A Better World, Eclipsed, and The Terror Beyond

Secret Origins Podcast, Episode 9. Hello, and

welcome to Episode 9 of the Secret Origins Podcast.

I am your host, DFJ and Mike, and joining me

is Lupus Conroy. Hello, sir. Hello, sir. How

are you doing? Pretty good. I'd just like to

let everybody know, I don't know if the thunder

and lightning is coming through the microphone.

If it is, I'm very sorry. We're having storms

here in Louisville, Kentucky right now. And,

yeah, I know we should unplug computers and all

that stuff, but we need to get this episode recorded.

So, anyway, if that comes through the microphone,

hopefully it'll be big and ominous and, you know,

since we are talking about three stories from

Justice League today, we will be talking about

A Better World, Eclipsed, and The Terror Beyond,

and I guess, yeah, that's pretty much it. As

far as me, I think this is the first podcast

I've been able to record where I can actually

report good news. Since the last time I reported

on this, I thought I was going to be homeless.

I've worked on a situation with Boys Haven, as

far as that goes, so I will not be homeless.

I will still be able to... Stay in this exact

same apartment. I'm not moving. And yeah, I will

be getting my finances in order in the next couple

of months. And yeah, I should be set to go. Unfortunately,

I can't go to BotCon. And as much as I try to

figure it out, there's no way I can go to TFCon.

I was really planning on going. I may still order

the non -attendee package, though. I don't know

yet. It just depends on what June's finances

are like. You said off -air you don't have anything

to report. And two weeks ago you said you would

have something to report. I really don't. Don't

you have a certain fake Green Lantern toy? Oh,

nothing fake. Nothing fake. Worst Green Lantern

ever. Oh, ouch. Ouch. That's not true. There

was Nort. Nort didn't do anything. He was just

a dog. But yeah, I did manage to get the DC Direct

Green Lantern Wave 2 Guy Gardner, finally. Oh,

cool. Yep, he looks pretty badass. He's a little

miscolored, but I can look past that and grab

a Sharpie. But yeah, he looks awesome. I'm glad

I have him, finally. And I'm waiting on something

else that ties into that. But that's still on

the boat. Uh -huh. Yes, I'll actually, over the

next two months, I'll be waiting on... Actually,

I'm going to use Big Bad Toy Store's pile of

loot for this, but I will be waiting on a few

pre -orders to get released finally. The Crystal

set of Optimus and Rodimus, regular Rodimus,

and War for Cybertron, Optimus, and Soundwave.

So I'm just going to do that in one big giant

schlomp as far as shipping goes. Yes, I used

the word schlump. I don't even know if it is

a word. It is now. Yeah, it is now. Also, I want

to bring up, you can go over to our UK affiliate.

They're our partners in podcasting crime, blogomatic3000

.com. Phil Wheat does an excellent job with that.

He gives regular weekly updates of what podcasts

we have released over here at Geekcast Radio.

He also does various articles about... It's just

like every other geek news site except it's done

in the UK. Sometimes he has stories before Geek

Tyrant does and whatever else. But very, very

cool. He did a really awesome... I think I might

have already mentioned this. I don't know if

I mentioned it on this show, but I think I already

mentioned this. He did a very good job. on the

Iron Man 2 review that he did. So yeah, head

on over to blogomatic3000 .com. Very cool. Anything

else to report from your end? My significant

other did open processor surgery, and that's

pretty much it with the computer. I did get a

new microphone, so hopefully my audio quality

will be a lot better. It's not so much cracking

and breaking and loose wires anymore. Well, that's

always good. As opposed to when we try to plug

it in and it melts down Skype and the computer

and everything else. Oh, boy. This episode is

going to be a little bit different as far as

the actual audio that you're going to hear from

the clips that I get. I'm not sure how I'm going

to do this yet. But I've grabbed a couple of

commentary clips from Bruce, Tim, and the crew.

And it's going to be mixed in somehow. I'm not

exactly sure where or when it will be. But, yeah,

I just wanted to let everybody know this episode

isn't going to be our normal one, two, three,

bam episode. So I think we're going to get into

some episodes. They couldn't see the beauty.

No imagination. They'd rather fight. Even this

wasn't enough for you, was it? You had to have

it all. Now we're on the brink of a war that

could destroy the whole planet. Could have been

so perfect. Paradise. And I let it get this far

because of the law. And the will of the people.

The people? This is all their fault. And they're

going to burn for it. Burn. You're nothing but

a mad dog now, aren't you? Ooh, a threat. But

this old dog still has a few teeth. There are

at least six different ways I can stop you right

now. But they all involve deadly force, don't

they? And you don't do that. No, you need me.

You wouldn't be much of a hero without a villain.

And you do love being a hero, don't you? The

cheering children, the swooning women. You love

it so much, it's made you my most reliable accomplice.

Accomplice? What are you... You could have crushed

me any time you wanted. And it wasn't the law

or the will of the people that stopped you. It

was your ego. Being a hero was too important

to you. You're as much responsible for this as

I am. So go ahead. Fix it somehow. Put me on

trial. Lock me up. But I'll beat it. And then

we'll start the whole thing all over again. I

did love being a hero. But if this is where it

leads, I'm done with it. Thanks. Do you smell

something? Hera. Well, it had to be done. Are

you okay? I'm great. A robot. I built mine to

take over for me when I had to be... Stan's laughing

at one of his own jokes. Yeah, all of Superman's

dialogue, the robot Superman's dialogue in this

scene is kind of a self -spoof of our corny dialogue

from season one. So almost everything the robot

Superman says is a direct quote of something

he had said in season one. Ah! Now, this is an

interesting scene, Batman versus Batman in the

Batcave. This is one of my favorite sequences.

Did Kevin do the script in order, or did he do

one Batman and then the other Batman? I don't

remember. I think he alternated. The voices are

pretty much the same. It's exactly the same.

Yeah, I mean, the characters aren't like, you

know, evil Batman isn't really all that evil,

so it really is the same guy. I do my best work

in the dark. Now, watch this. This is interesting.

This is an idea I had. that whenever one of these

guys is speaking, their back is to the camera

or they're in the shadows. So you never quite

know which one is talking. You have to really

pay attention to the dialogue to tell, you know,

okay, is that Justice Lord Batman talking or

is that our regular Batman talking? That's the

only time you actually see somebody's mouth move.

But the fact is, Batman talking to himself. That

was the idea. The idea was that it was psychological.

It was Batman arguing with himself. So that's

specifically why we did it that way. Which if

you had him arguing with himself... like sometimes

you guys did in the Batman the Animated Series,

it would have been corny, but this was an interesting

way to do it. Absolutely. I actually like the

heat of the argument. If you guys remember when

we were plotting the thing out, we were arguing

both sides of this with each other. Oh, this

whole season was one long argument. But specifically,

wasn't that where we were literally playing good

Batman and bad Batman, and somebody came up with

Justice Lord Batman's argument. Right. And I

said, well, you know what? Batman, he has no

answer to that. Justice Lords Batman wins. The

line about it where a kid never has to lose a

parent or something. Yeah, we were kind of play

acting it. It just kind of came out in the conversation

we were having back and forth. And then we all

stopped and were like, uh. That's it. We realized,

hey, you know what? That's our act break. It's

like, yeah, it's like, yeah, there's. Well, that

was the thing. We wanted to have Batman seemingly

go over to Justice Lord's Batman side to trick

him. And we figured that was a good way to...

That's a very believable argument. It's credible

that Batman would go over to his side by making

that argument. So that worked out really well.

But good Batman had an answer to that and held

it back. This was also one of the first shows

where we kind of changed our whole process where...

You know, the writers, Bruce and I, the story

editors sat in a room and just hashed it all

out. And all the things in the show kind of came

about from our conversations. Because there was

an original outline, and I think we just totally,

it's totally different from this. So, and I remember

all these, all the really cool bits in this came

about from us having these round -robin conversations.

The brainstorming session. The brainstorming

things. You know, it really shows. And first

off, we have A Better World Part 1. And we start

off with, in an alternate dimension, the Justice

League attacks the White House. Batman and Wonder

Woman take on the Secret Service, clearing out

a path for Superman to the Oval Office. Inside

the Oval Office, President Lex Luthor frantically

gathers up papers. Superman busts in, saying

that he's taking Luthor in for crimes committed

in office. Half -mad, Luthor rants that he's

not to blame, the people are, for not being able

to see or accept his grand design. for the world.

In rage, he prepares to press a button that will

start a nuclear war, saying that people will

burn for their mistake. But then he calms himself

and waits to see what Superman will do. There

is no way of stopping Luther from pressing the

button short of deadly force. Superman hesitates

and Luther mocks him, saying that Superman has

been Luther's greatest accomplice all along.

He loves being the hero with all the glory so

much that he continues to thwart Luther time

and again, rather than having the guts to end

it once and for all. At that, Superman comes

to a decision saying that if this is the place

that being a hero has led him to, he's done with

it. And his eyes begin to glow red. Okay, I gotta

stop you right there. Okay. Because, wow, this

is not our Justice League. You can tell this

is nowhere near our Justice League by the time

that happens. Most definitely. Continue. Okay.

Outside the Oval Office, a scream is heard and

Batman and Wonder Woman rush in to stop dead

in their tracks to see that Superman has incinerated

Luthor. Batman masters himself and coldly says

it had to be done. Wonder Woman asks Superman

if he's alright. Turning around, he reveals an

unnerving grin to his face and says, I'm great.

Sometime later, Earth has become a very different

world, now calling themselves the Justice Lords.

Superman and his five remaining teammates are

now the effective rulers of the planet. It is

revealed that the catalyst for the League's rebellion

was the death of the Flash, murdered as part

of Luthor's schemes. Monitoring events from their

new heavily armed watchtower, they have taken

over governments and subverted free speech on

the name of the people's safety. After denying

the current U .S. President permission to hold

an election to choose his successor, Hawkgirl

and Green Lantern are sent to disperse a protest

in Smallville. Batman has retreated to the Batcave,

claiming to be busy with a project. The mere

appearance of Lantern and Hawkgirl causes the

protesters to disperse out of fear. Hawkgirl

shows some doubts, wondering why they need to

go to such lengths when the world has already

become such a much safer place. Lantern says

that they have to remain vigilant, and he's at

ease with their actions. While Superman dines

with Lois Lane, she too voices her misgivings

about the Lord's fascist regime. Superman tells

her that she's missing the bigger picture, but

their conversation is interrupted by Batman,

who calls an urgent meeting with him and the

others. As Superman leaves, Lois tries to follow

him out of the apartment, only to be stopped

by guards at her door. She berates the soldiers,

and by extension the people of Earth, for being

indifferent about what's happened to their world.

In the Batcave, Batman shows the other Lords

an image of the Justice League battling Lex Luthor.

What they are seeing, Batman explains, is a real

-time event from an alternate reality, in which

the Flash is still alive, and the League is still

playing by its passive, law -enforcing role.

Deciding that the alternate world needs their

brand of law and order as much as their own,

the Justice Lords decide to intervene. In the

primary dimension, the Justice League continues

to battle Luthor, who is ultimately beaten and

sent back to prison. Shortly thereafter, the

Lords' Jean -Jeans emerges from a dimensional

portal saying that he has been sent from an alternate

reality by an embattled league that needs the

primary league's help. Although the league has

some doubts, they decide to trust him. Once they

have emerged into the alternate dimension, they

are quickly incapacitated by a trap. Hawker,

however, refuses to go down without a fight,

a fact noted by some pride by her lord's counterpart,

and is badly injured when Lantern has to knock

her out. While Hawkgirl is taken in for medical

attention, the other League members are locked

in a specially designed cell block. The Lords,

with the exception of Batman, then cross over

to the primary dimension to impose order into

the new world. It seems they arrive back just

in time, for the rogue Behemoth doomsday is on

the loose. The Lords each attack, but none is

a match for the creature except for Superman.

When it becomes clear that they are matched in

strength and endurance, Superman ends the fight.

by lobotomizing Doomsday with his heat vision,

much to the shock of the primary dimension's

Lois Lane. Watching from his prison, Luther realizes

that they aren't the true Justice League. Your

thoughts, sir? I like his line at the end, It's

not them. If there's anyone that would know that,

it would definitely be that Lex. Oh yeah, oh

yeah. Just going back to the beginning, you know,

again, like I said before, this whole first parter,

like right before the, like right as the Superman

and Wonder Woman image fades out or pans out

to reveal the White House, you know this is not

the Justice League. The one that we know. Exactly.

And it's funny, Bruce Timm even mentions in the

commentary that they were, it was either him

or it might have been Stan Berkowitz because

Stan Berkowitz was on the commentary as well.

They mentioned that there was supposedly going

to be a Justice Lords main title instead of a

Justice League. It was an idea. It never came

to fruition. But, yeah, this is just like, wow.

Let's see. The eyes, they burn! I like Hot Girl's

uniform, but not GL's or Jean's. The uniform

choices were kind of strange for me. I don't

know. See, I've got to disagree. I mean, I liked

Hot Girl's uniform, but I really dug... Martian

Manhunter. That was just really awesome to me.

A dinner date? Really? Damn. Well, you gotta,

you know, keep it up. You gotta have that little

bit of decorum and romance, right? Maybe? Yeah.

So alternate GL and hot girl, get it on. Talk

about some more hot wing sex. Where's the barbecue

sauce when you really need it? Oh, God. I swear,

I'm going to make that joke throughout this entire

show's lifespan because that's just... I don't

know. Wait, he wears that suit even when he's

not being Superman? That's nuts. I agree. Oh,

yeah. I think it was when they... Oh, no, it's

when they flash from the Lord's dimension to

our dimension. Alternate John hasn't come in

yet, but I made a note of it. It's about time

we get to the real heroes. And then she's going

to get violent on your ass, Luther. Talk about

breaking a leg. I so wish I had the Admiral Ackbar

line of, eek, get up! Well, I can't up that end,

because, you know, Lucas will come after you.

Yeah. He's going to come after us for episode

100 of, or episode 75 of MWAR, because it's nothing

but Star Wars discussion. Oh, when they get electrocuted.

Shocking, isn't it? Yikes. Doomsday. I didn't

know he could talk. Yeah, exactly. I mean, he

can't do it now, but I didn't know he was capable

of talking at one point. Did you notice the alternate

Jon Jones is stunned by the yellow flame? Yep.

That was a nice nod. An alternate universe Superman

gets tossed around like a rag doll. Oh, that

was the... Yeah. No, I know what it was. It was

the Doomsday fight. Remember when they first

come in? Yep. Because Doomsday is badass in this.

He just rakes his knuckles across where the gasoline

was and it lights on fire. That was really, really

cool. I liked that. That was like, ooh, okay,

and he's intelligent enough to do that. Wow.

I don't know. Whenever I see shattered... Whenever

I see glass shattering, I always have to make

a Transformers reference. So my next note is,

talk about a doomsday reaction. Holy crap, that

punch gave me shattered expectations. Regular

Lois' reaction is priceless. She's totally in

shock. You lobotomized him. And he's like, yeah,

so. It's not them. Dun, dun, dun. Oh, crap. That's

all I got. What did you think? Oh, God, what

do we got? So we see the beginning part where

they're just trashing their way into the end

of the Oval Office to the White House. And I'm

like, wow, now we're getting a real Superman.

Holy crap, you know, just he's shrugging everything

off, the bullets. The laser pistols. He's just

like, eh, I'm not worried about this. Oh, grenades,

huh? This is what Superman is supposed to be.

He's not supposed to be fazed by these little

bullets. Lex totally flipping out, but he makes

some really great points. Yeah. Like, you know,

the whole Joker with Batman in the movies, you

know, you made me. I'm here because of you. You

know, I'm your antithesis because you stood out.

And it's, I think this is where we're getting

to see some really, really, like, the major good

writing, and where we're getting the really dark

side that they're going towards. Right, and I

have to point out that the only reason why I

would not rate this two -parter above, I would

say above a seven, is because of the fact that

at the time when they wrote this, Sure, later

on, like two or three years down the line, they

got a whole lot of mileage out of this one episode.

I mean, the second season of Justice League Unlimited,

which I think it amounts to what is actually

season four of Justice League as a whole, it's

basically one long sequel to this story. But

when they originally wrote this, they weren't

planning ahead. It just kind of happened where

they could draw back to this. But, I mean, this

story on its own, it's all over the place if

that continuity wasn't there. Yeah, this is some

really great, great writing. Oh, yeah. You can

definitely see this is where they hit their stride,

and it's going to take off from here. Yep. Well,

kind of so. Yeah. Okay, it may take a little

bit. The fact that Diana's completely shocked,

and then we... we see, um, her talk to, to Clark,

or Kal -El, or Suits, however you want to say

it. Yeah. Um, after seeing the Justice League

Crisis of Two Earths, I was really expecting

Brian Bloom's voice to come out of Superman at

that point, rather than the normal voice actor.

Um. Brian Bloom? He was the one that played,

um, Ultraman. Oh, okay. So the, the crime syndicate

version. Right, right, right, right. Um, but

why would Batman say it had to be done? honestly,

like, Superman is faster than a speeding bullet.

He really couldn't just pick up Lex in a split

second and pick him up and chuck him? Well...

Or just destroy the entire desk with his heat

vision? He had to kill Luthor? Well, I would

have to say that the only reason why it had to

be done, or why Batman even said that, was because

you read it in the synopsis. You know, Luther's

actions led a... Luther basically killed the

alternate universe Flash. Right. If that hadn't

happened, well, we know it would be different.

Exactly. And then seeing Hawker on Green Lantern,

I was like, oh, love, I'm getting sick of it.

Barbecue sauce, anybody? Barbecue sauce. And

what he did to Lois to... put her basically in

the gilded cage. Yeah. I can see why he would

do it, because she is the type of person that

would not back down and would not stop until

she got the answers and started the revolts.

I like her line. I didn't write it down, but

I said it when Dame Delaney said it after the

guard talked to her. She turned around and goes

to close the door. She goes, Sucker. Yeah. Oh,

God. There was some... A couple good quotes in

here. Some things I can't do in a blink of an

eye. Yeah. I really did like some of the vehicles

that we saw in this one. The battering ram SWAT

vehicle, where the entire left side of the vehicle

is nothing but this huge battering ram. Yeah.

And it didn't do anything to Superman. But...

So, okay, we got the arguably morally ambiguous

Superman, who just picks up... was it a bus or

something and just crushes it into doomsday not

even checking to see if anyone was on the vehicle

at the time but you gotta understand though this

is a more violent Superman and he will this is

the one that I mean we're seeing the dichotomy

through this because he's not the one that would

care about the people at this point he's like

okay it's you know acceptable collateral damage

yep um And the moment where he just lobotomizes

Doomsday, not even like, okay, lasers, okay,

it's done. No, we see, like, the bone melting.

Oh, yeah, I mean, there is a scar there, and

we also see steam coming from the... Oh, yeah.

And it is classic Lex for him to go, oh, my God,

it's not them, but not, oh, my God, I better

not piss off Superman or he's going to do that

to me. Yeah. So that's what I've got. Shall we

go on to the next part? Yes. Okay. So, part two

starts off back in the Lord's reality. While

the Lord's Batman acts as a goaler for the rest

of the league, Batman and Flash both berate him

for the extremes in which... The Lords have gone.

But the Lords' Batman rejoins that such a thing

could just as easily have happened to them if

they'd been pushed that far enough. For them,

he admits, the push came from the Flash's death.

Okay, I gotta stop you really quick. Okay. People

at the DCAU Wiki, y 'all need to run spellcheck,

because that's supposed to say Jailer, not Goaler.

This is not fucking hockey. Goaler's another

old English term for Jailer. Oh, is it? Oh, I

retyped mine into jailer because it didn't look

right to me. No, it's a very rarely used term

at this point. Wow. Okay, continue. Okay, so

the Lord's Batman tells him not to bother with

trying to escape. He's thought of everything

their Batman would, which is to say, everything.

But Flash's heart rate becomes erratic and then

stops altogether. The Lord's Batman rushes to

the cell and opens it to see what's going on,

before Flash knocks him across the room and emerges

from his cell to free the others. Batman says

he didn't know that the Flash could artificially

manipulate his heart rate, while Flash confesses

that he didn't either. Batman leads to his counterpart's

Batcave to activate the dimensional portal, while

the rest of the League heads off to find Hawkgirl.

As he nears the portal's device, Batman is confronted

by his counterpart, who has anticipated his moves.

The two stalk each other through the cave, all

the while debating the ethics of what the Lords

have done. Batman says that they have crossed

the line by seizing power, and the Lord's Batman

rejoins that with that power, they've made a

world where no other eight -year -old boys will

lose their parents to violence as they did. At

that, Batman drops his Batarang, steps into the

light, and declares, you win. The League tracks

Hawkgirl to Arkham Asylum, of all places, the

only hospital equipped to hold metahuman patients.

But the asylum is a far different place than

the one from their reality. The staff are all

former criminals, particularly from Batman's

rogues gallery, all whom are placid, docile zombies,

apparently lobotomized by the Lord Superman.

A very polite joker is the superintendent. Pretending

to be the Lords, the League asks to be taken

to Hawkgirl. Joker requests a password, which

Jaune gives by reading Joker's mind. Joker says

they got it right, but apologetically triggers

the alarm because Wonder Woman was supposed to

say it. Robot versions of Lord Superman attack

the League, but are easily defeated and they

break Hot Girl out. Batman and the Lord Superman

drive through Gotham City towards Arkham. When

they stop at a red light, they see a restaurant,

where a customer is arguing with the manager

about the amount of his bill. in short order,

is arrested by the police for disturbing the

peace. Batman needles his Lord counterpart, saying

that Mom and Dad would love it here, and the

Lord's Batman says tersely, just drive. By the

time they reach Arkham, the military has been

alerted, and the League is barricaded inside.

The Lord's Batman, by this time, has had a change

of heart and tells the military to back off.

As the League prepares to return to reality,

to confront the Lord's Batman, confront the Lords.

Batman wonders openly what they will have to

do. The Lords are their equals in power and intelligence,

and they are willing to kill where the League

isn't. Superman isn't willing to cross that line,

but Batman says that some kind of line will have

to be crossed if they mean to succeed. In the

primary reality, the Lords have occupied the

League's watchtower when they receive an alert

of a prison breakout. Luther has escaped. The

Lords fly to the prison, but is a trap set by

the League. In the fight that follows, each League

member fights his or her counterpart, and neither

side is able to gain the upper hand. The exception

is Lord Superman, whose own counterpart is mysteriously

absent, and who ends up fighting Flash. Lord

Superman is goaded so far that he is prepared

to kill Flash to end the fight, but then Superman

arrives with Luthor, who has perfected a power

disruptor weapon. Luther fires his weapon at

each of the Lords, depriving them of their superpowers.

He is tempted to turn the weapon on Superman,

but remarks, A deal is a deal, and hands it over.

It is revealed that the League has secured a

presidential pardon for Luther in exchange for

his help in defeating the Lords, who are taken

away to prison. Lord Superman rages that everything

Luther does from now on will be on Superman's

head, and Superman returns that he'll just have

to deal with it. Luther holds a press conference

to field questions about what he'll be doing

with his freedom. He says that the business world

doesn't hold the same lure for him that it did

before, but he couldn't rule out a new career

in politics. Thoughts, sir? Batman versus Batman,

everything you'll ever think of. Flash uses his

brain and his heart. This is true. Justice Lord's

Batman's reaction to Flash flatlining, that's

just awesome. It does show some true shock and

emotion. That the Batman has a heart? Yeah. The

91939 bit. Now... I think it's been since debunked,

but I think at the time of this episode, someone

online somewhere figured out it was the first

appearance of Batman, but I could have sworn

somebody said it happened earlier than September

1939. I'm not sure, honestly. I don't know. And

then real Batman's line, but who can anticipate

you? Alternate Arkham. Joker, Two -Face, Poison

Ivy, and Scarface are all in the Arkham scenes.

Now, when I wrote that line down, I was originally

going to add to it by saying, wait, wasn't there

a Bat embargo? Because I know a lot of the Batman

villains weren't, like, I know, I think after

Wild Cards, which is the last appearance of the

Joker in Justice League, I think it's after that

that the Bat embargo went active, and they didn't

use any more of his villains anymore. But I don't

know. I'm not sure when it actually happened.

The Superman sentries. And this is where I'll

bring up the fact that on the commentary, which

the listeners have already heard it before we

started doing the discussion for A Better World.

Bruce Timm said basically because they made,

you know, Superman so stark and so, you know,

wimpy and everything else. All of the Superman

robots dialogue is from, it's something Superman

said in season one of Justice League. Really?

Yep. Wow. Yep. Bat versus Bat round two. Ding!

Again, this is another commentary bit, which

I've already put into the episode. It played

right before we started the discussion on this

one. You know, they actually go back and forth

about how they were going to do this, and they

actually talked about, if you watch that scene,

neither of the Batmans, the camera doesn't ever

focus on them together. Like, when one's talking,

you always see the other one's back. That way

they... It was kind of like... I guess it was

kind of like misdirection. That way you wouldn't

know which one was talking. And I'm not sure

if Kevin Conroy actually did the voices back

-to -back or if he did them... One run through

with one character and one run through with another.

Right. It would have been awesome if he did them

back -to -back, just having a conversation with

himself in the same voice. That would have been

kind of cool. If we ever get to interview him,

I will have to ask him that if he remembers it.

I don't know. Let's see. You might say, that

was the freakiest thing I've ever done. It gave

me such a headache. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I was trying

to think of where my next note comes from, but

it's when the Superman robot is taking our Superman's

head into the wall. Dang, the Superman bots can

hit hard. He just smashes his head into the wall.

It's like headbutting the wall there. Never mind,

the headset ended up coming off a few seconds

later. Oh, yeah, exactly. Yeah, thanks. No eight

-year -old boy will ever lose his parents because

of some punk with a gun. That was really powerful,

the way it was delivered. I was waiting to see

how long it was going to be before they brought

up the perfect world where it never happened

to him. Mm -hmm. Let's see. The I am him line,

I love that. I am him. And then my other, I just

got a few more here. The other one was hesitation

and then GL just saying, do it, or no, was it,

Superman said do it when it was RGL getting ready

to knock out the alternate hot girl. Because

he hesitates for a moment. It's not like they

don't know. Well, I know, but still. I mean,

it's not like Superman and everybody else doesn't

know that they're... that they've got feelings

for each other. True, but it doesn't... In reality,

it doesn't actually happen until Comfort and

Joy and Wild Cards is when it really consummates.

It really comes to. Yeah. Let's see. Two Jeans,

six arms. Okay, God. Tiaras are weapons. I was

thinking Sailor Moon. Wait, wait, wait. What

did you say a second ago about the Flash? I thought

it was Sailor Moon. It's like, whoa, Tiaran.

Tiaras are weapons, too, not just accessories.

She's an Amazon. everything that she has is probably

an accessory. I mean, can you imagine what she

could do with those, uh, those heels? Oh, yeah,

that's not something I want to imagine. Um, and

at the end, of course, um, um, it's so funny,

uh, our Batman taking Lord Superman away in cuffs.

That was awesome. Oh, boy. Um, And then Lex for

Prez. That bothers me. Yeah, it bothers me too,

but again, if I hadn't already seen this cartoon

before, it would really bother me more, but it

doesn't because I know what happens. What does

bother me is way back when they were first doing

it with the comics, I was reading DC and I was

like, oh god, I can't even imagine what's going

to happen with this. It's a really scary prospect.

Yeah. It really could be. I mean, have you seen

Superman, Batman, Public Enemies? Yes, I have.

You know, that's a scary prospect. He's already

president. But the fact that he's going to have

a wild kiss with... Oh, God, don't bring that

up. That's not an image I need in my head, and

that is the completely wrong model for Amanda

Waller. Oh, my God. I agree. Oh, that's... Okay,

what other notes do you have for this one? Okay,

we got Bats vs. Bats. It was a mind game that

was just... We know how good he is against other

people. It was amazing to see him against himself.

Flash being pretty important, as he put it. Yeah,

all the upgrades that went into the Watchtower.

Yep. All the weapons. And they're worried about

one little dinky Graviton cannon. later on in

the series, but if you look at it now, you know...

Well, see, that's the thing, though, and I didn't

notice this until I watched this episode back

for our recording now. I never noticed after

the Lords armored up the small, the mini Watchtower,

because technically that's what this one is,

because the other one, the new one, oh my god,

it's huge! But, yeah, the Watchtower now, I'm

like, wait, that... I never saw a gun on the

bottom of that thing before, what in the heck?

I never noticed it until just watching this the

other day to record for this, and I was like,

oh wow, so that's where that came from. Just

the, oh my god, look at the Joker. Arkham Asylum,

it's clean, it's white, it's pristine, everyone's

just relaxing watching TV. Oh, was it, oh, okay,

so they pick up, and this is the nurse in me

that's coming out, but even Mother Half was watching

this with me, and he's like, huh, that's not

right. They pick up Hawkgirl. They literally

pick her up off of the bed, and they walk out

with her. Her nasal disappears, which is the

thing that's going into her nose, obviously,

and the EKG continues to run, even though she's

disconnected. animation errors all help, but

it was like, does she have, like, Bluetooth,

like, electronics or something? What's going

on? Evil Superman is just completely sadistic.

What else? A power disruptor? Really? They're

going to let Lex come up with that? They're going

to let Lex anywhere near that? That's kind of,

you know, really scary. Well, he does give it

back, though, so I mean... Doesn't mean he doesn't

have it memorized. That's true. He's a 12th level

intellect. Okay, so evil Wonder Woman. Does she

know about her, the Justice Lords Wonder Woman,

rather. Does she know about her armor? Is that

what gave her an advantage over the standard

normal Diana? I don't know. Because we know our

Diana doesn't learn about all its capabilities

until later. Yep. So it's like, okay, did she

have an advantage by knowing about her armor?

I don't think so. I don't think so, because I

think what it boils down to is the alternate

Wonder Woman is much like the alternate Superman,

where... pretty much all of them are ready to

do, quote -unquote, whatever it takes, and literally

take that to the nth degree, where, you know,

it's just one of those things where she will

be more vicious, she will, you know, she won't

hold back, whereas the primary Wonder Woman,

I don't think it's a thing of her knowing of

her armor, because... It just isn't. Well, first

of all, she didn't use her lasso at all. I don't

even think the alternate Wonder Woman had a lasso.

I didn't even see it. If she does, I didn't notice

it. Okay. I don't know. Okay, what else do I

have? Okay, so this popped up. We've got Lex

going for the presidency. We're seeing the lead

up to it. It makes perfect sense because everyone

knows he's a criminal already. And it made me

think of this quote from Theodore Roosevelt that

when they do attendance at Congress, the congressmen

don't know if they're supposed to say present

or not guilty. It just made me think of that

for some reason. And I think that's all I've

got for this episode. Overall, it was a really

good episode, and one of the reasons why it makes

it such a good episode is all the continuity

they get out of it later on. Because it's like,

say you start watching Justice League, but you're

watching Justice League Unlimited, and you're

like, well, wait, why is this like this, or why

is that like that? You can then go back to this

episode, a lot of it, and it stems from this.

I think this is definitely one of those two -parters

that you can, if you're trying to get somebody

into understanding that there's more to cartoons

than just, you know, ooh -ah smurfs, sit them

down and make them watch this and make them have

to deal with watching something that actually

delves into ethics and reactions of how far people

would go. Yeah. All right. Well, we are going

to move on. Never. I know what you want, but

you can't have it. Have what? My precious diamond.

No. Stay back. Its dark power can destroy the

world. Not anymore. Hey, princess, fire's out.

Need a hand in here? No, he's finished. Whoa!

That was a little harsh. Are you feeling all

right? I'm fine, but there's still so much to

do. Previously on Justice League. For fast energy,

grab a light -speed booster bar with a big burst

of flavor in every bite. This is what these self

-appointed guardians of humanity are really about?

Cashing in on their image, shilling for whoever's

got the deepest pockets. No one's asking the

other guys to do this sort of thing. That's because

they don't have me as their agent. We believe

that our new AFD anti -fusion device will enable

us to completely neutralize enemy warheads at

the point of detonation. Up next is, oh Christ,

help me, Eclipsed. Oh, God. In an unnamed foreign

country, an American special ops team is tracking

an elusive criminal. Following his trail to what

they believe is his hideout, they find themselves

in cavernous ancient ruin. He noticed the word

cave inscribed on the wall, which one of them

realizes is Latin for beware. At the end of the

ruin is a large purple gemstone. Sitting on the

pedestal, one of the soldiers reaches for it

greedily, but then the bizarre figure jumps down,

an old man who calls himself Mophir. dressed

in ancient armor and wielding a sword. Despite

his age, he is amazingly swift and agile. He

yells at them not to touch the gem, but they

manage to subdue him. Let's see. The first soldier,

Burns, picks up the gem. A moment later, he begins

humming an eerie tune and turns on the other

soldiers and opens fire, causing the ruin to

cave in. Burns walks out alone, carrying the

gem and humming the same eerie tune. In Central

City, Flash has gotten in trouble again. He is

taken to doing product endorsements, drawing

harsh criticism from talk show host Glorious

Gordon Godfrey, who claims he and the entire

Justice League are exploiting their roles as

quote -unquote heroes for their own gain, and

that they pose a much greater menace than any

of the so -called villains they fight. Indignant,

Flash makes a surprise appearance on the Godfrey

show, but ends up humiliating himself and the

League even further. Jon Stewart and Wonder Woman

are likewise outraged, both by Godfrey's comments

and Flash's irresponsible behavior. In the desert,

Molfier emerges from the ruin, dons the boots

of one of the knocked out soldiers, and begins

tracking Burns. Burns is picked up by a patrol

who take him back to base. Once he has reached

base, he draws his gun on the driver and demands

to know about man's deadliest weapons. Scared

and confused, The driver says that the best thing

he can think of is a nuclear weapon, which can

kill thousands, maybe millions. Burns considers

and says it's a start. Doing this latest endorsement,

Flash takes an exception to the corny script

and the studio director. He rushes out of the

studio on a huff, managing to collapse the set

to avoid paying damages. Flash's venal agent,

Artie... sells the footage of the snafu to Godfrey's

talk show, providing further ammunition for Godfrey's

accusations. On the base, the commanding officer,

General McCormick, is preparing to exhibit a

new device, the AFD, designed to protect against

nuclear attack by stopping the fusion inside

a ballistic what? Inside a ballistic missile's

atom bomb. In the middle of the test, Burns breaks

through the barrier and around the exposed nuclear

missiles he has pursued and captured by the base

authorities. A short time later, when Burns is

being interrogated, he claims not to remember

anything, including the fact that his squad was

taken out by quote -unquote friendly fire. As

General McCormick watches the interrogation,

he is now shown holding the gem. He walks down

the hall whistling the same eerie tune. Seeing

the data on the AFD, he begins to review and

get interested. He sees Godfrey's latest talk

show, during which Godfrey rants that if they

wanted to, the quote -unquote Just Us League...

Wait, that was taken from earlier in the season.

Oh, yeah, I know, but still. It's not as cool

when it's not one of the original stuff. I know.

Could destroy the world. The general asks a nearby

captain, how to locate the league. The captain

jokes, put on a gaudy costume, and threatened

to hurt a lot of people. Flash confronts Artie,

wanting to know how Godfrey got all of the embarrassing

footage from the commercial shoot. Artie pretends

ignorance. Their discussion is interrupted by

an explosion from a nearby power plant. Flash

joins Lantern and Wonder Woman in going to investigate.

General McCormick stands atop a tower, ranting

that mankind's time will be forever eclipsed.

True enough, he has deemed the gaudy costume

and face makeup that looks slightly absurd, but

he is armed with the genuine weapons stolen from

the base. And the explosion reveals that he has

set fire to the flammable gas in the sewers.

Lantern and Flash take care of the fire while

Wonder Woman flies to the power plant to confront

the villain. She easily disarms him and he tells

her to stay back, saying she can't have his precious

black diamond, which has the power to destroy

the world. Undaunted, she seizes the diamond

from his grip. Lantern flash arrive and find

Wonder Woman about to drop McCormick from a high

ledge. Surprised, they stop her and ask if she's

alright. She says she is fine and walks out humming

the eerie tune. Dun dun dun! What do you got

for this one? Oh god. So we get some insight

into why people do these military jobs. They

pay really well and they actually do believe

that they're saving people from things in the

future. Okay, what's... You've got these skulls

everywhere. Where did the rest of the bones go?

Really? That's a crap load of skulls. Where's

the rest of the body pieces? Flash has absolutely

no taste. But... Oh, okay, so the Mirror... Someone,

please, please correct me on this one, but isn't

the Mirror Master... and it's Captain Boomerang

who's got the Aussie accent? Like, Digger, doesn't

he have the Aussie -British accent? Yes. Captain

Boomerang is the Aussie, and Mirror Master is...

I believe he's British, I think. Maybe. I wasn't

sure. I don't think he's American. I believe

he... No, he's not Australian. It's Captain Boomerang

that's Australian. We will find out. I'll be

able to tell you more later when we get to, oh,

what is it? I think it's Flash and Substance

in JLU. I don't know. There's some episode in

JLU where Flash is getting an award and he has

to go up against Mirror Master. I remember that

episode. Yeah, Mirror Master, Captain Boomerang,

Mr. Captain Cold. I was going to say Mr. Blizzard.

So, yeah, I'll be able to tell you then, which

will be a few episodes down the line here. Let's

see. We know why. We really do know why he has

all these product placements. He's got that super

metabolism. He has to be able to pay for all

that food somehow. Let's see. Okay, so I don't

know if anybody else is a... huge comic geek,

but Mofir kind of reminded me when he first showed

up a lot of Gateway from Generation X. Just this

really old, mysterious guy that's super athletic

and all this other stuff. Diana's reaction to

Democracy. Didn't the Greeks invent that? She

looked like she was going to kill somebody. Amazon

Negotiations. She beats the crap out of Eclipso.

Eclipso in the gaudy costume. Diamonds, really,

Diamonds aren't a girl's best friend in this

case. I really think that when we're getting

this character, it's like, okay, Eclipso's been

one of those big bad guys sometime in the past.

We've got to throw him in somehow. Yeah, it is

an homage to, I don't know what it is an homage

to, but I mean, it is an homage to a comic book

villain. Oh no, Eclipso was a comic book villain.

Right, yeah. but he used to switch from superhero

body to superhero body. Ah. But yeah, it was

one of those, okay, I'm watching this and this.

They really could have done something better

than Eclipsa. So what do you have, good sir?

Let's talk about Mulfier. You know who Mulfier

is? Who is it? Bob the Goon. Really? Tracy Walter.

Yep. Voiced Mophier, and Tracy Walter was also

Bob the Goon in the 1989 Batman. Okay. We've

got to talk about the eclipsing whistle tune.

Oh, my God, that is so fucking creepy. It is

getting creepy, yeah. It is just so creepy. I

mentioned it before, the quote -unquote, and,

you know, you even said it doesn't sound right,

but... I like how they reused the quote -unquote

just us league, and they use it for bad and not

good. That was kind of cool. I think right after

that line is when I wrote down, I really don't

like this storyline, and we're only in part one.

I don't think it's worse. Yeah. And, you know,

honestly, this story would have gone a hell of

a lot better if there was no Godfrey, if there

was no Artie, if there was no director, if there

was no Flash doing endorsements. Yeah. I only

have five notes for this. My last one is, yikes,

the look on Wonder Woman's face is creepy. And

that's, like, at the very end. When she has the

crystal in her hand. We should talk about the

crystal a little bit. They say it's a black diamond

throughout the entire episode. But it's purple.

It's purple. Maybe somebody's colorblind. Maybe

it's one of those that's so dark of a purple

that they consider it black. Could be. Like black

roses are really kind of purple. Yeah, could

be. Alright, so should we get on to part two?

Do we have to? Yeah, that's what I want to know.

Do we have to? Part two, shit happens. Later,

folks. No. We have to soldier on through it for

our fans. If we can soldier on through that episode

that shall not be named, we can soldier on through

this shit. Tell us how you really feel. Yeah,

exactly. Alright, so in part two, McCormick comes

around and is interrogated by the local police

station. He claims not to remember what he did

or why he is dressed in the bizarre outfit. He

is equally confused to hear that the AFD is missing.

He insists that it isn't a weapon, that it can

only be used for defense against nuclear attack,

unless you're going to go knock out a star. Wonder

Woman is watching the interrogation from behind

the mirror. Uh -oh. As she, Flash, and Lantern

emerge the street, Mophir appears and attacks.

Wonder Woman beats him off with ease, but Mofir

flashes her with light from a large ruby, and

she falls unconscious. Mofir raises his sword

for the kill, but Lantern's ring knocks him unconscious.

While Lantern takes Diana to the Watchtower for

medical treatment, Flash follows Mofir, who has

taken the local asylum in a straitjacket. Now

I gotta wonder... All right. Now, we all know

the DCAU cities, Metropolis and Gotham City and

everything else. It says he's taken to an asylum.

Was it Arkham? Weren't they in Central City at

the time? Yeah, I think they were, so it wouldn't

be Arkham. But still, every time I see asylum,

that's what... What you think? Yeah, because,

yeah. The doctors dismiss him as a raving lunatic,

but as Flash is leaving, he hears Mofir say,

Mankind's time forever eclipsed. Just as McCormick

did, deciding to listen, Flash asks Mophir to

explain himself. Thousands of years ago, prehistoric

men fought a vicious war with the Ophidians.

Wow, I can't believe I actually got that right.

Humanoid snake -like creatures. As the war turned

in man's favor, the Ophidians made a last -ditch

attempt for victory during a solar eclipse. They

conducted a magic ritual that created a heart

of darkness. with its souls in the last of their

warriors. The eerie tune is in fact the incantation

the sacrifice Inferians chanted as their souls

were taken. Anyone who touched the gem would

be possessed by them whose only goal was to wipe

out the human race. Mulfir is the last surviving

member of a clan of ancient warriors that erected

the temple around the heart and swore to guard

it forever. Flash asks how the possessing spirits

can be driven away. Mulfir says two ways. First,

with the light from my ruby, or second, by decapitating

the possessed person. Ugh, that's, uh... That's

kind of like being stuck between a rock and a

hard place. Mulfir didn't have a problem with

it, though. He seemed to like it. Oh, no, he

likes cutting people's heads off. Reina Bobbitt,

you are not. Oh, come on. You didn't get that?

I did. I just didn't want to respond to it. All

right. Flash returns to the Watchtower and fills

Jaune in. He says Diana has been acting strangely.

Flash talks to Diana, who seems to be normal.

He returns to the others, who say that they have

just discovered a breach in their security. They

review the security tapes and see Jaune removing

the AFD from the javelin. Jaune, confused, claims

not to remember. Flash dashes off and returns

with Mofir's gem, which he has brought with him.

He flashes Jaune, then Diana without effect.

He flashes Superman, and then the gem is destroyed

by a blast from Lantern, who is shown holding

the diamond. He attacks with the ring's powers.

They manage to overpower him and knock him unconscious.

The diamond falls from his hand. Flash warns

the other not to touch it before the others can

react. Hot Girl raises her mace and smashes it

to shards. This turns out to be a bad move. The

fragments fly through the air and stick to every

other league member except Flash. The only one

fast enough to evade them. Now he is the only

one of them not possessed. He runs with the others

in pursuit. Okay, I gotta stop. I'm sorry. There's

something severely fucking wrong with this. I

know Flash is the fastest man alive. But how

did the little crystals attach themselves to

Superman? What is Superman? Fucking chopped liver?

He does have super speed. I mean, come on. Well,

never mind that it's super speed, but his near

invulnerability. How did it pierce his skin?

Same with Diana. Oh, God. All right. And how

did it get through Green Lantern's... Personal

body shield. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I know

they were going for plot, and, you know, that,

you know, normal conventions of superhero invulnerability,

I guess, be damned. But still, it still makes

no fucking sense. While he hides, he watches

the others activate the AFD, and Lantern sends

it hurling towards the sun. When it hits the

fusion and the surface of the star begins to

stop in the dark stain, Ooh, somebody spilled

some Kool -Aid on it. ...begins to spread on

the surface. As the sun eclipses, people on Earth

scream in panic, and Mophir laments that he has

failed. Flash runs to a communications terminal

and tries to phone Batman, but Superman catches

up with him and destroys the phone. Then Cirelli

injures Flash with his heat vision. Oh, wow.

That was messed up. That really was. He runs

to the javelin bay but finds the controls already

smashed. Flash limps to an engineering bay where

the others converge on him, all humming the chant.

Flash waits until they are close enough. Then

he throws the switch and opens the cover on a

huge 700 kilowatt searchlight, blinding the others.

blinding the others with light that drives the

spirits out and the shards of the diamond off

their skin. They recover from the possession,

but as Flash says, we have a situation. After

a quick analysis, John concludes that the only

way to reverse the damage to the sun is to create

a wormhole near the stain that will drain away

the anti -fusion matter. The javelin is equipped

with a wormhole generator, but it requires near

light speed velocity to trigger it, and the javelin

itself is too damaged to use in time. Lantern

comes up with a radical plan. He will take Flash

into space near the sun and use his ring to hurl

Flash toward it. While Flash runs out on a makeshift

ramp, their combined speeds may trigger the generator

at the precise necessary moment to open a wormhole.

Flash makes one of his fastest runs to date and

hurls the generator at the stain. To everyone's

surprise, it works. The wormhole opens and the

stain is leached away, restoring the sun to life.

On Earth, people cheer and Mofir smiles. Um,

Flash awakens in the Watchtower sickbay, weak

and dizzy. Everyone congratulates him. The Justice

League is honored at a public ceremony for saving

the world again. Godfrey's sponsors drop him

and his show is moved to an early morning time

slot on Public Access Channel. R calls Flash

to tell him his sponsors are eager to sign him

on again. A little embarrassed, Flash declines

to do any more endorsements but recommends a

Sterling replacement. Mophier. Oh, Oh, God. Thank

God this is over. Oh, damn it. What did you think?

Okay. I want to see Godfrey go against Darkseid.

You want to what? Darkseid. I want to see him

go against Darkseid. Oh, good Lord. You know,

he bitches and complains about how bad and horrible

these supermen are. Apparently, you saw the last

episode. So... Let him deal with Darkseid next

time he shows up. Problem solved. Flash is the

guy that listens to everyone. He sits there and

we see in a later episode he's the one that helps

Trickster and, you know, oh, you've been off

your meds again, haven't you? He actually is

sitting there and trying to figure out what's

wrong with the person and giving the person the

benefit of the doubt in the case of Mofir. Let's

hear it for a ritualistic mass suicide. Bring

on the Kool -Aid. Let's see. Oh, yeah, so Eclipso

can suddenly just use Green Lantern's ring without

any training whatsoever. None whatsoever. But

Green Lantern can't use it unless he goes through

rigorous training in prior episodes. Well, now,

wait a minute here. We've seen before, whether

it be... Have we seen before whether it be Jaune

or somebody else take control of a ring? Yeah,

I know, Amazo. in Tabula Rossa. You know, we

saw Amazo copy the power and he uses it very

well. He doesn't need any training whatsoever.

And I would argue that Eclipso or the snake people

or whatever the hell you want to call them, I

would assume that, you know, they, I don't know,

they know too much. I don't know. Okay, so they

got this metallic device that's going to open

up a wormhole. They're going to throw it into

the sun. It's all going to be good. Isn't it

going to melt before it gets there? Yeah. Like,

seriously, I'm going to throw this and launch

it into the sun. It'll save everything. It's

going to melt before it even gets halfway there.

Yeah. There are no, at least to my knowledge,

at least from, and I'm not a big science nerd

or space nerd or elemental nerd, As far as I

know, and I'll give credit where credit's due,

they pointed out on World's Funnest Podcast when

they talked about this episode, there are no

metals currently on Earth that can survive being

hurled into the sun. Like you said, it would

burn up way before it gets there. It's made of

red matter. Always watch out for the red matter,

ladies and gentlemen. Let's see what else. Okay.

So they turn on that huge spotlight. Whose retinas

are still intact? Really? First of all, why the

hell do they have a giant fucking spotlight?

And it's funny. The thing, it says high voltage.

Why the hell do they have a need for a high voltage

spotlight inside the watchtower? I could see

if maybe it was outside of the watchtower to

look down on Earth. But... Yeah, why would someone

really need a nightlight? Yeah, I don't know.

Oh, okay, it's to get rid of the shade. Huh?

Shading. He comes back to the watchtower again.

Oh, okay. I guess. It's all shadow powers. Yeah,

I know, but that still doesn't... I don't know.

I guess. Go ahead. Okay, so we also got a lesson

in particle physics from Hawkgirl. How fast can

the Flash run? We're seeing him progress more

and more, constantly pushing that. I guess that's

the only thing he really can do, considering

his power, where his powers are coming from.

And how can he do that run when he just got,

you know, cauterized laser damage to his legs?

Yeah, exactly. I mean, even with that advanced,

you know, How is he able to heal a cauterized

wound that quickly? Yeah. Okay, another question

is, where is this anti -fusion matter going?

They're opening up this wormhole. Where is it

going to? Probably going to, like, Mofir's cave

or something. Yeah, and then I... Let's see.

Flash always a flirt all the way to the end.

And then this Godridge guy. It makes me think

of somebody else that's in talk TV, talk radio,

that's first name starts with a G, but I'm not

going to say anything. That's all I got. Yeah,

I'm actually waiting for the wiki to load because

I want to look something up. I think one of my

first notes was, hold it, Grandpa! I can't believe

you didn't, I mean, you mentioned the fact of

how can the snake people use the lantern ring,

but I can't believe that you didn't bring up

the snake biting construct. Oh, yeah. That's

so cool. Let's see. All right. What about the

season two eclipsed? Okay. All right. The one

time hot girl using her mace proves a horrid,

horrid reaction. Yep. I love how, I don't remember

where it was, but Flash pulled a Superman spin

move into the ground. Oh, and he was trying to

escape everyone, and he just kind of drills down.

Yeah, in the watchtower, that's right, the drill

down. Yeah, that's right, that's right. Wait

a damn minute. Flash jumped off the green track

and through the thing, after which it shows Lantern

not using the ring. Then it shows Flash green

-covered floating in space. What the fuck? I

don't know. That makes no sense whatsoever. Okay.

Um... Mofir does hemorrhoid ads. I know. Well,

I guess... No. It fits for him. Yeah. Oh, what

was it? Um... Oh, what is... I know two of them.

I don't know the other one, but there was three

things he said. He's like, uh... The pain, the

itching, the burning! I can't... I've got...

Oh, and I need it really fast, fast, fast. Yeah.

Oh. I'm looking at the wiki here. You know who

voiced Artie, the agent? God, no. Brian Doyle

Murray, who is Bill Murray's brother. Yep. Let's

see. Oh, yeah. Where did the Sarge show up? Because

I don't remember. Was it in the interrogation?

Yeah, the first interrogation. Oh, no, no, no.

No, it's where, what's his name, McCormick, with

Eclipso inside of him, where he's getting the

data on the AFD, the Sarge. We have a Transformers

reference. Really? The Sarge was voiced none

other by, wow, I almost screwed that up. The

Sarge was voiced by none other than Ian James

Corlett, voice of Cheetor. Wow. I always like

bringing Transformers reference with my superheroes.

Yeah, overall, this episode... Oh, God. No. Just

no. It really was a case of them throwing in

an old character just to get him out there, I

think. I just... They could have done so much

more with this. You know, honestly, they could

have just made this a one... part story. They

could have filled all the action in the second

part and put it into the first part, and we would

have been none the wiser. This has got to be

one of the dumbest stories in season two. Well,

I don't think they need to even do one. Yeah,

just don't touch it. That's what I mean. It wasn't

needed. Yeah, no, it wasn't needed at all. So,

we are going to be moving on. I warn you both

again. Once the spell has begun, I cannot stop.

And the pain will be unbearable. You've told

us before. Get on with it. Stupid magician. Grundy

not care about pain. Grundy wants his reward.

Very well. The elements are gathered in a place

of power. A wizard of great knowledge. The trident

of Poseidon. And the forbearance of a dead man.

The walls between the worlds have been torn asunder.

I order them now sealed. By the power of the

titans which resides in their trident. By the

power of the lords of order which resides in

everything. By the power of fate which resides

in the helmet of Naboo. Banish the old ones and

seal the breach. So fate demands. So fate demands.

Last up tonight, we have The Terror Beyond Part

1. At the docks of an unnamed city, the army

corners Solomon Grundy. He fights back with everything

that he has, but the army has... been prepared

for him. However, Aquaman arrives, riding a sea

serpent, and covers Grundy, promising to help

him. Taken someplace, Aquaman offers Grundy gold

if he helps him with something. They enter a

room and are greeted by Inza, who summons Dr.

Fate. Fate explains that he needs Grundy's help

in a ritual they are about to perform, but they

need to know how Solomon Grundy came to be. Grundy

has no memories of his past life, so Fate performs

a revelation spell to learn. Decades ago, Sirius

Gold was a wanted gangster. However, a deal with

the mobster associates turned sour, and they

killed Gold. They cursed his body with a powerful

gris -gris, which took his soul and dumped his

body into a swamp filled with mystical properties.

The magical forces did not sit well together,

and after several decades, Solomon Grundy was

born, cursed with greed, unaware of what he wanted.

The spell revealed the truth to both fate and

Grundy, and Grundy now remembers his past. Fate

says that Grundy will be able to help, but Grundy

no longer wants the gold for his help, he wants

his soul back. Grundy offers to do whatever they

want if they help him reclaim it, and Fate promises

to do everything in its power. Back at the dock,

Superman saves a soldier from being crushed by

a tank. Wonder Woman and Hawkgirl show up and

also offer their help, but Aquaman's appearance...

But after Aquaman's appearance, the commander

isn't so eager on superheroes. Deciding to investigate,

the Justice League heads to Atlantis. En route,

they see a cruise ship being attacked by a massive

sea creature of unknown species. The creature

is able to harm Superman, but Hawkgirl manages

to drive it off with her mace. See, it just proves

how much of a wimp Superman is. Reaching Atlantis,

the Leaguers are taken to Queen Mira. Hawkgirl

skips pleasantries and demands to know what the

sea creature was doing, where Aquaman is, and

why the Atlantean Navy is on full alert, implying

they may be preparing for a war on the surface

world. Insulted at Hawkgirl's rudeness and mistrust

of Aquaman, Mirror says that he's with Dr. Fate

and will speak to the League at his pleasure,

ending the audience. On the Javelin 7, Superman

and Wonder Woman criticize Hawkgirl's abruptness,

but Hawkgirl points out that it got them a lead.

This leads Superman to conclude that the sea

creature was magical, as only that, red sun radiation,

and kryptonite can hurt him. Heading to Fate's

home, they find no doors. Superman can't penetrate

the walls, so Hawkgirl smashes it with her mace.

Of course. They find the interior rather oddly

designed. The Leaguers then come across Fate

performing a spell in Grundy, using Aquaman's

trident. The Leaguers try to stop it, but Inza

throws up a force field. Hawkgirl's mace is able

to pierce it, knocking out Inza, and the Leaguers

are able to disrupt the ceremony. Fate and Aquaman

tell them to leave, but Grundy simply attacks

them. Fate sends Superman and Grundy to Egypt,

while Wonder Woman and Aquaman are sent to Easter

Island. Hawkgirl remains to fight Dr. Fate. In

Egypt, Superman is able to overcome Grundy, while

Aquaman defeats Wonder Woman. The victors take

their defeated opponents back to Fate's home

and engage each other, which Superman emerges

victoriously. However, in the battle between

Fate and Hawkgirl, she is able to use her mace

to break through his magical attacks. Suddenly,

she recognizes the runes on the floor as Thanagarian

symbols and demands answers. Superman and Wonder

Woman return with the unconscious Aquaman and

Grundy, and Fate submits. They demand answers,

but when Fate says there is no time, Hawkgirl

advises them to make time. Suddenly, a terror

in the empty space within the room opens, revealing

a massive, hideous... cephalopodal creature as

fate exclaims we were trying to prevent that

your thoughts good sir oh boy I like the line

as you know we were trying to prevent that I

like that that exclamation exclamation um Excuse

me. You know, it's funny. I was looking up on

the wiki for this episode, and it says in the

trivia that Aquaman's line of, if you want to

live, come with me, parallels the line spoken

by the T -800, Arnold Schwarzenegger, to the

teenage John Connor in Terminator 2, Judgment

Day. This line, with the clauses reversed, was

first said by Kyle Reese. to Sarah Connor in

the first installment but it was not until the

sequel that it became notorious now it's funny

that they put that in the trivia on the wiki

because my note for it is why is it when I hear

Aquaman say if you want to live come with me

I heard Aladdin asking Jasmine if she trusts

him I think you watch too many cartoons oh shut

up so do you I think this is the first time that

we've seen Dr. Fate in the DCAU since Superman

the Animated Series episode The Hand of Fate,

which the wiki does confirm that I am correct

in that. Wow, it's an enveloping world in the

Fate home. Yeah, no duh. It's like going into

the TARDIS or something. And so Fate demands.

Stop making demands, you bastard. I love... It's

not often, and we'll see it later a little bit,

especially when we get to Starcrossed, but it's

not often that Wonder Woman and Hot Girl have

good banter back and forth, but Hot Girl goes,

just for the record, I didn't start this fight.

There's a first time for everything. Yeah. I

love that. When Aquaman drags Wonder Woman underwater,

he evilly smiles at her. That is just creepy.

Oh, what was... I have another... I know I've

used this a lot in this episode. I know you're

sick of it, but... One of my notes, I think it

was when Cthulhu was... talking to hot girl.

I don't know. Something set her wing on fire,

and I made another note about barbecue hot wings.

And then my last note was what you've already

said. We were trying to prevent that. Let's see,

what do I have? We finally learned why Grundy

needs money. Yep. The curses effectively made

him the cookie monster. Let's see. Yay, we get

to see Arthur again. He's still a dick, but yay,

we get to see him some more. Hey, you know what's

funny? I don't mean to interrupt you, but you

know what's funny? You know, and again, we're

doing Sigur Arjun's podcast as World's Finest

Podcast is doing their stuff. They are currently

out of Justice League. They're moving on to Teen

Titans, which is not in DCAU continuity. But

anyway, when they brought that up about Aquaman,

when they were doing their coverage on Enemy

Below, they called him Arthur as well. And yes,

I know that's what his name is, but I've always

heard people call him Aquaman by his superhero

name, and it kind of threw me off. Yeah, that's

true. Go ahead. Sorry. So, we get to see Grundy

kick some serious ass, so we know he is an actual

threat. Because most of the time he's just that

Lummox that gets the crap beat out of him. Oh,

hey, look, they hired Tank Megatron. The tanks

in the beginning that just totally wailed. See,

uh, Dr. Fate really does know how to make an

entrance, and his voice actor is awesome, Oded

Fer. Yeah. That was just like, oh, sweet. He

actually, uh, Oded Fer actually replaced, uh,

what is it, um, what is it, stupid note. Um,

let's see. Oded Fer replaces George DeHilloyo,

who was the voice of Dr. Fate in the Superman

show, but go ahead. Okay, uh, What is it? Superman

being chafed by straddling the fence. Yeah. He's

a farm boy. He knows how to straddle his fence.

Oh, God. It's one of those things that you know

how to do when you're a farm boy. Oh, Lord. Let's

see. What else do I have? Magical tentacles.

And I was like, Cthulhu. It's got to be Cthulhu.

Magical tentacles. Arkham. Yay. I think the best

line out of this is definitely Diana going, Hera,

give me strength, and Hawker, without missing

a beat, saying, do you always have to say that

line? Yeah. How exactly do you x -ray water?

How do you use x -ray vision through water? I

don't understand how that would work. Yeah. Actually,

for that length and that density. Mira taking

absolutely no shit from anyone. Hey, she is royalty.

She's royalty. And Diana totally was like, you

know, you way overstepped the boundaries, you

know. You went beyond royal protocol. This is

not cool. I was bad cop. You're always bad cop.

Bad cop. Why play against type? Yeah. What else?

As they walked into Dr. Fate's place. I'm glad

every single one of them could fly. They didn't

step on the appropriate area. Woo! Down they

go. Oh, yeah. What's the other thing? What is

it? Who is it? It's... Where was it? No, it's...

Batman, Flash, Green Lantern, and John Jones

do not appear in this episode. Which, the only

two that can't fly out of the seven are Batman

and Flash. And the only one that could read everyone's

minds to figure out what was going on wasn't

there. Yeah. Which brings me to superheroes are

not so good at conversations. Not, hey, what's

going on? What are you doing? No. Oh, my God,

we have to stop him. It's a zombie. Really? Really?

You're going to have some moral problems with

them torturing a zombie? With no soul? Mm -hmm.

Okay. Okay, so, hot girl. Oh, my God, Thanagarian

runes. Is she upset because... that there's some

link to Thanagar? Or is she upset because there's

something that could reveal what she really is?

Dun -dun -dun! Yeah, I like that line when she's

flying around fighting fate. She's like, Thanagarian

ruins! And she finally lands and goes up to him.

What do you know about Thanagar? Talk! The magic

mace does everything. It even makes julienne

fries. Okay, so Aquaman and Wonder Woman, Arthur

and Diana, they're duking it out. Is this warrior

foreplay? I think so. Just goes to show you she

ain't no virgin. And seriously, Dr. Fate, you're

going to take these people that are going to

do massive amounts of damage, move them out of

your home, put them to places that obviously

are of major historical importance, and have

ley lines. Really? You're going to do that? You're

going to destroy these places of power? Wonderful.

Way to go, fate. You are right on top of that.

Throw them in New Jersey or something. Throw

them, like, in the desert away from the pyramids.

Really? That's the first place you're going to

think of to send them? Way to go, genius. Don't

send the one girl that's got the mace that's

demolished the outside of your house. No, keep

her around to keep doing damage in the house.

What is this guy thinking? I don't know. Oh,

wow. What else you got? That's all I got for

this one. All right. I'm just kind of looking

through the wiki to see if there's anything else

interested by... This is just part one, isn't

it? That is just part one. Wow. For a second

there, I was going to end the show early and

not even talk about part two. You really don't

like this episode. No, it's not that. I lost

my train of thought. Alright, in part two...

Wait, weren't you doing this one? Continue on,

good sir. I'll finish it, I guess. As the creature

hovers above them, Dr. Fate tries to cast a spell

to banish it away. The creature attacks, but

Hot Girl insists Fate... assists Fate, also speaking

the incantation. Fate explains that his spell

only bought them some time, and is curious to

know how Hot Girl knew the incantation. She explains

that it is something like a prayer on Thanagar.

Superman and Wonder Woman demand answers, and

Fate conjures up an image while he and Aquaman

explain. Thousands of years ago, Atlantis flooded

above the waves. Ruled by sorcerer kings in the

reign of King Poseidon, the ancient world come

under attack by the Old Ones, extra -dimensional,

who were preparing the way for their master,

Cthulhu. Poseidon drew upon nearly all of Earth's

ambient mystical energy to create the trident

which destroyed the already present Old Ones

and sealed Cthulhu's portal. However, it also

caused Atlantis to sink beneath the waves. Now,

I've got to say again, my Disney references are

going to come out here because King Poseidon...

Forming the Trident looks exactly like King Trident,

or King Triton from Little Mermaid. Now the old

ones are trying again. Fate was using Grundy

and the Trident to cast a spell which would prevent

Cthulhu from returning. Wonder Woman and Superman

oppose this, calling it torture, but Hot Girl

says that it's more like a sacrifice. She explains

that the ancient Thanagarians once worshipped

Cthulhu. who gave the primitives culture. Grundy

also insists on going through with the ceremony,

but Superman and Wonder Woman refuse without

another way. Hot Girl says there is. Go to the

old one's world and kill Cthulhu. Through incredibly

risky, Grundy wholly supports the idea, and Fate

agrees that it might be a more effective solution.

Aquaman refuses, however, saying that if they

aren't going to cast a spell, he was to be returned

to Atlantis. Fate sends him home and asks Indra

to remain to help Fate find their way back. The

Justice League, Fate, and Grundy head for Cthulhu's

realm. In Atlantis, Aquaman appears in his throne

room before Mira. The couple greet each other,

and then Aquaman orders his war council to be

summoned, and he realizes that he cannot hear

the creatures of the sea, for they are gone.

Outside the city, a tear opens and a swarm of

old ones head through. In the other realms, Superman

and Wonder Woman are still shocked that anyone

would worship Cthulhu. Hot Girl explains that

Cthulhu gave them agriculture, science, philosophy,

and even the Nth Medal. However, after a time,

they stopped worshiping Cthulhu. Suddenly, the

group are attacked by shrieking monsters, but

they are able to defeat them. They notice a large

swarm heading for a fissure, and Superman and

Wonder Woman head to slow them down. Near Atlantis,

Aquaman leads the Atlantean Navy against the

Old Ones. He calls for help from the sea creatures

and his call is answered. In the other realm,

Hot Girl, Fate, and Grundy find Cthulhu. He recognizes

Hot Girl as a Thanagarian and decides to speak

with her while ordering his minions to destroy

Fate and Grundy. Hot Girl is uninterested in

talking to Cthulhu, revealing that what they

paid for his favor is the souls of the ancient

Thanagarians. Hearing that Cthulhu steals souls,

Grundy becomes convinced that Cthulhu has his,

and manages to force his way inside Cthulhu.

Oh my god, that's messy. Let's see. Elsewhere,

Superman and Wonder Woman are barely able to

hold their own against the Old Ones. When they

begin retreating, Aquaman arrives through the

fissure, and the two leaguers place an asteroid

in the fissure, which Aquaman seals with the

trident. Meanwhile, Grundy has gone on a rampage

within Cthulhu. Oh boy. Talk about your anatomy

classes. Yikes. Damaging membranes and veins,

injuring the monster and allowing Hot Girl to

get free. Making his way to Cthulhu's brain,

Grundy fights a creature that is guarding it,

managing to destroy the beast, but he is mortally

wounded. Hot Girl races to his side and he asks

her to find his soul. Hot Girl flies over Cthulhu's

brain. But the beast is confident that she won't

attack, saying he has faith in her. Hot Girl

agrees and throws her mace into the brain, killing

Cthulhu, heading to Grundy. She comforts him

in his dying hour, saying that his soul is on

the other side. The next morning, the Justice

League, Dr. Fate, Inza, and Aquaman hold a funeral

for Solomon Grundy. Hot Girl doesn't understand

why Solomon Grundy was so calm at the end, but

Aquaman attributes it to Fate. I got Fate, Faith.

Sorry. Going from one character to a concept.

Yes, exactly. So, thoughts? Wow. Okay, so this

is Cthulhu. I love Cthulhu. The Danigarian prayers.

Okay. I Cthulhu. Is he the fishy Cthulhu? Extremely

primitive culture, and no one cares about Grungy's

wishes. He's just a slab of meat. Let's see.

Okay, so other monsters that we see, we see a...

I can't even say this, because this is H .P.

Lovecraft. Egolinak, which is the creatures with

the screaming little mouths in their hands, no

heads, huge bodies. We know now why Atlantis

stays viable, because of the magic. We do see

that dynamic growing through this episode of

Grindy and Hot Girl. Hot Girl smash! Yeah, I

wrote that down too. Let's see. We find out a

lot more about Thanagar. That they're very warlike.

This is where the basis of their culture has

come from. So what does that say about them now?

foreboding for the future. So, he can't hear

them, but he can make an army appear. Go figure.

Well, now, wait a minute. His army, that actually

kind of, well, it doesn't really tie into one

of my notes, but his army is the army of Atlantean

soldiers. It's not the sea creatures. So, he

had already mentioned that he was going to get

his war council together. I don't know. I guess.

What else? The quote, my hands are tied. Yeah,

nothing to say. I've got a gesture for you, but

my hands are tied. My hands are tied. Grundy

going completely apeshit inside the monster.

How exactly do you poison a zombie? I don't know.

Honestly, the high point of this was definitely

Grundy's death. Oh, yeah. The tombstone was very,

very apropos. Yeah. The start of the whole Solomon

Grundy poem. And the atheist and the priestess

are walking through a hall, having a theological

discussion. Through a hell, having a theological

discussion. Yeah. That's what I got. Alright.

I should point out, I'm just looking at the wiki

here still. The team of Aquaman, Dr. Fate, and

Solomon Grundy parallel the Defenders, a Marvel

comic superhero team. The DCAU team, as I said,

is Aquaman, Dr. Fate, Inza, and Solomon Grundy,

which the Defenders team was Namor for Aquaman,

Dr. Strange for Dr. Fate, Cleo for Inza, and

the Hulk for Grundy. And I gotta say, I really

thought, the first time I ever saw Grundy, I'm

like, wait, isn't that just the Hulk? That's

just a gray Hulk. Let me see here. What was the

other list here? Do you know who voiced Cthulhu?

No. Who was it? Whoa! Rob Zombie voiced Cthulhu.

No shit. Really? Rob Zombie. That's appropriate.

You already mentioned about the Thanagarian backstory.

The Hot Girl Smash. Oh, my other note about the

army thing. Okay, so I get that the trident can

hurt these creatures, but what the fuck is the

Atlantean battle cruiser going to do? They're

not magical as far as I can tell. They have actual

weapons. They're going to make it look squiddish.

They won't attack us. We look like squids. Just

like their master. Yes. And Grundy turns... turns

from a villain to a good guy, and he becomes

a redeemable character. I mean, he doesn't...

Not that there's a whole lot of depth to Solomon

Grundy, but before this, he was always a villain.

Well, was he really a villain, or was he just

somebody that was a rogue? Because he was in

it for the money. Yeah, well... He was in the

Injustice Gang, so, I mean, they were villains.

I mean, he's not like a big bad villain. I mean,

he's no Brainiac, he's no Luthor, he's no Darkseid,

but he's still on the bad side. And then I like

the, you already mentioned, you didn't say what

it was, but you already mentioned the Solomon

Grundy born on a Monday. I like that. That's

cool. What else do we have to say about this

final episode today? Anything? I thought it was

really cool, but that's because I'm a Lovecraft

geek. Yeah, I... Just to see that monster thrown

in there, I'm like, I know that thing! That thing

killed me several times in the role -playing

game. Oh, boy. Alright. Yeah, overall, this one

was better than Eclipse. We have two good episodes

this week, and we have one bad one. Better World

and Terra Beyond are fairly okay. Well, Better

World is good. Terra Beyond is okay. And Eclipse

is just horrible. It's not quite as horrible

as the one that shall not be named, but it's

still definitely bad. Yeah, no, it's not as horrible

as the one that shall not be named, but it's

still horribly bad. Alright, so you are going

to hear some more audio and then we are going

to come into the outro and then we will leave

you guys off. So we will be back after this.

Just like I know you're going to. Do that. What

are you hiding for? I do my best work in the

dark. I used to think that too. But what have

you ever accomplished from there? Aside from

scaring a few punks half to death and putting

a few more in jail. It all adds up. Not fast

enough. If you really want to make a difference.

If you want to change the system instead of just

patching it. You can't be subtle. You've got

to step into the sunlight. Take over, like we

did. Think about it. A world where there's no

crime, no victims, no pain, and no choice. Who

elected you anyway? Who elected you? The problem

with democracy is it doesn't keep you very safe.

It has other virtues, but you seem to have forgotten

them. I didn't forget. I just chose peace and

security instead. You grabbed power. And with

that power, we've made a world where no eight

-year -old boy will ever lose his parents because

of some punk with a gun. This is quote number

one. Uh, sorry, Artie. The endorsement thing's

really not working for me. But I know someone

who might be looking for representation. Mofir's

job to preserve the world. So when Mofir need

fast, fast, fast relief from cramping, burning,

itching, Mofir always reach for Gloxitol. This

is quote number two. We'll go out the back. You

fooled him. Even I thought you were him. I am

him. Well, that's it for us. This has been Episode

9. As I said before, we've had one pretty good

episode, we've had one okay episode, and we've

had one just holy fuck, let it die in a fire

episode. So we go from good to holy fuck to okay.

Let's see. Do we want to bring up anything else

before we go into the outro? I think we're going

to be seeing a lot of increases in what we've

got for story. Oh, yes. Yes. Very much so. And

I will be bringing that up once I get to that,

like when I mention next week's episode. Thank

you for joining us here on the Secret Origins

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Podcast. I wish you will join us next time for...

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four more stories of Justice League Season 2,

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next time.