Remote Control – EP 37 – Counterpart S1 E5

Is there a reason you're not walking out of the

hall right now? You couldn't just drop some intel

in a locker, send a simple cipher like any other

person, could you? Now with you, I get the...

These letters. Like, uh, Rilke here. And I can't

make heads or tails of that guy. All these years

with you, I'm still out in the cold. Welcome

to Remote Control. In this episode, you'll hear

DJ Valentine and myself, TFJ and Mike talk about

Counterparts Season 1. Episode 5. Now on with

the show. What do you think of the view? Different,

I imagine, where you come from. There's no need

for pretense with me, Howard. I know so much

about you. I know your other sent you here in

his place as a result of his being grounded by

the embassy. He didn't tell you about me, did

he? No. My name is Alexander Pope. And you, dear

boy, are nothing. Like our mutual friend. Hello

and welcome to Remote Control, the GCRN's TV

podcast that talks about TV shows from 2000 to

now, and sometimes we go back in time as well.

I'm, of course, TF2 and Mike. Joining me is my

counterpart, trying to be DJ V. See? See what

I did there? Nice. I mean, it's not like I could

make a spy versus spy reference or anything.

Because I don't think anybody wants to be, you

know... associated with Cosby anymore, sadly.

No, sorry. A monster that he is, or that he was,

or whatever. I've taken a break from watching

Black Panther 45 times to come on here and talk

about a little counterpart. I had some time in

between showings to watch a little counterpart.

I think I mentioned this last week, but when

Black Panther dropped, Ripped Apparel put out

shirts that day, like basically, you know, emulating

various versions of Black Panther the character

and one of them was Black Panther the Pink Panther

dressed as the Black Panther I saw that I also

saw the Carolina Panthers they changed their

names of the Black Panthers I was like that's

dope I would rock a Pink Panther as the Black

Panther and a Carolina Panther both of them are

welcome I have not seen a hell of a lot of movies.

We've talked about this since we brought this

show back. You're a busy man. You're a busy man.

I haven't seen Justice League. I haven't seen

the other one, the guy with the hammer. I haven't

seen that movie. The guy with the hammer. With

the green friend from work. You're the friend

from work. Yeah, that's right. That's the best

line out of all any of those trailers. He's my

friend from work. I gotta be careful my dog is

sleeping and his name is Thor so if I say Thor

very loud he'll be like, what's going on? What

kind of dog is he? He's a golden doodle, a golden

retriever and a poodle put in a Hadon Collider

and smashed together to make a golden doodle.

You are the second person that I know that has

a dog like that that is named Thor. Yeah. I wanted

to call him Blondie after Clint Eastwood, but

my sister said, no, Blondie's a girl's name.

I'm like, no, no, no. You're thinking of the

singer. I'm talking about the crazy Western gunslinger.

She's like, nope, Thor. All right. That was the

argument and I lost. So we are here once again

to jump down the rabbit hole that is Starz's

new original series counterpart. After watching

season one episode five folks, I feel like there's

no comparison There's no difference between Alice

in Wonderland and counterpart at this point like

holy crap This episode will be known as the episode

that broke my heart We learned some truths in

this episode that left me saying oh, man You

assume everything is supposed to be all altruistic

and everything in Sadly not First off. I just

want to say this. Hey good Howard. You're doing

a horrible job pretending to be bad Nobody buys

him as bad Howard like in the first four seconds,

but oh, we know it's you we know you even mr.

Pope Steve was named Steven Pope Alexander Pope

Alexander Pope. He's like, yeah, you're clearly

from the other He doesn't say a word. He's just

sitting on a bench. He's like, yeah. Yeah, you're

not him Honestly, that's a testament to JK's

acting between the two versions of the character

really I mean the fact that he could still look

like Alpha Howard and not you know and still

act like It would be like we said a couple episodes

ago And like Howard himself said don't make me

into you or don't make me be you kind of a thing

like he's not being Howard prime he can't because

if he does he loses who he is and I think Hopefully

because at this point folks, we're at the halfway

point of season one All right I thought we were

gonna I thought we were gonna get I thought we're

gonna get an opportunity for good Howard To try

and be bad Howard when he went to go see his

daughter and that the daughter's boyfriend or

whatever Answered the door. I was like this would

be a good opportunity. He's like no He's just

not that guy No, he's just not that guy. And

plus, you know, we find out or we found out last

time that, you know, uh, good Howard and quote

unquote, I had Emily, um, not Emily is the other

one. I'm not even sure if it's bad Emily. I know.

Exactly. But we found out that, you know, good

Howard's Emily had a miscarriage. So like, That

for him It you know him seeing the fact that

bad Howard has a daughter with bed with prime

Emily or whatever We're gonna call them because

they're gonna go back and forth between these

names folks. It's just too confusing I've never

done acid in my life nor would I ever but like

holy crap between watching the original Disney

animated Alice in Wonderland and watching this

yeah this feels like you're high through a whole

thing cuz like so much stuff is going like you

know I mean seriously you look at Alice in Wonderland

you know eat this to get bigger eat this to get

smaller eat this like sir drink this drink that

like seriously really it's a Disney asset trip

that's very much so Disney acid trips are not

cool. I Mean there there's that scene with I

keep calling I'm just calling him blacklist guy

and they go He takes fake Tom Hiddleston to the

country and mr. Peter quill quail whatever them

is and you got the the crazy living arrangement

with the twin the two counterparts in the I was

like wait, so are they is it like big Big love

where there's two wives and a husband. It was

just a weird... At first I thought it was mother

-daughter, but they said the exact same thing

about him burning the roast, and I'm like, oh

my god, it's... He always burns the roast. Outside

of Howard Prime and Howard Alpha, Good Howard,

Bad Howard, whatever, this is only the second

time we've seen somebody that has actually had

their other... the room with them because obviously

part is is Baldwin and Nadia from the other episode

mm -hmm And and and Baldwin slash Nadia For a

girl with a bullet wound in her face. She really

kind of is not striking out with the lady I Mean

she has clearly has a bullet wound in her face.

She's like that girl says this flirt with her

all the time. You hear her some free soup What's

going on here and now she's kind of like listless

like she has really nothing to do in this episode

no So again, and I think I'm talking about this

last episode. I think she's going to align with

good Howard I'm pretty I'm not like a hundred

percent sure but I'm like seventy five percent

sure you're right because She has nowhere else

like she'd been she's been abandoned by her own

people. Yeah so Unless she's just gonna go on

a revenge tour and try and kill the girl I can't

you said her name last week, and I forgot it

already Claire and just kill everybody in an

organization That's the only thing I can think

she's gonna do but she didn't seem like she was

like Really going to do that. She was just kind

of just hanging out Yeah, like there was no like

there was no real place for her in this episode

Because of everything else going on in the episode

I mean you've got them searching the office and

like you said quail and Revealing to the blacklist

villain that You know about the about the stuff.

We learn more stuff about the world, which is

great Like I've been asking for that At least

you know How many people lost nothing man? You

see five billion. Did he that's not I can't remember

how many people they lost an epidemic He says

the number but I know it's like a crap ton of

people. Yeah so and that makes me think that

there's There's some there's stuff going on in

the the bad Howard's world that they're just

not telling us all the information I mean they

had the epidemic which is which is a big big

deal But I mean like how did that affect the

rest of the world? We're only getting to see

it in Germany But I want to see like America

and in like England and everything else like

what it what is left after this epidemic is it

just these small pockets of governmental Resist

I don't know what's going on over there because

it's right like Howard is good I was like walking

around and there's nobody there I didn't even

think about it until he brought it up when he

goes like why is everything abandoned here? So

yeah Emily Basically says that the flu killed

a half billion people. What was the half billion

people? Okay? Yeah, I said five billion people.

Oh my god That's still a crap ton of people But

yeah, wow And now we find out that good Emily

I guess I felt like bad Howard at the end of

this episode where he was just like, I thought

you were good. He cheated on poor good Howard

with now. Now we're under the thing of does bad

Howard tell good Howard that his wife was cheating

on him? Yeah. And the craziest thing to me isn't

the fact that she was cheating. Okay. Yes. I

cheating is the worst thing you could ever do

in a marriage in my personal opinion. Other than

you know domestic abuse, but you know still We

find out that it's the guy that he's been playing

the game with Right. Yeah, like seriously, which

is which is kind of creepy I guess maybe some

kind of guilt thing where he's like, you know

I want to get this other guy. Oh, how are you?

You've never won before you almost won this time

and I'm like, oh my god Are you serious like

bad Howard loses bad Howard lose lost on purpose

there. I'm assuming I would hope He kind of like

gives him his look like, you are right. Okay,

buddy. Okay, pal. Yeah. Bad Howard didn't really

have a lot of, like he had a few lines, but it

wasn't like, you know, him, you know. Fuck off

what you know whatever it's like It's not here

that first moment where he's like is there any

reason why you guys are walking at this door

right now? I thought that was cool Yeah, that

that whole scene between that beginning line

and the ending line in that scene With him saying

why won't you ever let me get close or whatever

it is like I've got it in the audio somewhere

in the episode here, but It's one of those things

where like Wow Just it just hurt me that like

I guess Emily is bad on both not bad on both

sides. She's just their marriage is doomed on

both sides See like it seemed like we were getting

the yen yin and yang like one universe was gonna

be the opposite of the other but even no matter

what universe and I think bad Howard comes to

this kind of like realization where he was kind

of almost fallen for the fairy tale as it were

of Good Howard and his wife and then he finds

out. Nope. She was she's not maybe not as despicable

as his Emily, but she is she is not without sin,

which is this like man Yeah, that part hurt me

I was like kind of hoping that this guy was a

spot like there's some kind of crazy agent and

we pissed himself on my own No, he's just a he's

just a guy Alpha Emily's part, you know, basically

just hiding a go -bag or whatever it was that

he found there just right with a regular civilian

like and apparently the affair been going on

for however long I've been going on for but like

Yikes and again, it goes to the point of we know

nothing about good Howard's Emily other than

what he has said. Oh, yeah, we know like Everything's

through his perspective. Everything's doing it.

So you're right. You can't I can't remember how

long did he say that fair was going on for? Couple

of years, I think. Oh, man. That's rough. That's

just true. I mean, that's what makes me worried

now, because what does good Howard have to go

back to? Unless bad Howard kills this guy and

never tells good Howard about it. Unless or Emily

never wakes up and we never never learns anything

about it. It's like Good Howard's the truth is

not good for good Howard because what does good

Howard have other than he's completely dedicated

to to Emily Every time you see a conversation

was like it's just us. It's just I take care

of my wife I go to the store. I buy flowers now.

He finds out his wife has been in, you know Cheating

on him. I just I where does he go after that?

That might that might turn that event might turn

him into bad Howard because it seems like bad

Howard was changed But if they buy Pope made

him like like capable as a killer, but it seems

like that he might have changed when He and Emily

got estranged So me so if they if bad Howard

or good Howard finds out that Emily who's been

cheating on him that my tournaments you like

Yeah, ruthless guy. Yeah But I don't know Bad

Howard's double double aces uh... you know like

what you have because like we said last week

we saw a good howard try to kind of the good

howard and and and and we prime have kind of

uh... a thing you know where there you know he's

like all i was leaving you a note that was doing

the you know they're having this fun little that

that kind of thing and now come to find out that

His wife has been cheating on him the whole time

or whatever Is this gonna be the most expensive

episode of wife swap we've ever seen? Is that

what's gonna happen here they're gonna swap wives

they're gonna swap Emily I mean like seriously

like we thought and Emily prime says it in this

episode this week that you know as many similarities

that she and the other have There are also very

many differences. They're not the same person

now She specifically points that out to good

Howard because he's still in his in either his

Upstairs brain or his downstairs brain He's just

assuming that they can go on their merry little

way and just kind of help each other out and

whatever right He I think he's looking at it's

like even if she's not my Emily. She's still

Emily Yeah, so like I I mean the things that

make me love Emily is is there In his brain,

but I mean again If he ever find that that's

now it's gonna be I don't what is bad how we're

gonna do with this information That's all I want

to know right now. I was like, what is he going

to tell him? Is he going to? How long how long

does good Howard have left in bad Howard's world

another thing they haven't really answered That's

the like he they did say he was supposed to spend

a week there, right? Think so if they said that's

what you get his visa worked out, but I don't

know it seemed like it might be advantageous

for him not to Not to do it like keep good Howard

over there because bad Howard can now operate

with impunity on everything you do every only

once in good Howard's world, so And and and if

he's in danger though though Alexander Pope knows

it's not him because you think because that bad

The Emily from his world was telling him that

Pope is the one that was behind him his kill

order or whatever So if Pope didn't know it was

him, maybe he could be he's using I we could

evenly see him use a good Howard as bait or you

know a shield But now I don't know what his I

just want to know what his plan is at this point

because he's this other than figuring out who

this guy was that was a Apparently cheating on

or sleeping with good hours web. What is his

planet at this point? Is he just hanging out?

Are they both just hanging out? Netflix and chill

I don't know Do they even have Netflix on on

on this planet like on this version of earth?

It's called it's called flicks net over there

You work for the office? They call me a runner.

I don't know what that is. It means that some

years ago I took a man like you and made him

into a man like Howard Silk. So, I should say,

what, job well done? I understand you've been

spending some time with his family. That's right.

Let me guess. He didn't tell you about them,

either. It's in his nature. Perhaps he didn't

want you mucking around in his affairs. On that

subject, though, if I may offer you a word of

advice, you really shouldn't be placing any trust

in that woman. Emily? I can't speak for what

she's like on your side, but this one ruined

him. And I wouldn't want the same thing happening

to you. Maybe you don't really know her. No.

Maybe you're right. I just thought I'd warn you

as a gesture of good faith. Don't be shy. If

you ever need anything, just drop a letter on

the lab post. You haven't the faintest idea what

I'm talking about, have you? He was right. You're

so plain. Why don't you ask Emily about my signal

plan? Might surprise you what you don't know

about that woman. the episode with good Howard

meeting up with Anna and I'm like wow you end

the episode on that holy shit the one she's the

one person that doesn't know this it's not that

it's not her father so she's like why you like

this what's going on with you what's wrong with

it because he's completely not trying to be bad

-eyed at all sick you're dying you're this you're

that like yeah Howard wants to kind of make up

for everything bad Howard has apparently done

or hasn't done or hasn't paid attention or hasn't

been around or whatever wasted or not wasted

an opportunity that he would kill for and never

got so he's just trying to essentially they're

living vicariously through each other apparently

but literally doing it yeah and I don't even

think bad Howard is living vicariously through

good Howard at all because bad Howard just does

whatever the fuck he wants it doesn't matter

I mean obviously he's smarter than good Howard

when it comes to the spy stuff because he is

a spy and all of that but like I don't know man

this is just one This show is just Question after

another one question after another question after

another question Episode 10 better be 48 minutes

of answers. That's all I have to say cuz you

know that you know, they're not gonna give us

the answers You know, I'm now the girl that betrayed

Baldwin Claire Claire Tell me her name. I keep

forgetting him. She's in a room with a bunch

of guys and then It's clear the one that walks

in and they say it's an honor. There was two

girls that look exactly the same were they the

Duplicates I couldn't I was confused by that

Yeah, maybe they'll further explain I do I do

love how this episode opens where the guys like

talking crap today to that girl and then They're

automatically planning his death behind him.

He just can't he does not noticing as they're

planning his death the moment they open the The

door and he's like telling them. Oh, it's gonna

be easy to get rid of my body because nobody

asked questions Essentially, you know the opening

scene to this episode with the three infiltrators

coming across like, okay You know the girl that

was there that you know stood up and put her

hands out and put her jacket out and whatever

else and they're like, okay You're fine. And

obviously the gun was planted in the apartment

because they didn't have it on them But until

I rewind, I watched this episode like twice before

we did this. So I make sure I'd have everything

I wanted to talk about fresh in my mind. And

I didn't really realize that the the Coke bottle,

you know, silence just really actually worked

because that sounded just like a pop. It didn't

sound like I've seen the views in a couple of

other movies before. Yeah. What the hell was

it, Ronan? I can't. I've seen it in another movie

before. Oh, wow. That's a. ingenious way to do

that I guess yeah but yeah that guy just wow

he did he did never gonna see him again he did

he's gone but yeah the the mole I guess who do

you think the mole is at this point at first

I thought it was blacklist guy at near the end

maybe not It's not it can't be him because it's

somebody higher up that has been around for years

The only person I could think it would be is

somebody that so that we have not seen yet someone

that they have not revealed yet, maybe it's the

Lambert character or somebody else Richard Schiff's

character. Yeah, is that Lambert? It could be

Richard Schiff's character, but that's not Lambert

is the He's the Ambassador dude, oh right right

right right right yeah the douchebag guy Douchebag

captain douchebag yeah, I remember It seemed

like he beat two on the nose Probably because

he seems like a scumbag so him being oh, he's

also the mole like It's got to be like somebody

we don't you might be right. It might be somebody

we haven't seen yet or I mean the only higher

up I can think of was Richard Schiff, but it

kind of goes counterintuitive to what he was

doing in the episode We saw him in where he's

negotiating Stuff over to that side. So yeah

Richard Schiff's character is Rowan Fancher.

I'm probably pronouncing that wrong He's the

OI director of diplomacy So The the Claude Lambert

or Lambert or whatever He's the prime ambassador

to the alpha side. So he's good Howard. He's

on good Howard's side of the world so I'm Not

really sure I cannot wait until Wikipedia updates

the recurring cast on here to say Andre Howard's

go partner and Emily's Yeah, whatever the hell

he is My goodness, is it the last time we're

gonna see that guy Not unless bad Howard or not

unless good Howard decides to kill him I mean

I don't know good Howard has a capable It's tough

to gauge if it's I really think that that information

is enough to break him because I think that's

what broke bad Howard but I don't know man it

just seems like it's it we need more steps in

between where he is as good Howard in killer

it seems like if he jumps to that thing because

I was kind of upset that he punched that guy

I was like I don't know this seems like a bit

of a jump from this meek you know guy to physical

physically attacking people or killing them Mean

everybody snaps, but it's just you know yeah

Yeah, but like I've been saying it every week

I know probably anyone that's listening to this

is probably sick of me saying this I cannot guess

what this show I cannot You couldn't guess there

would be two girls that living in the same house

with a man They are duplicates of you couldn't

guess that No, I mean we obviously knew there

was gonna be two duplicates, but like I didn't

really realize there was gonna be another like

We've heard of defectors and what I assume is

gonna be human trafficking at some point You

know from people from this side to the other

side wherever else but like like everything to

do with Emily and Howard both versions like Wow

Did not see any of that coming no Not at all.

And that's what honestly makes a great television

show. It just does. The thing is, you're susceptible

to the lost syndrome. You set up these great

mysteries and you don't have proper answers for

them. That's the only thing that's worrying about.

All these little mysteries they're kind of setting

up. I hope that they know exactly how to give

us some closure. Conclude, you know something

something that's worth a payoff to all of this

stuff. So Well, like I said, I mean, you know

They they have to be able to Pay all the like

I'm not saying I want Like all the answers by

episode 9 and 10 because episode 9 and 10 well

episode 9 and 10 are two -parter right, you know,

so I'm not saying I want all the answers at the

end of episode 10 But I want most of them and

leave me with a little bit more For the seconds

like leave me with a teaser for the second season

kind of a thing right like but I mean come on

Maybe at the end of the season good Howard and

bad Howard are Gonna be because they've been

kind of working together in the situation and

I think at the end of the season They're gonna

be enemies. I think good Howard is gonna have

Baldwin Bad Howard is gonna have the might of

whatever the hell organization there I mean For

me to get more involved in their situation because

I think them working together is not Equal it's

on bad Howard's terms at all times. I think it

as them as enemies With Baldwin back Baldwin

and bad Emily backing up good Howard. I think

You might have a compelling little thing there

going on. This is a prediction. I'm probably

wrong But I'm just throwing it out there. I don't

even know like I It's so hard for me to predict

this show because it's just so damn good It's

so confusing and it's wow Just wow so Alright

folks next week. We're gonna act like you've

been here before You finally get to that episode.

Yes Which like like we said last week like we

don't know how this is gonna play out, but we

can only assume like You know like we said about

good Howard having to try to act like bad Howard

Obviously that hasn't happened yet because he's

still doing he didn't want he did once in this

episode He failed miserably but even bad Emily

kind of told him to pretend to be bad hour to

get this guy to Talk, but then he just did it

at gunpoint It failed and she just held the gun

and they told him everything So I think that's

gonna do it for us folks We're gonna be able

to interact with you online sir At trying to

be DJ V is my personal Twitter handle if you

find her the show I'm on simplistic reviews podcast

at simple tweeters on Twitter Absolutely, I am

at TF2 and Mike on Twitter. You can follow at

geek cast radio for all the other network updates

Join us next week for episode 6 of stars is original

series counterpart And we will catch you next

time here on Remote Control. You're certain?

You know, it might be helpful if you told me

exactly what we're looking for. Before Silk left,

he asked me to follow up on a lead. So I met

a source. A man who knows about the people funding

Baldwin. And what did he say? He mentioned Amal.

Here. Third floor. High level. I know every point

of exposure from this floor. If there's a leak,

it's controlled. He said it was high clearance.

There's only a few people that could be. You,

me, any one of your boys. How long did your source

say this mole has been in place? He's in years.

Come with me. We're going for a drive.