Origins with Jonathan and Maggie Schaefer-Hames on How They Got Into Comics

You've just jumped inside the pull bag. Join

TFG1Mike and the rest of the comic reading crew

here at the GCRN as they make their great escape

into comics. From DC, Marvel, IDW, Boom Studios,

Xenoscope, and more, we have everything you want

to read right here. Transformers comics? Yeah,

we cover that. He -Man? Yeah, sure. DC superheroes

like Batman, Batgirl, Nightwing, and Batman Beyond?

Yep, we have those too. How about TMNT from IDW

and I Hate Fair Land from Image Comics? Yeah,

we have all that here. Plus, so much more. It's

all inside the pull bag here on the Geekcast

Radio Network. So without any further ado, it's

time to talk about the comics we are reading

right now here inside the pull bag. Hello and

welcome to episode 382 of The Pull Bag. I'm of

course TF2 and Mike. This is another Origins

episodes... Episode as I've said before in the

last couple of them that, um, have, have had

to get, I can't talk. I've had to change the

way that I've been doing these podcasts lately.

And I've been kind of going the origins route

and getting people's stories of how they've gotten

into or out of comic books. And today it seems

like I'm the third wheel. Along with my lovely

and special guests the hosts of married with

comics see third wheel Jonathan and Maggie Schaefer

Hames. Hello. Hello Thanks for having us on the

show. Yes. Thanks Of course, you know, I'm only

doing this because the rod pod needs more content,

right? It does. Yes, it does. That was the agreement.

Actually, right after this, that's exactly what

I'm going to be working on once we get done with

this. I'm going to go edit. So the pullback has

25 new questions. So if anyone's listened to

the previous episodes besides, I think the last.

No, I did just come up with this before after

Episode 360 .5 with Mike Lademan, which was a

year almost a year actually almost exactly a

year ago Anyway, it's fairly simple. Hopefully

we'll have a good discussion out of it Just to

be clear so it's easy for all of us ladies will

go first for the answers Like we would have had

a choice anyway, that's right Come on So that

way I don't have to be like, uh, there are sometimes

in some, some things where I've talked to two

or three people and I'm waiting for them to give

an answer. And I'm like, this is where you answer

the question now. Anyway. All right. 25 questions.

Uh, you, you must answer in the form of an answer,

not the form of a question. So there is that.

John goes and changes all of his notes. Did you

grow up reading comics? And at what age did you

first remember reading or noticing comics, Maggie?

I did not grow up reading comics. I was more

comics adjacent as a kid. I grew up watching

Batman, the animated series, the 90s X -Men cartoon,

90s Spider -Man. I think they should be considered

superheroes. Anyways, it wasn't until actually

I was in high school and V for Vendetta came

out in the movie theaters and I went and saw

it and I wanted to read the graphic novel. So

I went to Borders and I picked up V for Vendetta

and then that was the first like comic book or

graphic novel I'd ever read. Then I went back

later and got Batman Returns. Dark Knight Returns,

sorry. Thank you. I'm so glad that you're here

with me for this. And then later on I read Watchmen

that was probably right after I graduated high

school and then Fun Home by Alison Bechdel were

the only four any comic related thing I'd ever

read until I met John several years later. And

it was actually more through him that I started

to get more into comic books and become more

familiar with the medium. Very cool, very cool.

What about you, John, as Astro Train decides

to drive through my apartment here? What about

you? What's your growing up story as far as how

you got into them or noticing them? Tell Astro

Train if he doesn't jettison some weight, he's

never going to come back to Cybertrain. Oh, man,

I don't remember a time I didn't. Read comic

books. I mean I was a very young child in the

period of the 70s when there was the like TV

golden age That batom the Batman Adam West shows

were on syndication Every and I at about three

years old was obsessed with this show I had this

thing. It was called an ATV Explorer. It was

a little kid -sized Little minivan essentially

that you'd sit. Oh, yeah And it had a steering

wheel on the top of it and I made my mom put

like a paper towel roll on the back for exhaust

because I think the the exhaust pipe that really

resonated with little little me and There was

also the Captain America and the spider -man

TV shows or lived in the Hulk and it was spider

-man in the Hulk that became my big focus as

well as eventually the Superman Chris Reid movies

and I would get comic books as presences as when

I was really on the first one. I remember I had

to look this up. It was Amazing Spider -Man 192.

It's a story about the fly and and Jonah Jameson

and Spider -Man are handcuffed to a an explosive

device that will go off if they try to remove

it and they've got 24 hours to deal with that.

And I learned how to read reading that book.

That's really adorable to me. Such a good way

to learn how to read a comic book. Yeah, and

they didn't like comic books. They didn't think

they were a good thing for kids to read. But

then basically, eventually I would read literally

anything I would get my hands on. So they were

like, well, I'll read these two, I guess. Yeah

i started learning on reading for from actual

not comics but actual books as a preschooler

and littler kid i started on golden books and

then went to barenstein bears and. My very first

and only transformers book back in the day that

i read was that that. I it's it costs. I think

it costs a fortune now, but it was a library

book. It was a Transformers story with Wheely

in it. That's all I remember. I can look at it

on eBay and stuff. And once I see the cover,

I know exactly what it is. But all I can tell

you is it's an actual kids storybook. That is

like Wheely's origin or something. Yeah, it was

it was like his bit in the Transformers, the

movie. Uh huh. Yeah. Remember this one? I remember.

Wheely, my name. Wheely as the same. Mm hmm.

Yep. Yeah. Why can't I find keys? This I remember.

Yeah, exactly. Then from there, it was like at

the barbershop. He had a big stack of comic books

to keep kids quiet. And I would. John Grubb and

Mayberry obviously I did yes Floyd the drunken

barber He had a bunch of comics and I would remember

reading through those and and I would occasionally

get stuff with my Islamic allowance I know that

the first comic I bought for myself with my allowance

was transformer 17 I remember that one specifically

because we which fans of other appearances of

us were gonna be on Transformers Chronicles on

the longbox crusade where we talk about that

one probably next next. Mm -hmm Very cool. Very

cool. Yeah, it'll be slightly after this one

comes out Great Timing people it's all about

the timing Yeah, and and speaking of timing this

this next question probably doesn't apply to

Maggie at all Sadly as a kid was there a parent

a friend or who just said here kid read this

comic and go away you bother me just you know,

shut you up and say, hey, here's Batman. Go deal

with it. You know, I go deal with it. I really

wish that someone had my my parents got divorced

when I was pretty little. And Batman and Indiana

Jones were the two in Star Wars and Star Trek

were all things that my dad would watch with

me when I was a little kid. And for some reason,

it never occurred to either my dad or my mom

to give me a comic book. It didn't even occur

to me. that these were characters from comic

books until way later when I realized what comic

books were. I'm someone who, I graduated high

school in 2008, so I don't really know exactly

where comic books were then, but I didn't have

any friends who read comics. I was never given

any. It was something that eventually I just

kind of sought out for myself, and even then

it wasn't anything I was super interested in.

I had kind of a snobby attitude towards them

when I was, you know, late teens, early 20s.

so they just never blipped my radar and that

has since changed which I appreciate and I like

trying new things and there's been several comic

series that I've read now that I have really

enjoyed and some that I've not enjoyed you know

and just like reading anything else or engaging

in any other kind of medium there you know you

take what you like and you leave what you don't

like and I'm glad that John kind of opened that

up for me a little bit and he was the first one

who really said, hey, if you like the Batman

movies, why don't you try reading this one? And

that would have been a much better introduction

than me going to Borders and for the first time

seeing rows and rows of Batman comics and thinking,

oh my God, there's this much Batman? I had no

idea and I didn't know where to start. It was

overwhelming. So that's why I think I just kind

of randomly grabbed Dark Knight Returns because

I liked the art when I was flipping through it.

I had no idea who Miller was, you know, like

none of that. Everything was new. So, yeah, it

would have been nice if someone had done that

when I was a little bit younger, but I've got

it now. So that's good. There you go. That's

all that matters. John, you've kind of already

touched on your story, but was there anything

as a kid that pointed you in the right direction?

You mentioned your dad and stuff. I think definitely

the barbershop would have been like the first

place that me because I was going there from

when I was like three and four years old and

that was place I saw them as a Something that

existed that you can read I mean there were spinner

acts and at the drugstore when I would Follow

that but I think the first time that somebody

actually said here kid. It would have been my

older cousin Chris when I was That was when I

was probably in like Seventh or eighth grade

because there was I think it was at that period

of time where I had stopped I had put away childish

things because I was like all grown up now and

after girls and my cousin said here's Here's

these Frank Miller comics read these and here's

these Denny O 'Neal green arrow green lantern

comics read these and I was Absolutely hooked

after that When you were a kid which characters

were your favorites Batman Batman has always

been my favorite ever since I was a kid and You're

gonna have to remind me which one that I like

the which Batman movie is a Batman Returns Batman

forever forever. Yes Ever since I was a kid that

movie has been one of my favorites I eventually

got to see the Adam West movie. I never got to

see his the television show. It wasn't on or

available when I was a kid, but I did get to

see his movie and I really liked that. So Batman

has always been very near and dear to my heart

and that has only very recently been expanded

to include other characters like Wonder Woman,

the swamp thing. Batman was always number one

for me. Batman Forever gets such a bad rap. I

just don't like it. John doesn't like it. And

I understand that people don't like it and that's

that's their That's their thing, and that's fine.

I get it. But out of those four movies, that's

not the worst one. No, it is not. Not by a long

shot. And I'm going to get some heresy here.

But frankly, none of those four movies are really

all that good. Well, I would agree with that.

And so and there are I think I don't think Batman.

forever is the greatest constructed movie, and

there's some silliness in it, but it's Batman.

I think I was just the right age when I saw that

in the theater. But it does have my favorite

part in any of those movies, which I love Jim

Carrey's riddle me this, riddle me that part.

When I watched it in the theater as a as a younger

person, I got actual chills at that moment. It's

a very well put together scene. I look at those

four films at the time that they were being made

and the limitations at the time like the technology

back like if they made those movies if they made

those exact movies today Maybe tweak the plot

a little bit. But if they with the technology

they have today those movies would be just as

popular as The Marvel Cinematic Universe if they

were made today My personal ranking of those

Notice folks. I said personal ranking. So this

is my own thing here 89 forever Batman and Robin

and Batman returns is dead last because that

story is so dumb You're not wrong I Mean Christopher

Walken almost saved that movie, but then you

remember there's no reason for Christopher Walken

to be in this movie I do love his son, the Christopher

Walken mini -me. Yeah, yeah. Man, Danny would

have been such a perfect freaking penguin if

they would have written a penguin that wasn't

some sort of weird freakish penguin person. Penguin

person. If they'd done like a true penguin with

him, I think he would have made a very good Oswald

Cobblepot. So today we supposed to be dapper

in Devon error would have been great seeing Danny

pulling that off. Yeah, he's a good actor I thought

it was weird that George Clooney ever played

Batman 2 that still blows my mind today I am

the biggest Batman Robin apologist that you will

meet Really? That's probably my least favorite

is the truth actually you're not because I can

trump you Yeah, are you? No politician intended

But I apologize for that movie all the time Because

I enjoy that okay, so that you know you talk

about a time that came out at the right time

1997 I was 17 years old Since I think the crush

in 93 I had had the biggest Crush on Alicia Silverstone,

and when I saw she was gonna be bad girl. I'm

like Sold I'll see the movie. I don't care who's

in it. I don't care whatever The interesting

thing is Sadly since mr. Schumacher has passed

away recently and in the last I forget when he

had it's been a couple of months since Joel Schumacher

died They released I think on the DC or the Warner

Brothers YouTube channel a Special cover like

the DVD specials or whatever it is that are on

the box sets The the the specials where they

have joel talking about both batman forever and

batman and robin there was these two special

things and it's one big youtube video i'll send

to you guys afterwards where he talks about it

and where all the other people involved with

it talk about it including Val kilmer at the

time because this was back when they originally

did the real this is not I am so sad and depressed

with what has happened to Val Kilmer with his

cancer and everything. Oh, man. It's just so

anyway. The point is in that special, they say

and Val specifically says they never called his

people. He was supposed to be like he had some

conflict or something at the time, but he was

supposed to be. In Batman and Robin Clooney was

a backup. Oh Yeah, how strange that George Clooney

has your backup Clooney as far as I mean material

aside. I like Clooney's portrayal of Bruce Wayne.

I thought he did a Okay, his relationship with

Alfred is probably the closest thing to a realistic

relationship in any of those movies I like their

chemistry a lot. Although I believe that George

Clooney has said he was playing him gay which

makes that even funnier to watch again now. I

will agree with the Alfred part as far as the

whole family thing and everything else, but I

feel that Val got Bruce's psychological stuff

done a lot better because if you look at Batman

forever, that's really, yes, there are silly

parts with the villains and whatever, but you

look at the way that Val plays Bruce in Batman,

he plays a better Bruce than he does Batman,

but It's more psychological than just what people

remember with the Fugitive and Ace Ventura. So

since we're talking about all this Batman stuff,

question four is the age -old question. DC or

Marvel? Both. Mostly Marvel for me. These days...

I don't know, because I've been kind of trying

to get onto a sort of an independent bent a little

bit too and trying to see things from creators

to either DC or Marvel. For a long time I was

definitely DC all the way, but more recently

I think I've become much more to prefer Marvel

than DC, which is I know what happened. I'm a

mostly Marvel character, except for a period

of time in the 1990s. very early 1990s to the

mid to late 90s. I was almost completely reading

DC. But Marvel generally hits areas that I like

a little more. Yeah, it's one of those things

where for me, it's about characters. It's not

about the companies. Right. You know, you take

Iron Man, you take Spider -Man, you take Captain

America at some point in their 80s. X number

of however many years any of them have been around.

There's stories in there that are really good,

whether it's a reboot story, whether it's a original,

you know, timeline story. Same thing with DC.

DC has had the He -Man stuff. So I like that.

They have the Batman Beyond stuff they've been

doing for a long time now. I enjoy that. And

it just depends. I honestly, at this point, I

Preferred Dick Grayson is Batman than Bruce Wayne,

but that's just that's just me because Gates

of Gotham was amazing. Mm -hmm All right. So

as Maggie said she likes also she's on an independent

kick and everything else The next question is

what other publishers do you enjoy reading? I

once when John and I were at our local comic

shop Saw an issue of Lady Mechanica by Joe Benitez

and it is his own He publishes it under his own.

It's Joe Benitez productions And he does the

writing I think and the art as well for it and

he's got a couple other people who help with

the art too Also IDW obviously because IDW phase

two transformers is what we cover over on the

rod pod and I love them There was another one

too, I can't remember now read some image image.

Yeah is another one as well. I Hate fairyland

is amazing. Oh, yes. Yes it is You would like

that. Oh, I was gonna say, I know not of that.

Yeah, that sounds like something. Oh no, you

would love it. Oh, okay. Cool. Just off the top

of my head without actually switching off any

windows or moving anything on my phone other

than the script that I'm reading from with these

questions, basically this little girl gets trapped

in this place called Fairyland and it ages her

to the point where in the real world she's...

God knows how long, but in the in the fairy land,

she still looks like a kid, but she's actually

like 37 years old and she has to fight all these

things. And it's by Scotty. She has to fight

all these things to try to get out of fairy land.

And she has to. And it's it takes cursing to

a whole new level and a whole new comedic level.

They change it like. You muffin fluffers like

they he does all that. It's hilarious. One of

the first panels, one of the first panels, I

think, and one of the first couple issues is

she kills the moon. I'm like, oh my God. It's

so hilarious. Get it in trade. It's on Comixology.

It's amazing. Cool. Definitely. What about you,

John, for publishers and other things, obviously,

IDW and all that? I like IDW. Probably besides

Marvel and DC, IDW is the one I'm looking at.

Most I mean, I love I'm just starting to get

into their Ninja Turtles stuff that's gonna take

me a while to plow through but the I loved gem

But UW is is so much fun. It is so much fun because

I Love Jim as a kid. I loved as much as I loved

the Transformers in GI Joe comics They were all

our cartoons. They were all in the same universe

as far as I was concerned and they share a couple

characters So they are But they shared a number

of voice actors, and I know back then we weren't

thinking about the voice actors, but now that

we are, it's like, hey, you know, Samantha Newark

is Jem, Jerrica and Jem, obviously, but she was

also Optimus Prime's girlfriend on Transformers,

so they're in the same universe. That's cool.

That's neat. I like Jem, too. I like that cartoon.

It always surprises me when everybody's like,

but Jim's a girl cartoon. Have you watched it

lately? Seriously, the first episode, there's

car chases. There's, you know, all kinds of mischief

and everything else and mayhem. It's like, it's

not just for girl. No, I must have missed that

when I was a kid, because. Seriously, I loved

gem I am I looked forward to gem being on as

much as you know catching a Transformers or GI

Joe because it was more it didn't matter to me

You know if it was a boy or girl protagonist

It was the things that they were doing and she

was exactly we were a bit obsessed by holograms

in the 80s for like 10 minutes. Oh, okay. All

right, and It was really weird. But therefore

gem and the holograms was the coolest thing ever.

I think gargoyles. Yes my equivalent gargoyle

seems like it was Beared maybe more towards boys,

but I flippin loved that show I've even why it's

on the Disney Plus app and I've been watching

it and I still love that I love gargoyles And

it's got all the Star Trek people you could ever

possibly want there's so many people on that

show walk on his knees into hell if you pay them

enough Yeah, I mean, you know you look again.

It's all about timing You know, you look at the

80s and you look at Transformers, G .I. Joe,

Jam, Mask, Mask, not necessarily so much, but

Transformers, G .I. Joe, and Jam, because they

were all Sunbow Productions, all of their voice

actors crossed over. I think, I'm trying to remember

if this is right. No, sadly, I don't think Peter

Cullen did any gem stuff, but I know he did other

stuff in other things that were Sunbow related.

But it's like, you know, and that's the time,

like John said, back then in the eighties, we

were all obsessed with holograms, whether we

were little kids or adults. And in the nineties

it's, Hey, we have all this popular Star Trek

stuff. So let's put, you know, let's create something

else and put the Star Trek. people as voices

in this cartoon about gargoyles. Oh, I was just

gonna say, I think that was Jonathan Fricks himself

was basically going, hey, I know some people.

I love Jonathan Fricks. He's one of my favorite

people. He's so cool. He's very he's very frosty.

Yes. All right. Print or digital? Which one?

Both either or and why? You know, Reading comic

books on our tablets when you can do the what's

it called? The panel -by -panel view? The guided

view, yep. It lends a sort of cinematic quality

to your reading experience that is really cool.

However, at the same time, being someone who

loves a good paperback, I do like having the

physical copy as well. I think I retain things

a little bit better if I read it off paper than

if I read it off of a screen. And there's just

something about holding a book in your hand and

that smell, even comic books, little comic books

get that nice little book kind of smell too.

And there's something about that visceral experience

that I really like too. So I'm kind of an either

or, and sometimes it sort of depends on the comic

book, because I think some lend themselves really

well to that guided panel by panel, whereas other

ones could be fine either way. Mm -hmm, yeah.

for modern comics for me, I definitely prefer

digital for individual issues just because For

some reason I don't mind paying, you know 399

or whatever for something digitally. That's only

that much content But to actually go here's here's

my money. Give me a few pieces of paper stapled

together. Thank you But uh, I and I I think most

of my comic reading now is is on either comixology

or Marvel Unlimited or the DCU, which is where

I'm consuming most I like if it's a story arc

by a creator I like I really like to have like

the epic collections Like the fantastic for those

are nice That's a nice sized amount that you

can take and have a chunk of books to read for

a while I mean, I love your mom bought me the

Superman exile omnibus, which I absolutely love

but Do not drop this on your foot. No. So that's

it's tricky. They're hard to read because because

the book is so big. The book is so big. I mean,

it's gorgeous and all of those things. And I

love having and I would never part with that.

But it's unwieldy. It's unwieldy. Bones kind

of the same. We have the bone omnibus as well.

But that I think at this point, the spine's been

creased enough that it kind of holds itself open

very nicely. But that's another. big book. Right,

and Bone definitely lends itself to be read as

one, like one giant thing. That's definitely

how I prefer to read comic books. I'm not as

keen on getting individual issues because they

seem like... It's almost like birthday cards.

They're nice, but then you just get rid of them

afterwards. Individual copies are kind of like

that to me. Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait

a minute, wait a minute. We have to explore this

because how long have you guys been married?

Well, we've been married a little over two years.

We've been together for about seven. Together

for, okay. So in almost nine years, you've gotten

rid of every birthday card John has ever given

you. John's actually, have you gotten me a birthday

card? I think early on in our relationship you

probably did. I have a couple that I have held

on to because of, for sentimental reasons for

sure, but there's been plenty that I was like

oh that's nice and I put it up like to look at

for about a week or so after my birthday and

then they get recycled. I don't know, I don't

keep them. But we really do tend to be about

non -attachment on things like that, too, mostly

because we're trying to move. So we're getting.

That's effectively we've got a couple of short

boxes that are full of individual comics, and

we have to move a good two and a half hours away

from here in a couple of months. And I'm thinking,

OK, so do we want all of these individual issues?

And if so, is there a better way that we could

maybe display them? You know, and we could have

like our own little spinner rack and kind of

rotate the comics that we have on the spinner

rack and things like that. But otherwise, they

just sit in a box like Gillis does that when

the comic tropes guy does that, too. And I really

like it. I think it's cool. But I don't know.

Maybe that's just because I don't have like sentimental

attachment to a lot of individual comic issues,

because this is still a relatively new thing

for me. And I like reading collected stories

where I can read from beginning to end. We are

going way beyond his question. no it's perfectly

fine this is what the whole you know this is

what the show is about if if a tangent happens

it happens like going back to the birthday card

thing i still have two and a half no two full

1990s nike shoe boxes filled with birthday cards

from the last 40 years of my life that's nice

though i i used to as well I had to make a personal

choice. Once I realized, okay, I have moved four

times, I have moved these boxes through four

different places and I have not looked in them

any of those times. They are obviously sparking

joy. And when it comes to, like you guys were

saying, having to pack up for moving and whatever

else, here's my suggestion. If it's single issues

whether you display them or not if they're just

single issues that you don't like say you want

to You've already read them. You already know

what the story is. Say you want to donate them

or whatever else Just go get the single issue

on comics ology And actually that's kind of what

we've been doing is converting John's a comic

collection more into a digital collection just

because it is significantly more convenient,

and I hate to say that that sounds so shallow,

but it's true. It's manageable. It's convenient

and manageable. Yeah, absolutely. Because you

can get, I think, really easily overwhelmed with

individual comic issues. Yeah, I can't even imagine

before we were together how many issues you might

have had, you know, that you've gotten rid of.

Oh yeah, that's a question down the line here.

So getting into the meat and potatoes of some

comic stuff. Who are some of your favorite comics

writers and why? I have my list. OK. I love the

first person I want to mention is Matt Fraction

because his current run on Jimmy Olsen is phenomenal.

And it actually just wrapped up fairly recently.

And I've been a couple of issues behind. So I'm

going to start from the beginning and just read

them all through again. But. I loved his Jimmy

Olsen and his Hawkeye was really good as well.

Well, you mentioned something else he did. Oh,

tons of things. Oh, I mean, he's done lots. Oh,

it's Iron Man. Iron Man, you said was also really

good. Yeah. So I'm quite a big fan of Matt Fraction.

J .M. de Mateus, I cannot not mention him because

J .L .I. is one of my favorite things ever. In

fact, I think it was J .L .I. was one of the

first series that John said, Why don't you give

this a try? And it was the first time that a

comic book made me laugh out loud, and that immediately

endeared me to the story. And I've read a good

chunk of it, but there's plenty of it that I

haven't read yet. We've only got the one omnibus.

And I don't think I've even made it through that

yet. Maybe. I don't know. I don't remember. Anyway,

so James de Mateus, Gail Simone for Wonder Woman.

And honestly, anything that she writes, including

her Twitter feed, because she's amazing and she's

very funny. She's so good. Oh my god. And her

Wonder Woman. She is the best troll ever. She's

hilarious. I love her Twitter. But her Wonder

Woman was amazing and I really liked that. That

was the first Wonder Woman I probably ever read

was Gail Simone's and I was very impressed by

that. And then of course, because as of the recording

of this, I finished reading Bone yesterday. Jeff

Smith is definitely one of my favorite comic

writers of all time. Bone is incredible. It's

so good. Those are some of my favorites. All

right, so before John gives his answers number

one Matt fraction if you haven't already From

image sex criminals sex criminals is amazing

You guys have to read that okay, and the sad

the sad thing is now that I'm thinking about

that story John Have you read the whole thing

or some of it or part of it John? I have I can't

remember if I've read it all. I don't think I

have read at least like the first couple issues

and things. Yes. Yes. OK. So the sad thing is

right now, I'm not thinking it's John and Susie.

I'm thinking it's John and Maggie. You'll get

there. I don't know what this means, but now

I have I hate fairyland and sex criminals written

down. So I will remember. Absolutely. Sex criminals

is amazing. OK. Then Gail obviously for me Gail

when I found her it was her back girl run and

Man, I wish they put her on back girl again.

I don't know who's on it current I know there's

somebody writing the the rebirth stuff now, but

I Wish they put her back on a bad girl title

because I loved Gail's bad girl run Okay, okay

John writers for you sir Oh, man. Well, there's

a few. I do love Gail Simone as well with her

through Birds of Prey, her Batgirl or her Deadpool

stuff, if you have not read. I have to read her

Deadpool. It's pretty great. Gail Simone has

as much to do with the current depiction of of

Deadpool as anybody does. Oh, really? Absolutely.

Grant Morrison. I'm a big fan of his like gonzo

meadow way of looking at the universe and the

occasional. glimpses he gives into his brain.

Mark Wade, I will generally like anything he

does just because he will have respect for the

character that he's writing and still give a

new twist on it. He's not going to come in there

and break everything just to be controversial

and get things like that. Neil Gaiman is Sandman.

Sandman comic if I if bone isn't Sandman's probably

the best comic series. That's a self -contained

one that I've ever read I Like Michael are Brian

Michael Bendis until I didn't oh No, we got to

hear this story. Well, it's it's mostly ultimate

spider -man Is what is an incredible series?

There's In always even before miles and after

miles and once miles shows up it it's a shot

in the arm that it needed to go and it was a

very bright spot in what had Really gone wrong

with the ultimate universe at that point, but

I like him I loved when they brought him in to

do the regular Avengers. I kind of like that

tone I think comic books needed that sort of

thing at the time, but as it went on and as he

became everywhere it for me, became just a bunch

of comics with people that talk like this, like

this, like this. And then when he went over to

Superman, I was reading that. I was I was interested

in the new take on that, even though I liked

where Superman was at that point, he was really

making him interesting. He was doing some fun

stuff. And then suddenly he started going it

away with where he had to show about the Lois

Lane loves Clark so much that she constantly

is is lying to him. And then, you know, his identity.

And then I'm like, and somewhere about halfway

through the first legion of superheroes, when

every member of the legion of superheroes talks

like Peter Parker in Ultimate Spider -Man, I

was like, sorry, Brian, I'm done with you. But

his Daredevil is still one of my favorite comics

of all time. There you go. Old school writers,

I love Roger Stern, Marv Wolfman, Jonathan Hickman

and Dan Slott, their current stuff I like a lot,

and also J .M. de Mateus, both on his J .L .I.

and his Spider -Man and various other things

he's done. I will always read anything by any

of those people. He did a House of Mystery. I

was just reading the J .M. de Mateus did. It's

called Something with Blood. It's about a vampire.

And they're kind of cool. I read a bunch of those

on the DC app, like a week or so ago, actually.

I was just working around, and I was like, James

Damateus wrote for House of Mystery? No way!

That was really cool to find. I love him. He's

so funny. He's great. And those books aren't

funny, but they're good. What defines a good

story to you? Oh, boy. I would start off with,

like, authenticity. I need to be able to believe

the story that I'm reading. I like characters

that behave like the characters behave, I guess

is kind of the idea. I have the sort of, you

know, the idea in my head of who this character

is. And I like to read stories that sort of exemplify

those aspects of that character. Oh, Cisco wants

to get out of the room. Our cat Cisco wants to

be on the podcast so badly told him that he can't

read yet. I like stories that I like stories

by creators, especially writers that that really

understand the character that they are doing,

whether or not they're depicting the character

in a way that I would or things like that. I

like that. when somebody gets down to the core

of why this character is good. Spider -Man is

an example of one that people either get or don't.

Superman's another one. But with Spider -Man,

like Dan Slott, for example, took Spider -Man

and managed to deconstruct him by taking him

out of his normal situation in a strange way.

He actually gave him success. He gave him a job,

he gave him tons of money, he was a successful

person to examine the fact what then of Spider

-Man, of Peter Parker remains. Can you do something

like that and still make it? And with Captain

America, when you have Sam Wilson as Captain

America with Nick Spencer, both with Sam Wilson

as Captain America or with the story of Captain

America getting cosmic cubed into a Hydra agent?

Those are both great examinations of why you

like a character and when when a writer can go

and do something like that You know it can take

something that takes you the reader out of your

comfort zone, but keeps you coming back for more

That I really appreciate especially these days

because I can go if I want something to be just

the same as it was forever I can go back and

read tons of old stuff. Yeah, it's there are

certain things that draw you into certain stories.

How I got into the IDW Phase 2 books for Transformers.

Somebody mentioned Shadowplay and other things

and I'm like, okay, what did they do to Shockwave?

Uh oh, what did Shockwave do to them? Okay, I

now have to read all 13 plus years of this stuff

now. With with the IDW books, it's humor is something

that's always going to get me. I like a balance

of humor and gravitas. And I think the IDW books

do a good job with balancing that kind of tone.

And I also really like the characters and how

there's such a big cast. But every transformer

has their own personality, you know, and it's

easy to tell them apart. They don't all look

the same and they don't all behave the same.

And I enjoy that. So I like good, strong characters,

and I do like humor, but I also like things that

are a little dark and heavy sometimes, too. And

the IDW books have a little bit of everything.

So you kind of have answered the next question.

We can go into more depth or more clarity, I

guess. What does a story have to have to draw

you in? Now, Maggie, you did just say about,

you know, the comedy and also the dark parts

to it as well. What about you, John? Like that

as well in certain things basically for a comic

to draw me in is that I mean comics are There's

a formula with how a comic draws. Yeah, it's

got a cover that makes me want to go Hey, there's

something in this comic and I want to do it'll

give me a splash page to show me The number of

things can do that and I am a sucker for pretty

much all of them I mean if a comic book has a

people with word balloons talking about, Oh no,

Superman's turned into some sort of, um, monkey

hornet or something. How will we stop him? Yeah.

I'm going to read that thing. 2021 the monkey

murder hornets come after us all. I'm sorry that

I retroactively created the monkey mortar murder

hornets. You guys, it's a strange year and that

monkey's paw. I keep forgetting it's right here.

Oh boy. Alright, who are some of your favorite

artists? I like Jim Apparo's art in Batman a

lot. I'm gonna go with... with Jeff Smith again

as well for art because the art in bone is also

very, very good. Nick Roche, his art for More

Than Meets the Eye and the IDW phase two books.

I really like his style. And Joe Benitez with

Lady Mechanica. He's done a few other things,

none of which else I've read. And he really hasn't

done a whole bunch when I did a fireside favorite

on one of the Lady Mechanica issues. and it was

set in the during the Day of the Dead. So there

were all these really bright colors, too, because

you've got like the sugar skulls and carnations

and candles and people with their faces painted.

And it was so vibrant and at the same time really

dark, because then at the end of the issue, they

get attacked by zombies. And it's this kind of

Victorian steampunk style of art. And it's absolutely

gorgeous. I really like that art a lot. Oh, I'm

much more of a writer person than an artist person.

So I always especially modern ones. I have trouble

remembering who's who and learning my take on

that I do love pretty much everybody that's involved

in IDW transformers in one way or another especially

as it goes on For old school. I'm a I like the

Bishamas a lot Sal Bishamas Marvel Universe is

what the Marvel Universe looks like when I close

my eyes In the 1980s like Avengers sort of thing.

Yeah, I mean Dan Juergens John Byrne I usually

like especially his early stuff into the 80s.

He gets a little lazier as he goes on Yeah, I'm

right there with you on all the all the Transformers

artists and how Fluid yet different it all seems

If I was going to have to like if somebody put

a fusion cannon to my head and say, pick one

artist, I'm sorry, everybody, but I got to go

with Livio Ramandelli. Oh, man does amazing things.

And I need to commission that guy at some point

once I, you know, go rob a bank. All right. Do

you have a favorite non superhero title? You've

already mentioned bone Maggie and and and some

others but just something that is not a superhero

title Not necessarily superhero from either company,

but just something that's completely different

You once read and I don't remember because I

didn't write this one down I don't remember who

wrote it but John introduced me to mouse guard

and mouse guard is wonderful and it's It's mice.

It's kind of like the Redwall series if anyone's

familiar with those books by um Oh, what's his

name Jacques something Jacques far less twee

right? Yeah a little less cutesy, but nevertheless

they are mice with little swords and you know

armor and and Heraldry and everything like that.

David Peterson is the name of the writer and

artist of that. Thank you I loved Mouse Guard

and and unfortunately because they were done

by seasons and I think there's only fall and

winter, because there aren't all four. There

are only two books that I ever read and I couldn't

find any more beyond those, which was really

unfortunate. But what I did read and what I did

find, I really, really liked. And that was not

superhero at all. I like Knights of the Dinner

Table by Kenza and Company. It's a story about

people playing Hackmaster, which is the D &D.

sort of game and the wacky shenanigans that they

get into that I enjoy quite a bit. Oh, the D

&D comics in general are actually kind of fun

to read too. I do love Chips Adarsky's Rick and

Morty. Is that Jim Zub? Jim Zub does that one.

Rick and Morty, yeah. Rick and Morty versus Dungeons

and Dragons is pretty great. If you're a fan

of either or both of those, it's really... One

of the best adaptations besides their core form

of those two properties I've ever seen. I'm looking

forward to reading Transformers and My Little

Pony. That's gonna be awesome. Man, can you believe

that Transformers is so good at crossing over

with these strange things? Mike, have you read?

You've read them. Transformers Ghostbusters should

not have been as good as it was. I have not read

that yet. It's on my Comixology wish list. Again,

things have... Life happens, folks, but I plan

on reading them. I have read the Star Trek you

read. Yeah. Well, that was episode 375 of the

show. I read that. That was I'll give it this.

It was a lot better than that animated series

originally ever was. Thank God. But yeah, IDW

and their and their crossovers, man, they've

got. Transformers my little pony coming up. They

just announced transformers back to the future

Just like and even though even the turtles crossovers

Once you get into the turtle stuff John Make

sure you read it from the beginning and there

I can send you a link to a forum page that lists

The full order you're supposed to read them in

so that way you get it in full story order But

man, they've done two different TMNT Ghostbuster

crossovers in the past. And those were really,

really good because it's basically, you know,

two versions of New York. Right. The battle ones

were pretty great, too. Yeah, the Batman ones

are amazing. I have not read Batman team and

T3 yet. I need to add that to my list at some

point. I didn't know it was out. Oh, yeah, it's

been out Batman team and t3. I'm pretty sure

it's I don't know if it's out in trade yet, but

I know that the the Anyway, well the last couple

of months have taken three years each so I don't

know anything that happened outside of yeah,

I Mean really honestly, I'm not surprised that

we're not up to the 23rd century yet or something.

I I don't know it It's a whole different Whole

different world we live in now. Yes All right,

is there or what is your favorite run on a series?

So let's say Detective comics is there a specific

storyline within that or Snyder's Batman or even

Danny O 'Neil's Batman I mean, I don't you know,

I say Snyder because at least modern comics you

at least have certain story arcs like you know,

court of owls or death of the family or that

kind of thing. I really liked Grant Morrison's

run on Batman. I liked the Bat God. There was

something about that that I found very appealing.

I really liked also, and John, you're going to

have to help me remember some of these, I think

a little bit too, but Bloom when Jim Gordon was.

That's Scott Snyder. Oh, okay. I like those as

well. I think I read all of those. Who else did

I have I really liked? You can help me with this.

Mark Wade's Daredevil, you were a big fan of.

That's right. I'm not Daredevil. I'm not Daredevil.

He's got his horns. I like that, too. Oh, I also

really liked the She -Hulk with her super paralegal

that I always want to say is Dan Slott. You like

the Dan Slott one. You didn't actually read very

many of the... No. But I should have read more

of that. And I do intend to get back to it because

I really liked She -Hulk. It was because she's

a character I wouldn't have otherwise thought

to have read. And I want to read more of that.

Same with the Mortal Hulk. I want to read more

of that, too, because that's just a character

that has never interested me at all was Hulk.

And then I found out that there was a She -Hulk,

too. And I was like, wait, really? So those are

two that I want to explore more. Yeah, you got

to love Jennifer because she's awesome. She is

awesome. I love every She -Hulk run ever. No,

do you okay? Well, that's impressive five out

of five stars Yes, Batman TMNT 3 was released

the trade was released April of this year, but

yeah the story it was six issues and did conclude

so Awesome. I sent the comixology link to you

and in messenger. So that way you guys have it

for later Hmm. Okay. Where are we going from

here? Any other favorite run of series you guys

want to mention? Oh I've got Besides dance lots.

She hulk is definitely one for me Let's see Roger

Stern sell the Shema's Avengers run in the 1980s

is a big favorite of mine as well as Stern's

amazing spider -man run A lot of Hulk runs. I

love Al Ewing's Immortal Hulk. I think it's going

to be up there with me personally as one of the

best runs of the character. And that character

has had a lot of great runs that I love. I mean,

everybody talks about Peter David's run. But

there's Bill Matlow, Sal Bechemma in the 1980s

laid the groundwork for that run of turning the

Hulk from something that was basically a very

boring character. into a psychologically interesting

character. He was the, and the wind is blowing,

so this might sound interesting. Just glad that

there's a video. Yeah, it's gonna get so hot

here today. Yeah, Bill Matlow and Sal Bechema

really, Bill created this psychologically interesting

character by creating the repressed memories

of his, of. Bruce Banner's father and Sal Bechema

could could draw the Hulk both as a very childlike

monster or an absolutely horrifying savage depending

on what the state of and he kind of created the

idea of the Hulk having different personalities

that Peter David picked up and just ran ran to

Timbuktu with I think my issue with that sometimes

is because I am still I could still consider

myself relatively new to comics, I bounce around

a lot. So I'll read a couple issues of something,

but then my attention will get grabbed by something

else. And I'll go and read that for a little

while. And sometimes I'll go back and finish

a run. But a lot of times I just kind of hop

around and rely on John to help me keep the plot

lines all straight in my head, because there's

there's so much and knowing where to start. And,

you know, trying to avoid the things that I don't

like to see in comic books, too. It's a difficult

thing to navigate sometimes. So I do tend to

bounce from thing to thing to thing just to try

to gain some experience with different kinds

of characters. Batman was always like my first

kind of gateway. But now I want to read about

more things, you know, so I've I've read little

chunks and bits and pieces of a lot of different

things. and that reminds me speaking of things

both Mark Wade's and Jonathan Hickman's Fantastic

Four runs are two of my absolute favorite comic

book runs in of any character in them because

the Fantastic Four are my favorite comic books.

And also speaking of things Alan Moore's Swamp

Thing was one of my favorite series that I've

ever read. I loved his Swamp Thing. I love Swamp

Thing. He's so cool. He's Moss Man's brother.

Anyway. That's a crossover, folks. That was great.

What is one comic you can read over and over

again, single issue or trade? One of my answers

would be almost any Golden Age Batman, because

Golden Age Batman is hilarious and I love them.

I love that era where they were storytelling

and the characters were so different and everything

was still very new and kind of nation. And I

love the crazy gonzo stories that came out of

the Golden Age. I could read those forever in

a day. Otherwise, I'm trying to think. Do you

have one that you would read over and over again?

Stan Lee, Steve Ditko, Spider -Man run. Oh, I'm

literally I'm reading it right now after I had

just read it a bit ago. That plus the John Byrne

Fantastic Four run too. Think and anything in

the Mike Carlin Superman era Yeah for me just

because this is a new question because when I

did my origins episode we didn't have these questions

back then It's Pretty much Kyle Higgins is run

on Nightwing in new 52. I can read that entire

series over and over again For just a single

trade Tom Zoller's long distance. Okay. It's

a romance comic, but it's really good. Uh, he

also did a, a digital, if you guys know of line

web tune, he did a thing on their, uh, digital

service. Uh, it's free. So there's whatever,

uh, called warning label. It's another romance

comic, but it is absolutely geeky and hilarious.

And I think you guys would love it. Basically

these two people meet up and the girl, when the

guy goes to ask her out, she goes, uh, hang on

a second. You might want to wait a minute. And

the whole bar ends up on fire and this giant

warning label shows up. So basically she's, she's

cursed and he's like curses. Those are a thing.

She's like, how do you not know this? Uh, and

so she's cursed and basically anyone goes to

ask her out. This warning label shows up basically

with her leading with her worst qualities first.

And it is just absolutely hilarious. I'll send

you guys links to the stuff afterwards, but long

distance and warning label. I can read those.

I've. Literally the physical I have the physical

trade to long distance and I have the digital

version I've read that book at least 20 or more

times. Oh wow. It's so fun Okay, so you mentioned

it earlier Maggie and not that we want to be

negative in these questions However, there are

certain things we do try to avoid So what are

are there the question actually is are there

comics you avoid altogether? But basically what

is it you? Don't want in your comics One of the

things that really bothers me in comic books

is the depiction of their female characters.

I Don't like oh, what was it? We were just watching

something on YouTube yesterday, and it was comic

tropes this YouTube channel and it was talking

about the Fantastic Four and it was in the 90s

and it was Sue Storm's costume with the four

cut out and her like stomach exposed and she

looked like a hooker and I did not recognize

her when I saw her and John said, yeah, that's

Sue. And I was like, that's Sue? That was horrible.

I am so tired of the narrow waist. thigh gap

big boobs thing that they do with with female

characters and it's so pervasive it's almost

hard to avoid it. Especially like with Catwoman,

that really bothers me whenever they do something

like that with their rather acrobatic and gymnastic

-y kind of characters those women who are able

to do those things have a certain physique and

that is it is not Catwoman's physique. It really

bothers me that there is such a reluctance to

depict different kinds of body types amongst

any comic book character, but certainly with

the female characters. That's why I really appreciate

like She -Hulk, because she's big and buff and

she's so cool and badass. And then there's Squirrel

Girl, who's rounder and curvier. And there's

absolutely nothing wrong with that. I'd like

to see more realistic. you know and I understand

these are comic books and they're not based in

reality but at least a slightly more respectful

take on the female form I would really appreciate.

It just is something that really rubs me the

wrong way and will immediately make me put something

down if I find it to be too egregious. I will

not read it anymore because art can really affect

your you know experience when you're reading

a book and bad art even if it's a really good

story will still turn me off of the story. Right.

As a quick follow -up before John gives his answer,

do you feel that it's gotten worse or better

over time with artists drawing the female form?

I think it's getting a little bit better. If

nothing else, at least it's not quite as skeezy

and full of male gaze. I'm glad that there are

more women actually and, you know, getting a

chance to write bigger titles so that we can

and draw different titles, too. So we can. I

think that is important. Yeah. And I hope that

that progress continues on. But I also find it

to be really disrespectful of the character.

Like when I saw that Sue Storm, I was like, she

is a much better character than she doesn't deserve

that. You know, you can you can draw her with

her full body, fantastic foresuit, and she looks

just fine. You don't have to sexualize every

woman. It's just not necessary. And I think there

is less of that now. And I think that that is

a good thing. I don't know what that was. That

was not astro trade. I could tell you that. Apparently,

we have dogs. We don't have dogs, but we have

dogs. Who let the dogs out? Who? I mean, who?

Okay, I think that's past. See what I mean, folks?

Stuff just goes wrong. It does. Hey, you get

what you pay for. Exactly. And nobody pays for

this, so it's OK. I like it. That's the joke.

I know. John, what about you? I'll echo everything

Maggie said will generally make me not like something.

I'll add on to it the other half of what, in

my opinion, they got wrong in the 90s, which

is the. I generally don't like superheroes who

kill. there are exceptions especially if they're

using it to make you know some sort of commentary

can be done very well the Punisher generally

gets grandfathered in for that but just the idea

that not to completely go off on a tangent but

it when Zack Snyder for example talks about roles

his eyes at people who thinks that superheroes

shouldn't kill because of course they would kill

no they're they're not real I'm not reading comic

books to see a realistic depiction of what would

happen if people put on and it Spandex and beat

people up because there is no such thing as a

realistic depiction of what would happen if people

put up spandex and beat people up because That

doesn't happen There's plenty of realistic things

that that I mean just look at all the conventions

we don't have this year Right Maybe this is just

me getting older, but I do like a level of fantasy

in my depiction of it. I can accept the whole

libertarian paradise fantasy of the individual

who is more equipped to deal with society's problems

than society. But then once that crosses over

into, and therefore watch me murder all these

people, it's... It's generally something I don't

like. There's not very much to my mind. Not very

many stories you can tell. Yeah. And so I generally

leave that out. And the whole point of being

a superhero is you save people. You don't kill

them. Right. It's the difference between an action

hero and a superhero. Exactly. Action hero shows

up the first thing to do is beat up or kill a

bad guy Superhero shows up the first thing they

better be doing is saving a person. Otherwise,

they're not a superhero anymore They're just

a national hero who dresses weird There are a

lot of those out there sadly If you don't say

the cat at least once out of a tree you ain't

no superhero All right, so are there any comics

in the past or currently? that you wish you hadn't

read them? Killing Joke. I remember. Really?

Yeah, I remember when I read it, I thought, wow,

this is so dark. And I was really taken in by

it. And it was a much more twisted version of

the Joker than I was used to seeing. And I was

really struck by that. But the more time has

passed since I've read Killing Joke, the more

I wish I hadn't read it. Because to be perfectly

honest, it kind of grosses me out. And I mean,

it led into, you know, Batgirl becoming Oracle.

And she was that for a very long time. So it

was definitely influential in the Batman universe.

But there's and I think it's just because I feel

like I've become really saturated with the dark

and really violent, especially in Batman kind

of stuff, where it just has to be the nitty gritty,

dark and depressing all the time thing. And I'm

kind of over that. 16 year old me would have

been all over that stuff. If I had read Killing

Joke when I was 16, I probably would have loved

it. I did read Killing Joke when I was 16. And

I loved it. And that would have fit, you know,

where my headspace was. But I've grown since

then and I've changed since then. And that kind

of thing just doesn't appeal to me anymore. And

now it kind of leaves a bad taste in my brain.

I think even Alan Moore has fallen out of love

with Killing Joke. He does not like that it is

in continuity. He was trying to do he was trying

to make a general statement that was supposed

to just exist and then moved on from yeah, and

and I think it I Mean, I I'm I have two minds

on killing joke I think there are artistic merits

to it definitely and it's an interesting idea

to look into but especially with the basic fridging

of Barbara Absolutely, no agency for her and

her only purpose is to motivate other people

to act a certain way and it's And that's not

Alan being a terrible person. That's Alan. Alan

being an individual writer at a time when a whole

bunch of individual writers were doing that kind

of story and not really paying attention to how

many other people were doing it. So. They're.

Going to go rescue someone. Red alert. Yeah.

For me mostly what I don't like about it if I

read it and and this is not my answer by the

way but what I don't like about it is is a It

started the Joker off on a path to just be the

super serial killer rather than the clown prince

of crime and It's the difference between that.

Well, if you want an example of how it works

tonally watch or don't watch the the Killing

Joke cartoon and Mark Hamill in depiction of

the Joker in that compared to Mark Hamill's depiction

of the Joker in the Batman the animated series.

The Joker is funny. I agree. You need to be.

That's the only reason the Joker works as a character

is that he's funny. and unpredictable, not just

that he's going to come in and kill 50 people

before you're able to stop him. Or shave your

face off or something like that. Or cut his face

off or staple it back on or whatever the hell

else happened in 1952. Yeah, that was pretty

gross. Yeah, I agree. I like a more... I want

to say Whimsical Joker. I really like, like in

Harley Quinn, the DC app cartoon that they've

got right now with Kaley Cuoco doing Harley Quinn

is phenomenal. And the Joker in that is really

funny. It's kind of like when ABC did that updated,

more adult version of the Muppets. It's kind

of like that, but with Harley and the Joker.

And I really like it. Yeah. And Killing Joke

just, it just doesn't work for me anymore. I'm

gonna just say sins past as my answer and then

move on because if I have to explain why I'll

have to Remember that sins past is a thing I

read. Oh Boy, okay The Wikipedia description

of identity crisis Read it when we covered omak

and I will that just makes me cringe all over.

Why would you put that in a comic book? I do

not understand that at all. That is crossing

way too many lines for me. Yeah, absolutely.

All right. How large or small is your physical

comic book collection? That's a good question.

I'm looking. We have a couple shelves. And a

couple short boxes. Yeah, we were down to three

short boxes and Two small shelves full of graph

various graphic novels physical amounts. Mm -hmm

The I used to have a rather sizable amount part

of it was damaged in a flood north unfortunately

and the rest I just kind of gotten rid of because

Well, it was only once when I moved Over fought,

you know what? The first time I'm like, okay,

I'm never moving that many long boxes again So

we're far down on physical thankfully the Like

like we already said thankfully we now live in

it in an age where comics ology exists even though

they're owned by amazon now but whatever you

know where you can have your digital collection

and not have to really worry about it and i know

people are like oh but you don't really own them

and i'm like i paid the money it's in my collection

as long as the servers don't go down i own the

damn thing. Yes, I'm not I'm not renting okay.

Yes, comics ology unlimited is amazing If you

want to pay a monthly subscription service to

be able to read Quote -unquote because they actually

use this term quote -unquote borrow and return

the books fine. I'd rather spend the Specifically

for trades wherever the trade prices are 19 20

bucks Whatever it is or trades on sale because

they do trades on sale all the time So, you know,

yeah, I own that. And as long as the servers

don't go down, I still own it. It isn't like

it's being taken away from me because it's digital.

If it ever does, then I'll just start over. Yeah,

I suppose. I suppose. Or, you know, if if Comixology

ever does go down, I guess, you know. The pull

bag will finally have its end point because I've

never I've done in the 11 12 years. I've done

them. I've never actually set an end point for

this show because This show because there's so

many comics There's so much old and new so much

talk about so many different things the show

can go on forever obviously Whenever I end up

expiring from this Unearthly plane we live on

especially nowadays My goal is to hopefully at

least get this podcast 500 episodes maybe And

you know if I had you know my regular setup we

would have been This is 382 so we're a little

less than we're like 18 away from 400 so Yeah,

I probably could have hit 600 before the end

of the year if I had my computer right now. Dang.

I'm a machine. Indeed. Okay. Heaven forbid anything

happened, but say the house, the apartment, the

whatever burns down, but everyone's out safe,

you guys are out safe, the pets are out safe,

all that stuff. What's the one comic you could

never live without? Like one comes back in to

save Yeah, I would I would not leave bone behind

those baby possums and Bartleby are coming with

me So glad that I have them in my head forever

I have become so enamored with that story. It

really blew me away Just these these tiny little

characters with big noses and like barely any

clothing have this Awesome fantasy fairy tale

story and adventure. I would definitely grab

our bone or the J .L .I. omnibus. Oh, no. Probably

bone over J .L .I. I have to. I'll be honest.

I will grab the Superman versus the amazing Spider

-Man treasury edition. That was the we bought

that. On our wedding day. Yeah, I guess maybe

that should have been my answer. I'm sorry. I

covered on our show. Yeah, I will always associate

it with you. Oh, that's a sentimental attachment

to that one. Unless the other treasury one was

closer because I like that one better. But our

true colors really come out today. Superman and

the amazing Spider -Man, we will cover that one

someday. Mm hmm. What is the most money you spent

on a comic or a comic item? So either a book

or a statue or a Funko pop or whatever. Well,

the most expensive comic we own for sure is that

Treasury Edition that you actually just mentioned,

because I that was like 50 bucks. We spent 50

bucks on that. Yeah. We overpaid. We overpaid,

but it was a local comic shop, so we're happy

to support them. But that's probably the most

expensive comic we own. I'm trying to think about

anything else. I spent twenty five dollars on

Dark Empire number one from a comic shop back

when, because I had that was when it was the

first new Star Wars thing in so long. And I had

missed it. When it came out and I started with

number two and they had number one behind the

counter there for 25 bucks And I'm like damn

it here you go Turns out I could have just waited

all of this time for rise of Skywalker and gotten

the exact same story I Like to think Dark Empire

was better. It was more expertly done Rise of

Scott Walker is good, but Dark Empire is better.

I definitely think JJ Abrams read Dark Empire

before he made the movie. A film director reading

something? Really? Not to say no film directors

read things. It's more a, I still have nightmares

from Revenge of the Fallen and it only got worse

after that. Anyway. The more than meets the pod

podcast their coverage of the Michael Bay movies

are an absolute scream to listen to We watched

all those movies in one day for them. It's the

incredible adventures of Michaela being stuck

in this horrible movie What I absolutely love

and I'll have to once again send this to you

guys if I can even find it There is a I think

they're still doing it or they might not, but

they did a number of them. There's this show

called tranquil tirades. It started as a, as

a blog, but they turned it into a podcast. I

don't want to say blog, but it was like written

reviews of basically the premise is they review,

they take bad movies and try to put, you know,

intellectual spin on them or try to dissect them.

intellectually kind of thing. And they did, I

think, the first three Transformers movies. And

these two guys, James and Damien, they are not

Transformers. Like they're basically non -Transformers

fans. They're movie fans, but they're not Transformers

fans. So it was so refreshing to listen to each

of those episodes. I think they clock in at two

or three hours each or whatever. But it was so

refreshing to see it from a non -fans perspective.

And it's hilarious. It's so funny. I'll have

to see if I can find it and send it to you guys.

All right. Was there ever a moment when you were

done with comics? So up to this point in your

entire life, were there, like John, you mentioned

earlier, oh, I hit high school and I discovered

girls and yada yada. So bye bye comics. Was there

ever a moment like that? I haven't really yet

come to the point where I'm done with comics.

I'm done with certain aspects of it, but it's

not going to prevent me from continuing to read

them because I am optimistic about where comics

are going. Most of the stuff from the 90s I'm

probably not going to read. Not that there aren't

stories from that decade that I wouldn't read,

but a lot of it is so over the top to me that

I'm just not interested in it. I wouldn't say

that I've come to a point where I'm done and

over with them. They're kind of going to, I think,

casually be in my life for quite some time. There

are a couple of times, for one reason or another,

I stopped. I think during the most egregious

period of the 90s, I wasn't buying too many things,

especially once Peter David's Hulk was done.

And then after Infinite Crisis and not specifically

because of Infinite Crisis, But I think right

around there, I just stopped reading them until

the new 52 started. I was into other things and

my life was going through a bunch of things.

Somewhere in the new 52, I came back to comics

sporadically and seriously did write about rebirth.

I feel like we've already answered this one.

What are you reading right now and what do you

think our listeners should check out? Hmm, let's

see. Um, everything we've already talked about.

Maybe I should, maybe I should move that question.

Besides Bone, Maggie, are you reading any? Well,

Matt Fraction's Jimmy Olsen. I'm really looking

forward to getting back into for sure. I would

highly recommend that. That's coming from someone

who despises the character of Jimmy Olsen. come

in full circle and absolutely loving it because

the whole point is that it's Jimmy Olsen but

cranked up to 11 and it was written for me. It's

like that fraction knows Maggie Schaeffer does

not like Jimmy Olsen. I'm gonna write this for

her. And I've loved every book of that that I've

read so far. I think that's the most current.

I'm not reading much current stuff. Al Ewing's

Immortal Hulk, Chibzarsky's Daredevil. I'm reading

and I gotta finish that daredevil series and

Dan slots fantastic for I enjoy especially it's

getting good again It kind of had a he came out

of the gate with that was like I finally get

the right fantastic for I'm gonna do and then

he put Galactus and dr. Doom and like his first

story and then oh, oh I should slow down a little

bit. So it's like a bit to build back up, but

I really enjoy I enjoy anything Slott does and

he obviously likes the Fantastic Four and he

has an interesting spin on that. So that's fun.

One of the things that I've really liked about

podcasting with comic books is that the comic

books I read, I tend to read for a show that

we're going to be on, whether it's for one of

our own shows. or to be on somebody else's. And

honestly, that's been kind of a cool way to read

them, because it means that I'm going to be reading

a wide variety of different books from a lot

of different eras, depending on what we feel

like covering or what we've been asked to cover

with somebody else. Like I hadn't read Neil Gaiman's

Sandman, which I still need to rectify. But last

year when we did our Halloween crossover, we

did Calliope and Midsummer Night's Dream. Those

were the first two books out of the Sandman series

that I read. And I was glad that at least I got

a little piece of that. So I can say at least

I've read those two stories. I read, actually,

I read all the stories to the one with Metamorpho

and the Dream of a Thousand Cats. It still blows

my mind that Metamorpho was in there, not Metamorpho,

but the woman who was Element Girl. Yeah. So

that's one of the things I like. For this year

we're going to be doing a Moon Knight. I'd never

read Moon Knight before so I read my first Moon

Knight issue just recently actually and I thought

that was really cool. The art in Moon Knight

is really neat, very striking with the white

and the black. Bone, obviously we're going to

cover that too and I just finished that and I

loved it, highly recommend it. It did win 21

awards so obviously it's worth reading. Conan

the barbarian. Hell of a lot of fun. Oh my god.

It's in the most recent one He's in what is basically

the Tomb of Horrors with a bunch of random other

adventures. It is so good I might like that I

might have to read that Conan the barbarian is

another one that I'm like I don't know if I'd

be interested in that and I'm sure if I pick

that up I'd probably like it Yeah for the pull

bag back in the day 2015 so five years ago we

did to hell well sort of two halloween specials

one was halloween one wasn't the first one was

we did um angels smile time they adapted the

smile time episode of angel into into comic form

which was even more hilarious than the actual

episode the episode is amazing i love that episode

of angel but they did that so we recovered that

on the pull bag and then For Halloween in 2015

we did something called angels angel masks to

look it up later, but Yeah, I for the longest

time on this show I've wanted to eventually do

Batman the long Halloween on Halloween, but it

has never come to pass at this point All right

Heroes, heroines, anti -heroes, heroines, robots

or villains? What archetypes are your go -to

reads? Heroes for me. Yeah. Yeah, because I really

like the villains as well. I really like a good

villain like Megatron is an amazing villain.

The Joker. Even though I feel at this point,

I'm a little over the use of the Joker. Starscream.

Starscream. Oh, Starscream is great. He's such

a good villain. He's hilarious. He's the best

villain. So I do really like a good villain,

but I'm definitely going to be more interested

in the side of the hero or the heroine. Yeah.

Very cool. Now, this question comes from Me because

i have one of these stories not with comics but

with toys when i was in people who have listened

to this show and any other show on the cast for

network for this story for the last twelve years

so. This is just for you guys when i was six

years old i have my parents got divorced when

i was two and nineteen two so in eighty six.

Had all for some odd reason. I don't know why

I had all my Masters the universe hero toys with

Castle Grayskull at my mom's place Snake Mountain

and all the villains were at my dad's place Don't

know why whatever Well at six years old one day

my dad said you're too old to play with toys

and sold all my villains Snake Mountain so So

This question, do you have a parents got rid

of my comics story because my one of my parents

got rid of my toys years and years ago. Oh, that's

heartbreaking. I'm so glad I have not had that

experience. My mom was always really good about,

do you want to try reading this new thing? Go

for it. You're eight years old and you're going

to try to read Dante's Inferno. Why not? Just

go for it. I don't think I mean my stuffed animals

never got taken away from me. No, I never had

that happen. My mom was always like, nope, you

do you. My brother, all of the Transformers that

I owned and wound up selling them. Thought he

took him for his kid. That's what he'd like to

tell you but oh That's sad I original optimus

prime That is heartbreaking It's very sad. I

love you Jason You're a good brother All right,

what is one item from a comic book you'd love

to have in the real world so like Green Lantern's

ring the lantern Batman's batarang that kind

of stuff Well that battering is apparently very

versatile as we have seen throughout Batman's

history That battering can do many things if

I if I wanted something. Oh, yeah The actually,

I'm going to go with the first one. You said

the Green Lantern ring. I have always thought

that that would be so much fun to play around

with. I mean, protect the universe with. I'll

go more pedestrian and a Quinjet. Not a bad choice.

Quinjets are cool and they can go anywhere, including

other galaxies. Apparently so, yes. Very cool.

All right. We're almost done, folks. I know this

has felt like torture, hasn't it? Number 24.

I've been enjoying myself. There you go. If you

could create any comic storyline, what would

you want to create and what characters would

you want to create it with? Now, this is if DC

hired you both, Marvel hired whoever, you know,

or not just hired you. Let's just say they gave

you permission because heaven forbid anybody

make a a fan film these days without getting

anyway. So basically, what characters and what

story would you want to tell with those characters?

One of my favorite and I feel underused characters

from DC Comics is Kismet. She hasn't shown up

a whole bunch. Most notably in the JLA Avengers

crossover. I think that's the biggest one I think

where she was a part of although she's more used

in Superman stories And I would kill to get to

tell a story with Kismet. I love the idea of

First of all, it was the art of Kismet that that

first drew me to the character. I think she was

stunningly drawn and the idea of the DC universe

being encapsulated in this feminine form that

is the entire DC universe. There's something

about that that just makes me want to give Kismet

a hug. I love that idea so much, and I appreciate

so much of what the DC universe has given me.

It was particularly with Batman, just because

he has resonated with me for so long. So if I

was going to write something, it would definitely

be for DC. It would definitely be a Kismet story.

And I would want to use as many of like the the

magic -y people like Phantom Stranger and Spectre

and Constantine and Zatanna, Dr. Fate. I love

those characters. Swamp Thing, I would want to

include. I just use all the crazy characters,

all the magic -y ones, but it would all be centered

around Kismet. Yeah, very cool Yeah, mine's along

similar lines Yes, I would have Kang and Morgan

Le Fay Go back in time to the Marvel 1800s and

transform the world into some sort of magicals

You know techno monstrosity and all of the Marvel

Two -gun kid and rawhide kid and those people

would have to team up in order to fight them

That would be pretty cool either that or when

I just thought of while you were saying Okay,

I want to write a story about the supreme Soviets

in 1989 Like the the Soviet super soldiers has

been wall falls and then their fallout with them

having to deal with the fall of communism and

how their lives are changed and all that stuff,

mostly because I think Ursa Major, the man bear,

needs to be in more things because he's a Russian

and he's a bear. His name is Ursa Major, the

big bear. That's so cool. Comics are silly. They've

got some amazing things. But I actually do think

that would be an interesting take to deal with,

because deal with the fact that their entire

the entire aspect of them is that they're commies.

Well, now there's no communism. What are you

going to do? Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Absolutely going

to do. It's it's so interesting to me. That I

believe comics do it better sometimes. Now, I

know there are some film or television adaptations

that are really good. When you take a real life

story and adapt it as a graphic, not like George

Takei's, they call this enemy. Oh my God. Mouse.

Wow. Yep. Uh, I think IDW is just now announced

or they announced a couple of weeks ago that

they're going to be doing a tenement square graphic

novel. So yeah, I love when comics. like adapt

the real life story into a comic because, you

know, especially with kids today, like they didn't

live through, like, I barely remember Tiananmen

square. I mean, I remember seeing it on the news

and stuff, but I don't remember CNN was so much

better back then anyway. All right. I can tag

onto that. I really agree with you on that. I

am such a history nerd. I mean i love his like

his the stories that exist in history that just

are untold and i am all for different adaptations

of that even if even if you want to take liberties

like the musical hamilton is one of my favorite

creations of anything that exists because partly

because well so you work with musical genius.

But besides that, it makes you want to check

out these stories. And it's fun to really look

at it in the terms of the artistic license he

takes, like which aspects of this are true and

which of these you'd be surprised to find aren't

or are I mean, other way around, which aren't

true and then which are. And it's it's really

neat to go and do that. And I love that when

things like that and if comic books can serve

that purpose to people who wouldn't normally

find out about these stories. I am always glad

when they exist especially when the written one.

Yeah, I think with the advent of Hamilton finding

new ways to tell historical Events is kind of

important. I think history is something that's

important for people to learn but it tends to

be delivered in such a Dry textbook kind of a

way that if you can take a real life story and

give it color and give it, you know, dialogue

specifically from a character. I think it's a

really good way to get people into that story

and almost put them in a character's shoes and

have them go through that event, you know, through

their imagination rather than just be told a

bunch of dates and names. Right. Yeah. Absolutely.

All right. And the final question is What is

the one piece of advice you would give the comics

fandom? Lighten up Would be my answer Try not

to take it so seriously it Obviously, these are

stories and books that mean a lot to people and

these are characters that a lot of the fandom

have been following for many many years and through

childhood and it's hard to put that sentimentality

aside and that sort of nostalgia that really

affects your perspective on things. And when

stories start to change or evolve, that's okay.

You don't have to claw at the, you know, for

the old stuff or it to remain the same. You can

allow things to change and get better. So yeah,

I would say to just lighten up a little bit and

try to enjoy yourself and don't focus on the

hate so much. Yeah, it doesn't matter if there

are three fucks in Hamilton Disney Plus. Oh,

geez. Like, seriously, really? OK. Is that bothering

people? No, they. Oh, yeah. Oh, I had censorship

really bothers me, too. Yeah, I'm not a big fan

of censorship. If you don't want to hear it.

I agree with Maggie. People should lighten up.

It's fiction. If you're not getting joy out of

it, go back and read some that you are. You are

wasting too much energy going on negative tirades

and joining up with people who have really strange

ideas about why things are happening and what

things need to be happening. Absolutely. And

I am on board with you guys. It's all for the

fun and enjoyment. It's for. You know what? Say

what you will about the band Creed, but their

song higher is a song about escape. And if you

can't make your great escape into comics, then

I don't know what kind of enjoyment you have

in your life because comics are for everybody.

Comics, no matter whether you're 60, 70 years

old and remember the old old days or if you're

You know seven eight nine ten eleven twelve thirteen

fourteen fifteen now growing up with whatever

you know, whatever kids comics they have now

because Certain comics most definitely are not

for kids And that's okay because as I said comics

are for everybody there's something in comics

for everyone whether it's giant robots Whether

it's holograms whether it's DeLorean's whether

it's capes and cowls. It doesn't matter There's

room for everybody. Well said. Yep, definitely

agree. All right. As Thundercracker decides to

fly by, here's the point where you guys can pimp

out all that Rod Pod content you're not creating.

I promise I'm going to edit an episode right

now. Yes. In addition to the Rod Pod episodes

we haven't been putting out, we have doing several

other things under the General Married with Comics

banner lately. We've we are almost done with

this. We've been doing kind of a chapter at a

time thing of The Wounded Sky by Diane Dwayne,

which is my favorite Star Trek book. Oh, and

it was so much fun to read. We've been doing

that with Lane from I always get it confused.

I would just want to call her Batman books. The

Dark Knight in prose. We're doing that once we

do that we'll go back to doing some comic book

related things maybe maybe get back to a couple

of the encyclopedia brown stuff. No, yeah, I

keep getting people are like you guys gonna do

any more encyclopedia brown stuff like I suppose

we probably should and And definitely for Mike's

sake if if for nobody else's we will be getting

out some rod pods pretty soon But otherwise and

transformers related stuff. I every month do

a Transformers Chronicles the Marvel years over

on long box crusade where we cover the Marvel

Transformers comics in order Maggie is on plenty

of those as well Sure am. And we are there with

Pat and Delvin. Hi Delvin. And we have a good

time talking about this stuff. And you can find

us on Twitter. I am at MWC underscore podcast.

And I am at Maggie and the rain. No I in in.

No I in in. All right. Anything else you want

to say before I go through my diatribe? Till

all are one. Till all are one. There you go.

Thank you for joining us inside the pull bag.

If you'd like to get in contact with us, we'll

leave feedback for the show. There are several

ways to do so. Visit the website, keycastradio

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the website. It's dying, sadly. Here are all

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I know I just pulled a wheelie. Apple and Google

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actually prefer spotify because. I've been told

by our our people behind the curtains that spotify

listenership for our shows here the gastro network

is actually the most popular listenership that

we can't leave this feel like an itunes or on

apple podcast whatever it's called now when we

started this whole thing it was just itunes dammit.

Follow us on Twitter. It's at geek cast radio

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their page. All the links will be in the, in

the, whatever I put on the website post or whatever

it is. I don't know what I'm talking about anymore.

Oh boy. Whoever thought that central air out

in the Pacific Northwest knows central air out

in the Pacific Northwest was a bad idea is just

evil Anyway for now I am TFG and Mike with John

and Maggie John forgot his own name Was looking

out the window and enjoying the wind that was

just blowing in for that one second It's gonna

be a hot one here today Yeah, not having central

air in the Midwest is just as bad as not having

it in the Pacific Northwest It's okay. I know

you're not supposed to talk about weather and

things in the podcast, but this is the end of

the damn show folks It's one of those things

where we moved out here and yes and whatever

but they're like Yeah, no most apartment buildings

most houses unless you put it in whatever yeah

It doesn't come with it because we have to the

whole reason why we moved out here from the Midwest

because we were in Chicago adjacent was because

My wife wants to be on the coast and she loves

the temperate weather we knew if it gets above

65 degrees I puke There's just no way around

it. I you know, I just can't handle heat anymore

and even though i know you guys are suffering

because you guys have that that heat still it's

coming somehow this whole virus that we live

in now has moved the weather pattern where the

heat is traveling west instead of going from

west to east it's oh god it's just so bad as

of this recording i am facing two 100 degree

days oh i can't do it anyway Sorry, folks. Make

ER a great escape into comics. I don't know when

episode 383 is gonna happen. I'm not sure. It

depends on if I can find recording and editing

monkeys to be the guests next time. Who knows?

I don't know. It very much is one of those things

where it's an adjustment. So we hope you enjoyed

this episode. Go check out John and Maggie's

Married with Comics. the rod pod. I know it's

the long box you said, but what the hell is the

name of the Transformers thing over there? Transformers

Chronicles. The Marvel. There you go. I knew

it had something to do with Marvel. I am. I swear

to God, I'm losing my mind. I've lost it years

ago and just embrace it. It's a lot more interesting

once you do. All right, folks, we're out of here.

Catch you next time. Bye. You've just heard the

latest episode of The Pull Bag, the GCRN's first

comic review and discussion podcast. There are

several ways to get in touch with us and leave

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