Interview with Terry Smith on Black Stone Cherry’s The Human

Hellooo Mets! This is Jesse from Rock Sugar and

you're listening to the GeekCast Radio Network.

Keep it right here. Previously on GeekCast Radio.

Now, of course, if this was a normal music talk,

because I'd now be asking you for your final

thoughts and your contact details, but given...

This isn't! But given it's been blank sharded,

which I'm gaining... That's working for me more

and more. If in 10 years there are people wandering

around Scotland saying, and it'd sound great

in a Scottish accent as well, he's being blunt

-charted. So let's move on to the next decade

that hasn't yet arrived. Yes, we're, like I said,

two or three, well, we're two months away from

the 2020s. So my biggest joke now, and I know

this is not supposed to be a joke, but it is

a joke for me. I wasn't alive in the 1920s. My

grandmother on my mom's side was born in 1920.

She was nine years old when the depression happened.

So being a kid at that time, that must have been

awful. But because we are now coming to the 2020s,

I want to call it the roaring 20s again, because

it's, you know, like, I don't know. So, again,

going back to Blackstone Cherry and figuring

out a song that, who knows what, you know, you

said in the last episode of Music Talks, or I

should say episode 10 of Music Talks, because

hopefully by the time this is out, people would

have heard my episode, would have heard the other

episode of GeekCast Radio, yada yada yada. In

episode 10 with Chris Bloom, and in other episodes

of Music Talks, you've said that there's Music

for everyone, there's always new music, whether

it's from the 50s and 60s or now, somebody is

always experiencing new music to them. So what

kind of feelings are we going to have in the

next decade? What kind of music is going to emerge

in the next decade? Are we going to see a revival

of full -on reggae on radio? Probably not, but

you know. Like, what's going to happen? That's

a great question. That's a great question. Because

none of us know what's going to happen, but what

could happen? And from there, again, the Family

Tree, the latest LP from last year, it is the

third track, New Kind of Feeling. And, you know,

in the song they say, What did I get into? What

am I gonna do? She turned the ocean blue, but

damn it. She's perfect I've asked a thousand

times been asked a thousand wise. I got to keep

on trying cuz girl you're worth it and Then he

he goes on later to you know say I don't need

her He goes on a new kind of feeling for you

Feeling you want it. You can't have it. It's

perfect kind of healing. Yeah, all right So I

don't need a reason Don't need no reason. Yeah

for my new kind of feeling and I'm like Like

I just said what's gonna happen next year what's

gonna happen in the next decade Whatever feelings

that music produces from us or for us We don't

need a reason for it. We just know what we like

And I don't know what Blackstone Cherry is going

to do. We have something that we're proud of.

If you're not going the next step, or doing something

different every time, then for us there's no

reason to do it. So we absolutely pushed ourselves

to give you all the best record we could with

this album. And I hope y 'all love it, man. Well,

that was a blast from the past. How the hell

has it been two years since we recorded the blank

-charted version of Music Talks here on GeekCast

Radio? Hello and welcome to the 291st episode.

I am, of course, Steve Jo and Mike. Joining me

is Mr. Terry Smith from Music Talks Podcast.

Hello, sir. Hey, Mike. Great to be here. I get

excited when I hear you say 291st. Long may it

continue. Long may it continue. Yes, let's hope.

Today, tonight, whenever you are listening to

this, we are discovering the human condition

of Blackstone Cherry. Cherry, not Terry. Blackstone

Cherry. And I am also dedicating this one, and

I have to say it this way because of the government

and it's a story that I'll tell in a minute,

but I am dedicating to this the memory of my

lovely ex -wife, Karen Blanchard, who passed

away one month ago as of this recording. I miss

her every day and I love her more, most, infinity

and beyond. That's a whole thing that we did.

Today, we're going to be talking about Blackstone

Cherry's 2020 album, The Human Condition. The

story as to why I have to call Karen my ex -wife

is because on supplemental security income, you're

not supposed to have any money. You're not supposed

to be with anybody with any money. If your parents

who are supposed to be the people who are, you

know... Taking care of you if they die you get

their survivors benefits If you marry you no

longer get your parents survivors benefits because

your spouse is supposed to be the one Financially

taking care of you outside of supplemental security

income So in 2019 we had to get legally divorced

in order for me to get benefits again. Yay Don't

you just love the United States government folks?

Come on. Give them a hand Anyway Blackstone Cherry,

the human condition. What were your initial impressions

after listening to this the first time? I am

very surprised, Mike, and I'll tell you why.

Obviously, we did the Blanchard episode of Music

Talks a couple of years ago. I listened to the

band, listened to the tracks and thought, yeah,

it's not my sort of thing, but it's okay. and

I looked at a couple of reviews and one of them

categorized Blackstone Cherry as Southern Swamp

Metal and I thought I've got over 3 ,000 albums

in my library, I've got almost 40 ,000 tracks

and I don't think there's many that would get

categorized as Southern Swamp Metal. So back

to, hey, what they do, they do well, but it's

not my thing. I've actually really enjoyed the

album, really enjoyed it. It seems to me it's

a bit, and apparently they recorded it in a different

way. I think it's a bit smoother and more polished

than previous stuff. And I'm keen to hear what

you as a longtime fan think. Well, I've ordered

the vinyl today, Mike, so let's put it that way.

And by the way, of course, the vinyl only has

13 tracks on, which is the way it should be.

Yes. No, no, no. So we'll talk about that later.

Yes. Yes. Today we are going through the deluxe

edition, which they released digitally this year

in 2021, but in 2020 they released 13 tracks.

The deluxe edition has 19 tracks on it. And the

only reason why we are talking about the deluxe

edition version is because it has their cover

of Tracy Chapman's. Give me one reason. It has

two versions. Of that cover. The other tracks

that are on there are live versions of again,

ringing in my head ride and something else. And

I have to say this, and I think I've said this

to you before on other recordings that we've

done together. I am not a fan of listening to

live tracks. On a, on an LP on a set on a CD

on a, on a whatever. I'm just not. A fan of it

because it doesn't sound, it doesn't sound like

the product should sound. It's different if you're

sitting in the front row and Chris Robertson

is singing his heart out to you. And that's fine.

But on a album, it just feels weird. So that's

why we're not talking about the live tracks.

We're only talking about. The two versions of

the give me a one reason cover so coming up is

the the let's kick this album off with that amazing

opener ringing in my head will be back after

this. All right, folks. What a... This band just

knows how to kick off an album between this album

and the last full LP they did, Family Tree. That

one kicked off with Bad Habit. This one kicks

off with Ringing in My Head. Holy crap. Yep.

No, I agree. I agree. I mean, my view, Mike,

is that I think... And I think track running

order is always very important to me. and what

i like about the 13 tracks is that you know it

feels like an album i think they do a great job

on the running order but the opening track i

mean you said amazing opener it is you know but

for me it should be a statement of intent it

should be a manifesto and absolutely but you

also get this thing that uh because apparently

they recorded the album just before lockdown

you know uh given everything that's happened

in the last almost two years then An opening

track that starts with, people, people, your

attention, please. I need to tell you about a

new disease. Now, apparently it was an old song,

but yeah, that's a bit, a bit prescient, I think

is the word. So, but a great way to start. Fantastic

opening track. That's the interesting thing about

this album. If you look through some of their,

cause what I love about Blackstone Cherry besides

the music and besides what they do with songs

is that when they do promotion and when they

do videos and when they do this, that, and the

other thing, most of their albums, not all of

them, but I would say I think since Family Tree,

maybe, I don't know, since the 2018 album, they

do track by track commentaries where these videos

on YouTube and they give you, you know, little

snippets of whatever. And, you know, this album,

they wanted to take new ideas, completely new,

never done before, never whatever. Like, obviously

you write brand new songs for a brand new album.

But also they took ideas from older songs and

then mashed them up to make a whole new song

kind of thing or whatever. And with ringing in

my head, like you said, that opening line. That's

just, I mean, it's like they're Alanis Morissette

of the Southern rock genre, because seriously,

that was so ironic when this album was released.

And it's just, I love the melody. I love the

instrumental. The backbeat instrumental on the

beginning of this, if I could just have that

on loop in my apartment all the time, I would

just. Absolutely be jamming out the whole time

because I love it. No, I agree. I agree. Great

stuff. Great stuff. Great stuff. All right. Moving

on to track two. This is again. We'll be back

after this. Alright folks this song is rising

like the phoenix this song is man You want to

talk about poignant considering what's going

on in my life or what has been going on in my

life, it's like Wow Yeah Again the beat the music

the the whole instrumental to this is so cool

to me And the lyrics of it again, it's just the.

That's one thing about this band is they try

their best to write the most interesting positivity

type songs. Yeah. I mean, I was, I was surprised

Mike and, and clearly I've listened to this more

closely than I listened to the stuff, you know,

when we did that first episode. One of the many

things that surprised me was lyrically how strong

it was and we'll touch about this later but also,

you know, there's There's a lot of vulnerability

in there. They talk about some really challenging

issues, you know, again, it wasn't sort of what

I expected From a what did I call? What were

they a southern swamp metal? You know, I think

lyrically it's really the other thing I wrote

on this track on my notes and it came up I guess

through the whole arm, but there's some standard

I don't know who the drummer is, but God, he's

good. I mean, the drumming on this is fab, but

there's numerous tracks where you just sit there

and think, wow. I mean, the band, but the drumming

isn't something that I normally pick up on, but

it really hit me listening to this. The drummer

for Blackstone Cherry is a guy called John Fred

Young. His father is one of the Kentucky headhunters.

What's a Kentucky headhunter? Really? With all

of your music knowledge, so the Kentucky headhunters

are and were, were and are, think of Blackstone

Cherry, but think of solely setting them in the

sixties and seventies. Like that sixties and

seventies rock sound kind of thing with a little,

like that's like he's. That's where john fred

young comes from this is i believe it's his dad

that's in the kentucky head hunters so what they

are and all with a musician so they were a band.

Of course now we're both gonna have to hear how

they did the ballad of davey crockett of her

the last one grammys. Yep. And brothers Richard

Young and Fred Young drums and vocals. Yep. Wow.

Yeah. Fred Young is John Fred Young's father,

I believe. Yeah, but John Fred, man, he is one

of the best drummers today. Well, apparently

the Kentucky Headhunters are still going. Yep.

They released a new album this year. That's a

fact, Jack. Wow, well, I will go back and expand

my musical knowledge to the Kentucky head and

just thank you I love my links. So the highest

-peaking song is a cover of Oh Lonesome Me by

Don Gibson, which Neil Young covered on after

the gold rush. So there you go Now, how can we

get Neil Young to Bruce Springsteen? That's the

biggest question. I'll find a way. I'll find

a way. I'm sure you will. But yes, again, this

was the first single. I just love when first

singles do something like this. Yeah, my comment

was the first single and you can see why. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. And one of the biggest parts of

this song, one of the biggest lyrics in here

that really speak more to me now than ever before.

You're lost and so confused from a choice you

couldn't choose. I know just how it feels. Cause

I felt the same way too. Now, not everybody knows

the same way that I'm feeling, but considering,

you know, what this song is and how it's done

and yeah, it's just so good. Alright folks, let's

hop into the medicine bottle because it's time

to push down and turn. Up next, track three is

Push Down and Turn. This, again, because I've

watched the track by track commentary, lead singer

Chris Robinson has always been a vocal person

about men's health and men's mental health and

things like that. And he was just taking the

medication that he had to take after something

that happened to him. and he just took a picture

of the top of the bottle where it says push down

and turn. Yeah, he's bipolar apparently, isn't

he? Yeah, I think so. Yeah. But I mean, I guess

that goes back to my thing about lyrically. I

think this is a really strong song and it wasn't

a subject I expected to come up and I think Stephen

Sondheim passed away. a week ago, and I watched

a documentary of him, and he was saying that

when Cole Porter wrote a song, he always came

up with the title, and then he basically used

the title to work out the melody from just the

words in the title. And I think Push Down and

Turn is probably one of my favorite song titles

of the year, I have to say. It's just so clever.

And it paints that picture. Yeah. And the song,

is it like, it may sound, when people listen

to this song, it may sound like... It's a addictive

thing. It may sound like it's an addictive drug

thing. It isn't it's talking he's talking about

having to You know, it's okay that you have to

take pills. It's okay that you know It's it says

here in one of the verses. I'm glad I called

you What can I I'm glad that I called you what

can I offer push down and turn forward reverse

once my mouth two times a day See you next month.

Same time same place. Well Most people get their

medications maybe two or three months at a time

kind of thing. And it's just one of those things

where if you're on meds because of pain, because

of bipolar, because of whatever it is, if the

medication helps you, if the medication unclogs

the fog in your brain or if the medication, you

know, it's okay to take meds. You don't just

not have, you know what I mean? Yeah, it's interesting

see this is and this is why I love music and

lyrics because I For me there's you can read

it two ways. You can read it that way and I totally

support your your Message of you know, it's okay

to take meds It's one of my standard lines to

myself and to other people is it's okay to not

be okay But also I think there's another when

I when I listen to John there was an element

of yeah, but There's other things than meds as

well, sometimes. There is, yes. Is it just being

prescribed thoughtlessly or is it being described

actually very thoughtfully and as you say, hey,

this is what you need at this point in time.

You can take it either way. That's smart song

writing to me. Yeah, absolutely. It's one of

those things where, yes, you're right. Prescription

drugs can be abused just like Other drugs can

be as well, but the thing of it is is I think

this song is is saying that. It's okay for you

to need the help up so that the that the actual

medicine medication, whatever is going to give

you. Like I probably wouldn't be sitting right

here right now if I didn't take my pain pills,

I'd probably be better than I'd have you recording

this over zoom or something because. I almost

couldn't get up this morning kind of thing because

of my lower back pain. You asked me how I was

going to get to Springsteen. The answer is he's

been on antidepressants for over 30 years. You

read his book and it says when it starts getting

dark, basically, Patty gets hold of him and says,

take your meds. I absolutely agree with him.

And not to take away from the seriousness of

that, but you say, when it's getting dark, I'm

like, you start dancing, duh, dancing in the

dark. Oh, very good. Your future as a standup

comedian is assured, Mr. Blanchard. No, no, no.

That is very good. Not at all. Not at all. Just

start dancing when it gets dark. Oh god. Alright,

up next we are going to learn how it is and how

it comes to be when angels learn to fly. And

I promise, folks, I will try my best not to cry

on this show. Alright when angels learn to fly

this is the fourth track When I first heard this

song when the album first came out in 2020 I

Just felt like it was another song for me to

remember my mom by Yeah, right in the last month.

It's become so much fucking more than that because

as much as Karen did for me I did for her the

whole point of being in a relationship being

married whatever you want to call it however

you want to label it the whole point is you're

there for each other no matter what like if if

somebody can't if one person in the relationship

can't pick up the slack the other person tries

their best it's a it's a give -and -take thing

and Back and when we met she was a superwoman

and basically packed up my whole apartment at

the time when i moved to chicago like i physically

could not do i physically could not do it at

all and as she got she started to get sick and.

You know it is what it is she had liver disease.

Because of drinking and it wasn't like she was

like I said do you offer like I've said another

podcast recently. Karen was not a drinker to

drink she wasn't going out there you know dancing

topless on the bar or she wasn't going out there

with you know. Chicago bear colors painted on

her face screaming at the top of her lungs because

the bears lost again because that's the bears

do. You know what I mean? It was just one of

those things where she would have one or two

drinks a night, maybe a few more, but she was

always responsible about it. I'm not trying to

make excuses for my wife who is no longer here.

I'm just saying that's how it was. Then she just

couldn't. You wake up you go to work you go do

all this stuff and your brains going and going

and going when you get home You have some dinner

you watch some TV. You're hoping your brain will

quiet down her brain never shut up Hmm. So in

the end, you know last couple of years she would

use vodka and said diet seven up to to go to

sleep because Every pill you as soon as you put

a pill in that woman's mouth as soon as soon

as she swallowed any kind of medication She would

immediately have a tolerance to it like in no

time so no like no 600 ibuprofen's worked no

None of the actual pain medications were working

outside of say oxy and It got worse and worse

and worse and by the time we moved out here to

Washington State and all of that just Everything

just started declining and declining and declining,

and I knew the exact point when my wife was no

longer there. Besides the fact of her body shutting

down and her system shutting down and the whole

physical, the fact that she's dying. When Karen

refused or said she didn't care about watching

Jeopardy, I knew she was gone. because this is

a woman whose dream was it to eventually be on

Jeopardy one day. She would answer, and the sad

thing is she didn't do it correctly, but it is

what it is. When we met, I have been watching

Jeopardy since I was five years old. Used to

watch it with my grandmother, used to watch it

with my mom, whatever. We always followed the

rules. So if Alex gives you an answer, you...

As the watcher, answer it the same way the contestants

that you have to, you know, what is, you know,

this is the best music podcast in the UK. What

is music talks podcast? That's, that's just what

it is. You know, you have to do that. She would

always just give the answer and I'm like, you're

doing it wrong. I'm sorry, but you're doing it

wrong because they would, they would penalize

you for that. If you were on the show. And we

argued back and forth about that all the time,

but yeah, as soon as, as soon as she stopped

caring about Jeopardy, I knew my wife was gone.

So this song, getting back to the song when angels

learned to fly. Between the lines, stop right

there. I just need a second of your time. And

then part of the breakdown, I'm going to call

it the breakdown chorus. I've been hopeless and

broken since you've been gone away. or since

you've gone away. Like those two lines is just,

I want one more second with her. And it just

doesn't. When you find someone who you think

is supposed to be with you for the rest of your

life until you both, you know, you ever seen

Bicentennial Man with Robin Williams? Yes. Okay

at the end when they're both in the bed and she

has the nurse lady galatea she has the. Portia

whatever name or whatever the character's name

is basically the wife has has the nurse go ahead

and turn the husband's thing off because he's

already gone you know they're laying there together.

You know. That's how you're supposed to, you

know, you think of Phenomenon in 1996 with Travolta

and Sedgwick and whatever. And, you know, they

have the scene where they're in bed and John

Travolta's character is like, it's time. And

she's just crying. You know what I mean? That's

how married people, that's how people who are

in love, that's how they're supposed to die.

They're not supposed to die in a hospice. One

died before the other. The whole point of being

together is you do stuff together. Well, that's,

that's, and, you know, obviously there's your

situation, Mike, and then there's been COVID

for 20 months is that too many people have had

that experience of this is not the way it's supposed

to be. And it's, it's something that's ingrained

in us. Um, I mean, I was actually talking about

it last week. It was an article I read and then

I posted some people, um, But you know, I lost

my brother, what, 10 years ago now, just over

10 years. And it was cancer and we knew he was

dying. But we spent, you know, last few days

with him at the hospital. And when he went, there

was his wife, his kids and myself and Laura.

And it was clearly very sad, but there was a,

it might sound perverse, there was almost a beauty

about it, you know. And I feel absolutely feel

for you and everybody else who's been denied

that because it's part of the grieving process.

Yeah. COVID didn't do us any favors. I mean,

thankfully neither one of us have ever gotten

that kind of thing, but the whole thing because

of COVID and I don't give a shit what anyone

says. We are not out of the woods. We are still

in... People will say stuff like, oh, last year

when COVID happened, it didn't just happen, it's

still fucking happening. Well, there was an article

yesterday in The Guardian basically saying from

one of the senior medics in the UK saying this

is the start, not the end. Yeah, absolutely.

It's not going away. It hasn't gone away. It

won't go away. So basically, because of the initial

Start up of covid last year and the whole travel

ban and the whole this and the whole that that

was that traveling was karen's thing. And the

whole point in me helping her realize her dream

is even though i talk some sense into her because.

I have cerebral palsy. I don't drive. If I am

on the Oregon coast on a beach with nothing else

around and an ambulance is going to take 30 minutes

to get to me and I'm like choking on saltwater,

yeah, no, we need to live somewhere where an

ambulance can get to us fairly quickly kind of

thing. So we settled in downtown Vancouver, Washington,

and that's where I am still currently. I don't

know how long I'll be here or whatever, but again,

the whole point of coming out here was because

instead of a three -hour flight from Chicago

and a three -hour drive, she was only a three

-hour drive away from the coast, except in the

beginning of the year last year, you weren't

supposed to go anywhere. You were supposed to

stay at your house, at your apartment, at your

teepee, at your whatever, whatever you live in,

stay in place, shelter in place. If that hadn't

happened, we would have gotten to the coast.

We would have gone down there. We would have

done some sites. We would have done all these

things and it just, it just never happened. And

then she started getting really sick and you

know, it just wasn't, wasn't happening anymore.

And now I have, and I hate, absolutely hate this

term. I have to now face a new normal of number

one or not being here and number two, figuring

the shed out on my own because I might as well

go build a teepee on the beach with the prices

in this state. And I know, you know, I mean,

you guys had a house in Seattle or whatever,

but I apartment prices. Oh God. Oh, it's stupid.

I mean, the property price is more than doubled

in the seven years we were there. It was just

stupid. Yeah, that's crazy. So anyway, Blackstone

Cherry, when angels learn to fly, it takes on

a whole, whole new meaning for me now. And it

just, it's just such a good song. Yeah, I mean,

I mean, obviously, Mike, when I listen to it,

and it's one of the, there's a few on here that

had a different meaning, given I knew I was one

recording. this with you and to what you've been

through recently. But, you know, this I think

this track and track six, in love with the pain,

you know, what I wrote down, and I actually mean

it as a compliment, you know, this is what we

used to call adult oriented rock. You know, those

two tracks, it's like, yeah, they could they

could be on the radio in the 80s or the 90s.

And it's You know, it's infectious. You've got

fantastic melody and hooks. I said before the

lyrics, you know, this song and, and in love

with pain is really vulnerable. And then you've

got those great sort of chiming choruses. So

what's not to like other than you might shed

a tear or three. Yeah. Oh, well in love with

the pain has a whole other. We'll get to that

one when we get to it. In between that, we have

Live This Way. oh boy this song let's see great

beat great instrumentals but the lyrics on this

are just haunting because this song is a pretty

hard song to start and when he gets to the chorus

of leaves are changing time is wasting sorry

if this comes out wrong i'm tired of waiting

anticipating can't believe we've been this long

Life is way too short to live this way. Like

the way he sings that is like Holy crap again

these guys they did not know no one Okay, maybe

some scientists knew kovat. What whatever I'm

not getting into that not getting into that But

I'm just saying these guys these musicians these

people who want to give their audience a great

album They didn't know what was gonna happen.

They didn't know it and the way that this album

reads and the way it listens is that They have

put out I'm just gonna say it There's no other

album that could come out in the decade of the

2020s. That is gonna be more meaningful and more

life realistic than this Because they pulled

stuff in these songs like this one You know again

For every lie you you tell seems a thousand tears

have fell in my state of mind. I'm trying to

find my way back from hell Hello, we're all trying

to find our way back from hell I mean fantastic

observation Mike and you're spot on but also

for me what it says is this which is and I have

done a lot of this over the years you know that

you sit down and you look at lyrics and you analyze

them and what are they saying and that and the

reality is they're always going to be filtered

through the individual circumstances and when

something like Covid happens that is genuinely

global you know it's gonna it's just gonna put

a whole new lens on it and yeah you know for

me it's it's irrelevant whether they knew or

not or they were right you know in 2021 you can't

hear those lyrics or the lyrics on the opening

track without thinking of what everyone's been

through and that's the power of music and art

i think you know is it is it Helps us filter

and make sense of all the shit that's going on

basically And I have to have to trot out my favorite

didn't story when you know the whole thing of

What you know is lyrics and what were they about

and there was the famous playboy when playboy

actually? half attempting to actually be a magazine

as well in the 60s. And he's doing the Playboy

interview and the guy says, you know, people

really want to know what your songs are about,

but you're very mysterious. And he said, no,

I'm happy to tell you what they're about. And

the guy was like, wow, I'm going to get the biggest

scoop ever. He says, really? He said, yeah. He

said, well, what are your songs about, Bob? And

he said, some are about three minutes long, some

are about five minutes long, and some are about

11 minutes long. That's definitely Dylan. but

a great song and more great lyrics. I just wrote

down a hard rocking and great riff. It's powerful

stuff. Yeah, it is very powerful stuff. Then

we cannot talk about this song and not talk about

that ending because that ending, that ending

yell, that is John Fred Young. That was the drummer.

Okay. Okay. Yeah. I love that. I love those touches.

Yeah. So good. So good. All right. Moving on

to the next track. We have in love with the pain

up next. I don't know if I don't know how much

of the stuff I sent you you actually looked at

but they did a video for this and They filmed

it in New England Right. I didn't say that Yeah

they all have to send it to you they filmed it

in new england they filmed it at ducksberry beach

in massachusetts and i'm just like again before

karen passed i was like oh this kind of reminds

me of another time in massachusetts when i was

living there back twenty years ago at the time.

And then obviously karen passes i watch it again

and. So far in at the time, because as of this

recording, December 6th, 2021 would have been

the four year anniversary of when we got married.

So we had gone to see some of her family several

times. We'd visited with them, whatever, whatever,

whatever. Well, because most of my family are

good. I want to say 85 % of them on my mom's

side still live in Massachusetts. that was going

to be the next big, when we could obviously get

back to traveling, get back, you know, obviously

this was like, you know, end of 2019, 2021. I'm

like, okay, we've seen your family. Not that

I don't want to see them again, but we've seen

your family. Time to travel. We have to figure

out how to get to Massachusetts. And we never

did, obviously. And I look at this song and I

watch this video and I'm like, I will never have

my wife. Myself sitting on Duxbury Beach or situate,

you know situate Beach or whatever and it's just

so good You know The lyrics in this the the melody

the just everything No, I totally agree with

you and that's obviously I don't have that connection

that context but I mean, I think when angels

learn to fly and end up with pain, probably two

of my top three songs on the album. Yeah, absolutely.

You know, and just, you know, this along with

when angels learn to fly, you know, just that

opening chorus, that Those those opening lines

just I Don't know see the sad thing is the okay,

so the the song opens with I saw your silhouette

standing by the window I read the note you left

that said we'd be fine I'm losing sleep turning

turning everywhere the wind blows but tomorrow

looks as bright as your eyes Well, I love that

sentiment. I am sorry tomorrow is as black as

coal for me Right now, right now in this moment

because she's not here anymore. Like it just.

Hey, I don't know, but I still love this song.

I still can't like, I still can't not listen

to this song because it's such a good song. And

that for me, Mike is one of the things, you know,

we talked before we pressed record about and.

I realize at the moment you'll be getting lots

of well -meaning people like me saying things

to you that will sound like platitudes, but the

fact that you've still got that spark, you still,

painful though it is, want to listen to this

and other tracks that remind you, Karen, that's

why the phrase, this will pass, I passionately

believe in, because it will, but I also think

it's really important for everyone. trying to

help and support you and for yourself to just

recognize that yeah at the moment it looks black

and don't let's not pretend it's anything else

than that but it will get better it will get

better and this is clearly a band but sing about

some tough things but always have that current

of optimism underneath. Yeah, I think I've said

this to you off air a few times, and I've said

this, I've probably said this on social media

and whatever, and I've probably said it in the

Cherry Heads official Blackstone Cherry group

on Facebook, which is a really great place to

be. Blackstone Cherry, at least so far, the band

can do no wrong in my eyes, and they are essentially

my version of the Grateful Dead. I only got to

see them once, and luckily, thankfully, it was

at a time when I was with Karen, so we were there.

This was at the time when they were doing the

Family Tree. Family Tree was just coming out,

the Family Tree album. It hadn't even come out

yet. This was March 29th of 2018. And, uh, you

know, we went and saw them and they, they were

like, yeah, we're going to do a couple of new

songs off the new album. Like you guys get to

hear them first. And I'm like, oh, cool. So great.

So awesome. And I have this picture of the two

of us, uh, with the stage kind of in the background

kind of thing and, and, and whatever, but yeah,

basically. As long as they come to this, as long

as they come to Vancouver, Portland, whatever,

hell, even if they go up to Seattle, I'll find

a way. I'll find a way to thumb to Seattle. It's

only three hours. Of course, if Terry and Laura

were still here, I could, you know, just get

on the zipline. Yeah, no, I know. I know. Um,

but in love with the pain, it's a great song

with great lyrics and great music and. You know,

it's going to make another analogy here and I

don't know how the hell we could tie this to

Bruce, but. The chorus I'm in love with the pain

addicted to your flame. Yeah, I can't get enough

I want to feel your burn turn me upside down

and turn me inside out leave me cold as rain

I'm in love with the pain and love with the pain

The thing I hear in that and it's so silly. I

hear Palmer's addicted to love Serious fuck -me

-eyes coming over here. Science -o -nation -o

-roman's coming in right beyond! And you may

not be able to find a way to Bruce, but I have,

because just going back to This Will Pass, I

was just thinking and the fact that, you know,

Blackstone Cherry have that thing of optimism.

So if you listen to Nebraska, which is, yeah,

it's a depressing album, you know, not a lot

of good happens to the characters in Nebraska.

But the final song on Nebraska is. Reason to

believe and it has four verses in it that talk

about all sorts of tragic stuff But the chorus

is struck me kind of funny seem kind of funny

sir to me at the end of every hard -earned day

People find some reason to believe and that's

how the album finishes Yeah, so, you know 38

minutes of misery and then there's just like

the limer of hope at the end I mean, I know certain

artists have duds, but wow, that's a ringing

endorsement for a dud of an album with, hey,

38 minutes, and then it ends gracefully. It's

his masterwork. It's his masterwork. It's brilliant.

It's absolutely brilliant. But that's a different

episode. That's a different episode. Yes, that's

a whole other podcast. Up next is The Chain.

I remember when when the when the track listing

got announced and they didn't really define like

you know how sometimes track listings on websites

or wherever it'll denote oh it's a cover or oh

it's this or oh it's that or oh you thought it

was the Fleetwood Mac song didn't you? Yep! So

did I! And you know what? I know they do covers.

That'll be the cover. Yeah, that was my thought

too. And then I was like, you know what? That

would be fucking awesome if they did do that.

But we have this song that is a story all on

its own. Oh boy, and this is another one of their

hard -hitting, and that's the thing, you know,

we talked about sequencing and things like that

on this album. Between all of these tracks, you

know, In Love With the Pain is a very much a,

it's a, it's a more melodic, soft track, whereas

it's sandwiched between Live This Way and The

Chain, which are basically two barn -stompers.

Uh, cause holy crap, the chain, man, it just.

Would you know what dinner? I mean, it's funny

you saying that you picked up Fleetwood Mac as

well. Cause, um, so obviously it's not the Fleetwood

Mac song, but, um, this, this to me said grunge.

And I mean, this is a compliment and sound garden.

Oh, yes. It reminded me of it was like, yeah.

I mean, really, it was one of those. Now that

I would like to hear live. Yeah. Um, great so

yeah, it's just It's just so good and It's a

story song. It isn't like all of their songs

tell a story, but literally this is you know

You know the first lyrics in here One in the

chamber, five on the ground. Now another is dead.

That's six gun sound. Pow. You heard just what

I said. I ain't going to repeat it. God is my

witness. We got to learn how to fight for one

another to be a better brother. Like that's start.

That's the start of a whole story. And again,

these guys, these guys are just so good. The

second verse right now it's time to stand out

without religion to blame we're all one of the

same like all of all you can't control until

we all make a change we are just links in the

chain. And if that isn't anything that is like

that that's not just because these are covid

times like we all need to make that change literally

that's my entire life i've met someone or i've.

you know, been friends with someone or whatever

who is going down a path of, Oh crap, you need

to change your, you know, you need to figure

out something or else you're just going to be

a link in the chain or again, stand, you know,

wanting to stand out, being different. Like I

am not, I am unlike any other podcaster that

I know. Like I, I have my ways and I can, like,

you know, you have your format. your wonderful,

wonderful format and I can be a guest on your

show and go by your format and be fine and I

can come up with an idea for your show and if

you do it, great. If you don't do it, great.

You have your format that works and I think it's

great. I still think we need to do... I still

think... So, hey, you do it. If you do it, great.

If you don't, but let me remind you of the ones

you haven't. No, no, no. This is something, again,

it's not blank charting. It is blank charting

your format, but it isn't. It's not changing

the format. It's just changing what's in the

format. I had mentioned to you a couple of years

ago when we first started talking and started

whatever, doing all the stuff that we've done.

You take music talks and you apply it to music

technology. So let's just say the sixties and

seventies are record players and that kind of

thing. The eighties and nineties are CDs and

cassettes. Two thousands and beyond are digital

and MP3 and whatever. And you talk about each

of the music technologies throughout the decade.

Do you know, I've realized, Mike, that if you

were a Hollywood producer and the script writer

came in, it would go something like this, which

is, hey, I really like the script. And, you know,

we'd like to take it forward. There's just three

small changes I'd like to make, which are...

The beginning, the middle, and the end. No, no,

no, no, no. That's not, no. Come on. You know

that would be an interesting episode. I'm jesting

with you. The problem you would get into that

is that the CD actually came out in 1985. So

what would you put in the 90s? So there wasn't

really anything in the 90s, you see. Well, I

did think about it. I did think about it. And

cassettes, cassettes were really a seventies.

So that's, well, we've, we've learned the decades

before on music talks. I'm sure you can't even,

even you can't turn a decade into 20 years, 11,

maybe, but 20. Music technology changes every

20 years. There you go. So we've got the same

format, it's just that one uses 10 years and

the other uses 20. Sounds like beginning, middle

and end to me. You know I love your creativity

and I love your ideas. And maybe, who knows,

maybe one day, if I come up with an answer for

the 90s, I'll, yeah, actually think, go on, play

some music and I will. Yeah, we're gonna go on

a ride yeah, we're gonna go on a ride folks will

be back after this All right, folks, I have been

on a Harley Davidson at least once in my life

and I burned my leg because you should never

wear shorts on a motorcycle. I was seven, seven,

eight, nine or 10 years old. I forget what age

I was. There is a picture of me and my uncle

Patrick. He had this giant Harley and little

Mikey should not have worn shorts that day because

the muffler burned the side of my leg like you

would not believe. And the reason why I'm saying

all of that is because of the next track is called

ride. And to me, when I hear this track, it's

specifically a motorcycle out on the open road.

Yep. That's what it is. Yep. And, uh, I, um,

I get the same pictures and I think feel really

romantic about that. And the reality is I hate

motorbikes. I've probably been on one less than

10 times in my life and it just feels dangerous

and exposed and vulnerable and all of those things.

But there is a side of me that would love to

be able to, I've actually got friends who were

up, they've motorcycled all over the world. You

know, you get up into the Scottish Highlands

and some of those roads up there. And it's like,

I look and think you just want to get on a motorbike

and run. It's like, no. And I've never burnt

my leg, Mike. So I sure I sure the movie plays

in my head, too. I guess. Yeah, I don't have

any interest in any two wheeled vehicles at all.

I need at least four wheels under me. But, yeah.

I love the visuals. I love the sounds. I just

love everything about motorcycles, depending

on which ones they are kind of thing. And this

song reminds me of when they were doing the,

um, the big bike rally in Sturgis. They used

to do it. I don't know if they're still doing

it. Um, it's, uh, it's, I think it's, is it North

Dakota, South Dakota, whatever, wherever the

hell Sturgis is. they used to do this big bike

rally and all these bikes would come around.

There would be music, there would be whatever.

People think of Fast and the Furious except on

crotch rockets kind of thing. This song literally

is the Harley Davidson of this album because

that's what I hear in my head when I listen to

this song. I think that's a great image. Absolutely.

Alright folks, we're gonna find out if my heart

has wings up next. All right, folks, if my heart

had wings, like I said, this band, they just,

they just pull at like, you know, if your guitar

loses a string, you restring it, but it's, you

know, you always hear that twang when the string

pops out of the guitar. That's essentially, you

know, as they're singing this song, you know,

strings just popping right off your heart because

holy crap. Yeah, it's my it was my favorite track

on the album, I have to say. Yeah. I think everything

about it. And again, I mean, you got that fantastic

outside of the lyrics, you got that fantastic

guitar solo, but the drumming is just brilliant.

But is amazing. But yeah, you know, the the failed

relationship and all of that. So yeah, I think

they take every box on this one. Yeah. Yeah,

absolutely and The thing of it is with Karen

and I is we went in with it we went into it with

eyes open Like we each have our issues. We try

to help each other out with whatever the issues

are kind of thing and with this song, I don't

think either one of us ever had had to have the

moment of pride going dry, but I'm alone here

and my pride's gone dry, can't find a tear when

I want to cry, and it's really starting to feel

like goodbye, just like goodbye. I could not.

Everybody, the doctors and the nurses and everybody

at the hospice was like, oh, don't you want to

see her one last time or don't you? Like, the

last time I saw Karen, and this is not exactly

the image I wanted either, but the last time

I saw her. They got her up. They got her on the

stretcher and it was right outside the apartment

door and with us You know how you have hubby

and wifey like yeah, you know you shorten whatever

Well, she never liked hubby. It just didn't just

didn't sound right like wifey was fine that that

works whatever so For some odd reason, I don't

know what it was. I made a bumblebee joke and

I just started buzzing like a bee. So she would

call me Husby, H -U -S -B -Y, Husby. Cool. And

she on the stretcher, she looks at me and there's

just this vacant look in her eye and she said,

Husby, one last time. And it just, this song

is like, holy crap. Yes, I know technically this

is a breakup song kind of thing, but. It just

feels like goodbye. Again, these guys with their

sequencing because, holy crap, I was not expecting.

You talk about, oh, what's going to be the...

Because I was expecting a cover on this album.

I wasn't expecting it to be what it is, but I

was expecting it. And then you get electric light

orchestras. Don't bring me down. Right. It's

time for me to be contentious. Oh, so I'll tell

you what I've written. So I know they do covers.

Um, but I was actually yesterday with Stephen

having an interesting discussion about when you

should, you know, what makes a good cover. And

one of the things we agreed on is that, you know,

a cover should give you, it's not about being

better or worse, but it should give you a different

view on the song. It should add something. And

I'm afraid I've written here, surplus to requirements.

Now, I then put it in bold when I, and I know

I'm making that, when I heard the covers. give

me one reason I'm like why didn't they pull one

of them on the album because I mean it's a very

if if if you and I went to see them live and

they did don't bring me down I would love it

and it would make me smile and jump up and down

because I think live it'd be great fun but on

an album which up until now I think is brilliant

it's just like yeah it's them playing an ELO

song exactly the way ELO played it There you

go See I have a slightly opposite opinion because

I had like I it's been years since I've listened

to the yellow Original version I listened to

this and again the sequencing I you know it is

what it is, but I Can't see this album going

from my hard -head wings, and I actually tried

it from my heart, if my heart had wings to some

stories because the way that don't bring me down

ends the way that they Blackstone cherry it up.

I listened to the original and I'm just like,

I did not like the original compared to what

they did with it with Blackstone cherry. The

other thing, actually, I said they did it like

yellow. They didn't because of course, if you

listen to the original is he sings, don't bring

me down. Yeah, bring me down Bruce. Yeah I managed

to get him. Yeah, he actually wasn't singing

Bruce. It's just people assumed he was at the

time. He was yeah, so we will agree to disagree

on that I'm gonna sequence it and I haven't done

this yet with The second version of give me one

reason and see how that works. Okay. Yeah Yeah,

I'll have to try that. Alright folks, next up

we have some stories after this. Now I am fascinated

to get your take on the lyrics to this song.

Cause I am unsure so I'm keen to get your view.

Some stories. Might not be worth believing in

even if we do this song. I know that they had

said that they just wanted a song that just makes

sense, but doesn't make sense. And this to me,

and I don't think they do. I don't think BSC

does this a lot. This to me feels like a conspiracy

song. Like they're not trying to spew conspiracies.

They're more trying to figure out if the conspiracies

are actually. Good theories or not because the

lyrics in this Who boy? So the the thing here

some stories ain't worth repeating even if we

do if you believe everything they say well You

might be a fool. Well, I kind of agree with that

line Is it the original story or is it the conspiracy

theorists I mean because you can I mean and again

I said it before it it could be really clever

songwriting that says do you know what you can

actually read it both ways so that's why i said

i was i'm unsure because are they saying some

stories aren't worth repeating i .e all of the

this is my personal view all the stupid conspiracy

theories about did we land on the moon jfk might

be a different discussion um or are they saying

don't believe the shit you're given that You

know, we didn't land on the moon and somebody

else shot JFK, wasn't Lee Harvey Oswald? Don't

know. You know what? I just have fun with this

song and I wanted to explore more on the lyrics

and figure out exactly the answer to your question

and I don't really have an answer for it because

if we didn't land on the moon, then, you know.

uh if we had and i don't know it just as far

as who shot like i don't know it's it's a fun

song on this album it's it's one of those songs

that takes you uh you know how we've we've talked

about so far in this episode about how a lot

of these songs bring real life moments into context

or our irony of what's going on. This song is,

even though they mentioned specific real life

events, it's a fictionalized version. This is

going to be crazy. This to me is there we didn't

start the fire. It feels like... You know, because

I'm sure you've heard that song plenty of times,

how Billy Joel mentions all these things that

have happened in history and whatever and the

message behind that song. This song is more so

playing on the side of, well, did we or didn't

we? If we did or didn't, what should that answer

be? The listener has to figure that out. Sorry,

I haven't figured it out. And we end up back

at our own opinions, don't we? What we should

probably concentrate on is that actually the

line, there is a man wearing shark Armani, he'd

shake you down for troubadour money. That's a

great line. I love that. Whatever shark Armani

is. So that's um, yeah, that's I really don't

want to say this but Because I love this band

and now you're making me think Not that I think

this person wears our money because I don't know

if you have our money for 70 year old oranges,

but Like seriously, that's a billionaire to me.

There's a man wearing shark Armani like that

and he'd shake you down for the Troubadour money.

That's billionaire. That's companies. That's

Bezos. That's whatever. I don't know. I'm just

looking at shark Armani. Technically, he threw

himself from the top of the world. I mean, there

are higher points in the world than the Eiffel

Tower, but I can kind of see that. Beautiful

lyrics, Michael. Beautiful lyrics. Yep. And we

then get to the second to last track on the main

part of the album, which is The Devil in Your

Eyes after this. All right, folks, the devil

in your eyes. Oh, wow. This. I can't tell if

this is a breakup song or if this is a like a

fictional war. Like this feels like one of those.

You're in another universe type thing. What were

your thoughts on this one, Terry? I'm just going

to go and remind myself of the lyrics. Yeah,

I think it's the. This reminds me here you go

a Man who well in fairness these are allegations.

They've not yet been proven So let's give him

the benefit of the doubt for the moment, but

Ryan Adams not Bryan Adams, right and he does

One of his early songs is called come pick me

up Yep, I'm basically, you know, it's got this

car chorus of you'll steal all my records and

you'll screw all my friends and and people thought

it was this Obviously a song about some awful

relationship and he was angst -ridden and he'd

been hurt and all of this and I saw him interviewed

and somebody He said yeah, that's what people

think he said, but it's absolutely not the interview

is like, well, okay So what's the sucker back

and he said it's about that moment when you walk

into a bar and you see someone and you look at

them and you're attracted to them and you go,

I know you are going to be trouble, but that's

not going to stop me. And then the song is, yeah,

I know you're going to do all these awful things

to me, but so I think it's a similar thing. You

know, beautiful dancer Bamba, you are the cancer

running through my veins. A little bit of heaven

gone to waste. You know, so I think it's the

and I keep losing you is yet it's the. It's the

yin and yang of you're attractive, but there's

a dark side. Yeah, it's good. It's bad Good song,

but I mean the thing that got me was two things

one And again, this was a pleasant surprise on

the album is the amount of light and shade there

is you know, it's not all It's not one -dimensional

and particularly in this song and then that drumming

again and another fantastic chorus Yeah, the

chorus is just so good. Yeah, such a big, yeah.

Yeah, the way this song ends, I literally, as

I'm saying this, I've already ripped the segments

for the songs that you all have heard throughout

this entire podcast. I may have to go back and

re -rip - And re -do that one. And re -rip Devil

In Your Eyes, because I kind of want to have

it - be the the final lines of the song because

the way the song ends is like hmm laughing, Mike,

is it doesn't happen all the time, but the number

of times on Music Talks when I do the clips beforehand,

and then we do the interview, and then I go,

I need to go back and change that one. Yeah,

I'm with you. I'm with you on that. But yeah,

a great big finish, as you say. Absolutely. All

right, Terry, I'm going to steal your line and

push you on to the final track of the main part

of this album. And we'll be back after this.

All I have is time on my hands I ask the Lord

to give me something But on my knees it's hard

to make a step Alright folks, final track, and

the reason why I say final track is because give

me one reason and give me one reason the plug.

Those are essentially bonus tracks that we will

talk about in the outro because they are essentially

a cover of obviously Tracy Chapman's Give Me

One Reason, and we will obviously dedicate the

time to them that they deserve like we have in

the other ones, but basically... This is the

album finisher for Blackstone Cherries, The Human

Condition. Keep on keeping on. This song, when

they did the Family Tree Tour, they ended every

concert with the title song, Family Tree, because

that song is all about family and whatever else.

I'm not actually looking at it right now, but

that was their ender. Now, obviously, since they

released the human condition, I have not had

a chance to see Blackstone Chariot concert because

of COVID and because of everything else. However,

once the first the very first time I did my listen

through this album last year, I got to this song

and I'm like, yep, that's it. Every until they

release a new album with a song that is a better

concert ending song. Usually Blackstone Cherry

does maybe 10, 12 songs per show, sometimes a

few more. This needs to be the ender to every

one of their shows. This is what they need to

close it out with because you bring in their

positivity and the positive message and wow.

Interesting. I had initially a slightly different

experience because the devil in your eyes say

big finish. This came on. And, you know, as I

said at start, I do love album sequencing. So

they got bonus points for yet they're finishing

on the, you know, the hopeful note. And I was

driving at the time when I was listening, so

I wasn't like sat listening properly. Yeah, yeah.

And it was like, that's good. But it actually

feels a bit throw away compared to the rest of

the album and then i suddenly the second time

i listened to it i thought i've listened tried

to listen to it as you and thought what you're

going through at the moment yeah and then i looked

at the lyrics again and it just and you know

it's i guess one of the themes that have come

out of this is it sounded completely different

um and i'm i'm with you that i think that's It's

a great finish to the album. I hadn't thought

about live, but I think you're absolutely right,

Mike. That's one way you're bouncing up and down

and punching the air and singing. Well, not singing,

probably shouting at the top of your voice, because

I can't sing, but I can shout very loud. So yeah,

I absolutely agree. Yeah, it is definitely, especially

now looking back on things that have happened

in the last month or a few months or a couple

of years. I've asked several people, I've started

scheduling podcasts again and I've asked several

people, hey, what's best for you? I can make

anything work and blah, blah, blah. First two

lines, I'm the heir to absolutely nothing, all

I have is time on my hands. Like seriously, if

you had, and I'm not saying you do have, because

we're gonna wrap this up here soon, folks, but

if Terry had told me he had three hours plus,

We would be recording this and we would be recording

the music technology episode of Music Talks podcast

because seriously, you know, I would take up

all your like, oh, I have three hours with Terry

Smith. This idea, this idea, this idea, whether

you do it or not, here's all these ideas, come

back to them later and pull them out of a file.

But keep on keeping on is a message that You

know and and again, you know like like I mentioned

when we did our our original music talks Blackstone

cherry episode when I picked in my blood for

the 90s Yeah, which was the one that was the

the video was based across, you know the guy

coming home from the military and whatever else

and that song is basically about this has Feelings

of you know military to like one of the lines

all my brothers are fighting in the sand You

know Every day I fight another battle. I got

the scars to prove that I can heal and as the

world starts to unravel I hang on tight to anything

that's real like the world is still unraveling

folks, but we have to Keep on keeping on and

doing what we're doing and figuring out how to

do what we're doing in a way where it will affect

like podcasting I'm not going to sit here and

do a show where I'm yelling at the top of my

lungs or I'm cursing every other word, even though

I do curse and these are marked explicit and

whatever. The point is, is that if I want people

to continue to listen or start to listen to my

stuff, I have to put stuff out there that is,

you know, listenable, that is, you know, whatever.

And that is at the end of the day. Even though

I've got stuff going on, I still like, you know,

and I know the world keeps turning, but you know,

yeah, you know, you go back to when I told you

my, most of my life story on my episode of music

talks and you know, in that, I remember you saying,

you know, no matter what has happened to me,

I find this way. Like I have to, I, there's like,

what am I going to do? Like, yes. Do I have moments

where like, Okay, perfect example, and this is

not on this album, but on their 2016 album, which

I may have you go back to at some point, I know.

Cherry's not your thing, but I just love talking

about them with you because you have the other

side of my coin as far as differing opinion.

On the 2016 album, Kentucky, there's a song on

there called Long Ride where Chris wrote that

about his wife and about his grandfather. And

in that song, it's that album's version of when

angels learn to fly kind of thing. I'll send

that to you later. But sometimes I have music

playing when I'm in the shower and I needed something

and I just threw on Blackstone Cherry. This was

like a week or so ago. Broke down in the shower

and started crying because the first thing I

thought of was, you know, oh my God, Karen's

not here anymore. We're not on our long ride

anymore kind of thing. And, you know, you, but

you got to go back to keep on keeping on. And

the message of this song is, you know, when everything

that's good is gone, got to keep on keeping on

till I get where I belong. I got to keep on keeping

on when everything, you know, that, you know,

You just have to keep going because if you don't

keep going, like people, you know, we have this

phrase, you know, oh, how's it going? My answer

to that always is it's going. Sometimes I wish

it would stop, but it's going, you know. Well,

it's one of the things, isn't it, as well as,

you know, I've got a very good friend who works

sort of counseling and therapy. And one of the

things she talks about is Sometimes you have

to fake it. Actually you don't feel like doing

it and you're not doing it very well but just

at least trying gets you somewhere and suddenly

one day you'll stop faking it and it'll feel

more real. Clearly what you're going through

at the moment is a massive, massive challenge.

Yeah i'm now sixty four and i guess one of the

realizations for me particularly in the last

ten years i guess is is realizing that. Everybody's

broken to some extent you know i'm one that laura's

told me this is you know you you bump into people

during the day or you'll get anything what's

up with them and then you have no idea what's

going on in the life you know anything could

be happening and we're all. to a greater or lesser

extent. You're at the top of that scale at the

moment because of what happened with Karen, but

we're all struggling on a daily basis. I don't

see that as a gloomy, depressing view of life.

I actually find it, I feel refreshed by the ghost.

That's the reality and let's recognize and try

and just quietly help each other in any little

ways we can because we're all having to deal

with challenges and shit and all of that stuff.

Exactly and therefore you know the message of

just keep on keeping on is It's doesn't get all

you know reason to believe you find some reason

to believe yeah, absolutely and the thing of

it is is The album is called the human condition.

Yeah Every track on this album even ride because

ride is basically the the biker anthem even that

every track speaks or can speak to everybody's

way of life. That's another thing, Mike, which

has impressed me, I guess, about is that I think

as an album, as a coherent whole, it really works

well. This isn't, I mean, it's not a concept

album in that sense, but this isn't 13 songs

that have just been banged together. put on a

bit of vinyl and put on a streaming service.

To me, it feels like a very coherent whole and

I think they should be congratulated for that.

Which is why the additional six tracks on the

Deluxe Edition are necessary, of course. They

give me, they give me one reason covers. I actually,

well, let's, let's talk about that. Cause it,

give me your view. Cause I'll, I'll, and then

I'll, I'll give you mine. Okay, so when when

I saw when we saw them live in 2018 They ran

through like they had a section where they would

just do a jam and There is nobody In music right

now in the rock southern rock whatever, you know,

swamp rock, swamp metal, whatever you want to

call them. Where Blackstone Cherry sits to me

is there on top of the mountain. Chris Robertson's

voice can essentially do no wrong. And they in

that medley of things that the noodlings that

they did, they covered part of Foxy Lady. And

I really, oh yes, I have always wanted to hear

the between that and them covering black streets.

No diggity. I've always wanted actual released

album tracks of those. So I could, you know,

whatever, but cause again, hearing it live completely

different from hearing from in studio and the

give me one reason I was like, that makes sense.

That's, that's awesome. I love the main version,

track 14 off the Deluxe edition. And the plug

version I originally thought, which is track

19, I thought was like the demo at first. realized

oh it's it's not really a because demo to me

is like like Bruce just sitting there in the

back of his head born in the USA cover me they

you know take whatever lyric you want from from

what you know like you take the I love that it's

you that I get to do this with because you take

the instrumental that you can't get out of your

head from working on the highway. If you had

the demo working on the highway, you wouldn't

recognize it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Well,

that was intended to a Bruce podcast. Born in

the USA was a Delta Blues. It's completely, completely

different from what finally came out. Yeah. Um,

yeah. And, but that cover, man, that, that track

14. Oh, so that is your favorite of the two of

the, like, I like what they did with the plug.

I thought it was interesting, but I like it.

Like you look at, uh, don't bring me down and

they based to me after listening to the original

version again of don't bring me down and then

listening to Blackstone Cherries right after

it. I have this, this phrase that I use, they

Blackstone cherry did up. Like if you look at

their two bluesy peas that they did, uh, back

to blues volumes one and two, they take all those

songs that are classic songs that are amazing

songs, and they just put the Blackstone cherry

sweet spot on it. That to me is what they did

with the original, like the main version of give

me one reason with the plug. I feel like they

decided to. Over 9 ,000 it with the Blackstone

cherry style, but I still like the more recognizable

version Yeah, I mean for me I agree with you

that my as a standalone track I prefer the first

the 14 and If I when I resequence it and I'll

let you know I actually think if I was to take

out don't bring me down I'm putting give me one

reason the plug version may work better, but

we'll find out when I make my playlist. But the

foot 14, I mean, and, you know, the Tracy Chapman

song, and I checked on my system and I've got

52 different versions of that song. I haven't

listened to the others yet, but I think they

do a great version of it. You know, it's a blues

at the end of the day, but they put this as they

used to say on X Factor, they make it their own.

It was nice to come out with a trite comment

at the end. Honestly, a great experience, Mike,

and one of the things I said on my best albums

of the year, I'm actually calling this year's

favorite albums of the year, because I've realized

having done it for 20 years is really arrogant.

Let me tell you what the best things are. These

are just my favorite. They're not perfect, but

I've listed. I talked about one of the Impacts

of this year with everything else that's going

on is. I don't feel that while i've listened

to a lot of music i don't think i've listened

deeply to a lot of music you know i'm sitting

down and reading this internet and looking at

lyrics so you know prepping for this is actually

been a real joy. The two reasons one was you

know candidly i didn't expect to like the album

anywhere near as much as i have said thank you.

And secondly, it was great to just, you know,

really listen and look at lyrics and play stuff

again. So, yeah, it's been an absolute joy. Absolutely.

Absolutely. And you were about to release your

60th episode, I think, right? Well, it won't

because the next two episodes this month will

be... favorite albums of the year and I've done

it with Stephen Routledge who I met in the podcast

so it's going to be a two -parter where in the

first one we have our top ten albums each so

we run through ten till five and then part two

which that'll be out on the 16th of December

and then part two will be out on the 30th of

December which is nice timing just before the

end of the year and then episode 60 will be out

second week of January. So it's not 219 Mike,

but I never expected to get anywhere near 60.

So it's a joy Yeah, and it looks like it's gonna

continue. I mean those people keep getting in

touch saying they want to be on the show, which

is great Yeah, absolutely I still think you should

label those 60 part one and part two and then

start the new year out with 61 That way you don't

lose your number sequencing already Yeah, specials.

In previous, I've never counted them as episodes,

so I'm only retentive on that stuff. All right,

folks, that's going to do it for us here on GeekCast

Radio. Coming up next, we've got my buddy Christopher

Morton. He's going to stop by and he's going

to give us a recap of Emerald City Comic Con

this year for 2021 because he did attend the

convention here in Seattle or at least three

hours north of me in in Seattle, Washington.

Thank you for listening to us here on Geocast

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Smith? Thank you for listening, until next time!