn't Batman be Superman

like how he just Kind of would strike at the

right moments. He kind of investigated situation

and he was lurking in the shadows Looking for

the right opportunity to kind of claim his vegans

and I have been waiting for Black Panther forever.

Like I remember years, like one of the first

podcasts or when I early in the podcast, we did

like an episode talking about what we want to

see Marvel future, like what movies we want to

see come out. And I was one of the, my first

ones I wanted to see was Black Panther movie.

And I cannot be more ecstatic for what we got.

Like I, I didn't know how Chadwick Boseman would

do in the role and he freaking nails it. Like

he just, from the voice to the way he carries

himself, he just in the look of the Black Panther,

the costume is awesome. I hope they don't change

anything about it. You wouldn't. think that would

work. But yeah, I just enjoyed and just the way

he would move and he felt differently because

movements are different compared to others like

he would like just the way he fought. I think

that was a good way to differentiate him compared

to everyone else. And I don't know, I'm really

excited for what they were doing. I think they

really introduced him and made him really a kickass

character from the beginning and how he would

be able to kind of go toe to toe with Cap and

kind of hold his own, which was like a dream

come true watching that happen. I was like, yes,

more of that, please. I want to see more of that.

Well, Chad Chadwick Boseman's good at that stuff

because I remember watching the Jackie Robinson

movie and You know, he's good at those subtle

like sort of body body English and body maneuvers

and stuff like that because he really He really

nailed down the the style of running that Jackie

Robinson had like running the bases and stuff

He had a very unique stuff and he got that down

to a T and I think it Kind of what you're talking

about is the same thing he did for this movie

like very Very unique fighting style and the

way he carried himself and it really like came

through and kind of kind of shined He felt like

a king like he felt like he would be like a king

and warrior like he had yeah And even I mean

he was he james brown too. So like he's just

he's got the guy I got some range for sure. So

I don't know about you guys, but I was I really

wasn't sure of how they were gonna bring him

in because Know for whatever reason I had this

notion in my mind that they were gonna introduce

him and he would already be the king of Wakanda

I guess I wasn't sure that they were gonna have

his father in there I'm not against it that they

did it in any way. I think that was it was very

well done But for whatever reason I was thinking

he was already he would come in and he'd already

be the king of Wakanda and You know, they do

something in his country and just kind of piss

him off But I think their way was better than

the way that I had it in my head I thought they

were going to tie it back to the whole Iron Man

fight from Age of Ultron somehow. I thought somehow

like that would help bring them in. Oddly, it

wasn't that that brought them in. It was the

fact that Ultron used stolen vibranium that caused

Wakanda to come out. Which I thought was good

because it's like, why is this country suddenly

now appearing? And then it made sense because,

okay, well, the mineral that they're known for,

how... Helped almost destroy the world so they

could see that they needed to you know Maybe

go out and do some damage control or whatever

you want to call it But yeah, that's how I thought

I thought they would incorporate it that way

or the winter soldier would maybe kill someone

or like Like at when he's under control and that

would help get him involved But yeah, I wasn't

totally sure but I think in my I thought my mind

it would somehow talk tie into that Hulk Iron

Man fight from the last movie. I don't know about

you Greg I really didn't have a grand vision

of how he would come in, really. I'm not a huge

Black Panther fan from the comics or anything,

so I wasn't really coming in with a stance. I

kind of know about him, a little bit of his back

history and everything. So I really didn't have...

a notion set in my mind of how I expected him

to come in. And I think they did a great job

with how we came in. Like, it fit the movie very

well, fit with the story, and like I said before,

it made him more seamlessly plug into the role,

especially as opposed to Spider -Man, how they

brought him in. And I thought... Bozeman did

a great job with the character. I thought he

fit the characteristics that I know Black Panther

for and like you guys were saying I thought the

the movements that he did with the fight scenes

kind of fit with the character and fit with the

role of Someone that would be named Black Panther

Yeah, I cut you off before I just had a question.

I was wondering if I was the only one that had

an issue with this particular part of Black Panther's

character, but I sort of had a little bit of

issue with this revenge path that they set him

on. I never really pegged Black Panther for a

character that would be big on vengeance or anything

like that. I figured with him being royalty and

the way he carries himself and sort of the honor

code that he has, very similar to guys like Captain

America and things like that, I wouldn't think

of him as someone who would go crazy into this

path of revenge that he wants to avenge his father's

death by killing Bucky. And I never really thought

of it that way, I guess. I wasn't too crazy about

it at the beginning of the movie, but I like

where it ended up though, because, you know,

obviously when he follows them to Moscow and

he hears them, he hears the exchange between

Zemo and Cap and Iron Man and stuff, he obviously

puts everything together and... realize what

happens but i mean i like how it ended up but

i guess i was just a little bit shocked i was

a little bit thrown for a loop there because

i i never Pegged him for something like that.

What do you guys think about that? Well, I think

it's just that he's young He was still a prince

when he started off at the beginning of this

movie and he's still trying to fit into the role

of a king or Grow into that. I think you were

looking for where he wouldn't be taking revenge

I think he started off a little bit different

than you expected But then grew into that role

as as the story went on. So I I thought it did

a really good job with that I guess in the way

I for him I maybe in his eyes he wasn't seeing

it as revenge more of a duty in the sense of

honoring his father this man took his life so

it was his duty to protect his father now he

must then fulfill that duty in this way by avenging

him and I don't think in in the character's mind

it was as motivated as revenge as he realized

until I think at the end when he when he was

able to witness what Tony was going through in

revenge that he had and In comes the realization

of what was really driving him and I think he

was fooling himself and thinking it was more

so The duty of Black Panther like you mentioned

like Black Panther was the warrior protector

of Wakanda and He failed in that regard. So what

this was his way of overcoming that or trying

to fix that and then once he saw that that wasn't

really what he was doing I think he kind of changed

his path and realized okay this is where this

is where redemption needs to occur and this is

this is you know I'm not really fixing anything

I'm letting it consume me so I actually like

that arc I thought and then we have seen him

in the comics No, I'm not be afraid of revenge

in the sense of with like Neymar like him They

have had their past in their history and he's

certainly done certain actions which were in

response to you know things that would happen

in Wakanda and trying to kill Neymar and when

they had their conflict in New Avengers and Just

thinking of the Black Panther series For a while

in in the 2000s. I felt like there there was

a revenge plot in there, too But I know I that's

why I had no issue with it to be honest with

you yeah, I guess I don't know I guess just because

I was kind of thrown for loop in the beginning

there and Maybe maybe I thought too much into

the line to where he told black widow. He's like

I am NOT my father and I guess that kind of uh

I don't know, maybe I didn't take it the right

way or something, but I was like, oh, wow. Like

his father seemed like such an honorable man

and he was the standup guy and he said, I'm not

my father. And then he goes down this revenge

path. And I'm like, wow, like who is this guy?

You know, like it's not a panther that I recognize.

Not that I'm a huge black Panther fan, but, but

I, I agree. I love where it ended up because

I think there's a sort of a deeper meaning in,

in his line where he says, I'm done letting vengeance

consume me. I think he's talking. About the present

situation, but I think he's also talking about

as a whole he's done letting vengeance consume

him So I think that was a great that was a great

moment that they took him to so worked out in

the end I was also curious, we didn't talk about

him yet, so, though, it was that of Zemo. And

I know, Greg, you're a huge Zemo fan. I know

he didn't have the purple, purple hat or purple,

whatever you want to call it. Mask. And hats,

Jesus. He didn't get it glued to his face. No.

And there wasn't, he didn't have a huge amount

of screentime. I guess this isn't necessarily

Baron Zemo, but what did you think of Daniel

Brola as Zemo and like how the character was

handled? Not the Zemo that we're really used

to, but I thought they fit him more for the story,

and I thought they made him a little bit more

of an interesting character. He wasn't a villain

out looking to take over the world like we have

been getting. It's more personal. These Avengers

came into his life and had a negative influence

where he thought they were a positive influence

at first. Then all of a sudden they came in and

they took his wife from him essentially and he

didn't think they paid for it. And so he's going

out and he's going to make them pay. So I thought

that was a really interesting concept. I don't

think it's really Baron Zemo, but he did have

that. intelligence and that connivingness that

kind of would go towards Zemo so I was kind of

on the fence about him a little bit and I'd like

to see maybe him transform more into the Zemo

that we know so I'd like to see him in another

Marvel movie somewhere if it makes sense but

I thought he did an overall good job his acting

was really well done I remember him from What's

what's the Tarantino film the one with Brad Pitt?

Yes, that one he also he's definitely got great

acting chops And I'd love to see him in more.

Chuck what are your thoughts on CMO and Daniel

Perot? I guess at first watch I wasn't really

crazy about him. I thought he was good enough

I don't know if it was the actor if it was the

the different scenes that they gave him but the

first time around that I watched it I wasn't

I really wasn't enthused about him as at all.

He didn't do much for me, but The second time

around that I watched the movie, I think I really

came to appreciate him a lot more. And I started

thinking about, you know, for once in a superhero

movie, the villain actually wins, if you think

about it. Yeah, that's kind of interesting. He

actually succeeds in splitting up the Avengers,

even though nobody got killed or anything like

that. But there are still Avengers teams, but

he did. basically split them right down the center

and that's what he sought out to do so he definitely

succeeded in in what he set out to do and I think

that makes him very formidable and in a way it's

a lot like the comics even though there were

some you know major differences from his character

in the comics but in a way he's a lot like the

character in the comics being so formidable you

know like in the under siege story where they

Storm the Avengers Mansion and systematically

taking out the Avengers. He is a great mastermind

and a strategist and stuff like that. He's a

very formal adversary for Cap. Other than Red

Skull, he's probably his greatest enemy. I think

in that respect, he definitely lived up to it.

I came to appreciate him a lot more when I saw

the film again. He's obviously not the most dynamic

character ever. Basically window dressing he's

there to like move the plot along but I thought

that made sense because I felt like I didn't

want a villain to dominate this this movie or

or a villain to kind of get it in way of the

true conflict and I thought it was smart for

the Russo brothers really just to make create

a character that Was he was concise like and

I don't think concise is necessarily a bad thing

I don't necessarily think you always need a villain.

That is super you that is the person Running

the show you don't think you need to have a Joker

and Dark Knight in every film and and this it

made sense because there was everything everything

else going on Having this shadowy figure just

kind of secretly pushing things and pushing the

buttons right buttons the right time made sense

Will say like there is a lot of contrivances

when it comes to his plan like a lot of things

have to work out Very specifically for it all

to kind of tie together the way it does But I

feel that's that's kind of the norm when it comes

to comic books to be honest with you So I didn't

have any issues and during the film since I was

so I wasn't really understanding completely in

a good way Like what was going on? Like I I thought

I had a movie figured out. I'm like, okay They're

gonna go and they're gonna have this action set

piece where they fight all these Guys, I was

actually kind of disappointed in a way. I'm like,

uh, well tony's gonna find out that he's really

behind it all he's gonna, you know team up with

cap and they're gonna get together and they're

gonna stop zemo and then Iron man's gonna try

to bring in winter soldier and cap's gonna say

no, you can't do that They'll fight and wonder

soldier will get away and then be the end of

it when it goes the way it goes and like We go

into that and they're all dead. I'm like What

the hell's going on? Is he, I'm like, okay, is

he gonna become like the abomination and take

all their power and become some sort of monster?

And when it, when you see the video and I'm like,

I got like, not anxiety, but I'm like, holy shit,

like it just started clicking. I realized what

was going to happen. I'm like, oh my God. Like

that's, the Russos have. given us two of the

best surprises in the MCU so far with the Hydra

being behind all this other stuff and then with

Winter Soldier killing the parents of Tony Stark

and what that meant. I thought that was a stroke

of genius in the way it was set up from the beginning,

from the moment you see Tony Stark as a young

Robert Downey Jr. from Weird Science talking

to the guy from Mad Men, like that scene, like

how that all, like I just thought that was there

and then how it all just Came to this brilliant

little in tidings a brilliant little bow at the

end and it really made a lot of sense It was

like the opposite of the Martha moment and Batman

v Superman not to keep heart harping on that

But it's hard not to and that you just like it

just became this emotional Reaction from Tony

Stark as we mentioned. He's this guy who is so

frat His emotional state is always fragile to

begin with and when you see something like that,

I bought completely with the link he would go

to to kill this guy like where he says the thing

you know he killed my mom at the end of the day

i don't care if he was brainwashed i don't care

what happened he killed my mom i'm gonna do what

i need to do like kill kill him i don't know

what you guys thought of the the final twist

if you guys enjoyed it as much as i did Yeah,

I thought that was spectacular and I was definitely

not expecting it at all and I do agree It was

kind of like the Martha moment, but done well

in this movie But yeah, it was it was incredible

and it definitely improved the movie tons I didn't

mind where it was going or you were kind of disappointed

and I didn't mind it for the most part but this

definitely picked it up for me and like it was

a Shot to the stomach to to see all this Like

what is that? What is she? What is she showing

on that monitor? And then all of a sudden you

start to notice. Oh wait, that's the screen Oh

wait his parents left and you started like as

you were watching the the monitor You're like

putting things together and you're like, oh crap.

This is Tony's parents This isn't gonna be good.

And then you're going through your mind trying

to figure out. Well, how's Tony gonna react to

this? It's not gonna be good like Yeah, I don't

check. What are your thoughts? I did enjoy it

as well. I thought it was kind of tough to see

Tony react like that, knowing, you know, how

brainwashed Winter Soldier was. Cause I think

like, there was still hope for, obviously he's

going to react and he's going to flip out and

everything. But I think there's still hope for

Cap to sort of calm him down and say, like, Tony,

take it easy. Like, you know, because you see

that actually happen. You see him turn to engage

Bucky and you see Cap kind of grab his arm and

like, stop him. But I think the moment that really

pushed it over the edge and made him totally

lose his shit was the fact that he felt betrayed

by Cap because Cap knew and didn't tell him.

And that's the moment for me that I think really

sold it to me because at that moment he's he's

feeling obviously the betrayal by Bucky and what

he did, but also by Cap, who he considered a

friend and who kept one of the most important

secrets from him. So I think that really pushed

it over the edge for me and I was able to definitely,

I bought it after that because I'm like, okay,

I could see where that would really send him

over the edge too, so. As a cap fan Do you feel

like that would be something Captain America

would do like Steve Rogers would withhold that

information? Or do you think like it's out of

character for him to not tell Tony Stark? I kind

of thought about that a little bit after the

first time I watched the movie. I feel like the

true essence of caps character I feel like he

would have told him in some way like I feel like

he would have said Listen, Tony Bucky was the

soldier that was assigned to kill your parents

Obviously they had him brainwashed and try to

sort of explain it somehow I feel like he would

at least try to and you know tell him like you

know it's important remember that it's not his

fault he can control his actions and he was he

was a mercenary that was brainwashed and everything

like that and sort of diffuse it like at that

point before it came to a head like this. I think

Steve would have realized that that would have

been the thing to do. But like he like he mentions,

he's trying to protect him because he doesn't

want to hurt Tony. He's trying to be better friends

with Tony. So he doesn't want to, you know, if

they're on edge from previous movies, he doesn't

want to do this and like ruin the shot of them

becoming friends. So, I mean, I could kind of

buy it, I guess. I bought it, but I did find

it was a little out of character. And I was at

first like, how would he, how do you even know

that? Like, how did he even know it was him?

And I'm like, oh yeah, I'm Winter Soldier. When

they find out about Hydra, they do talk about

Tony Stark and they don't explicitly tell you,

tell him, but Cap's a smart enough guy to kind

of put the pieces together to figure out it would

most likely have to be Winter Soldier. So I liked

how it tied back into that without really even

telling you that's what it was doing. So. Chuck,

you mentioned how at the end, Zima wins. And

I did really like that, how it ends in a rather

somber tone, which is different from any other

Marvel film. The one thing though, like I thought

that was a really great way to kind of end it,

where you have, I mean, it's almost Empire Strikes

Back in the way where it feels like it really,

not to compare it to that, because I feel like

a lot of people have, but just how the heroes

are losing, like how can they overcome this?

I don't know how you guys felt about this, so

I felt a lot of that was lost though. And I got

what I did it. but when you get Tony getting

that letter from Steve Rogers, and that is a

Steve Rogers thing to do, but I felt like if

they ended it without that, it reminded me of

how, not to do that alt comparison again, but

how Batman v Superman ended with the... Dust

rising off for the the casket of Superman. Yeah,

we know Superman is gonna come back alive You

know, I but you don't not necessarily have to

show us that image I was wondering like what

it means would it be even more of an emotional

wall if it didn't end with that? Like we're almost

on a little bit of a lighter note I don't know

if you guys had the same issue at all or if you

were fine with it No, I think I was fine with

that like because like you mentioned that's that's

a very very cap thing to do to send that letter

and it's just the exact wording that was in it

like if you need any of us, or if you need me,

I'll be there. I thought that resonated more

with me anyway. I really didn't have an issue

with it. I don't know. I guess it's a personal

preference thing. What do you think, Greg? Yeah,

I didn't mind it at all. And especially since

it got an appearance by Stan Lee involved in

there. I was very excited about that. I was wondering

when it was coming. It was like, it's a while.

We haven't seen him yet. Possibly his best cameo

ever. Tony Stank. I still go with the Amazing

Spider -Man one when he's in the school, in the

classroom and they're like doing all the crazy

stuff behind him. I think that might still be

my favorite Stanley cameo and like the lizard

and him are fighting. I guess to switch gears

a little bit, I did want to bring up something

that I was kind of thinking about afterwards.

You know, just thinking about the comic and how

it compares to the movie. And I looked at trying

to compare, if you remember in the comics, Tony's

team sort of creates a clone of Thor. And I sort

of related that a lot to vision in this movie

because there was a lot of striking similarities.

It's a character that they created out of science.

They created him with Jarvis programming and

Ultron and the mind infinity stone and things

like that. So a lot of similarities there. And

then I was looking at like just him sort of being

a extremely powerful character on that team that's

sort of careless and distracted and things like

that. And you see the same result of that carelessness

as Thor had in the comics when he killed Bill

Foster and to me the Bill Foster in this movie

was Rhodey and he was the casualty of that that

carelessness that not necessarily that like I

don't think Tony could have ever foreseen that

happening it's not like the comics where he definitely

went too far with doing that but I'm just saying

there were a lot of Pretty cool similarities

when you think about it with roadie kind of acting

like the bill foster and obviously We're glad

that he didn't die. He was he was only Paralyzed

hopefully only temporary paralyzed, but I just

thought that was an interesting thing to think

about if you guys thought about that I did get

that a little impression a little bit when you

see a character basically You know get hit with

a beam of light and be severely injured and that

was you know Seeing roadie fall the way he did

that was that was pretty brutal and uh, especially

like you see falcon stop and then iron man just

freaking just let out his aggression on him and

I thought it was I thought he was gonna i'm like,

wow Maybe he's actually gonna die the way it

just i'm like wow, they're actually gonna kill

him and he I thought so too. Yeah He is paralyzed

which is yeah, I wonder how that's gonna if they're

gonna keep that like can you just be in the suit

and be okay? Well in the comics he kind of turned

into a little bit of a cyborg. Yeah Yeah, then

they stopped I think they stopped that for a

while. Yeah That was in between them kind of

like having interest in having the character

around and not having the character around like

it It's his waning popularity. I think Yeah,

I was a little worried about Ant -man to be honest

or giant man as he became which was I'm like

thinking yeah, I'm thinking like, okay They killed

a giant man in this civil war book one, but I'm

like, well, they can't because they're doing

it made a wasp movie so but There was a little

bit of time where I was kind of worried for him,

especially in vision, kind of like phased through

his chest. And I'm like, oh man, he's going to

shift his density, like when he's in his heart

and like kill him. And I was like, oh shit. But

then they just turned it into a comedic moment

where he's like, someone just flew in me. Paul,

I mean, there's a lot of people who are great,

but Paul Rudd was great. He's like, I'm shaking

your hand for way too long. And I know you too,

you're great. And the giant man sequence was

great and I loved how he like moved like Godzilla

and like slow motion that was yeah And that I

could actually buy too because like just growing

that huge like you would think he would have

trouble adjusting to it and he would be moving

really slowly because of his gigantic size, so

What do you guys think about the how does vision

fit into the team now? Do you think they're gonna?

perceive him differently? Do you think there's

going to be some dirty looks? Do you think there's

going to be general disgust around him? Are they

going to forgive him pretty quickly? Or how do

you think that'll shake out? I think for Vision,

definitely with more War Machine and Tony, they'll

be cautious of him. I think Rhodey definitely

more than Tony. Rhodey might even be scared of

him coming down the line here and there. The

others, like a cap side, I don't think they'll

have as much of being scared of them as other

people. They might use it against them as like.

like in the middle of an argument to bite back

at him kind of like say something you don't really

mean kind of situation and I'm interested to

see what will develop with Vision and Scarlet

Witch because they kind of had a little bit of

a romance thing going on there which I was quite

interested in what didn't overpower through the

story but they just kind of hinted at it Here

and there and it definitely fit with what was

going on I thought I thought scholarly vision

were much better than this and they were in Age

of Ultron Like I thought Scott which I agree

like I don't know. There's more to her I felt

like they got a better hold of that character

even just with her powers I think with the vision

there it is gonna be that like looking over your

shoulder type of thing I think I read something

about like people are wondering does this mean

he can't pick up Thor's hammer anymore considering

that he seems to be Not you know fallible and

he has like is he becoming more and more human

in a way? Does that? Distrust then they does

somehow Thanos maybe and next Avengers movie

use that in For his advantage considering he

is has a you know a gem and I like how he pointed

that out There's a conversation he has about

the gem and how he fears it and how he tries

to control it and what it means I still don't

think they have a A great grasp of how to use

him in the movie. I think he's one of those characters

where He's so powerful. It's hard to figure out

how to fit him in an action sequence with all

these other characters But I thought using scarlet

witch and him were a good trade -off like how

they could kind of cancel each other out And

he also looked amazing in that sweater like he

that was That was a good choice. Yeah, just like

it's so odd that it just and he almost looks

better than that than he does in his like normal

uniform So I do feel like they're gonna go back

to that moment I would I would think he would

have to when you you know when you have a team

member paralyze another team member and That

team member is basically a child because he's

only been our life for a year or two I could

see that having major effects going forward.

I have I have a theory that I've been formulating

about vision and I think, like, obviously, you

know, we have two more Avengers movies coming

up, and they're supposed to be even two very

different movies. They said they even went as

far as getting away from the part one and part

two label. And I really do, like Greg mentioned

about the relationship with Scarlet Witch and

Vision, I think they're gonna develop that a

lot more. And I really loved that aspect. They

were playing with, like, his emotional feelings

towards her. They were also... Uh, dabbling with

the, the emotion of regret when you, you know,

you see him sitting on the couch, kind of flipping

that chess piece. And it's like, it's bothering

him that he hurt roadie, you know? So he's sort

of feeling like these emotions that he's not

supposed to feel. Those are kind of subtle things,

but I thought they were really cool. Like I thought

that was really neat picked up on the first watch.

But the second time I watched it, like, I really

saw like how much it was bothering him that he

hurt roadie. Like I'm not sure if it was it bothered

him that he made a mistake or if it bothered

them that he hurt somebody but I took it as it

bothered him that he hurt Rhodey and he hurt

someone that was supposed to be considered his

friend like he's a member of this team you know

he let them down so I thought that was interesting

they're sort of playing with that emotion but

I think they're gonna develop him and Scarlet

Witch more but my theory in the end and I think

it's gonna take place in the in the fourth Avengers

movie I think Thanos is actually going to kill

Vision to get the Infinity Stone. And the reason

I think that is just because Vision being the

Avengers, clearly their most powerful character,

I think. Well, I could argue Hulk, I guess, but

I think with having an Infinity Stone in his

head, he's considered their most powerful member.

And I think that would be a huge statement if

Thanos just offs him right at the beginning.

And it would just be like this huge... moment

of like how powerful and how ruthless Thanos

is he just takes out their most powerful member

like just like that I think that would be a huge

moment so I guess that's what I'm kind of not

actually hoping for but it would make sense to

me so that's my theory so far but I highly doubt

that'll Work out because it usually doesn't Hey,

you've been been right in the few things remember

you you were Spot on regarding the sentinels

and days of future past so they were tied into

being part of mystique and that was right. So

that was cool So, uh, yeah, I mean, I think that

makes sense. It's kind of danios is Half, I mean

he's gonna get the infinity gauntlet you would

assume so somehow vision is gonna lose that lose

that gem, I would assume, so that I could see

that. Like you said, it's a good way to immediately

establish Thanos as the threat, because they

really haven't done that yet. I think for the

casual fan, people who know Thanos, yeah, we

know who he is. But in the films, he really hasn't

done much besides just sit around and talk. So

I think that would be something they could do

for sure. And think of the emotional impact it

would have on Scarlet Witch, especially if they

spend the next movie getting a lot closer. and

then he dies like she's gonna flip out and just

say no more mutants but something to that effect

oh wait i can't do this in this movie because

there are no mutants no more enhanced i guess

no more no more metas no more foxes so they can

we can get the rights back of everything yeah,

I could see I mean that's a good question just

going forward where we're they're gonna go with

this because I Guess at this point the only thing

that could bring them back together would be

that of a world -changing event I don't know

but I also wonder if we'll get another cat movie

considering We have not there's never been a

fourth installment of an individual film, you

know Iron Man 3 is hopped after the third one

looks like Thor sobbing after the third one So

I mean I would be for another cat film. They

seem to be the best movies of this franchise

or this franchise so Yeah, I think, I don't know.

Like, obviously we have Doctor Strange and we

have Guardians yet to go. We have the Spider

-Man, which I know Tony Stark's going to appear

in the Spider -Man movie. And I'm kind of thinking

Cab might appear maybe even briefly, but I don't

know. It just seemed like they were going that

way with their little exchange in the movie.

But I think we're kind of set with this rift

now. and you're kind of set up well for Thanos

to come into the picture because he's going to

come in at a time where the team is divided and

they're going to have no plan of action against

someone this powerful and they're just going

to be scrambling to get things together and they're

going to kind of be forced to come back together

and put things aside. I think it's a good place

to leave it with Thanos coming into the picture.

I don't know about you guys. Yeah, I think it's

smart. I mean, Where things can't get worse than

they get worse. So that's a good way to go. And

I could see cap. Does Black Panther come before

the next Avengers film? I forget the order, but

I could say I'm not sure. I don't know the order,

but I think it's the same year, but I'm not sure

if it's before or after we have Captain Marvel,

which actually that happens after I think, but

didn't they announce that Captain Marvel will

appear in the. The first Avengers infinity war

I'm not sure I'm not sure I only think I remember

hearing is that in humans has been pushed back

indefinitely if it will ever happen, so I wonder

if they're just Considering I wonder if they're

just they're restructuring and changing things

considering the infinity war films are getting

their changes if they're just Looking and thinking.

Okay. Let's let's let's change things around

and based upon which is fine I think it makes

sense if you know if you feel like you have a

better path and things make more sense They go

a different direction. I would say do it So is

there anything else you guys wanted to pick and

bring up that we didn't that we did not discuss

I guess a couple little things You mentioned

a panthers of black panthers fighting skills.

I thought they're awesome But I also thought

they did a great job on Captain America's fighting

skills. Yeah, they you know, they developed them

a lot in Winter Soldier. Obviously, there's a

lot of great scenes in that one, the elevator

scene being my favorite. But this one, like you

see him get the best of Spider -Man. You see

him have a good fight with Panther, but eventually

gives the edge over him. You see him fighting

a lot of different characters and just just crazy.

Even the sequence in the beginning when they

were in Wakanda and, you know, him fighting crossbones

and stuff like that. I love that one. the moment

he had where he like he skipped the uh in the

beginning sequence like the the shield like twice

and like hit the dude and he had against the

wall or something like that but yeah yeah that's

pretty awesome and then like you had spiderman's

line about uh doesn't obey the law of physics

whatsoever i'm like that's so a spiderman line

thank you for yeah yeah that was good i like

that little exchange they had too or not not

only them talking like you know when he asked

him where he's from he says queens he's like

brooklyn and he's just kind of like he knows

like he's gonna cross paths with him again you

know what i mean like he's he knows like he's

a good kid deep down so he's he's pretty sure

that down the road somewhere they're gonna be

working together you know despite what's happening

right now i think cap has the foresight to see

that but i also thought he had the foresight

to realize that how sprite how strong spider

-man was by just tangle him with a little bit

and you know he really didn't know the limits

of his strength but he kind of knew that he was

very strong and when he sort of dropped that

uh huge trailer thing on it he knew like spider

-man could hold that but he knew he couldn't

do anything else while he was holding it so it

was sort of a neat tactical thing to kind of

keep him in one spot i thought that was pretty

cool too yeah yeah it was neat it was neat too

how they kind of paid homage to the spidey sense

i don't know if you guys caught that um i felt

like he was i i don't know i felt like did it

but they did it with almost like the way they

did daredevils powers in his show where they

like you saw his reaction the way he could you

know catch a punch or you know do things so quickly

but necessarily I don't know if they did I didn't

catch it if they did like anything that like

anything visual but beyond that I didn't notice

I thought there was one very specific moment

when he was kind of when he was in the airport

battling with Bucky and Falcon and he's kind

of up in the swinging through the rafters and

stuff and I think I think he was kind of fighting

with Falcon and Bucky throws something. I don't

know what it was, a big hunk of metal or something.

And it was kind of coming from behind him and

Spider -Man was like, uh -oh. And he kind of

turned around and saw it coming. So I was like,

oh, there's the spider sense. Like he knew something

was wrong and he turned around and avoided it

and stuff. So I thought that was pretty cool.

Did not notice that. See the benefit of seeing

it twice. We've only seen it once. Yeah. I actually

saw that the first time. Of course. Gotta throw

that in there and be like, yeah. But there's

other stuff I didn't pick up on the first time.

It's just what you have to be thinking of at

the time because sometimes you're thinking about

the scene before and you're not, you know. You're

a little distracted. So yeah, I think there was

a lot of great sequences but one I think it's

not getting talked about enough is the the stairway

sequence like that escape and how amazing that

was when you had like went to soldier getting

like a batarang and start just kicking out of

people like yeah, that was awesome like how and

You saw them try to go out of their way to not

kill people and which was cool though They do

kill people a good deal in these movies in the

more Marvel films because Falcon straight up

shoots people in the face, but I'm surprised

you don't hear much complaints regarding that

when it comes to Marvel films, because there

was a video out there regarding Iron Man's kill

count. It's pretty high in the Marvel movies,

but I don't know if it's just because it's part,

I guess it's more the way they do it or what

have you. We're considering they're getting shot

at in the middle of war that it's more acceptable.

And then Falcon drops the two bombs on the guys

that were behind the truck. And I think we kind

of talked about this already, but uh, I guess

we can maybe end this where you where would you

rank this within? The marvel lore do you put

this on the top already? Do you do you you know,

is it top three? Is it better than the other

avengers? And what are your thoughts on that

greg? Uh, yeah, I definitely put it in Like my

top three. I think uh, i'm not sure where exactly

it would go, but it's definitely around my top

three there Chuck is I remember right at the

movie ended. I think your words were I have a

new favorite film. So is that the case? Well,

let me start by saying there's a lot of movies

in my top three When it comes just the Marvel

Cinematic Universe I definitely have it up there.

I I think and it's I'm thinking it's number one

right now Like I mentioned, I I really enjoyed

Winter Soldier a lot the first Avengers and Guardians,

they were all top notch for me. But I think,

I think with my love of the story beforehand,

coupled with the fact of getting down to, you

know, really getting inside Cap's head and inside

his heart and seeing what he's all about and

him being a favorite character of mine. And then

also thirdly that just the This was the first

movie in a long time where I really got that

rush When you see that moment with the at the

at the airport with the two sides standing together

And you have new characters in here This is the

first time you're seeing the Ant -Man with the

Avengers and this is the first time you're seeing

Black Panther and Spider -Man with the Avengers

and it was the first time since That epic scene

in the Avengers where the six of them are standing

back to the back. I really equate that with that

scene This is the first time since then that

I got this huge rush and this huge lift in my

chest from the movie. So I think with all those

things combined, it just really put it over the

top for me. So I'd have to put it as my personal

favorite right now. Nice. I still think it's

Winter Soldier for me for number one. Number

two, like it gets a little tricky after that.

Like it's up there, I think. Civil Wars there

Avengers and like Iron Man the first Iron Man

for me are really close to one another I feel

like Iron Man kind of gets lost in it But I feel

like you still have to Give it credit for being

a big reason why this all existed if that wasn't

as successful as it was I don't think we get

any of this, but I don't know. It's it's definitely

my top three where it fits. I'm not sure but

As of right now, I still like Winter Soldier

a tad more. But again, after rewatching it, I

could see it being top of the bunch. But either

way, the Russo Brothers, super excited what they're

going to do with the Avengers. Because I feel

like they may have given us the best Avengers

movie yet, which is saying a lot. And they've

given us the best Cap movie already. So kudos

to that, man. Yeah. All right. All right. Anything

else before we bring this episode to a close?

One quick thing I'll mention. When Scarlet Witch

was fighting the Vision, do you guys remember

using her powers on him? Her powers of seduction?

Yeah. I had a huge, I guess, brain fart the first

time I watched it, and I guess I wasn't paying

attention. I was caught in the moment, or I was

thinking about Hawkeye or something there. But

actually, no, I did catch it the first time.

I don't know what I'm talking about. But what

she was actually doing was controlling his power

and changing his density. And I think some people

were confused about that because they think she

just kind of threw him through the floor, but

she actually increased his density so high that

the floor wasn't able to withstand his weight

and he fell through all those levels and really

probably down into the earth pretty far too.

I don't think she was using telekinesis to throw

him down, but I guess that makes more sense if

she was just adjusting his own power of a...

Density that makes that makes it seem more sensible

considering that than her just having the ability

to have telekinesis of that level. Yeah, that's

like the first time. When I first saw the scene,

I was like, oh, wow, she put him right through

the floor. And then as I thought about it a little

bit afterwards, I'm like, oh, wait a minute,

she just increased his density because she decreased

it before that so that Hawkeye could get away

from his sleeper hold there. You kind of like

phase through them. So I thought that was really

cool, a little subtle thing that they did there.

But also I noticed the second time I watched

it, I saw that when she attacked Vision, the

Infinity Stone was glowing red, like with her

power. So she was like almost controlling the

stone. And I thought that was really interesting.

I did not see that the first time around. And

I think it fits into my theory with the Thanos

killing Vision, possibly taking the stone. But

if Scarlet Witch can sort of manipulate that

stone better than Thanos can, you know, that

would give them a huge edge. But just something

a little worth mentioning. It's very subtle.

Obviously, the little tiny stone on his head

is hard to catch with everything else going on.

But, you know, benefits of watching it again,

you sort of... look for more details and stuff

but some people picked up on it the first time

and i was impressed but i didn't very cool yeah

i think there's a lot more to catch with like

that if you sit back and watch it again i'm sure

there'll be videos and videos upon it huh but

cool all righty but we like to hear what you

thought of Civil War you can let us know what

you thought of us and or what do you thought

of the movie? What do you thought of our review?

You can go to key cast radio calm or we're on

Facebook and Twitter just search talking in circles

GCR and you guys are also on Twitter What are

your Twitter names? I am at her old gauge Chuck

I Am at the create board and I am at movie revolt

But that'll be it for this week. We'll be back

next week same time Same channel, same podcast

feed, but for now. This has been Chuck. This

has been Greg, or emo Tony Stark. This has been

Dan. We've been talking about Civil War in circles.

We'll see you next week. Or Hot It May. It was

Hot It May. Which rhymes with Marissa Tomei.

Maybe that's why they cast her this entire time.

That was the reason. Like I was Stark Caldery

or Unusually Attractive Ant. She's pretty hot

though, guys. She's back in the lab. Lost in

space. A rocket plummets to the surface of Mars

at breakneck speed. I think this is it, you guys.

We're dead for sure this time. Oh, what planet

are we crashing into again? Damn it, Greg. The

narrator, who's obviously you, by the way, already

said it. It's Mars. Pay attention. Don't they

say men are from Mars and women are from Venus?

Yeah, but that's just a book type - Whoa! Greg,

you saved us! Yeah, how did you do that? We tried

everything to avoid crashing. I don't know really.

I just didn't want to die on a planet of all

dudes, so I course corrected to Venus. Brilliant.

So now we're gonna die in Venus instead? Pretty

much. Well, at least he brought us some more

time. Great! Now we just ran something over.

Greg, why don't you go see what it was? With

Greg away, checking outside the rocket's hatch.

Dan and Chuck set to work fixing the rocket,

flipping switches and pressing buttons. We're

sorry, the number you have dialed is not in service

at this time. Those aren't the right sound effects,

Dan. Oh, my bad. Hey guys, look who I found!

Space Pope! Hello, everybody! Where did you come

from, Space Pope? Well, your friend Greg ran

me over with your rocket. All my lady friends

could tell you that - Yeah, sorry, bad joke.

Um, and sorry about running you over to Space

Pope. Oh, that's alright, you little scamp. But

it looks like you gentlemen are going to crash

into Venus. Uh, you think you can help us with

that? Of course I can. You boys just need to

give me a hand by saying the space pope oath.

With endless hope, with whitest hair, surely

he will lead us in prayer. Spreading love, vanquishing

fear, gather round, space pope is here! A light

emanates out from the space pope's chest and

pulses each time it grows brighter until it becomes

a blinding white light. The light dissipates

and the trio comes into view sitting in an old

wooden attic. Where are we? Yeah, and where did

the space pope go? Hey guys, look what I found!

Greg, what the hell, man? Where did you get that

bucket of crap from? Over in the corner by this

hole. Dan looks through the hole to see outside

to a town square with people bustling about and

Nazi flags flying high in the sky. The end.