CINEMA GEEKS
Cary Grant Retrospective – The Philadelphia Story Review

About this Episode
Hey guys, this is Rob Paulsen and you're listening
to the Geekcast Radio Network. Hello and welcome
to episode 224 of the Cinema Geeks. I am one
of your Cinema Geeks optimists, Solo, and joining
me as usual is the Comic Con series. Dan, hello,
how are you doing? I'm doing good. I'm glad we're
doing this show because it was it was little
touch and go there for a moment Our power went
out internet went out like literally like 30
minutes ago. I'm like, oh no, but came back So
but if I cut off in between you'll know why I
don't know. It's not even stormings I don't know
what's going on. That's the crazy part. Yeah
Here here it could always be storming. So it's
like well, you know, you never know but Yeah,
I'm glad you're able to do this one looking forward
to the conversation today. I have no idea what
direction this is going to take. So I'm intrigued
to say the least. We are continuing our talk
through the retrospective that is the Cary Grant
retrospective. We covered four of his films in
the Hitchcock retrospective and decided that
we had not gotten enough Cary Grant. We hadn't
gotten our fill yet of the actor. So we decided
to continue through his filmography. We've already
talked about bringing out Baby and His Girl Friday,
both of which would be probably considered screwball
comedies, whereas Today's topic we're going to
go more into the, I guess, romantic comedy. This
is a fine line, I guess, that distinguishes one
from the other. We can get into that a little
bit probably during the course of our conversation.
But we are talking about 1940s, the Philadelphia
story. Before we get the lowdown on the film
and all of the details, Dan, just remind people
what your background is or what you came to this
film as far as knowledge of the Philadelphia
story. Came with zero knowledge of the Philadelphia
story. I have not seen this before. I didn't
really know much about it It's like one of those
movies I've heard about of course because it's
Oscar nominated has big stars in it But I really
knew nothing about the plot the background where
it comes from so kind of going into this completely
blind Yeah, I had for once I've seen the film
that you haven't so I like that for I'll take
my moment in this It didn't help me at all. But
once upon a time like I said probably in different
episodes my mom and I were I think it was while
I was home from a break at college or maybe right
after college or maybe towards the last couple
years of high school. I don't remember exactly
when, but we were trying to make our way through
some of the AFI top 100 films that I had not
seen. A lot of them she had seen because she
grew up in that time period and things like that.
Well, I guess not in this time period. She was
born a year after this came out, but we were
making our way through a few of these. And this
is one of the ones that I remember watching and
I remembered Having a positive reaction, but
I could have told you nothing about the film
until I rewatched it this last week so it was
probably 20 to 25 years ago when I saw this so
outside of a vague recollection that I liked
the film at that time I couldn't have told you
anything about it nor did I probably even know
really who Cary Grant and all of these people
were back then I mean I probably did but not
to the point that I do now so it's definitely
interesting so Let's let Dan do the dirty work
here and lay down the foundation for the Philadelphia
story and then we'll come back with our reactions
and thoughts. Don't call it a comeback, she was
doing it for years. The Philadelphia Story is
one of those movies that's own history is as
interesting as the movie itself. After being
labeled box office poison, Katharine Hepburn
left Hollywood and headed to Broadway to work
on the production of The Philadelphia Story.
It became a major hit and Howard Hughes bought
the film rights and worked with Hepburn to make
a film of their choosing. They cast who they
felt would be the best chance of success for
the movie. That cast included Cary Grant, Jimmy
Stewart and Ruth Hussie. Those choices proved
to be correct as all but Grant were nominated
for an Oscar, with Jimmy Stewart winning his
one and only Academy Award. The film was also
a box office success, making over three million
dollars, making it one of MGM's biggest films
of 1940. In the film, Tracy Lord is a wealthy
Philadelphia socialite and she's preparing to
marry George Kittredge, a successful but stuffy
businessman. On the eve of her wedding, her charming
ex -husband CK Dexter Haven reappears, determined
to win her back. Dexter arrives with two reporters,
writer Mike Connor and photographer Elizabeth
Ombre, who are covering the glamorous event for
Gossip Magazine. As reporters mingle with Tracy's
eccentric family, Mike is surprised to find himself
drawn to her wit and vulnerability. Meanwhile,
Dexter quietly shows his general love and support,
in contrast to George, who judges Tracy harshly.
The legacy also led to later adaptations of High
Society, and it is seen as one of the greatest
romantic comedies of all time. Does that remain
to be true? Considering this is Katherine Hepburn's
movie, where does it fit into the career of Cary
Grant? Back to Kevin and myself to discuss. On
a play so first watch for you dan of the philadelphia
story going in a little bit of a different direction
than the previous two films we talked about with
carry grant all those still comedic what was
your initial reaction of the philadelphia story
after watching it. It's interesting you know
going through these retrospectives the hedgecock
one now this one we've watched a lot of really
good movies and this one how i claim like i said
it's going into it not knowing much about it
and. Honestly like it's one i'm kind of still
struggling with with for a lot of reasons You
know it's a movie certainly that is of its time
And i try and not to like judge a movie by 2025
standards when it was made when it when? because
takes Very little time to realize. Oh, this was
definitely a different time You know you get
you know kind of the domestic abuse joke like
right in the beginning like oh wow This is a
not not holding back and there's a lot of that
stuff that may maybe not hold up the greatest
But I was like not trying to hold that necessarily
against it trying to judge a movie for where
it's at And you know, there's so many great stars
in this as we know, of course care grant James
Stewart the only movie they've ever done together
Catherine Hector Yeah. Uh, but I guess, yeah.
And then Hepburn as well. So you, it's a stacked
cast. Like you can see why it might be game so
well regarded. Um, and as I'm watching it though,
and there's elements about it that I, that I
think are, I love the story behind it. Like there,
how this was kind of a play that Catherine Hepburn
Had she kind of for she was looked at for this
came out as box office poison for a while so
she stepped away from hollywood the display and
this was kind of like her big comeback story
and she let a lot of it even help the kind of
getting the cast together but the movie itself.
Just as I'm going through it like there's there's
good laughs there I don't know if I would qualify
it and I saw people qualify it as a screwball
comedy maybe just because we're coming off of
his girl Friday and Coming off of bringing a
baby. It is so much like more tamed than those.
It's not nearly as fast -paced It's not nearly
as like off the wall It's more true to life compared
to those in a lot of ways, but I don't know.
I I wasn't super invested in dynamic of the storyline
you have this kind of marriage going on and you
have kind of like not even a love triangle it's
like a love like octagon it's all these different
people kind of you know involved and it's a lot
of the care like Catherine Hepburn is fantastic
the performances I think are strong although
I think Cary Grant really doesn't Get much to
do compared to like what we've seen them so far.
He's he's really on the sidelines for so much
but I I struggle too with I will say as I look
at this movie. I'm trying to understand like
what is it? Trying to say like what is the point
here? And I and I don't know what was getting
at like I do wonder if it's a movie that gets
hindered by a lot of the Code at the time like
if yeah during when this was made if you had
a divorce They had to get back together. That
was a rule You know if you have people of high
society they had to look be looked upon in positive
light and you feel that here and it's it's strange
and I guess that's I was I don't know I I struggle
with this in a lot of ways. I don't think it's
necessarily poorly made or or bad I just I didn't
really enjoy it though. I guess is my best way
of putting it So i'm struggling with it on a
rewatch And I don't know if I'm struggling with
it in the exact same ways or. I guess I'm still
trying to come to terms with how I feel about
the film, and one thing that I'm struggling with
for sure is trying to decide if watching this
after watching bringing up baby and his girl
Friday. Does. You my viewing of this film, I
don't know if that makes sense, but like. Obviously,
the other two are way more screwball, like they're
way more crazy, fast pace out of this world and
things of that nature. And this is a different
animal, so to speak. And I don't know how that
worked for me watching them in the order that
we watched them, if that makes sense. I don't
like I'm trying to decide if I if we would have
started with the Philadelphia story, what would
have been what would have been my take. Yeah.
And then we watched those other two later. I'd
like to think that I can separate all of the
films and just watch them for what they are and
just like in a vacuum, so to speak. But I guess
that's it's that's not the word. That's not how
brains work. So it's really hard to like separate
that. And then the other thing granted, like
you said, it seemed like a lot of not only was
there the Hays code that's going on during this
time, but reading up a little bit on this film,
which makes sense. They talk about how there
was like a kind of rush of or rash of these types
of films that are dealing with the topic of divorce
or the topic of temporarily going away from your
significant other or your husband and wife and
then coming back to them, those types of things,
which I hadn't even really thought of. And then
as I'm thinking back, it's like, well, OK, bringing
up baby, he's leaving his fiance and, you know,
having this this this playing that leads to something
else. Got it. His Girl Friday. We have a divorce
that ends up, you know, she's getting remarried
and then, you know, the first husband comes back
into the picture and then we get almost that
exact same plot line here. where she's getting
remarried and he's involved. But then there's
also now a third person involved. So it's like
we're getting all that. And it's. I agree with
what you said. I'm wondering if also part of
it, because we've kind of been focused on Cary
Grant in a way is. Skewed by, like you said,
he's kind of not 100 % relegated to the sideline,
but he's not nearly what he is in the two films
we've just watched like. He is front and center
in those two films. And it's going to be interesting
to kind of go through the rest of this series
to see like what kind of roles he plays in all
the rest of the films, because we didn't necessarily
set out to watch only films that he was like
the lead or star in, although he's Perry Grant.
So he's going to be a star probably in most films.
But we were just looking at films that he appeared
in. So it'll be interesting to see if we have
other ones where he's kind of, you know, third
or fourth. I mean, he does get top billing for
this film. But he made that happen. So yeah,
you know, you could say he's third. Well, it's
interesting because he gets top billing. But
in reality, he's probably third on the list as
far as like screen timelines and things like
that. I'm just completely guessing. That's just
I have nothing to back that up. And you have
Jimmy Stewart, who is third on the billing, but
gets the Oscar for the best actor. for this film,
so it's kind of an interesting, not only is there
this like, it's not a triangle, you're right,
but not only for lack of a better term, this
triangle of love story going on in the film,
but then it also seems like there's a triangle
of who gets credit for what as actors in this
film as well, you know what I mean? And I did
not realize, I was... I guess dumb to the fact
that this was Cary Grant and Jimmy Stewart's
only role together. I just figured that there
was probably other films that they appeared in.
This is the fourth time that we've seen Cary
Grant and Hepburn together and the second one
we've covered bringing up baby being the other.
He's also on holiday with her and then an earlier
film called Sylvia Scarlett. So they are there
together a number of times. Yeah, I'm really
struggling with like the order that we watched
it and trying to decide if that's influencing
it. I'm also trying to think back 25 years to
why I had a positive reaction the first time.
outside of maybe it was just something that I
hadn't seen before and it didn't necessarily
fit into the, I think sometimes people, especially
younger folks, look at older movies and think
it's gonna be a certain way, whether they think
it's gonna be boring or they think it's gonna
be something they can't relate to or something
like that. And maybe my, maybe I was like 17
or 18, I don't know. Maybe that was refreshing
when I saw this and was like, well, this is actually
like something I can follow and it's... Got some
humorous parts and things of that nature, but
I yeah, do you think it? It's at all weird to
watch this one after those other two that are
way more intense It's very much a different speed
Yeah, it kind of is bringing a baby and his girlfriend
a kind of in the same vein and in style of execution
Helps us both both of those are Howard Hawks
and this is certainly a left gear I think even
without that I think I would still have A lot
of this the similar issues because I was able
to eventually kind of settle in to like what
this was. Okay, this is this is going a different
way definitely more romantic con, you know, kind
of a combination of the romance in comedy and
I again, I think that I struggle just looking
at kind of like Catherine Hepburn's character
and like her Progression and you certainly feel
bad for her in some ways like it feels like especially
at the end It's like this is just like gasoline
101 where she's led to believe like she did something
when she didn't necessarily do it And the people
are just not being like it's it's it's a strange
Feeling but I also feel like in a lot of ways.
She still has that kind of take charge Element
of her character and like I said, I do think
it's interesting that before this she was looked
at she was labeled as box office poison because
of She was an actress that was more You know,
she didn't fit that stereotypical role. She I
guess was seen as more kind of she stood up for
herself a bit more I guess and You see that here
and she's certainly like a broken individual
and this is has a lot of broken people but I
feel like it ends up being Very forgiving of
all their transgressions and a lot of was like
everyone kind of gets out of this unscathed unscathed
Yeah, it's like it wraps it up with a with a
bow at the end. That's that's a little too neat
and pretty yeah, and you know when there's that
now like a bite I think really hurts it because
Again, that's where I'm like, I'm trying to alter
like what is like what is ultimately the point
here? It's almost like the point here is like
the bad guy is the guy that like you had to work
himself You know was started at the bottom worked
himself up. He ends up being the bad guy and
everyone else that kind of like, you know that
was born into their into their situation is seen
as like You know that they're in the right which
is a weird weird thing. Although I guess jimmy
stewart's there is meant to be more of the uh,
you know the everyman, uh, and I guess that's
also what we remember way back when we did vertigo
we mentioned like how the The like the romantic
dynamic dynamic there wasn't didn't work for
us and I got similar feelings here like Jimmy
stewart and catherine heparin like I think catherine
heparin tells a lot more but I never saw either
of them having much chemistry so like there's
that dilemma of like okay like oh who do you
want them to get together like who's who you
know that that's you want that tension there
and i was like i just hope all these people just
leave each other alone i think that's kind of
the best i felt bad for um you know ruth uh yeah
Or the photographer like cuz she's like the only
innocent person she seems like the only likable
person because it's like get away from all these
people But I don't know if that's that's where
I just I struggled with it. So like, okay Well,
it's it's interesting to be in a couple points
that you brought up number one. I is Jimmy Stewart
just a hard person to pull off the romantic angle
in a film or I mean, I haven't seen like all
of his films, but it seems like we've seen that
a couple times where it's like I think it I think
he works and it's a wonderful life. I think I
think it works. Yeah. So that's true. That's
true. I also was not prepared for how young Jimmy
Stewart is in this one. Yes, because we just
came off of, you know, some of his Hitchcock
novels, which are like 15, 20 years later. But
I was like, holy cow, he's young in this film.
It's like he's 30. third year You know did Katherine
Hepburn end up with Jimmy Stewart? I was like
no she didn't oh she ended up with the guy that
she was like Engaged to her whatever. I was like
now. She's like wait. What I was like yeah She
just ends up with Cary Grant. She's like what?
How why I don't understand so it is interesting.
It's like I get that he's like trying to you
know potentially win her back and things of that
nature, but They sure don't spend a whole lot
of time developing it from her angle as far as
why she is willing to go back in that situation.
And then it also makes you question like. It
comes out right out of the gate and she, like
you said, has the domestic abuse where he just
like throws her to the ground and then they decide
to make like some comedy jokes out of it with
like the little sister or don't say socket. Yeah,
yeah. Yeah. And all this other stuff. And it's
like, how was that angle even important? Like,
I feel like you can take that completely out.
You can just have some dialogue that like references
that. They didn't get along similar to like what
we got in his Girl Friday. And it doesn't change
anything like it's so it's like it's a weird
choice to like have him do that, because then
it makes it even more messy. The fact that she
just goes back to him with little to no Like.
Yeah, development of that. So that's kind of
rough, like they spend the time developing her
and Jimmy Stewart. Like that's granted, they're
both drunk off their butts, but like that's where
they spend them. By the way, I think they both
played excellent drugs. Yeah, like I said, I
think all the performances here are really good,
even if like the chemistry wasn't perfect. And
part of that, I think, was purposeful because,
yeah, you don't want them to be together. Jimmy
Stewart's character is a bit lost. He's kind
of not be made it into that mature level yet.
Right. I guess kind of has in some ways, even
though he's kind of a predictive jerk that is
just trying to drive her crazy. But yeah, I feel
like sometimes, though, like when we get those
when we get characters that are, quote unquote,
like drunk or whatever in films that sometimes
it gets like it gets overdone. Like the people
are like going to bananas or it's like they have
trouble pretending to be drunk when they're sober
type deal. And or, you know, obviously we saw
Cary Grant play a drunk role in North by Northwest.
Right. And it's played up a little bit more on
the comedic side, whereas this one is doing it.
Yes, it's funny. And yes, there's a lot of moments
during those scenes that are. Comedic, but I
feel like it's more believable that it's natural.
Not being played for comedy, but it's funny because
of what just naturally what's happening. So I
did appreciate that part of the film Yeah, I
agree. I think that and there are some really
good community bets in it as well. Like there's
the funny joke about like I'm asking for the
typewriter forget the exact line, but there are
some good back and forth moments here and there
Yeah, so I do think there are some strong comedic
bits like you pointed out and I think the cast
does work well together and then they feed off
each other pretty well like the chemical chemistry
is a group is strong and It does feel like a
movie though. That was a play it and it's very
stagnant. Yes, it's not it's not moving very
often it in Kind of like there's no momentum.
That's kind of the thing too. It felt like there
was even the like the wedding I'm like wait there
That kind of just happened. I didn't even know
that they were already like it just kind of comes
out of nowhere and That that was one of the issues
too. It's just like things just kind of happened
because they have to nothing kind of moves from
the moment from one moment to the next all that
organically and That kind of I think that's where
a lot of my disengagement came from too. It's
like you had a It didn't kind of bring you in
it kind of just went from one moment to the next
in a rather like a hazard manner it almost reminds
me of like Something that you would have seen
like a TV. I'm not trying to didn't this may
sound overly harsh But like if you had a romantic
comedy like a sitcom and like this was the this
was the movie That they produced for the like
out of the sitcom because the sitcom was popular
then they're like, oh we need a movie for it
And like they threw some stuff together. I feel
like there needed to be like. Like there was
no momentum like you're saying. Like it didn't.
It just seemed like it was put together to be
put together in a way I don't. There's not. I
mean, granted, there's acts like there's a beginning,
middle and end and all that type of stuff. I'm
not saying that it doesn't have the structure
of a story and stuff like that, but you're right.
There's no, there's not much of a crescendo.
There's not much of a build. It's a little quick
with the switch at the end. and it almost is
anti -climactic where it's just like, oh, I guess
that's what we're doing here and now the movie's
over. So I didn't feel much of a build for anything.
I want to get your take too because I think we
both said that, you know, Cary Grant doesn't
get quite as much as we're used to him getting.
I don't know if we think that he should have
got more or not, but just like that's what his
role was. Two things that I found interesting
on that. Number one, I did read that he was given
the choice of which role he wanted to play. Yeah,
and he won't he went with the abuser so I'm just
And the and though it's it it's interesting that
he didn't go with the Character that gets the
most like pizzazz out of it He did go for the
I guess maybe he wanted to be the character that
gets the girl in the end I don't know but he
had his choice and then there was also an interview
with the director I believe it was and he was
talking about the film and talking about the
cast and you know saying how A lot of people
say that this was a fairly easy film to make
like it only took eight weeks of shooting I guess
there was very few retakes the guy that gets
the Donald Ogden Stewart who gets the Oscar for
screenplay says it was like the Easiest Oscar
one in history because he hardly had to do anything
He just listened to the play and like wrote some
at during the play and he was like that I'm getting
an Oscar for this But the director, I know, made
some type of comment about how, you know, there
was all these awards given out and we had this
like great cast and he's like, Hepburn gets a
nomination, Jimmy Stewart gets a nomination,
Ruth Hussey gets a nomination and he's like,
Cary Grant's the one person out of the group
that doesn't get a nomination and his quote was,
and he's the best of the, he was the best of
the bunch, which I found that was interesting
from coming from the director that he considered
Grant like the best of the bunch, but maybe just
from a... Acting standpoint a talent standpoint
because I don't see where he would have gotten.
He doesn't get enough here. I don't think to
warrant Award nomination, but He may maybe has
like the most command of his role. Yeah most
comfortable because he He he's very natural.
He fits a role pretty well. Like he yes that
conniving We've seen shades of his other Like
I think so yeah, I is I do agree It's not the
most showy performance and I think that kind
of makes sense because I think Jimmy Stewart
as an actor kind of fits that role better because
he He had He can play that every man a bit more
like if you have a character that's supposed
to be your average individual and someone that's
meant to be or like the El the individual of
high society and you have right If you were to
switch them, I think it would have come out a
little strange, right? so I think I think it
was the right choice even if they didn't give
him it didn't give him as much to do but I think
what he does he does well he's just He's the
one that is kind of poking and prodding the one
that is kind of pushing things to happen and
just just watch it and then stepping back and
watching the chaos. So, yeah, he's very much
an observer in this, which is something I think
Cary Grant does really well. Like he when you
see him in scenes like he's really good at reacting.
And I think his reactions go a long way in a
lot of these scenes. He also is very like intent,
like he's very. careful to be. In the moment,
even when he's not in the moment, like he's if
you watch his eyes and his body language. Like
he he's paying attention to what's going on.
You know what I mean? Sometimes you see somebody
when it's not their time to speak or it's not
their time to do stuff. You don't 100 % get like
them selling the fact that they're in that moment,
and I feel like he does a really good job of
like. Being a presence even when he's not speaking.
And paying attention and kind of being a part
of whatever's going on and he's very good at
the little side comments and like the little
like he is almost like better. Being able to
just interject some ad lib lines or some little
one liners here and there that it's kind of fun
like I almost always want a little bit more of
that but you know we have had some films where
he gets a lot of that so like that's good too.
Gary Cooper made a comment to that I thought
was kind of interesting he was quote unquote
upset that they. cast grant in the film that
maybe I don't know if he was genuinely upset
if he was just making kind of a comedic quote
or whatever, but he he said Carrie Grant shouldn't
have got the role. I should have Carrie Grant's
too pretty and nobody would believe that Hepburn
would have thrown him out in the first place.
So it should have been me because I'm ugly enough
where it would have been believable or something
along those lines. So I thought that was kind
of kind of funny as well. Obviously, this wasn't
like you mentioned that, you know, Katherine
Hepburn gets a lot of say in this like part of
her deal with like owning the rights to the Howard
Hughes bought the rights but then gives them
to Katherine Hepburn and she sells them but has
some say in like the director or the writer or
different people and I think she got like some
able to suggest like some of the casting and
things like that and I did read that you know
she wanted Clark Gable and Spencer Tracy to play
these roles first but they were both busy with
other commitments so then I you know, ended up
being Cary Grant and Jimmy Stewart after the
fact. I don't know about enough about Clark Gable
and Spencer Tracy to know how that works. Obviously,
Clark Gable would be playing the Cary Grant role
and Spencer Tracy, the Jimmy Stewart role. So
that was kind of interesting as well. And then
I do find Cary Grant just he is a fascinating
person like he's had some interesting things
in like the negotiation of his contracts. And
I don't know if it's him doing it. If it's somebody
I don't know how, you know, their agents, if
they had agents back then, I don't know much
about classic Hollywood. But, you know, we talked
about like in one of the Hitchcock films where
he had it, like wrote in that he gets so much
more money if it was after, you know, the the
time period, which it was like all after. So
he made like a ton of money in this one. He demanded
top billing and one hundred and thirty seven
thousand dollars, which was a lot at that time
period. That's the equivalent of like two point
eight million, I think maybe five years ago.
So he demands like all this money for it and
then he just donates it all. He they said he
at least everything I read he donates the entire
salary to like the British War Relief Fund. So
like he made this big stink that he needed to
be top billing to get all this money just so
he could donate it all, which is like, I don't
know. I just find him a fascinating human being.
So, yeah, another thing I wanted to get your
take. I know I have a feeling obviously based
on what we've talked about, how you're going
to feel. But this film, I believe, like you talked
about, probably has 100 percent, you know, Rotten
Tomatoes. Rotten Tomatoes named this the best
romantic comedy of all time and AFI on one of
their list of top 100s when they were doing the
genres had this number five on the all -time
romantic comedy list Do you feel that those are
rankings too high for what you? Observed and
watched with the Philadelphia story. Oh I certainly
want to put them like if I'm ranking romantic
comedies on that list I think you know the movies
we've done already. I mean we Say I would rank
bringing up baby and his girl Friday a lot higher
than either of it then then this But again, I
don't know in the sense of like this is certainly
more on the romance side So if you're looking
for more of the romantic angle like this spends
more time there, but personally for me, it's
I I couldn't Do you know would you I don't have
that admiration yeah, no, I get that Do you have
any guesses as to what AFIs number one romantic
comedy was on that? Top ten. It happened one
night. It happened one night was number three.
OK, got another guess. That was good. You got
like a you got one of something that was in the
top three, just like that. Well, it's like it's
the you know, it beats Harrison Cain. What like
give me a hint of decade or the number one film
is from 1931. You want. Starring Charlie Chaplin.
Charlie Chaplin. Yeah, city lights. Yep. City
lights is number one. The second film is from
1977. Any hall is any hall and then we have it
happen one night. I'll give you number four is
Roman Holiday from 1953 with Audrey Hepburn.
Then number five is the Philadelphia story. There's
two films on this list, one from 1989 and one
from 1993. Oh, actually one from 1987. Any guesses
on those three? Harry met Sally. Yep. That is
number six Pretty woman. Nope. I have 1987 starring
Share Oh Moonlighting is that what it's not moving?
Yeah, and then number 10 on the list is from
1993 93 that's not one pretty woman, right? I
try to know Holds That's not he got me. What
is that other one? Is it Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan?
Oh, I don't remember them. I can't think of that.
I can only think of he got mail, but that's not
the one before that. You have the right to people
and that's the same type of thing that I would
be thinking through. It's Sleepless in Seattle.
See, of course. Yeah, which I've never seen.
So there you go. Okay. And then the only other
two on the top 10 would have been Harold and
Maude from 1971. And interesting. Number seven
is also a George Cukor film who's the director
of the Philadelphia story. He also directed Adam's
rib, which also has Katherine Hepburn and this
time Spencer Tracy. So I haven't seen that one.
That one's from 1949. So those were the AFI's
top 10 romantic comedies of all time that was
done, I believe back in 2000, maybe. Is when
they did all those? We did it. Yeah, like 100
and then they redid it again. They did one and
then they did it again. I think it was the wrong
time. Yeah. OK, so interesting how everybody
thinks about. I guess it depends on if you're
going to put more of an emphasis on the romantic
part or the comedy part or like how you balance
those two things out. I definitely would not
probably put. Philadelphia story like you said
higher than some of the other ones that we have
talked about but Other thoughts that you had
about the Philadelphia story other things that
worked or didn't work for you that you haven't
got a chance to mention yet I didn't want to
reiterate that just how good Katherine Hepburn
in this is in this because I think like the best
part of it is her character because there are
so many there are many layers her character there's
she's got a lot she has to do she's pretty much
in every scene and She has to kind of ride this
line of like Being likable being you know, but
also kind of broken and having like, you know
you see and when she has to be more dramatic
even if the script is a bit maybe quick and it's
pacing like she sells it like it feels like she
has to go through so many different emotions
in a very short period of time and It really
remarkable you see why she was the star she was
and you know, of course, you know she worked
on that she wasn't she was she did the Broadway
play and You know, it was a role, you know made
for her and it it's really strong and so I I
did want to mention just how strong she is. I
know this is a Cary Grant retrospective, but
gotta give her flowers as well. So I thought
this wanted to end. We didn't talk about her,
but I did think one of the funniest parts of
the movie was Virginia Wielder as her younger
sister. She certainly was that comic relief.
You talked about... Kind of a sitcom feel or
character did kind of feel like, you know, maybe
that was kind of a. Inspired a lot of sitcoms
to kind of take a character like that, because
you feel like you always get that spunky. Little
kid that is wise above their years and you see
that in so much and I don't know if this was
the first person movie to do it or what have
you but I thought she was at least good and It
gave a lot of really some of the best moments
of the movie so almost reminded me a little bit
of the sister in the Hitchcock film that we watched
with Goodness gracious the one that was like
the picture of not suburbia, but like of the
opposite of suburbia the rural town setting where
the two Charlies. Suspicion? No, shadow of a
doubt. The little girl in that family. Almost.
Yeah, yeah. That type of vibe. Yeah, definitely.
Also, Hepburn does her, I guess her own quote
unquote stunts in this film. When she jumps in
the pool, that's actually her and all of that.
So she wasn't afraid to do that. Interesting
hadn't read this beforehand. So I'm kind of just
reading this as we're going through. And it's
just an odd take, but this is from one of the
cameramen from the film. And his quote is, everyone
had enormous fun on the movie. The days and nights
were sweltering that summer of 1940, but nobody
cared. Carrie got along very well with Kate Hepburn.
She enjoyed him pushing her through a doorway
in one scene. So she fell over backwards so much
that she had him do it to her over and over again.
And I'm like this just shows you the difference
and I guess there was a scene in which she had
to throw Carrie out of the door of a house with
bag and baggage and she did it so vigorously
he fell over and was bruised as he stood up looking
rueful Kate said that'll serve you right for
trying to be your own stuntman. So apparently
they got along well and they didn't give to two
thoughts about the domestic abuse at the beginning
of the film. Yeah, different times. So that's
kind of crazy. But yeah, you can say that a lot
because you have drunk driving. You have like,
you know, open, you know, do you have a plot
that hinges upon a rich bureaucrat and not. but
not that he's cheating on his wife like that's
that's that's the story rooting for it's like
it is a definitely a different time so there's
no Philadelphia and this whatsoever not one shot
of liberty liberty bell on what um only the opening
the opening uh the text in the opening right
isn't that from where they do the declaration
of independence yes yes sure that's true that's
it that's it yeah i guess this is based on like
an actual like socialite splash like person that
was like the Catherine, I know it's written for
Catherine Hepburn, but they had like an actual
person in mind that they were doing the writing
and whatnot. And I think they said something
about the fact that they were going to try to
film it at their estate or their mansion or something
like that. But they didn't end up doing that
either. So but that was kind of an interesting
little note, too. There's obviously a lot of
trivia on a film that has been around since 1940
and has definitely been. reviewed in lots of
different ways over the generations. Mostly positive,
but I can kind of see some of it. But like you
said, I think my takeaway at the end, as I kind
of struggle to decide how this fits into the
other films that we've watched of Cary Grant's
is kind of what you said, like what's the point
ultimately? And where is the build, the momentum,
the... You know crescendo and some of that stuff
that you kind of hope for in a romantic movie
comedy like especially even when we're thinking
about some of those ones that we listed off I
think of like when Harry met Sally or any romantic
comedy that we've seen like some of them are
like a dime a dozen or whatever, but There seems
to be more of an arc in those and to me that
was what the main thing that was missing here
was if she's gonna end up with Cary Grant I need
more of an arc between those two characters and
a more of a rationale for how they end up together.
I feel like Without that. It seems like we're.
Just along for a weird ride that doesn't necessarily
like it's it. It reminds you of like a story
that somebody would tell you about an experience
they had, and I don't think I would. I would
hear that story and say like, hey, this would
make a great movie. Because because it's like
missing the bang like it's missing the the gusto.
But what are your final thoughts on it? Yeah,
I think it even like. She's always she has a
lot of decisions to make in this and like even
when she decides to break things off with her
fiance like that that moment just was I mean
a bit too clean and almost like it felt like
there needed to be a bit more there and like
I said, I think that's the biggest issue is that
I think these are characters that in a lot of
ways do some really like awful things and And
are so especially even like Jimmy Stewart's character
who's supposed to be the everyman like the way
like he's kind of like so dismissive of With
house his character and and but like there's
and there's no resolution there and I get maybe
that's kind of the point it's not as trying to
show that life isn't that clean but then at the
end of the movie a kind of Kind of reverts against
that and everything kind of comes together far
too quickly So I do think there was power I don't
know how much this is in line with the play and
I wonder if the play was able to maybe Give us
a bit more But I don't know like it and like
I said, like you mentioned maybe it's just be
coming off of the other films It's changing direction
as quickly as possible. But like I said, I do
think ultimately like I I walked away with even
trying to you know not allow you know the process
of time to make me like overly judge it but even
without that I just I was just disappointed and
just ultimately did not really enjoy this so
I also find it I also find it weird like it's
like the director wanted to do a swerve at the
end but I don't feel like you can do swerves
when it comes to relationships like You have
to build it to a point where it's believable.
You can't just throw a curveball at the end and
be like, oh, you thought he was going to be with
that guy, but she's with this guy. And that doesn't
work when it takes time for us to believe in
the relationship. I don't know. That's ultimately
what leaves me wondering. Because it sets it
all up that she's not getting married to her
fiance because of Jimmy Stewart. That's how they
set that up. Whether it's just Jimmy Stewart
is the window to her to let her know that she's
not really into that guy. I guess you can go
that route. But like I said, I feel like it just
is too quick and too clean at the end for me.
And then, like you said, there's a lot of. Ultimately.
Bad decisions that don't have consequences. Yeah,
for the most part, which. Like even like Cary
Grant, like his. He everything he does is basically
like a lie and. kind of just does gaslighting
and kind of manipulates everyone and at the end
it's like, oh, I never have saw a reason why
them getting together at the end is a positive
for either of them. This feels like the next
day it's gonna be a replay of where the movie
began, so. Yeah, absolutely. I would be interested
because I heard like there was an interview with
like Julia Roberts. There's a lot of people who
love this movie, which is fine Yeah, he says
that it should never be remade because it's perfect.
But I don't know like I could see Like I said,
I think there are the bones of something really
interesting here and maybe without the the Oversay
of the you know the code that you can maybe get
around some of those issues So I don't know would
you be open for them to kind of take this and
remake it I know they they obviously did the
in a way musical the musical way back after this
and stuff, right? Yeah, like we talked about
you take all the domestic abuse out we don't
need that You make it some other reason why they're
not together and then you do something there
has to be something between when they're having
their drunk sequence and she's realizing maybe
that she's not meant for the other guy. There
has to be a whole nother act then to me that
like makes her go from Jimmy Stewart to Cary
Grant or there has to be something like so. I
mean, I think there's the bones there for for
possibly something. And obviously, you know,
you can throw different types of comedy in there
to make it work. It's just I don't know. Like
I said, it's hard coming off of such fast paced
comedy to also have this like as a slower. this
is burn comedy type thing but I have learned
one thing as we've covered Cary Grant is that
it seems like he and maybe this works because
the characters in these movies do the same thing
but as an audience he's done, we've seen him
play some roles that aren't like the greatest
human beings in the world yet it's really hard
not to like him he really is Yeah, he's really
like smooth and he's really likable as a as a
performer. And so even when he's playing these,
like we talked about with suspicion, like he's
playing, he's lying the entire film. Like there's
nothing good about him for most of that film.
And it's like, hey, I still I still going to
give him the benefit of the doubt. I think he
can turn this around. It's like, well, Perry
Grant has that going for him, I guess. And we'll
have to see if that continues in our next film
when we talk about 1941's Penny Serenade, which
unlike this film, he was Actually nominated for
an Academy Award for that one. So like we do
every time let's give them a brief glimpse of
what to expect Dan What is your history or knowledge
of the 1941 film Penny Serenade? I Like this.
I honestly know even less about penny serenade
than I do the Philadelphia story. I've never
watched it I don't know if I heard much about
it before we started doing this retrospective.
So I'm looking forward to it because I know Literally
nothing. I don't even know if it's a comedy or
if it's more, you know where falls into that
line I'm assuming it's a little bit of both because
that's what Cary Grant would did did back in
the day But yeah, I'm looking forward to it because
I'm wondering like what about that role Gave
him the Oscar and right is it so is he doing
something extra special to deserve it? Or is
it more of those like bright place right time?
So here's to see it's directed by George Stevens
starring Cary Grant and Irene done who we've
heard that name a couple different times as we
were talking about some of the Hitchcock stuff
and it's listed as a melodrama Dan so we'll have
to see how that plays out but it's also got Cary
Grant making a very much of a kind of funny look
on the poster so it's hard to see him not adding
some type of comedy in here so like you I know
nothing about Penny Serenade other than the picture
of the poster that I'm looking at and a couple
names that are attached to it. So I'm definitely
interested to see what his Academy Award role
looks like compared to the other, what now seven
films that we've seen him in. So that'll be very
interesting as we make our way through this.
So Dan, how are ways that people can reach out
to you if they have any questions or comments
about your take on the Philadelphia story? So
if you love it and you hate me now, you can reach
me at comic con tears on all the social media
platforms Also, I guess I should throw out our
letterbox because I never talked about that but
I'm on I'm at the only social media site that
I'm not Comic con tears its letterbox for a movie
revolt so we can find me there, too All right.
Yeah, you can check my letterbox out as well.
Just search out Kevin 1981, I think is my screen
name or Kevin Thompson, either one. The other
thing I forgot to throw out of the introduction
is I'm going through a weird phase of movie watching.
So we're watching all these Hitchcock and Cary
Grant films and different things like that. And
I decided to pair that up with going through
all six Final Destination films. So it's really
weird out of me going from one to the other and
back and forth. I will say that much so. That's
an interesting journey for sure. You can also
reach out to me at the social medias at Optimus
Solo. You can search out the show name Cinema
Geekcast or the network, the Geekcast Radio Network.
So that does it for this episode. Tune in next
time for another chance to listen to more of
the Cinema Geeks.
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