573 – Characterizations In Comic Characters – Superman (Clark Kent)!

Hey, this is Jason Marsden. You might have seen

me on SpaceGuideToSpace .com. You're listening

to GeekCast Radio. Hey, it's Jesse Rass here,

and you've made the great escape into comics

by jumping inside the pull bag today. You'd better

be wrong, Jor -El. You'd better be dead wrong.

Hello, folks. It is I, TFG1 Mike, from the GeekCast

Radio Network. You are listening to The Pull

Bag. This is episode 573. Yes, I know we're late

with this, but Dave McIlvaney and I recorded

this sometime in 2024. I don't remember exactly

when. This is a new series for the Comic Book

Podcast here on the Geekcast Radio Network. It's

called, what is it called? C -I -C -C. Characterizations

in Comic Characters. And basically what this

is going to be is we look at one single character,

Batman, Superman, Spider -Man, Iron Man, etc.,

etc., etc. Per episode, we look at their history,

we look at their greatest moments in stories,

we look at some of their not -so -great moments

in stories, and we just have a fun discussion

on that character. And to debut it, Dave McElvenny

and I decided to go with the Boy Scout himself,

the American alien, the Kryptonian survivor,

Superman, a .k .a. Clark Kent, mildman reporter

at the Daily Planet. So... This is a test run,

folks. I don't know if we're going to continue

this. I wouldn't sit here and beg for feedback,

but if you like this, email us, feedback at geekcastradio

.com. Let us know if you want me to do more of

these episodes or not. Thank you for listening

all these years. The Pull Bag is about to celebrate

12 years online in March, so that is awesome.

and just have fun reading comic books, folks.

That's all there is to it. When you're reading

stories, just have fun with it. Make your greatest

game in the comics and jump inside the episode

right now with me, TFG and Mike, and Dave McElvenny.

It's going to be a super discussion all about

this characterization in a comic book character

for Superman. Da -da -da -da! Wait, I don't think

that's the right thing. Anyway, on with the show.

Martha? Martha? Shh, you'll wake him. Whoa, Martha,

what are you doing? Put that thing back. We don't

know where it came from. He's not a thing, Jonathan.

He's a baby. A little baby. Who would put a baby

in a spaceship? That's just my point. Could be

Russian. A Sputnik baby. Oh, really? Maybe he's

one of ours. You think NASA's missing a kid?

I don't care where he came from. All I know is

he needs us, Jonathan. Look how he's reaching

out to you. Cute little fella. Got a good grip,

too. Ow. Ow! Hello and welcome to The Pull Bag.

This is episode 573, and I have no idea when

this is going to come out, folks, because as

of this recording, we haven't even released episode

562 or 63. So we're 10 episodes ahead. Not really.

But I am, of course, TFG on mic. And returning

is the super Dave himself, Mr. David McElvenny.

Hello, sir. How are you? Good. How are you, Mike?

Pretty good. Pretty good. And just like when

we started The Origins, 30 questions all about

comic reading 11 years ago. Almost 11 years later,

I want to add something new to the podcast besides

the origins, the reviews of comics, and what

can we add? Well, how about character studies?

Now, comics and character studies and people

on the internet that do all kinds of film studies

and characters, they've all been done before,

so this is probably nothing new. It's just our

opinions on this stuff or kind of going through

the history and saying what stories we do remember,

don't remember, everything else. And with Dave

being... As knowledgeable as he is, notice I

didn't use the term ancient. I used knowledgeable.

There's probably not going to be any shortage

because that's the short end of the stick, folks,

is me. Because I know half of nothing or less

than nothing about Superman when it comes to

comics. Superman to me is Christopher Reeve.

It's the cartoons. It's the TV shows. Some TV

shows are better and worse than others. But basically,

this is launching the new thing here inside the

pull bag, the characterizations in comics characters,

so CICC. We will highlight one comic character

per podcast episode, go over their history in

brief, talk about how many writers and artists

have created for said character, and then go

through some of that character's best and worst

moments in comics. So that's the plan. Flying

by the seat of my pants on this one, folks. Because

outside of, is it Romita Sr. or Jr.? And he's

the artist, isn't he? He's not the writer. Yeah,

see, folks, I am just dumb when it comes to Superman,

unfortunately. When did you first pick up a Superman

book? So long ago. I don't know if I could narrow

it down specifically, but probably about four

or five years old. I really have very little

memory of not seeing comic books of any sort

before that. Maybe I did. You know, definitely

by the time I was ready to go to school or, you

know, in kindergarten, I know I was reading.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And like I said, for

me, I don't remember a lot of it. Oh, and I should

clarify this, folks. When I say comics or characters

in comics, whatever, we are going to be specifically

talking about specific characters or specific

people that were those characters. So if I said

Superman, which I did, most people are going

to assume Clark Kent, not any other version.

But I do have in parentheses here for the title

of the podcast to clarify Clark Kent. Bruce Wayne,

Batman eventually, Tony Stark, Iron Man. There

have been other characters that have played the

title roles. I think outside of Wonder Woman.

I don't think anybody else has been. I don't

think they've. Yeah, that's not a thing. At least

I don't think it is. So, but yes, specifically

Clark Kent, Superman, Jerry. It's Joe Shuster

and Jerry Siegel, right? Or did I get the names

mixed up? You got them right. Okay, good. They

created the man back in 1938, and the origins

of this character, Last Son of Krypton. Oh, boy.

What is your defining characterizations? For

you, when you look at a Superman comic, what

does that comic have to have for you to really

be like, this is a Superman comic I want to continue

reading? Well, for me, just overall, as far as

Superman's character, link it to that. It's,

you know, he does what he knows is right. You

know, there's Elliot S. Magan famously wrote

in Miracle Monday that there's a right and a

wrong in this universe and the distinction is

not very hard to make. Yeah, that's. His north

star, if you will, for Superman, Superman sees

what's right and does whatever he can to make

sure things, you know, that he's doing the right

thing. Now, you can argue about what the right

thing is, but, I mean, if you go back to Superman's

origin in the late 30s, basically the champion

of the oppressed was, you know. During the Depression,

the world was preparing for war. Superman was

doing things like making sure that wrongly convicted

people did not go to the gas chamber or electric

chair. He would break up wars by forcing dictators

to fight each other physically rather than send

young men to die in a war. He would tear down

the slums and rebuild decent housing for people.

He was always looking out in those days for the

little guy who didn't really have any power,

which is probably top of mind for a couple of

Jewish kids in Cleveland in the late 1930s. I'm

sure they didn't have a lot going for them and

wanted a champion. Yeah. Yep. And I think that's

a, I think that's a through line for a lot of

Superman's character is he's always trying to

do right. I mean, I remember reading stories

over the years, especially you would see them

in the silver age of like, they used to call

them imaginary stories. Now they're elseworlds

kind of thing. Where they would imagine Superman

in some different reality. Where, you know, he

was found and raised by, you know, a criminal.

Or he, you know, his rocket landed in Africa

and he was raised by apes. He grew up in a place

like Tarzan. Or even later on in Superman Red

Son, Soviet Russia. Yeah. No matter what sort

of environment. you know, he's bound in, at some

point in the story, he becomes a recognizable

to us Superman, where he's not going to, you

know, fight to conquer or fight to oppress people,

take away their, you know, human rights. You

know, even if that's the way he's been brought

up in some different society, at some point in

the story, wait a minute, why would I be doing

this? I have all this power. I should be helping.

Yeah. To me, that's super helpful. Yeah, absolutely.

And the funny thing is I was looking through

the Geekast Radio Network, the pull bag history

here for hope. It is the best thing I can look

to say, but yeah, Superman and the pull bag have

not gotten along. Because when I started the

pull bag 11, 12, 11 and a half, 12 years ago,

I figured, okay, I like Batman. I like Superman,

but there's too much there. And at that time

in 2013, we were two years, two or three years

into New 52. And I didn't at the time, and I

can always go back and change my mind on this,

folks, but I wasn't really excited about New

52 Superman at the time. I don't know what it

was. It just wasn't my thing. But we do have,

there should be four, but I'll tell the story

why there isn't four in a minute. We have three

episodes of The Pullback dedicated to Superman

so far, and unfortunately we started off on the

Frank Miller foot of the DC Black label Superman

Year One, issues number one and two. So the story

behind that and why my buddy Joe and I never

finished with that third issue is because I saw

the solicitation for the first two issues of

that. I thought were cool. Oh, this is a different

Superman origin. Again, you can you can have

different writers to different origins, all that

fine thing, whatever, as long as the character

has similar, you know, whatever to each incarnation.

as far as his morals and personality go so we

got to the first two issues and i'm like okay

this is cool this is interesting this is fun

i read this list for the third issue super uh

dc black label superman year one number three

written by frank miller i forget who the artist

was off the top of my head but written by frank

miller issue number three we're gonna go to gotham

and we're gonna bring diana in so we have the

holy trinity and i just immediately said Sorry,

Joe, we're not finished in this. And I never

not even if a comic is bad and I don't like it,

I will usually finish it because they were bringing

like I felt that that story was Superman. You

can tell a three, especially those black label

books that they were doing. They were only three

issues. You can tell a full on Superman story

without having to bring in the other two of the

Trinity. You know, like. Oh, God. And I mentioned

to my buddy Joe the other day, I said, you know,

maybe we should really finish that stuff at this

point, because it's been years since we covered

that. And then earlier this year, we did episode

552. 52, folks. Get it? DC, yada, yada, yada.

Ha, ha, ha. We did Superman Unchained, which

was the Scott Snyder story. And the reason why

I wanted to do that one was because I had already

read all Scott Snyder's Batman. I want to see

how he handled Superman. think uh from what i

remember from that episode my buddy ryan and

i we liked it but it was a nice little one -off

it was never an ongoing kind of thing so that's

kind of that my history with superman comics

as far as that goes everything else has been

movies tv cartoons etc so I'm doing this specific

one to see if we have... Maybe I'm going to go

back and read some Superman comics at some point.

I don't know. What is your... Okay, let's see.

Follow the thing I set out here. The man has

had a very varied history since 1938 -39 when

he debuted, and he's gone through a whole lot

of stories. 57, no, it's like, what is it, over

75? Is it 75 years? Jeez. It's longer than that.

Yeah, I'm doing the math. 1932. I have 86 years

at this point. Yeah, 86 years. It's almost 100,

close to 100. Yeah, 86 years of Superman, folks.

So you said as long as his main part of his character

is he's always doing right. Do we think because,

I mean, most babies that get sent to Earth from

a different planet don't really have time to...

Does Jor -El and Lara have any impact on his

character in the way he is, or is it all Jonathan

and Martha? Well, you can argue back and forth

depending on what stories you read. You know,

in the origin story back in 1938. He was essentially

an infant when he arrived on Earth. But if you

go later on in books, in the Silver Age, he was

probably a little older than that, probably a

toddler when Jonathan and Martha found him. So

in most Silver Age stories, he has some memory

of Krypton, and he has some memory of Jor -El

and Lara. So in some of those stories, because

again, it depends on what time period you're

looking at. In some cases, you can say, well,

it's the innate goodness of his parents that

is coming through in him. Right. In fact, in

one Bronze Age story, there's a story where the

guardians of the universe. They decide that either

Jor -El or Lara would have made a good Green

Lantern. And so the mixture of those genes, C

-L -L, they thought, well, we could make him

the leader of an independent Green Lantern Corps

just based on his genetic heritage. And then

once he got sent to Earth and he became Superman,

they decided, well... When the universe gives

you a Superman, you don't turn him into a Green

Lantern. But that story sort of implied that

a lot of his indie character came from his parents.

But also, you've got to look at it as he grew

up in Smallville with Martha. And in a lot of

the Superboy stories in Silver Age, they're...

you know, helping him through his early years

as a young superhero and giving him guidance

as to, you know, what's wrong. Maybe he's going

that way, this way. So you can kind of lay it

either way. You can say it's genetics, you know,

it's nature or nurture. Genetics for how he was

brought up. Or, you know, I kind of think of

it as a combination. Although, there was obviously

some innate goodness in him. But, you know, Jonathan

and Martha Kent obviously helped that along.

It's never easy. Yeah. You know, you can really

look at it however you want. A lot of, you know,

I think a lot of the other stories that I've

only read about haven't been read. It's kind

of ever popular, dark, and pretty. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, yeah, I mean, you know, unless, what is

it? Blue, yellow, red. I forget which one changes

him. Yes. That's what I thought. Like, yeah,

generally he's a good guy unless he's got. Red

Kryptonite poisoning somewhere. Yeah. Oh, boy.

I know. It's Silver Age silliness, but... No,

no, no. I mean, look, you know, you can't...

Yeah, you say it may be Silver Age silliness,

but that's what it was. It's like, you know,

okay, well, the green Kryptonite kills him. Well...

Krypton was made of other parts or other whatevers.

Let's see what happens with other colors. Like,

you know, I mean, that's like the lantern core.

Again, going back to them. It's not just green

lanterns. It's yellow lanterns. It's red lanterns.

It's orange lanterns. It's indigo lanterns. It's

like there's a color for everything. So, you

know, this is what it is. But, yeah. And I, yeah,

I don't know. I never had an interest, and I

don't know if there's any comics that could be

recommended to me to make me have an interest.

It was never interesting to me to have him on

Crypt. The point of the interesting part of the

story is that this is a baby whose parents are

trying to save him by shipping him off to Earth.

that poor soul uh to you know escape the exploding

planet because the planet's gonna explode and

they want to save their son so yeah obviously

the story mainly is gonna be with with earth

and with the kents and everything else the funny

thing for me is i never had an interest in the

superboy part of it it was always he lands you

see him you know pick the truck up in his red

underwear uh i'm specifically meaning the movie

because you know similar to what you'll see in

a lot of the early yeah yeah exactly he picks

the truck up you get maybe a few little montage

scenes and the next thing you know he's you know

pushing his glasses up for the first time and

oh well gee uh lois i don't know too much about

uh all that kind of stuff being from smallville

And I'm not here. I'm not like I what I've read

of the character and what I've seen of the character

in my lifetime and 44 years of me being on this

planet. I love aspects of the character. The

point of this is specifically for this episode

is for me to learn and figure out what other

Superman stories I may want to cover on the podcast

in the future. But yeah, his character. And his

personality, like you said, at the end of the

day, as long as he's doing good, as long as he's

doing the right thing for all humankind kind

of thing. What was your most, out of all the

Superman stories you've read, what was the most

interesting one to you? Interesting you ask that

because one of my all -time favorite stories

is what we used to call an imaginary story. Where

it's, you know, as they used to say, you know,

this is a story that... Didn't happen, but maybe

it will someday. It was the amazing story of

Superman Red, Superman Blue, where it starts

out with Superman having a big list that he has

made. I think he's been scolded by the people

in the bottle city of Kandor. You promised to

expand our city to normal size, and you've never

done it. and all these other jobs that you promised

to do and you haven't done them. So maybe you

should switch places with one of us, and your

replacement can do all these things. And so he's

got this big, long list. He wants to eliminate

all crime and evil. He wants to get rid of all

the kryptonite on Earth. He wants to enlarge

the bottle city of Kandor. He wants to do all

these different things. And so he's like, I'm

going to do this. This is it. And again, this

is an imaginary story. So he cobbles together

this weird sort of helmet or crown, if you like,

powered by all different colors of kryptonite.

And he goes in this glass box. puts this thing

on his head because it's going to make him like

a hundred times smarter than he is. And he'll

be able to figure out all this stuff. And he

puts this on and, you know, Supergirl's there

with him and she turns the power on on the machine.

And very quickly, he starts screaming in pain.

And she said, no, no, you got to stop. No, no,

keep going. We're going to do this. And then,

you know, the machine explodes. And the dust

clears, and there are now two superheroes. One

of them, his uniform is essentially all red,

and the other one, his uniform is essentially

all blue. And they each have Superman's powers,

but they are each many, many times smarter than

the original superhero. So they decide, well,

we can work together and solve all the world's

problems. Basically, that's kind of what they

do. They go and they build a set of orbiting

satellites that emit an anti -evil ray. Because,

of course, it's the Silver Age, so you can do

that. And so this thing, it eliminates all evil

thoughts from everybody on Earth. And so now,

all the criminals... who are on Earth, and all

the bad people on Earth, they're now good. They

want to do good things. Lex Luthor, he decides

he's going to help. So he creates a serum that

will cure all diseases. It cures cancer, it cures

his baldness, it cures whatever, anything that's

wrong with him. And so he gives it to the Superman,

and he says, just put drops of this in the water

supplies all around the world, and it will cure

every illness. on Earth. This is how powerful

this thing is that Luthor has created. Like I

said, it brings his hair back. So he does that.

And once this happens, we see Supergirl letting

everybody out of the Phantom. Superman's like,

what happened? Did the evil Rey work backwards

on her? Now, I realize that It will work on them

too. So take them out of the phantom zone and

they will be exposed to the anti -ghost. So they'll

be good with their superpowers. So they've got

rid of all the evil on earth and all of the evil

in the phantom zone. And Brainiac happens to

come to earth and it works on him. But it works

on him so he joins in. Interesting. The two Supermen

figure out how to enlarge the bottle city of

Kandor. They also figure out how to eliminate

Kryptonite. And basically what they do with the

Kryptonite is they send it all back to the original

location in Krypton. And in the process, it reverses

the explosion. And now there is this planet no

longer radioactive orbiting the Red Sun was rich

and then the Superman go and Must take a rocket

ship And they the bottle city of kandor so they

recreate the ecosystem and it turns out then

that the people from the bottle city of kandor

they've lived their lives in a kryptonian environment

they want to keep doing that but they want to

do it at their normal size on their home planet

so he has a space arc he like enlarges them all

He takes them back to Krypton and larges the

Bottle City on Krypton. So now there's this fully

built city on Krypton and a full -size population

for the city. So they're back on Krypton. Ooh,

technical difficulties. Let's move on, shall

we? They've got that. And all these good things

are happening. And then they decide, well, there's

two of us. Superman, Red, and Blue. The big question

has always been lowest or lowest. Oh, God. They

each get one. They each get one. So they have

to decide who gets which one. So as you do, they

take two steel girders and bend them into the

shape of L's. So they've got L, L. L, L. And

they go on top of a mountain during a thunderstorm.

What they decide is, whichever one has their

elf struck by lightning first gets first choice.

Is that so romantic? Okay. Okay. So, of course,

as would happen, both are struck at the same

time. Of course. Now, you know, now how do we

decide? And the one says, well, if I had had

first choice, I would have picked Flo. The other

one says, well, I would have picked Lance. There

you go. Problem solved. Problem solved. They

each get to marry the woman that they want. And

it's a triple wedding because Jimmy Olsen and

Lucy Linning get married too. So all three of

them are getting married. So all this wonderful

stuff. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Jimmy and

Lucy got married to each other? Yeah. Because

they've been dating forever. Oh, okay. So. So

now everybody's married off. All these meeting

characters that have been romantically thwarted

for years are now all married. And they decide,

well, the one Superman, I think it's Superman

Red, decides, well, he wants to go back to Krypton.

He doesn't want to be a superhero. He wants to

be a regular Kryptonian. Right. Supergirl says,

well, I'll go too. Crypto and Super Horse, of

course, his powers are based on magic. So they'll

have some super being on. So they all go back

to Krypton. But the other Superman, blue, he

decides he'll stay on Earth. The Earth doesn't

really need him because there's no more crime.

There's no illness. So. He just sends his robots

out, you know, to take care of emergencies that

arise. And he devotes himself to the study of

science with his mother, Jor -El. He and Lois

have a couple of kids. They settle down on Krypton.

Superman Red and Anna have a couple of kids.

Skype intergalactically or Zoom intergalactically

with each other between Earth and Krypton. Everybody

seems to be living happily ever after, but the

story ends with, so what do you think, reader?

Who is happier, Superman Red and Lana or Superman

Blue and Lois? But I just love that story because

to me, it's the happy ending that everybody deserves.

I always say, whenever somebody brings up...

the Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow

story that was the end of that continuity before

the John Byrne reboot. They should have just

republished Superman. Everybody gets a happy

ending. Because Whatever Happened to the Man

of Tomorrow is not a happy ending. Many long

-time characters die horribly, including Krypto.

Like, don't kill the dog. Yeah, don't kill. What

do you want to kill the dog for? Come on, man.

Don't kill the dog. That's ridiculous. That just

reinforced my love of Superman, Red and Superman.

I like that story better. Again, that's my opinion.

I know a lot of people like the other story better,

but it gets to decide what they like. Well, and

again, I mean, that's why I had you here. It

was because, you know, to give your opinion.

And it's fine. I have strong opinions. Don't

we all? Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's

got one. There is no wrong opinion. There's just

smellier ones than others. So, yeah, for me with

it, like. Now, looking at Superman Red and Blue,

I'm like, oh, that's where those Funko Pops come

from. They come from the modern story, the 1998

story. Yeah. Because I kept seeing, I'm like,

oh, that's cool. They repainted Superman, not

thinking, oh, right, it's not just Funko repainting

the Funko Pop. It's them making an homage to

something, which is really cool. And again, I

think I want to read the original Silver Age

story, even though those colors are a lot. Well,

I mean, I'm a big fan of Silver Age because that's

when I grew up. But even I will admit, some of

the stories, when you read them, you just go,

what? well yeah i mean this is the same thing

i did with like the marvel transformers issues

from the 80s like what why are you what oh yeah

no and that's the thing and i don't say that

judgingly to the point of oh my god that's the

worst thing it's just like it's more confusion

than being judgmental yeah and it's like how

do they get away with that Oh, I'll be judgmental

about some stuff, too. Well, yeah, but at this

point, since I've never read any of these things,

again, like I said earlier in the episode, the

point is to see if there's stuff that I want

to cover on the podcast in the future. But just

seeing that classic quote -unquote classic 1998

cover with the blue and white and red and white,

just those are the red and blue super... And

then looking at the small little image Wikipedia

has for the original Silver Age story you just

synopsized for us, I'm like, ooh, all red and

all blue. And technically that's not all blue,

because if that was all blue, his S would be

blue, not red and yellow. Oh, I think that was

branding. I think the DC didn't want to mess

with that symbol. Yeah, probably. I mean, nowadays

they might well do that, because there are so

many different S symbols now. Yeah. Yep, yep.

I'm trying to see here. And obviously I know

this is, I think I probably asked you this in

your origins episode, but I don't remember. It's

been so long and I'm old. And yes, I know I'm

not that old, but I'm old. I have brain damage,

damn it. Leave me alone. But has there ever been

a Superman story where they twisted his character

so much that you just didn't want to read it?

Or do you read everything anyway? Well, as far

as the stuff I grew up with, I would say, no,

there's, there's never been a story, but there

have been times where I've, especially more modern

times where I go, that just doesn't feel right.

Yeah. You know, I, I remember when, when John

Byrne, I would, I would practically. because

it was like, this is not Superman I grew up loving.

First of all, and again, I understand it because

many people did not like the idea of Superboy.

So one of the things he did was get rid of Superboy.

I always liked the characters. If you get rid

of him, I'm inclined not to like what you're

doing. Not just for the character of Superboy,

but for other beloved set of characters for me,

the Legion of Superheroes. 30th century superhero

teenagers who were inspired by Superboy and who

came back from the 30th century to the 20th century

to prank Superboy and invite him to come to the

30th century and, you know, eventually had him

join the Legion. So you get rid of Superboy,

you really have to deal with what does that mean

for Supergirl? I didn't really like what came

from that. And that was kind of my first big

thing. I could read through the John Byrne reboot,

but I don't want to say it was hate reading.

If I hate something, I just won't read it. But

I wasn't enjoying it. the way I wanted. Yeah.

Well, I got to give this guy a shot. And similarly

later on, because after that I kind of petered

out reading a lot of Superman. But then when

Brian Michael Bendis came along and everybody

was leaving, he's doing a new version of Superman.

And I thought, well, let me see what that's like.

I started reading some of his stuff and it was

okay for me, but not great. But he, as, as somebody

explained to me, he writes for a long story.

I grew up on comics where you could read three

Superman stories. Yeah. Whereas I read, I think

I read the first year. Brian Michael Benson.

And I'm like, I'm 12 issues in and I haven't

read a complete story. It's just long, meandering.

When is it going to get to the point? And eventually

I gave up on that. This is not what I read comics.

No shade to people who like that. So I can't

say I got to the point where it's like... No,

I can't stand this version of Superman. Or I

don't really like this kind of storytelling.

I don't think it's doing anything horrible for

the characters. Yeah. I usually give writers

one story arc. If they're only going to be there

for one story arc, I will try their one story

arc. which is usually six issues. And then I

will try the next person's story arc. But usually

after that seventh issue, if it's not really

grabbing me, I'm like, and this is with any comic,

this isn't just superhero stuff, but anything

like, you know, I'll give you a shot, but you.

Especially with comics having to be monthly and

have to get the monthly people coming back, coming

back. You better do something in your number

one or your number two issue that's going to

make me want to stick with this the whole time.

And if you don't, then I'm just going to respectfully

move on to something else that I want to enjoy.

I'm at the point now, partly because I can't

put the investment in. 12 or 15 or 20 issues

before I get to the point of the story. But also

it's like beyond that, I'm cheap. And so what

I usually do, if there's something I think I

might be interested in, I will wait until the

trade comes out and then go to my local library

and see if they have it. I'm not spending a ton

of money on a story that I don't know whether

I'm going to like, but also I know if I pick

up the trade. I can probably get the complete

story. Yeah. Rather than waiting monthly, you

know, month after month after month. Yeah. That's

the one thing I wish that the big two would have

switched coming out of the pandemic. I wish,

and I know that they'll never do this, that they'll

still be selling monthly books long after any

of us are gone kind of thing. But I wish that.

the pandemic would have done something to these

two comic book companies to where, oh, we need

to change this up. Let's start selling trade

paperbacks. Let's start, instead of piecemealing

month to month to month to have these people

come back, let's give them the whole story. Let's

write stories to be whole, you know, collected

edition stories kind of thing and not worry about.

the month to month to month to month to month.

And yes, I know that is a higher cost that let's

just say for, it's usually issues one to five

or one to six. If it's an ongoing, let's just

say that's anywhere from 15 to $30 per trade

per month. You're basically, I'm now seeing the

flow on this logic because if you like more than

just one character, then you're going to be spending

a hell of a lot more money. But yeah. I don't

know. You're right. I've been waiting for the

trade forever most of the time. Half the time

when we cover comics on the podcast, it's in

trade. I don't do single -issue reviews unless

it's specifically something like the DC Black

Label stuff. They said these are just going to

be three -issue miniseries. Okay, fine. I think

the Superman one is the only one we covered,

and we didn't even finish it, folks. So what

does that tell you about DC Black Label? I don't

know. So you mentioned Byrne. You mentioned Bendis.

Who would you say, for you, is your favorite?

And I know I asked you this way back when, but

looking at all of the writers, looking at everything

that has been written with Superman and stories,

Who are your favorite storytellers when it comes

to The Man of Steel, when it comes to the writers?

I would say probably either at or very close

to the top for me is L .A. Das Magnus. I really

like the stories that he wrote for the comics,

but even beyond that, his novels. He had the

first one he wrote, Superman. And then my favorite

of his is the Oracle Fundamentals. They're novels,

and they're not, like, if you just, at the time

it came out, if you picked up Superman, Last

Son of Krypton, you would think it was based

on one of the Christopher Reeves movies, because

that's the picture on the cover. When it first

came out, there was, like, a section in the middle

of the book of photos from the movie. So if you

weren't paying attention, you would think it

was like a novelization of a movie, which it's

not. It's a completely original story. It has

nothing to do with any of the movies, but it's

a really good story. I think Magan, whether he's

writing a novel or whether he was writing a comic

book, he has a real feel for the character of

Superman. but also for the character of the movie.

I think he really understands each of those characters

and the dynamic between them. I think it's really

good. Another one of my favorite writers, not

so much for character creation, but just, I'm

a sci -fi fan, and in the 60s, particularly,

Superman was essentially a science fiction character.

And if you want good science fiction superhero

stuff, Edmund Hamilton is hard to beat. He is

really good with science fiction. Totally different

style than, say, Agate, but I think those two

are probably pretty close. Very cool, very cool.

86 years, there's a lot with any comic book character

that's been around that long. But some of those

Elseworlds stuff, some of that stuff is interesting.

Some of that stuff is cool. Oh, yeah. I mean,

you can probably find stories that have Superman

in just about any situation you can imagine,

whether it's an in -continuity story or an imaginary.

Anything you can think of, you can probably put

Superman in any kind of situation. Absolutely.

Kind of like Dark Knights of Steel. Oh, my God.

What is this? Oh, boy. That's a whole other.

I don't know what they're doing over there at

DC, but that was a story from 2012. This is interesting.

Well, it says it was a 12 -issue series. But

Wikipedia still has it listed as January 2022

dash. So they may go back to it at some point,

I guess. I don't know. Or whoever wrote the Wikipedia

article. Just never. Yeah, probably. That's usually

how it goes. But who knows? Who knows? Like I

said, folks, this is a trial run here. I do know

Dave is a huge Superman fan, as you can clearly

hear. I have some ideas now of Superman stuff

that I may want to cover in the future on the

podcast. Clark and Superman, go farm boy. I don't

know. He's always been one of those characters

that it's like, I'll get to it when I get to

it. For me, it's never been about the comics

and the comics that I've tried so far. Like I

said, I remember enjoying the Scott Snyder Unchained.

series, the nine -issue series, but man, that

Miller, oh, you Batman whore. To me, you can't

treat Superman the way you would treat Batman.

No. For me, again, growing up, I always will

think of them as good friends, but they have...

really different approaches, even though I have

to say in the Silver Age, they didn't really

have different... Superman and Batman were both

smiley, happy people. I know a lot of Batman

fans will find that astonishing, but the Adam

West Batman didn't come out of nowhere. Oh, yeah.

No, they didn't just pull it out of their butts,

folks. They got it from the comics. And, you

know, yeah. Anything else you would like to say?

Anything you think we missed? Again, folks, like

I've said multiple times, this is a trial run.

Most people listening to this probably didn't

think we gave enough time to Superman, but we've

been recording for almost an hour. So any final

thoughts from you, sir? Nothing particularly

profound, but, you know, I think for anybody

that... That hasn't really explored the character

of Superman. Like you said, with 85 years of

history, I think anybody can find a version of

Superman. People my age tend to enjoy the stuff

that I enjoy. Silverade. And younger people enjoy

later stuff. I think most people could probably

enjoy a lot of the early olden age stuff. It's

a much more rough sort of Superman, but there's

fun there too. I mean, I think read Superman

for fun because he's a fun character. Imagine

if you could fly and if you were in home, you

would, you would have a ball. lying around and

knowing you couldn't hurt yourself. Forget, oh,

I would go rob banks or I would do this. Just

imagine what an eight -year -old kid would think

about this. I could fly and I could just jump

off a building and I wouldn't hurt myself. It's

fun. You can find fun in supermarkets. You can't.

You're probably not looking. That's kind of my

opinion. in general. Or particularly, as far

as this podcast goes, if it's not good, it's

more my fault than theirs. No, stop it. Stop

it, stop it, stop it. But again, the whole point

of this is to explore the character that we can,

and I said, like, I'm going to be inviting veterans

of the character, people like Dave, who have

read All 86 years. Because, you know, he's just

that ancient. Or you could look for somebody

who's as ambitious as John Wilson. Who has probably

read at least as much Superman as I have. Even

though he's considerably younger. He's the completest.

That man and his, oh my god. I don't know how

he does it. I'm a machine when it comes to podcasts,

and I'm in the middle of doing all kinds of stuff

over on Studio 2009. We're releasing 31 podcasts

for 31 days in December and December, but like,

oh boy, his Superman reading, oh boy, wow. We

did a whole podcast on it. He is amazingly dedicated.

Once he decides to do something, he's going to

do the very best. Absolutely. Absolutely. All

right, folks, I'm sure there's plenty. I missed

being the newbie here, but this, like I said,

multiple times in this episode is a K trial run.

We can always come back to Clark Kent in the

future and do an updated version of this, or

I can just start covering Superman books at some

point next year or the year after or whenever

the heck it is. Coming up next here inside the

pull bag, I honestly have no clue because, like

I said, I'm recording this 10 episodes ahead

of where I'm supposed to be editing. So I have

no idea what you've already heard in the podcast's

lineage from 572 to 564 going backwards. And

then from 574 onward, I have no idea. All I know

is I have to get to episode 599. before the end

of the year because next year is going to be

sporadic for the podcast for the first time in

years because we are going to be somehow right

now i only have 58 days out of 90 but we're going

to be doing 90 nights in nightwing if i can find

40 more nightwing trade paperbacks So yeah, coming

up inside the pull bag, no clue, but I'm sure

people will listen to it and like it. If you

guys have suggestions, or I've got a couple of

people that I'm thinking about with Batman, Bruce

Wayne, and Iron Man, Tony Stark. Those were Batman,

Superman, Superman, Batman, and Iron Man were

the first three that I thought to do this little

series within a series of four. So, yeah, that's

what's coming up here inside the podcast. You're

probably going to get more Skybound, G .I. Joe,

and Void Rivals crossovers from Jesse Early's

podcast, another comic review. We've been reviewing

the Transformers, G .I. Joe, all the Skybound

books over there, and I've been cross -promoting

the G .I. Joe, specifically the miniseries and

probably the new ongoing that's going to happen

in November. By the time you people hear this,

it's probably way past that. So, yeah. Okay.

Thank you for joining us here inside the pullback.

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for the podcast. I am at TF2 and Mike on Twitter.

You don't use Twitter, do you, Dave? No, I don't.

No, okay. That's what I figured. I didn't use

it when I was Twitter, and I'm even less. A little

less, yeah. I've got 16 years into that thing.

I'm not like I'm ignoring all the drama. I'll

say that. And yeah, that I have said this recently

on podcasts. I said that that platform is like

the biggest clicky in my life. Get in, post what

you want to post and get out. Whereas at least

ten and a half years ago, actually having conversations

on that platform. Now, not so much here. Here's

the podcast. Listen if you would like to. Please

do so. Yada, yada, yada. And then get the hell

out and go find something else to do. You can

find us on Facebook, facebook .com slash Geekast

Radio Network. You can also check out the pullback

over there as well. Next time, as I said, I'm

not going to say because I have no idea. It's

listed as a Comic Origins episode, but I don't

know if that's what's going to happen or not.

So for now, I am TF2 and Mike with Dave. Can

I go, buddy? As always, make your greatest game

in the comics, and we will catch you next time.

What do you think of the name Christopher? Now,

Martha, let's discuss this. Or Kevin? Martha.

Or Kirk. I know. We can use my maiden name. What

do you think of Clark? Clark Kent. Yeah, yes,

Miss Stevenson. Ten and a half years ago, we

were actually actually having conversations.

Actually, actually, what the hell? You've just

heard the latest episode of The Pull Bag, the

GCRN's first comic review and discussion podcast.

There are several ways to get in touch with us

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unleash the geek in you. That man won't quit

as long as he can still draw a breath. None of

my teammates will.