Review: The Odyssey

Starscream here, and I am the lord and master

of the Geekcast Radio Network. Don't tell Megatron.

Hello and welcome to episode 250 of The Cinema

Geeks. I am one of your Cinema Geeks optimists,

Solo, and joining me as usual is the comic concierge.

Hello, Dan. Hello. I'm just going to have to

start putting a disclaimer every time I put a

number next to an episode because I really have

no idea what number episode we're on. And we're

recording multiple things and we have some kind

of locked away for different releases and stuff

like that. I'm always trying to put the pieces

together and then we'll do something random where

we actually get to the movie theater and want

to talk about something new. So then I'm like,

well, that should be released now, but it's...

number y is going to be later i don't know i

don't know how all that works so hopefully nobody

pays attention to the episode numbers and yeah

that's why all the new podcasts don't use numbers

you're right you know that was just like when

the podcast was first a thing like you everyone

just used the number that was just a thing you

did but like no one does that anymore so i guess

we're just like we should we should get it get

with the times i guess i don't know i don't know

why now you know it's like yeah why change a

good thing right now um i hear we're real popular

in denmark no i have no idea um so today is one

of those times where dan and i both were able

to get to a theater within the last you know

few weeks and and watch a new movie actually

you've been a few times recently yeah to see

some films but we we had some crossover with

one of the ones that we were able to see and

that was also i believe on both of our most anticipated

lists at the beginning of the year and it was

your number two pick in your box office draft

if i'm remembering yes you're correct correct

which was a good pick uh it's definitely up there

nicely it's like it's like yeah what's one of

the few that i that i got right so i think you

were good with michael and you were good with

the odyssey so far and you still got some bullets

in the chamber so to speak so today we are talking

about christopher nolan's the odyssey but before

we get into any of that dan i don't think we've

ever discussed our history knowledge liking or

disliking or experience with Homer's ancient

play, The Odyssey. Did you have to read this

in school? Did you cover it at one point? How

old were you if you did? We never read the entire

thing. I think we read snippets of The Odyssey,

The Iliad, Beowulf. We took, I think, pieces

of them and dissected them, but never the entire

thing. Did you have to read the entire thing

or portions of it? i don't believe we had to

read the entire thing but i could be misremembering

i know we had the same thing we did the odyssey

the iliad we did do beowulf around the same time

i think i don't know if that was in this i assume

it was all in the same class i don't know how

that would have been split up into two different

years that seems like it would be weird um if

you're doing like ancient literature you'd probably

do all those together right oh how old were you

my for me i'm thinking this was probably like

i don't know maybe 16 ish yeah i was probably

around that age like middle like high school

like 10th 11th grade yeah um yeah i want to say

it wasn't my freshman year wasn't my senior year

but like somewhere in between yeah and i didn't

remember much of it uh i never read you haven't

revisited it numerous times since you were 15

i haven't surprisingly enough but uh so i never

read the entire thing i've I got interested in

it somewhat because of when Troy came out. Because

that was like right when we, what was that, 2004?

So right after I graduated from high school.

Not to date myself, of course. We've been doing

this a while. But when that was coming out, I

got interested in... like the iliad and at the

same time marvel pretty published uh an adaptation

of the iliad so i got into like that aspect of

it but i never really read or got into the odyssey

portion of it do you what did you think of it

do you remember enjoying it or being like this

is a slog in high school or like what was your

take way back when i did i definitely enjoyed

it like that that's partially why you know i

got into it more i actually saw troy in theaters

like three times because i really dig uh that

one that's when i had way more time on my hands

than i do now so that was helpful um and it was

also like not something i necessarily planned

but it was like i went with friends and this

and then like family and then other friends so

you know back when you're old younger and have

multiple friend groups that's not something i

actually enjoyed troy as well like yeah i remember

watching that when it first came out and i know

a pooping on it or whatever that's not a very

educated phrase there as we're talking about

the Odyssey and whatnot but a lot of people were

down on it and like I always thought it was one

of those ones where I was like I guess it worked

for me like whatever and but I feel like I don't

know I feel like some people have come around

over the years a little bit more on it but I

did enjoy Troy it's also one of those things

where like suddenly when something new comes

out like everyone likes the other thing in retrospect

more suddenly it's like when she hulk came out

or other things like suddenly everyone loves

the 2008 hulk film and thinking like where did

this come from like that was like where did they

and i feel like that's kind of happened with

troy but i was there in the beginning like you

i obviously i saw it three times partially because

i did really love it at the time i did revisit

it recently after seeing the odyssey just because

it's like i need to go back to it but yeah though

like that type of sword and sandal adventure

if you want to call it that the clash of the

titans and things like that we don't get movies

like this not even just in scale but like genre

wise very often anymore so that was partially

because why i was excited for it and then of

course it's christopher nolan you know as much

as like sometimes he can he has the film bros

after him and like the weight of his name but

ultimately like he has he's able to make event

films in a way that like no one really did since

Spielberg in a way so yeah I was gonna ask you

kind of going into that not just your history

with the Odyssey but like being a Christopher

Nolan film I know that's what got it on our radar

right not just that it's like this classic story

that we probably haven't revisited in decades

but like that it was also a Christopher Nolan

film which put it on our most anticipated list

we thought it might have some success with the

box office because of that name connection but

like where do you kind of sit like As far as

a Christopher Nolan fan, how does he rank amongst

your... Is he one of your favorite directors?

What's your history with Christopher Nolan overall?

I wouldn't say he's one of my favorite directors.

I just saw Tenet for the first time a few weeks

ago. It came out during COVID. I missed it. I

never went back. I generally enjoy his movies.

I do like the Batman trilogy. Inception, my favorite.

Still probably Memento. I love Memento. that's

uh so that's a huge fan of i'm a huge fan of

that uh i know people bring up prestige a lot

i i saw that once i think i and i enjoyed it

but it's not one i think i've watched nearly

enough but i i like his movies i wouldn't say

he's like my favorite director by far but i do

he do want more often than not if i'm gonna see

a movie he does to see it in theater uh obviously

with tenant i didn't do that partially because

of covet at the time but i love seeing inception

in theaters and things like that so i you know

i'm kind of i guess a lukewarm fan but how about

yourself i'd say i would probably describe myself

as a little more than lukewarm i mean he's done

he's done 13 films i haven't seen two of them

i didn't realize he did a film before memento

so that's my bad oh following yeah yeah it's

you know it's his first film and you could tell

it's you know it's one of those things where

it's like it's impressed that this got made because

it was a time when it was hard to make films,

but it's worth watching just for, you know, see,

you know, a young filmmaker come alive in that

way. But it's not, I would say of all of his

film, it's probably, I would rate the least last

out of all of them. Yeah. I haven't seen that

one. And I still haven't caught up with tenant.

It just came out when my, it was the year my

daughter was born and COVID and this, that, and

the other. And I just haven't gotten around to

it, even though, you know, I like, uh, um, him

and i like you know john was it john david robbins

or washington i'm gonna get the name wrong yeah

i'd be interested to see what you think of that

one because there's a lot of some people like

think it's an underrated masterpiece you know

whatever you want to call it and some people

are i think it's a mess so i would say christopher

nolan's kind of interesting because there were

movies when i was a kid that made me fall in

love with films right like star wars and the

indiana jones series and and stuff like that

back to the future like those films really kind

of like i don't i don't know if they just changed

my way of like looking at films but they were

like opened up my eyes to like how cool films

could be and like really at a young age made

me fall in love with them and but i think as

i was getting older there was certain older i

say as i was a teenager um and you know in my

high school maybe early college years there were

certain films that kind of again gave me a shift

in like how i viewed movies like it was no longer

just the the shock and awe or the wonder that

you get as a child when you see stuff on the

on the big screen that like wows you from that

standpoint but they're they're films that are

like make you think of the world differently

or make you think of life differently or just

whatever or just change like what you understand

is possible in film and i always view memento

as kind of one of those like early on and it

was just like one of those that was like wait

a second like what are we doing here um and and

it for a long time that was like one of my favorite

films that i had ever seen and i still would

probably rank it real close to the top if not

at the top of my ranking of nolan films but i

think what impresses me even if some of them

aren't as high as that one for me out of the

11 that i've seen i don't know if i've had a

bad experience you know what i mean like the

batting average is good like they might not all

be grand slams but there's not any strikeouts

for me like most of these are hits like they

might be a they might be like a a blunt single

occasionally or like an infield single or something

like that but like they're all they've all been

like different levels of yeah good in my mind

the only one that comes to mind that i didn't

that is borderline and like it's been i don't

think i've seen it since it's come out say insomnia

right yeah that's what i figured yeah i didn't

love it but also like that was i think him still

still finding himself and i wonder too like going

back to it if i would like i said it's been you

know 15 years since i watched it so i'd be intrigued

to see if it holds up if it's better than i remember

or whatnot right i do feel like there's a few

of his filmography that i need to watch a few

more times because memento i've seen like i don't

know i don't re -watch a lot of movies but i've

probably seen memento at least four times uh

if not a couple more i've seen all of the batman

films you know a number of different times but

insomnia prestige even inception and interstellar

as much as i enjoyed them when they came out

i haven't done a lot of re -watching of yeah

those films so i feel like there's some that

i probably need to re -watch like i i would be

ill -prepared to rank his filmography at this

juncture because outside of memento and the batman

trilogy i don't know if i've seen any of them

more than i think i've seen inception a couple

times but i've only seen interstellar once i've

only seen dunkirk once i've only seen oppenheimer

once i think i've seen prestige maybe a time

and a half and insomnia like once so inception

was one i was i would be say look like i didn't

love it i was there's aspects of it that i love

and aspects of it i didn't so it's kind of right

in the middle for me but again like you haven't

seen it since since i saw in theaters right so

i'd be you know and a lot has changed you know

but i didn't have a kid at that point and there's

such a big like father -daughter relationship

within that i wonder if that would you know impact

me differently right all these years later so

definitely could so i guess that kind of transitions

me into like one of the main things that i want

to kind of start off with with discussing because

it is the kind of the nolan aspect of the odyssey

here for for 2026 so i had two different questions

kind of around nolan and we've just spent some

time talking about all of his films and one of

the more fascinating ideas that i've heard come

out of some of the different discourse with this

film and christopher nolan and i am going to

try to keep this podcast as much about the actual

film and like real things that we can talk about

and not the nonsense that represents the world

we live in but um one of the fascinating I don't

know if culmination is the right word, but this

film feels like a summary or a culmination or

a connection piece to like his entire career.

So if you, and this is kind of, I'm kind of summarizing

or, or trying to make this easier than how I

heard it explained and add in a little bit of

my own touch to it, I guess as well. But a lot

of people view, you know, memento as a, as a

film that's really dealing with identity and,

and things of that nature. You have, Batman as

a story, especially in this trilogy, is are you

becoming the person you're meant to be? There's

obsession involved in the prestige. Inception

is a man trying to get home to his children.

Interstellar is a father separated from his family.

Dunkirk is about survival. Oppenheimer is about

living with the consequences of your actions.

The Odyssey has a little bit of all of that.

Is it? Do you view that as some sort of culmination

of all of this stuff? Has he been preparing to

tell this story for 20 years without realizing

it? Is it just something that just spoke to him,

you think, as far as themes he's used to, and

that's why he kind of gravitated towards this?

Or do you see it as something that's completely

separate from the films that he's done before?

I think it's certainly something that has interested

him since the beginning, because as we mentioned,

Troy, he was actually attached to that early

on. And he was potentially going to be the director

until he felt like he wasn't up to being able

to direct that yet. So I think this material,

obviously, it has interested him since the beginning.

And I think throughout all of his movies, you

see a lot of the influences of the things that

he loves. He never made a James Bond movie, but

you certainly see influences of those films in

everything from The Dark Knight to Tenet. I know

you haven't seen it, but there's like many people

said. Yeah, like many people said, it's the closest

thing he's done to a Bond film. And I think there

are some common themes that you bring up a lot,

but he loves time, the use of time. We see that

a great deal. So I think there are just certain

stories that I think he connects with because

of the machinations of them, like the way they're

designed, the way he can play with time, the

way he can... the longing that you mentioned

so i do think it's i don't think it's necessarily

not a coincidence i don't know if that at i don't

think like you know day one he's like okay i

am i'm gonna do all these and then my magnum

opus is going to be the odyssey but i certainly

could see him thinking like okay now i feel comfortable

like yeah now that like i've done this and also

understanding The challenge is just to get to

a point where you can make a movie like this.

I think he mentioned after Oppenheimer was a

bigger success than they even imagined, he kind

of had that metaphorical blank check to do whatever

he wants. So he was in a place both financially

as a filmmaker and as a craftsman ready to take

on this story. So I think it's kind of a comedy.

It's basically the perfect storm where it's something

he's wanted to do. and now he has the capability

of doing it. And then within that, he took elements

of the story that I think appeals to him most,

and knowing a little bit of it, he clearly put

his own spin on it and brought those elements

in. So I think it certainly is him working towards

this and then taking the opportunities, like,

okay, well, now it's now or never, and biting

the bullet and doing it. So that's my take, at

least. yeah i think that's a good take i don't

think there was like a conscious effort necessarily

but i can see like he's played in this sandbox

enough where he could feel comfortable or just

like when you decide to do stuff you do stuff

you're passionate about and he's done stories

that have these elements so it's a maybe just

a subconsciously like a clear choice to do something

else that speaks to a lot of the themes that

you're used to like telling you know a lot of

directors have certain things that they tackle

a lot like you said with the time and his situation

i was wondering you know he is known for his

intellect right he's known for having these films

that are almost about similar to like solving

a puzzle he has playing with the elements of

time he has the like the intelligence when it

comes to the actual filmmaking itself right and

like how he's going to do it and how he's going

to frame things and what elements he's going

to use so like he has a lot of that in his like

repertoire or or as far as like his legacy of

what he's known for do you feel like with the

odyssey we've gotten what could be called his

most emotional film that takes a lot of those

other elements but adds more of the core being

you know all of these emotional topics like guilt

and regret and coming to terms with your decisions

and forgiveness and your family and what is home

what does that mean how do we get you know all

of these things do you feel like he's been emotional

throughout all of his films or do you feel like

he kind of tapped into that more than we've seen

before with this one I don't think he's been

emotional throughout all the films. I think if

anything, that's one criticism in the sense of

his films can be a bit cold, but I think there

are certain sequences, that's not a word, sequences,

there are moments and pieces of that where he's

able to break through a bit or utilize at least

actors that, to me, I think the most emotional

movie still Or maybe it's just because I'm thinking

of that one scene with Matthew McConaughey watching

his daughter grow up right before his eyes. That,

to me, still feels like the most emotional in

the ending as well. So on an emotion standpoint,

I felt like Interstellar was a bit stronger with

those sequences. Certainly, it's here, per se,

but I don't know if it ever... The way it's structured,

in a way, it's like there's... you don't necessarily

get time as much time to have those emotional

connections. Like you see the regret, you see

the fear, you see the, the horror of like coming

to terms with one at one's actions. But in the

sense of like emotion of characters towards one

another, I don't think it is not, not saying

it's a fault, but I don't find it more emotional

than anything he's done before. If anything,

a little bit less, a few films, but how about

yourself? I mean, I think I would put Interstellar

as maybe the most emotional if I'm remembering

my experience right with them all. Again, some

of these I've only seen one time. I think I would

put this one, like if I'm doing like a line and

I have super emotional on one end and no emotion

on the other side, I'm probably still putting

Odyssey on the half that is towards the emotion

side. I'm not putting it as far as I put Interstellar,

but I'm not also putting it like. on the left

side with like just like no emotion at all um

and obviously it's it's almost impossible to

make a movie with no emotion right like you're

gonna have some elements of that or you're not

human i guess unless you're yo evil and you make

yeah yeah video game annotation then you're really

good at making no emotions yeah i i think it

i think some of it just depends on like what

speaks to you from an emotional standpoint too

yeah um you know i think some are obviously going

to really connect to like the the father daughter

thing like you talked about with interstellar

or different things like that even the batman

films you can find emotion in there where you

know as bruce wayne as a character is kind of

traversing his life and you know with his parents

and things like that there's obviously i mean

i think we're somewhat immune cold to it or immune

to it because we've seen the batman origin story

so many times but like there is had you not seen

that before there is emotion with losing your

parents and things of that nature right and coming

trying to like fill that void so i think all

of them have like a little little elements i

felt it a little bit more with this one than

i have like even as much as i love like memento

and like i think inception's like a very well

-constructed film but i felt more emotion with

this one maybe than i did with those yeah i would

i would i would agree with that yeah sure i mean

i think that the thing about this one is for

me a lot of adventure films or epics or these

types of things are about like an end goal or

an end destination like trying to get somewhere

whatever the case may be right like we're um

we're traversing a long environment or a lot

of years or something where we're on a journey

like that's like the hero's journey it kind of

comes with adventure films right and i think

one thing that i felt a little bit more in this

one was it wasn't about getting home as much

as it was about Odysseus's belief that he was

worthy of home in that respect. So I felt like

that was a little bit of a twist on the adventure

film trope that I enjoyed. It's not just about

him getting there and then everything's just

going to be sunshine and roses. It was like,

am I worthy? Do I deserve to even be there? Can

I justify myself going back into that? setting

and things of that nature you know it's obviously

been a number of years we've made some choices

you know things of that like obviously there

still is the journey right there still is overcoming

the obstacles there still is like the the evolution

or the character arc that we're going to get

with most of these stories just inherently but

I did appreciate that it was a little bit more

of like what he felt about inside and being worthy

of like what home is I guess That was a bit unexpected.

And not just that aspect of it, but clearly what

this movie was saying on, like, a social -political

level. I know, obviously, you mentioned, like,

keeping it to the movie within itself, but to

the film. But, like, what I think Christopher

Nolan, like, he touches upon, you know, social

-political things. You see it a bit with The

Dark Knight and, like, the idea of, like, Big

Brother and pieces. And I wasn't, I didn't know

if that would be at all. within this, like, it's

obviously this archaic story in a good way that's

gone on forever. Could it really tie to today's

world or, you know, our times in a way? But clearly,

like, I don't, you know, it seemed that was certainly

there. It seemed, not just our times, but the

idea of what war can do to society, you know,

seeing Odysseus come to that realization that,

like, once it's broken, it can't be fixed and

like that that regret and then it all started

making sense regarding like so many people speak

in like the modern english of today and i don't

know if that was partially just because it's

more of a financial decision because you're doing

the odyssey people speaking like they did back

in the day with that would you scare people away

but i think it also ties into like again what

this was saying about you know the way in which

politics and the way the world functions has

been broken to such a degree. Like the, the quorum

is of the, you know, Zeus's law has long left

the building and, and how we're still like paying

for, you know, I forget the exact phrasing about

the people from the aisle or the, the ships from

the sea or whatever. And then what, realizing

that, you know, those are actually us, like we're

the people that are, I guess, spoilers a bit

for, The Odyssey, which I guess we can just say

up front. We're going to spoil it. It's been,

like with Project Calamari, if we saw it in theaters,

and considering it is The Odyssey, I don't know

if there's much to spoil. How old is the poem?

I don't know. Old enough. But that surprised

me the most, within the same vein of how... it

was him coming to terms with accepting and then

the allegorical elements of that and not i don't

think it's it's i think it was well handled because

it's not super direct it's not like you can you

can take it a lot of different ways but i think

it certainly is him saying something without

it being too overt and too on the nose which

i think can happen a lot with movies today even

movies i agree with i'm like okay i agree with

you but you take a step back a bit but i thought

it was there was tact here that I appreciated

I too thought that like being able to connect

it to I mean I know the poem's been around for

thousands of years and you can't do that if you

don't have some element of like time like timelessness

like where it just doesn't matter but like I

was also surprised with his ability to connect

it to the modern audience I guess in a way of

showing how you can become and i think this is

pertinent to today whether it be social political

whether it be hobbies whether it be the internet

world that a lot of people live in and things

like that but like how much you can get so laser

focused or tunnel vision on something that may

be initially a good venture or have a good intent

behind it but that you can become so lost with

how much you get into that and lose like you

have blinders on to the rest of the world almost

like that the idea of you know i know obsession

has been a movie this year but like the idea

of being obsessed with something or being so

wrapped up with something that you start what's

the phrase you lose the the trees through the

forest or the force of the trees the force of

the trees yeah the force of the trees right like

you're you're losing sight of like have i taken

a step back to see is this still worthy is this

still yeah worth the decisions and the sacrifices

i'm making because it's it's easy like i don't

know using a simple example like in business

or in sports like you can be so focused on winning

that you start to win the wrong way right like

you you lose integrity or you lose you take the

shortcuts or you you know for sports you pump

the steroids or you start betting on outcomes

or whatever it is like you lose sight of like

what's real and i think that was a interesting

way that he kind of had a little play on that

too with like how much he can just hey i have

this idea that i think it's going to work and

it reminds me of like the jurassic park line

right like we became so what is it we became

like so obsessed with could we do it that we

never asked if we should or whatever yeah the

malcolm line which is i butchered but like it's

a great line obviously um in cinema so i thought

that was an interesting take and i also was somewhat

impressed with i and i'm not no one has done

this before but like with a blockbuster like

this with an epic summer film based on a property

that everybody knows coming out in a time where

it's not easy to make for every movie to make

a bunch of money at the box office like how much

he was willing to i don't know let certain scenes

breathe to let the film go for i know that's

not rare to have long films but like he's doing

this in a way where it's just not it's not action

every other second or joke every two minutes

or whatever the case may be that a lot of other

films franchise blockbusters have tried to rely

on to keep the audience's attention and i was

somewhat impressed that over a nearly what was

this like almost a three -hour film that it does

have moments where i can see it losing some audience

but i appreciate the fact that it does let some

stuff breathe and it has some long stretches

of more like visual storytelling and some of

that where it's not just exposition dump joke

action sequence repeat you know all that kind

of stuff what did you feel about the pacing and

kind of like his ability to i guess trust the

audience to like be along for the ride even though

it's a long one you know what i think i think

you you make a good point because it's a movie

that was made for adults and wasn't afraid of

that fact like it it didn't like have to you

know, let's throw in some levity just for levity's

sake, like you mentioned, or the community relief.

It felt fitting. And I know it being nearly three

hours or whatever it was, like I never felt bored.

Like I never felt, I felt the structure of it

kind of kept me intrigued and knowing that, okay,

like it's, obviously you have an idea where the

story is going. How do you keep people interested

when they, in most cases, should have an understanding

of like what this story is or have some idea

or expectations and i thought of how it went

with with that story how it was struck again

similar to like dunkirk how he loves to like

start at one point and go to others like the

the constant flipping back and forth and i do

think he kind of expects people to have somewhat

of a working knowledge of where the story originates

which could maybe a fault to it in a bit but

i think if you came in completely blind knowing

nothing might lose it might be a bit confusing

at first or it might feel like he's rushing certain

sequences because you're like or like giving

you the cliff notes yeah yeah i don't know yeah

i do if anything that was my my one i wish it

would stay with scene sometimes longer like or

yeah like we get some glimpses of certain things

like the like the giants with like i was like

oh i would like to be within this was so impressive

to see like i'd like to be within this moment

more or see other elements of the stories or

see more of of the of this world because it seemed

like you know we were like you said cliff notes

is a good example of it so yeah i i think of

like the whirlpool sequence like they kind of

set that up a little bit like you can go this

way and it's going to be this you can go that

way and it's going to be that and like there's

going to be this big dramatic thing and i think

they were onto the next thing after that like

within five minutes yeah yeah it is so it is

interesting where like the scenes within themselves

tend to like take some time like the which i

think may be the best one of the best scenes

is the um cersei scene with the pigs and whatnot

like that like i loved how like it it it like

it took some time although i know with the actual

story it's a lot longer yeah but it within the

way it's structured the one downside is that

we do we we do fly around so much it is trying

to like okay we have you know we have a lot of

room to cover so we have to kind of go fast forward

a bit so it kind of tried to have this has been

like a good i hate to even say this but there

was enough material in the odyssey that you could

almost excuse this being like a trilogy yeah

or you know what i mean like i hate the idea

of that but like you think of like the lord of

the rings right like yeah how much time they

had to kind of develop each of those films like

i'm not saying i wanted an odyssey trilogy but

like you could have almost justified with the

amount of material that there is that yeah or

at least like a part one part two at least yeah

which i'd rather this i'd rather like be leaving

wanting more and rather than feel like i think

it'd be hard to like within that sure like together

together they would tell a complete story i think

it'd be difficult for like part one to feel like

you're watching a complete movie so yeah i if

it's it's gonna be impossible no matter what

you do because this is such an epic like it is

the epic so i'd rather leave wanting more leave

like okay well now i want to know more yeah I

think that's a better feeling than like, okay,

well now I have to come back and do this all

over again. So that, and I think like some, some

of us are like tired of that in a lot of ways,

like not just the money grab, but like, does

everything have to be a two -parter? Does everything

have to be a trilogy? Does everything have to

be like, exactly. You know, that type of thing.

And I think for, for youngsters to like the youngsters,

I'm talking, but like for the younger generations,

I think this is enough to like, say like, Hey,

watch this film and you may be interested in,

in actually, reading the book or or something

that's more in depth not necessarily i guess

you may not read the entire epic but like you

may be more inclined to like look into that material

or just be like me and go back and watch troy

which i feel like that's what a lot of people

do that too that's that's one way to do it you

know those that don't read you know no just kidding

um so another thing that obviously nolan is somewhat

known for is his filmmaking abilities and one

thing that this definitely brought to light similar

to how we kind of talked about Project Hail Mary

and maybe the combination of Project Hail Mary

and the Odyssey both making a crap ton of money

this year will send a message but practical filmmaking

versus CGI Dan massive practical sets real locations

physical ships real environments camera tricks

that make things Seemed like there's no possible

way. That's actually being a real thing. That

is filmed. What was your take as you watched

it. And as you reflected afterwards. Of what

you appreciated. Or what you thought of the filmmaking

style. It was like. A breath of fresh air. I

can't even think of the phrase. But it looked

amazing. And to pull. We talked about movies

that make you love movies. Jurassic Park is certainly

there. And I think it also gets a. I think CGI

gets a bad rap because people think CGI equals

bad. It's like, no, bad CGI equals bad. And this

movie has plenty of CGI in it. It does the Jurassic

Park thing where in order for CGI to be at its

best, you are able to mesh it with practical

and digital. And I think that's what exactly

this does. It uses classic camera tricks, like

literally using little people. and giants to

make that giant scene, but it's not like they

don't use CGI to make things up a bit, but it's

not all CGI. It's not like they're in the, you're

telling me like the two headed thing wasn't,

was not real. No, no. Uh, and it's not like you're

watching people in the blue screen costumes in

a blue screen background where it's like, this

is basically just an animated film. So, uh, it

was, it, everything had weight to it. The most

famous sequence, of course, probably being the

Cyclops sequence. There's clearly CGI being used

there in multiple ways, but it feels like they're

all in the same spot, and it does bring you back

that, well, I wonder how they did that, which

is that wonderful feeling that I feel like we

get when we're watching some of these older films

that we tend to talk about a lot, but I certainly

had that here. What was your takeaway when it

came to just the use of special effects? i mean

i think this would be a fascinating film to watch

a behind the scenes like documentary oh yeah

or the special effect like the special effects

the um special features on the dvd like from

back in the day like this would be one that i

would actually like a lot of times they have

like whatever reels or or something like behind

the scenes of some films and you're like i what

what do i need to see the behind the scenes of

this film for you know what i mean like this

would be one where i would be like i'm actually

like seeking this out like show me all the tricks

show me how you did these things because even

just a few of the things i've seen have just

been like when i was watching it i had no idea

and then like afterwards i'm like that is amazing

and i didn't realize how amazing it was in the

moment and now i'm like even more impressed with

how they did that or whatever i think the guys

on film spotting kind of said it the best when

i listened to their review of this film and they

said like you could basically smell the salt

water Like you could, you could feel, you know,

all of the stuff that was happening and it had

a weight to it, like you were talking about.

So I really appreciated it. Like you got to understand

that doing a film like this, where we're going

to be dealing with Cyclops and people being turned

into animals and all of the different like giants

and crazy, even the Trojan horse itself. Like

you're going to be dealing with all of these

things that if not done right, could look awful.

like we we've seen it before right like we've

seen it in different films you know like you

said bad cgi is bad cgi but like it was a pretty

tall order when you're tackling this to number

one decide which moments in the odyssey you're

going to cover right like that's step one is

like what are we going to avoid altogether and

what are we going to like focus on and i'll give

them credit they didn't necessarily back away

from some things that you would be like that's

really going to be hard to pull off and i i just

think they did a good there was never a moment

where i was taken out of the film because of

a visual so i i really appreciated that fact

and you know it's a some of them may be different

than what you're used like what you are used

to with the story or what you like see in your

head or think they're going to do. But I think

they made it work for like, I don't, I can't

recall a time where I was like, well, that one

may not hold up. Like there's times before where

you see other films and you're like, that looks

okay now, but I think in 10 years, that's probably

going to like reek of, of the time. Uh, I didn't

get that with this film. So I was pretty impressed

with the, like, the the filmmaking and the the

way that they were able to craft this was i think

um something that will probably be looked at

by others to address how they make stuff in the

future like i'm hoping this and project hill

mary can send a message like that would be ideal

yeah do better yeah i think i think it's the

message ultimately is like you need it's a you

know it's a financially it's like well it's cheaper

but i think when you spend the money you know

you got to spend money to make money as they

say i think you know project he'll marry which

was expensive but not super expensive i think

it showed that you can do that and it not be

tied to a franchise or anything like that obviously

a successful book but you know still that's not

it's still something that is not like a franchise

film or that with the odyssey of course the odyssey

has the lineage and of course you know nolan

himself is a franchise but again he got there

because of making movies like this right so i

mentioned that not taking it out of the film

i didn't have a question did anything take you

out of the film or in the sense of we haven't

really talked about the actors or the performances

yet so i was curious if any of any what were

your thoughts on you know obviously matt damon

we have the star -studded cast and like pretty

much everyone's like an a -list star right but

what were your thoughts on the performances so

i am a sucker for matt damon like i like him

in almost everything he does so yeah i don't

know if i'm a good like critic of like whether

he's doing good or not i feel like he captured

the right elements of the character for me like

he didn't come across as a superman he didn't

come across as like this uh as much as he as

having these poems and songs you know written

about him and his life and stuff like that he

i think his performance was able to like ground

that somewhat and and make it more about the

the real human behind the myth so to speak and

i think that's one of the themes obviously they're

covering in the film and kind of highlighted

so i i appreciate matt damon and and he's one

of those few actors like i can do no wrong in

my book um i say that and someone's gonna like

post like a crappy matt damon role i'll be like

well i forgot about that one but um i i think

he was good um i thought overall like obviously

i know samantha morton and john leguizamo are

getting like a ton of love and that is 100 warranted

like searcy and I can't remember what the guy's

name is, but the faithful servant slave of Odysseus,

John Leguizamo, is amazing. I would have to go

back through his filmography to see where I would

rank this role. Number one, of course, is the

clown from Spawn. This may be a close second.

I don't know. Sorry, Luigi, Super Mario Brothers.

i'm really thinking like this may be one of his

best then oh yeah i mean he's done a good move

i mean he's done yeah i actually think he's actually

quite good in spawn despite that movie being

awful but no he's done he's done some good stuff

he was uh he was in summer of sam which so he's

been in good stuff but i don't know if he's ever

like and i've always been a fan of his like i

guess like on this more of a subtle fan because

it's like it's he doesn't always like jump off

the screen at you yeah as much as like here it

was just like holy cow like he has reinvented

himself yeah i had no idea he was i had no idea

he was even in this like and i agree i think

in star -studded cast like his performance is

up there as one of my favorites yeah as like

the ones you mentioned uh charlize theron i liked

i thought you know for a big name like i think

she was able to do what was needed to do for

the clip so character so i enjoyed that i do

say i do want to say like i think john bernthal

should look like he did in this film and all

of his future films like he should just make

that his permanent like screw the long hair go

bald put whatever like tattoos or whatever else

you had in this film like just be that guy from

here on out no i appreciated john barrenthal

um you know anne hathaway was good robert pattinson

was good i will say he does have the one moment

that may have taken me out of the film and i

don't know if it was intentional or not maybe

it was supposed to be hilarious but when he's

calling out those weapons every time before they

drop through the i was like This is ridiculous.

He was doing it in such a way that I was laughing

to a point where I'm like, I'm not sure if I'm

supposed to be finding this as funny as this.

I think you're supposed to find him cowardly

in that moment for sure. The timing and the way

he did it was almost a comedy sketch piece. And

I know Tom Holland is the one that's getting

the most criticized in this film. I thought he

did what he was supposed to do. Yeah. I think

Nolan cast him perfectly with the idea that he

is going to come across as a little bit boyish

and naive and inexperienced and all of those

things that Tom Holland has done in other roles.

So I think it was smart casting and I thought

he did what he was supposed to do. I don't understand

a hundred percent why he's getting the most,

it seems like, um, criticized out of everybody,

but. I thought he was good. Maybe I'm just a

Tom Holland fan. I don't know. I think his, his,

his part is tough because a lot of his acting

is reacting. Like a lot of his role is reacting

to the world around him. And from like, you know,

all the suitors that were there for his mom to

literally, I think his scenes with John Barenthal,

I think he, if you go back and watch those, he

obviously, when you focus on John Barenthal and

like his presence and everything like that, uh,

But I think what you see with Tom Holland, he's

learning about his father. And I think you see

a lot of his admiration begin to grow. He is

in this challenging role where part of him is

conflicted because he loves his dad or his memories

of his dad. But at the same time, just... the

concern of like his world falling apart i think

it's a very hard role to play it's not very showy

like he doesn't get that scene where he's like

you know taking off you know becoming the hero

per se so i i agree i think people seem really

harsh on him and like i i don't think like he's

the strength of this film but i i was never um

distracted or felt like his character was an

issue if like if anything was distracting it

was just that there are so many stars it's like

like charlie's there on shows up and it's like

everyone is like an a -list it's like it's hard

to it there's so many big actors that it's hard

to like forget that you're watching a movie because

you're seeing the actor before you're seeing

the performance yeah eventually i think with

all of them i was able to get there for the most

part but um i think like if anything that was

like i don't know if you need charlie's there

aren't but at the same time it's like but you

know i agree but i think it was the right ones

that could still like yes it's a lot of big names

but it was like choosing the right big names

that are not going to yeah you know i don't know

what force something or not going to like like

yes like why why charlie's their own but i was

like but i felt like she did the role right right

like it was like why uh john barenthal but like

he did the role right right like i got a lot

of that like i can get some people that are like

you know why was zendaya in this movie and i

can see that like for me i don't care put zendaya

in every movie and i'll be fine with it like

i think she's a pretty good uh actress but like

i could see that right but i felt like most of

them like stayed within the confines of what

their role was that's a valid point because they're

stars but they're also all actors like there's

no one here that doesn't Every one here has been

acclaimed for one reason or another, and rightfully

so. I do feel like Charlize Theron, if anyone,

didn't get as much. But that's also, again, her

partially the role. But at the same time, we

don't get movies like this. You probably need

someone where you trust and can have the weight

that's needed. No one felt like they were just

there because of their name. They all have...

proven themselves actor wise even like someone

like Travis Scott which I I know he's like comes

from the world of music but I thought you know

I didn't know that yeah so if you didn't know

it I thought it worked like Himesh Patel I thought

did a good job um as like the second in command

he's another one where I felt like he was he

had he was really he came out I know he was in

Tenet as well yeah so he was really good in that

I thought he was good in this and I did like

you mentioned you're a huge Matt Damon fan Myself

as well. I think we come from a generation of...

The Bourne films are like... I love the Bourne

films. But what I love about this is that I never

felt like I was watching Jason Bourne. Maybe

a little bit at the end with that final sequence.

But he plays the character... Odysseus is this

complex figure. He's heroic, but at the same

time, he's selfish. He is regretful in this,

of course. There's a lot of different... portions

to him as a character he makes a lot of mistakes

a lot of dumb mistakes at times um and i thought

like he handled that well where he was able to

i think it might be up there as one of his best

performances i would not be shocked if like he

gets an oscar nomination i don't know if he'll

win you know we were way too early for that but

i was a little if i was one of my concerns was

like like is it just matt damon because of matt

damon and as it ended i'm like oh no like he

i thought he had did great with the performance

yeah and apparently like just seeing some of

the cast interaction too like it seemed like

it was a cast that gelled really well together

i know sometimes you have this many big names

you expect there to be like maybe less uh kumbaya

moments or whatever but like there was i saw

an interview i think it was either zendaya or

tom holland with like like talking to matt damon

and like there was just like mutual respect from

a generation of actors to a different generation

of actors and like appreciating the craft and

the talent of everybody involved so it seemed

like it was uh well orchestrated from that standpoint

i also want to give a quick shout out because

i thought he was incredible in this moment and

i haven't heard anybody talk about him at all

but and i know it's a super small moment but

james remar as teresias the blind prophet in

the underworld yeah like if that was not the

most perfect casting ever he played that role

perfect, I thought. I don't know. I want to almost

watch it again just to focus in on his role there

as he's kind of prophesying to Odysseus about

what's going to happen. Again, this blind prophet,

I thought was... He almost reminded me of one

of the guys from Pirates of the Caribbean. I

can't remember which one. I thought that was

a neat little role as well. Anybody that we didn't

get to talk about that you wanted to highlight

from a cast standpoint? I feel like I should

also mention Anne Hathaway because I thought

she was phenomenal too. I mentioned how there

wasn't as much emotion within it, but when we

got to finally see her and Odysseus come together,

she held her own. I thought she had some of the

best scenes within this. Again, not an easy part,

but I think she's just wonderful. And I feel

like... and hathaway can be one of those people

people love to hate because she's a bit like

she takes herself very seriously and things like

that but you know i think in this you see why

because she's really good at what she does so

and i think that's probably what they all it

seemed like actors who realized the rarity of

what they were doing and that appreciation i

think helped i don't know if this is from the

outside and you know looking from the outside

in but it seemed to certainly go a long way so

i just had a couple other questions i wanted

to throw by you i know we kind of talked a little

bit about the practical effects and things of

that nature but i'm curious now obviously they

had to pick and choose like some of the sequences

that they were going to try to depict and whatnot

and which ones they were going to spend some

time with and and we got a bunch of these big

sequences or big set pieces or obstacles and

i was wondering you know as we go through them

so you have like the trojan horse aspect right

you have the the cyclops meeting you have the

sirens you have circe you have sylla and the

whirlpool you have this visit to the underworld

you have the various you know giant sequences

you had a couple different ones like that you

have the return to ithaca in that final confrontation

like was there a set piece or a sequence that

just like really blew you away or what were some

of your like favorites and was there any of those

sequences that maybe didn't quite work as well

for you No, I don't think there's any sequences

that didn't necessarily work as well I mean the

the pig sequence is probably the one that stands

out the most but then the final action set piece

like it's you know something we building towards

and it felt like Rightfully epic if there's anything

that like maybe hurt it a bit was because it

you can tell what you know the this was all an

IMAX and like obviously with those cameras there's

like there's challenges in the sense of like

how you can move them and it felt a bit claustrophobic

but at the same time i feel like that was certainly

purposeful because that's where the way you wanted

to feel but i thought it was certainly a standout

sequence and then the other sequence just being

the the cyclops sequence with just the meshing

of practical and and um and cgi so those were

i think those nothing ever felt like it wasn't

you know everything you the money was on the

screen and when we finally get to that moment

of the detroit you know the trojan horse and

if anything i wouldn't even want to mind a little

bit more within that but at the same time i think

the point there was just to see it how it impacted

odysseus and i think that that ended up working

well how about yourself i mean i think i agree

with probably those two like the trojan horse

sequence is interesting right like I guess they

added some elements that I had never, I don't

know if it was in the poem from when, whatever,

27 years ago when I, when I covered that in high

school, whether it was on the beach and people

were drowning inside the horse. I don't know

if some of that was just a Nolan, you know, interpretation

or stuff like that. But I thought that was interesting

to see on that scale, like the way they did that.

But I think the, the Cyclops and CRC sequences

were, were the ones that I think were the. kind

of the the meat and potatoes of like really showing

what they could do with this i think there were

some cool elements of some of those other sequences

like when they're showing the giants and the

small you know compared to like normal people

and and things of that nature were interesting

i thought the underworld was well done but i

thought they all were handled in a good way but

i think yeah it's easy to go to those two the

cyclops and circe the other one we're seeing

is a good call out because that that was that

looked like it's hard to like go back to in the

sense of because it was so eerie and creepy but

in a good way so that's a good point you make

a yeah i i agree with that and i was also wondering

like this is one this had nothing to do with

listening to another podcast or doing any research

or anything this was like the the thought in

my head as i left the theater was around this

like i'm walking out of the theater and and in

my head i'm thinking to myself when was the last

not part of a like non -franchise epic film of

this nature that worked as well as this one did

and i was trying to like rack my brain in the

car coming home like take out all the comic book

that you can't use one of the avengers movies

right like planet of the apes is a franchise

so you can't count planet of the apes and you

can't count dune because that's part of a franchise

so those are some of the other ones that i like

thought of but i'm like how far back do we, and

I know this is based on something else, like,

but it's not a franchise. It's not film five.

That's been led up to, you know, through four

other films and things of that nature. So, you

know, it doesn't have the advantage of something

like, you know, the, the, um, the third Lord

of the Rings film where you've had that buildup

or whatever. I was like, when was the last time

that we just got something that was a standalone

epic or fantasy film that like worked as well

as this one did. And maybe you'll have some that

you can think of. that i didn't think of but

i almost had to go back to the year what was

it 2000 with or when did the gladiator come out

2000 2000 like has it been 25 years since we've

gotten like a standalone epic of this type of

nature that worked just by itself to this level

or what's your take on that i mean yeah it's

without franchise you know obviously you think

of like lord of the rings but of course that's

like a franchise i mean It's hard to say because

there's movies I'm thinking of like... What was

the... Guillermo del Toro fantasy adventure that

was... I can't think of the name. Not the movie

that kind of put him on the map, but I can't

think of the name of it. But again, it wasn't

like huge scale. I mean, the first Pirates film,

that eventually became a franchise, but when

it was a standalone, that was... I wouldn't say

it's nearly as good as this, but that was...

good example of like a an epic type film that

had those elements oh man i can't pan's lab when

some of you are thinking of okay gotcha um which

isn't it's not like it has it's not like it has

massive set pieces it just has crazy creatures

i don't know i can't really think it really had

me thinking like i i think i would put gladiator

in that camp because i think gladiator when it

came out was just like regardless of how anybody

feels about it now or this any other i know there's

been a sequel so i guess you could call it a

franchise but that i don't think that counts

the same it wasn't like a series that led up

to like something bigger but like i thought about

that one and i was just like really trying to

wreck my brain and i was like because at first

i was even including franchise stuff i was like

i feel like you have to go back to like the the

more modern planet of the apes even if you or

or i guess you could count dune from you know

the last few years like Dune and planet the modern

Planet of the Apes films are those the closest

franchise ones? We've gotten in the recent time

periods that you would like put on that same

level We're just thinking like epics like fantasy.

It's like sort of sort of like just in somewhere

in that fantasy realm We're like fantasy like

so everywhere everything everywhere at once one

account, right? Cuz I thought really it's more

like science It's an interesting, it's an interesting

thing to think about because that was where I

was, I was getting this, like, you know, kind

of like back in the day, right? Like you had

Ben -Hur and you had like Lawrence of Arabia

or Spartacus or something like that. I was like,

is this like our modern version of something

like that? Where it's like, you know, Gladiator

and the Odyssey and like a couple of things like

that. Like, I do think, you know, from a scale

standpoint, the Planet of the Apes films and

from a quality standpoint, like what we've been

getting with the Dune films is kind of close

to that. But again, I guess it depends if you're.

if you bring in franchises or not, but I think

it's an unfair advantage when you do have like

some films that are able to make some of them

more than they are based on like, like, that's

what I think of when I think of Avengers, right?

Like that took eight films to build up to it

or however many, you know what I mean? Like,

not that that isn't still worthy, but like, it

was interesting, like coming out of the theater

thinking like, this is like a blockbuster that

I don't think we've seen in quite a while. like

i'm not saying it's like the end all be all i'm

not saying it's going to be like my number one

best film of the year the best film of the decade

but like i had that feel of like scratching that

itch of just this epic fantasy like i couldn't

put a finger on when the last time i had that

feeling was coming out of the theater yeah i

mean there's certainly been films not within

this genre like i'm thinking of like gravity

for example that was like oh that was just pure

spectacle or even captain phillips uh that was

just like very suspenseful that that come to

mind But yeah, an adventure like this, we had

Gladiator 2, but no. So I think the Dune movies

is what would come to mind. I do really love

those, but again, that's another franchise per

se, so it's been a while since we've gotten something

like this. Unless you want to say, again, if

we want to expand genres, and we can say a few

months ago with Project Kilmary, but that's more

science fiction. I think the first Pirates movie

is a good... probably a good comp i know it turns

into a franchise but if you just take the first

movie of a franchise by itself like i think you

could get that that's why i was like would not

count the avengers and like what was iron man

the first movie of that series like yeah i don't

know if it quite hits the same as what we're

talking about so like it's definitely an interesting

thing to kind of like definitely because basically

the superhero film is kind of over the civic

rim like it's it's it's got the spectacle but

i don't know it has the quality like yeah i mean

that's like a fun adventure and then there's

like you know smaller scale things like godzilla

year one or minus one forget the exact name i

always get the year i think year one because

the comic books but that's not it right um so

it's a good question either i couldn't glad eater's

a good call but i don't know if there's something

in between right that because it's hard to get

films like this in general and then if they are

successful it's hard you know We're probably

going to get another one. We're going to get

the Odyssey 2. No, just kidding. I was also curious.

I don't want to get into the nonsense around

this 100%, but I am curious. What's your take

on adaptations? How much leeway do you give somebody

who's adapting a fictional thing? No matter what

you're adapting, My thought is, unless you're

trying to do a documentary or you're trying to

say you're being accurate, just be good. You

can change whatever. That's always been my personal

opinion. You can change, adjust, do whatever

you want. As long as it's good, I don't care.

That's always been my opinion. I feel like people

care about source material only when they care

about source material. I guarantee you there's

movies that you love. Everyone loves certain

movies. maybe like no one complains about die

hard not being like the book it's based upon

or gets a story from uh but you know people like

jurassic park we both love jurassic park it changes

a lot about the the original film of the book

uh so my interpretation is just be good i don't

care what you change or adjust as long as you're

not trying to as long as you're not trying to

build yourself as an accurate adaptation or like

i mentioned be like a documentary that is trying

to be telling the real story then i don't really

it's not you know newsflash it's not based on

a real story like a real event like no no no

yeah i'm just saying when like if it was like

an actual documentary you know right once you

say based on a true even though based on a true

story like i know it's not true i don't it's

fine if they change whatever it, but as, as long

as they don't then go like, Hey, this is what

really happened or whatever. But I don't care.

How about your software? I know, I know, you

know, we've had, we mentioned our experience

with it. Did you care about any adjustments or

changes or how do you, when it comes to source

material, you really care about like, what's

your thought process? Like, especially when you're

adapting a fictional thing, like it's not like

you're, The historian and the history major in

me does at times have a little bit of hesitation

when you're going to tell a story that is based

on or is a depiction of a real event that is

then going to be understood as the real event

in a way. I don't know. People think the Patriots

is a real story. Like the animated Pocahontas.

like oh yeah yeah if we do it that way and then

everybody just actually thinks that that's real

and that's how things happened like i think there

is some like internal pushback i have a little

bit with that like let's not trick people into

thinking something is real that's not but like

especially when it comes to a fictional story

or a universe like it's it's like i don't care

like you do what you want to do to make it work

for whatever whether it's making it work for

a moderate audience whether it's just um directionally

like making it tell a theme or a make a point

that you're trying to make like i think all of

that stuff is is like totally fair game and do

what you will for it like what was the like all

of the critiques of like what was it the little

mermaid or or whatever disney character that

was like hey this is the wrong hair color or

this is the wrong race it was it was yeah i mean

that was with the one where like the the original

story like the things like the character is green

like or or whatever you know what i mean like

it's like mermaids don't actually exist you know

right it's like it that we're getting so stuck

up on it's not faithful to the version that we

grew up with when that's not even faithful to

the original like what are we doing here like

that stuff drives me bananas i will say I have

at times had some internal, like just personal

preference when the change seems like a change

for changes sake. Yeah. Versus like, there's

a reason based on the story or the character

or the development of something. And it was like,

Oh, I mean, I don't know why we did that, but

like, it's fine that you did it. It's fictional,

like do whatever you want. But sometimes there

is like, I would like, to understand why but

like it's not something that would like make

or break the film for me and it's just that's

just simple like i don't know like changing the

backstory of a character that i've already known

from another adaptation and that's like okay

did we just do it to do it or it's because it

like helped tell another story like no i get

that like in the sense of this is you know being

a comic book fan i don't mind if you change it

but just understand then what that means when

you change it like right there i think this is

a completely off topic but zach snyder for example

he loves it to take his characters and put them

in other people's stories in the sense of like

he'll change elements of characters like batman

and superman but then try to then take his versions

and force them into stories where they're where

they don't fit because he's just taking the story

of a frank miller or someone else and not fully

understanding when you change this element of

the character then what does that actually do

and right so that's like that's where i had i

do have an issue with like when you don't understand

the changes that you're making right like you

said change for change sake that that's where

i ultimately say if you're going to change it

change it just make it good that's like that's

my and there's a difference between changing

somebody's like backstory or Or you know a pivotal

point to their character development. And changing

somebody's hair color. Yeah. They're two different

things. So yeah. I didn't have a question for

you. Okay. You brought up a good point about

when's the last time. This happened. And then

the kind of flip side of this. Thinking of could

it ever happen again. And I heard going into

this. A lot of people were. Only Christopher

Nolan could make a movie like this. And probably

as of right now, that's probably the case. But

say 10 years from now, 15 years from now, whatever,

do you think there are any directors on their

way of being able to not make The Odyssey, but

to do their version of this? Someone who maybe

will be like, oh, this is this director, and

only they can make a movie like this because

of their proven success. Do you think we'll basically

get... ever see a director with the power of

a christopher nolan again or anyone currently

going today that you think is on that trajectory

in any way i know that's a big question to ask

i guess he's not he's older than christopher

nolan so i don't think i can i can go there um

i was gonna say like i have a hundred percent

faith in matt reeves of handling yeah something

of this like he did don of the planet of the

apes he did war for the planet of the apes you

know he's I feel like his work with the Batman,

you know, was, was, uh, high quality. Like I

could see him handling stuff like that, but he's

older than Christopher Nolan is. So I guess like,

that's not somebody that like I can project,

you know, forward 15, 20 years, but man, I don't

know if I have someone like on like a specific

director in mind. Do I think that it can happen?

I think the more that we develop the, the skills

to do not a hundred, like, we got to this point

where it was like hey we have cg and not and

i agree with you all cg isn't bad but there was

a point where we like we have the cg technology

and now we can do things that we've never been

able to do before like we can we can tell stories

that we've been afraid to tell before because

we knew it was going to look like booty right

um and i i think they're is a point there as

technology continues to expand and develop and

stuff like that that we still have other things

where it's like yes we could do it before because

we had cg but now we have even something greater

than that whether it's better than cg whether

it's a mix of practical things whether we develop

other skills like i feel like that's always going

to continue to evolve so i think it opens doors

for telling stories that may have not been told

before because of fear or because of capabilities

or whatever the case might be i don't know what

that story is i don't doesn't even have to be

necessarily based on a story that already exists

it could be you know something completely you

know new and and uh not tied to anything but

Um, so I think that we could definitely see that.

I don't think it's going to be something where

we see something like that, you know, every year

or every couple of years, like, is it going to

be 25 years between that's how long it's been

from gladiator to the odyssey? Is it going to

be 2050 before we see something like that? I

don't think it'll take that long. I, I think

it can happen more frequently maybe than we might

think at first, but. I don't know. I'm hoping

that the combination of technology and practical

effects will continue to evolve to the point

where people can take on stuff that feels like

this in the future, maybe more frequently than

that we have seen in the past. Great answer.

I think that you bring up a lot of good points.

I did have some people that I think that come

to mind. So let me run them by you and see what

you think. The first person that came to mind,

who I think has almost a similar trajectory as

Ryan Coogler. I said the name already, Christopher

Nolan. Because Ryan Coogler, like with Nolan,

who had his first film being Following, that

was kind of a small independent film. That was

Ryan Coogler with Preview Station, which was,

I guess, a little bit bigger, but it was more

of a personal story. Then he gets into the franchises

with Black Panther, similar to Nolan with the

Batman movies. Then he has his big standout hit

with Sinners, and you could say that maybe with

Nolan. whatever maybe prestige or whatever film

you want to say. So I do. And he has also done

some things with the industry, like his working

to get the rights of sinners back after so long

and things like that. So I think Ryan Coogler

is one that comes to mind as someone that he's

on. He's not maybe there yet, but potentially

could be. So that was one that came to mind.

That's a great answer. Another one too. And.

She has another movie coming out, I guess, next

year because it got pushed back, would be Greta

Gerwig. Of course, the Nolan's correspondent

with Barbie Heimer. Obviously, you know, Barbie

was super successful. I don't know how Lady Bird

and Little Women, they weren't like gigantic.

So it may be too much. But, you know, we know

she's doing the Narnia films and like Netflix

is even putting those in theaters now, like actually

doing a theater push. So I'm guessing they have

faith in those. So if those are. to be successful

and you know she already has a billion dollar

movie in her back pocket which is something not

a lot of people could say so i feel like she's

you know on the potential there i thought maybe

a dennis villeneuve he's actually like you said

with uh he's younger he's older than nolan so

that doesn't work he's kind of doing it with

dune right like he's kind of already there like

what about uh what about joseph kaczynski i what

has he done top gun maverick and um i know a

lot of people didn't like f1 but i'm saying like

that's kind of more uh earlier stuff but i could

see like maybe going off of i mean f1 was super

you know what f1 was did like it wasn't huge

domestically but in a worldwide so i think the

question would be like can he do something that

is yeah you know like his own another one too

this is probably really early um because he's

only done i think two films at this point really

But he's got another one coming out this year

is Zack Greger with he's done Barbarian and Weapons.

Of course, those are horror films. But again,

those were Weapons was like one of the biggest

movies last summer. Barbarian was successful,

but not huge. But he's doing the Resident Evil

movie coming out later this year. So that proves

to be successful. So that was someone who I thought

about as well. And then we have Lord and Miller

who did, you know, did Lego. They've been attached

to a bunch. I don't know their ages, though.

I looked those up. Those are just some of the

people that kind of came to my mind of potentially

as maybe they have, you know, both the financial

success with their films as well as the critical,

like someone like Ari Aster, for example, like

I know people like he's got, he's a name people

know, but I don't think he's ever been like has

the blockbuster behind them. But I don't know.

Those are some people that seem like maybe like

if, if they keep going the way they're going,

like if, if I know Ryan Coogler's been announced

for the next black Panther film, but maybe if

he does another, you know, standout hit, like

outside, like, you know, another, not, not another

like centers too, but another movie that is original.

And I think he, like, I think, so I do think

there's, there are a lot of individuals and there's

something that obviously we have obsession and

back rooms without those directors that, but

that's only, I was trying to think of people

that had at least multiple films. that have been

successful so what about like uh what about brady

corbett he did the brutalist i know that's a

completely different style right yeah but it

it's a it's a it's a um it covers a lot of time

period it's kind of got a spanning like storytelling

way like if he really like took an epic and like

grabbed onto it like i haven't seen vox lux or

uh i think he had another film before that but

yeah he's young i think he has the talent i still

haven't seen the brutalist but i know it was

heavily he clearly may have the talent i think

the only thing would be would he ever get to

the point where the people would be trusting

to give him yeah that's true that amount of money

because i think that's the question so that was

i was just thinking that like some directors

that like i also apparently didn't realize how

what age any of these directors that i really

like are yeah i know i thought i didn't realize

how old didn't not he's not old but like you

know all right like we're like oh wow he's he's

a little older than i expected i thought he'd

be a little but because you know forget like

the only one younger than me yeah goodness gracious

um so um yeah that's that's one i'll have to

like ponder a little bit because i think that's

definitely an interesting question as we're talking

about like when and you know if there would be

another epic like who's gonna make it like that's

yeah i've i've had a bet money on anyone right

now would be it'd be ryan coogler because he's

like i said he's he's everything he's done been

has been successful he's already you know won

oscars not or his movies have won oscars on him

but right um and then like and the big thing

like he showed that he has the ability to negotiate

on on more of you know so that's i think a big

part of it too so i don't know it's we'll find

out now ryan googler's uh directorial uh the

iliad yeah that's what's coming then somebody

can do you know they already tried to do beowulf

a while back oh my god so well we should do that

i don't know if i've ever saw that though it

was an animated one right I don't know. I just

know that that was not a story that I was intrigued

at based on my high school time to go back and

revisit. That was a tough, we didn't read that

entire thing. We read like a, like a page. This

is, it was a slog. Yeah. So obviously this one's

doing well. Um, I think its budget was a whopping,

it was a lot of money, 250 million, but it's,

uh, going to make a billion dollars, I think

worldwide. So I think it's going to do all right

here for, for the odyssey. And I want to say

it's, uh, pretty well received i haven't looked

at any type of like um yeah people put i think

right now if you know you're doing oscar odds

it's probably i mean it's obviously going to

be nominated and probably be the on the we're

still obviously we didn't hit technically oscar

season which is like the fall but yeah it's gonna

be a contender for sure and it was i mean there's

like you mentioned there is a lot of noise around

it i'm sure maybe that might impact it um also

this made me realize why i love watching things

that aren't popular because my news feed was

covered was like yeah jam -packed with some of

the worst takes in the history of the world when

it came to like this i'm like how do people do

this like it's so much better watching things

no one cares about because you don't have to

deal with i used it uh i used it as a barometer

on certain social media platforms that i'm on

of like how can i really quickly identify people

that are uh of the far right mega movement and

yeah it was very easy to point those out and

just block them from my feed yeah it was crazy

people even yeah but even beyond that too just

like there you have that like those crazy people

because like you know um people freaking out

because lapita nyong 'o was was cast um and then

then others not like i'm saying you have to love

this movie or they're not criticisms like but

some of them were like i mentioned like the modern

english people i'm like do you not it's clearly

a choice there like do people not they use the

wrong they use the wrong type of metal on the

ship dan that is a that is a deal more about

the helmets or the i'm like i'm gonna i'm gonna

go crazy man and then they would be like it's

why can't it be like troy What? When did Troy

become historically accurate? The Trojan horse

didn't look as good as it did in Troy. Where

were all you people when I was watching that

movie loving it and no one else did? Now I feel

like I can't love it because you've tainted it

with your nonsense. Right. Anyways, I think we

talked to, yeah, I think we covered everything.

Like it was fun to talk about a new film from

2026. We've got to do that a few times. We might

be able to do that a few more times here throughout

the rest of the year, but we also have our other

series that are going on. So, you know, if you

haven't had a chance to see a lot of movies in

the theater, don't worry. We got your old streaming

content covered where we're covering all of the

Western films that you could possibly like think

of. um we've been covering things like the naked

spur and uh johnny guitar we have some some classics

coming up with like the red river and shane and

uh what high noon i think is coming soon so you

like west bravo yeah yeah we got you like everything

you could possibly listen to there and then we're

also doing some more science fiction fun for

more of the geek side of of uh our uh predisposition

i guess with our planet of the apes series so

you can watch us as we go through all of them

not just the modern ones no we're going back

through all of the originals uh the good the

bad and the ugly i'll say of that and you'll

have to kind of like tune in to see which ones

are which fits fits well right because we did

that movie too just earlier this year right yeah

so uh there's lots of stuff to listen to as we

kind of make our way through this and you can

always keep uh track of us on letterbox and you

can go back and see like which one uh or our

facebook and you can see it is if dan or myself

is uh in a better shape for the box office draft

and kind of how that's going not me not me spoiler

alert it's not over dan um and uh you can check

out you know what that is looking like is i think

we each have three films or four films that are

yet to be released so yeah i still have my number

one pick yeah so my number one pick with doomsday

and i got uh and hoping my sneaky like seventh

pick of dune dune can like uh bring it home for

me still like i regret that you know i got the

new hunger games movie everyone go see that and

clay face yep which i know and then you know

cat in the hat is gonna it's gonna it's gonna

blow down the box people don't realize it's gonna

make a billion dollars um dan i think you did

curse the minions movie though by the way oh

my god no minions film has ever made less than

like whatever 400 million and i know you've never

been a fan of the franchise you draft one of

the minions movies and i see it in theaters too

i do my part and it gets good reviews and it

gets good reviews no money to be made i don't

understand the world it is a weird year for the

box office that is like and then same thing with

I curse Moana, but I'm actually okay with that.

I will take one for the team. You're probably

okay with both of those. You're fine with both

of those not doing well. I hate saying it, but

I did like it. It was pretty good. My kids loved

it. I somehow ended up with the sneakiest pick

on the planet somehow with Spider -Man as my

third draft pick. that was i remember going back

i think if i remember saying like i don't think

it's going to do well this year i don't know

and then that yeah i thought we were doing well

you know like we have all these we it's a decent

year at the box office like there's a bunch of

films that have made over 300 million like we

have you've drafted you had at least two of them

with michael and odyssey i had project hail mary

and uh toy story and mario like they've all been

doing phenomenal and then here comes spider -man

and in one weekend beats almost all of them Like

what, what world are we living in? I, yeah, I

was just, you know, I thought maybe cause like

the other, the other Spider -Man's that weren't

no way home did okay. And I thought the MCU was

dead. That's what people said. But I thought

comic book movies were like, like nothing seemed

like it was making money and Supergirl tanked

and like everything else was tanking. And then

Spider -Man said, remember me? I know it's interesting.

I don't know. So I don't know what that means

for Doomsday, if that's a good sign for Doomsday

or not. We'll see. Because it didn't really...

I don't know. We'll see. I do think it means

that regardless of what other kind of superhero

fatigue people have and whatever happens to the

DC and the Marvel Universe, I think we can be

assured that no matter what happens with all

of them, Spider -Man will continue to live on.

Yeah. We're going to get more Spider -Man. Sure.

It was always my favorite as a kid, so I'm fine

with that. I mean, yeah. I know everybody's like

Batman and Superman fans. I was always kind of

more of a, I didn't read comics. I didn't watch

a lot of superhero stuff, but I remember having

a Spider -Man coloring book and I thought he

was cool. Can't deny that. All right. So you

can search out Dan at the comic concierge. You

can search out our Facebook page. What is it,

Dan? I'm a country years movie podcast. If you

search that, you'll be able to find it. and the

um cinema geek podcast is probably oh yeah sorry

the comic concierge movie podcast would be an

interesting yeah that would be weird i am combining

everything yeah cinema geek podcast it's on facebook

i gotta start posting more um but you can catch

us on there so yeah for sure check us out on

letterbox you can check out the website i'm gonna

say it the wrong way though because they just

changed it it's the gcrn .com so uh it is no

longer geekcastradio .com it's thegcrn .com so

you can check that out and all of our stuff will

be posted there as well as any articles that

dan and i write usually get posted there as well

so you can check out all of that content so that

does it for this episode tune in next time for

another chance to listen to more of the cinema

geeks