Survivor Series 2017 Review

Oh boy. This is not good for Jericho. Every action,

there is a reaction. All fellas were about to

have my favorite kind of flashback. Yeah, I think

we're going old school. Shield style. Ladies

and gentlemen, welcome to the podcast arena.

Coming to the ring at this time. Welcome to mayhem

mics. This is episode 27 of the podcast I'm of

course do you have to remind joining me is Ryan

the name flow Merkley. Hello, sir. Hello How

are you? Thank you. Yeah i'm good it's been a

while yeah it has been a while since we did episode

twenty six part one of our of the may young classic

coverage here on mayhem mics for geek cast radio

on this week and geek and i moved i'm getting

married uh... whole bunch of crap is happening

not not literal crap but you know just whole

bunch of life maybe i should have just done a

solo show or something i've been doing that thing

yeah well you know you've been working and all

that and everything else We're getting kind of

back into it and things like that and we're gonna

catch everybody up on kind of what's I've been

paying attention. I've been watching the shows,

but like I have like I think I'm marathoned Hell

in a Cell and TLC like within one day and I just

like I Don't know they just weren't that great

of pay -per -views I watched them when they aired

and I had the same thing where I was kind of

getting burned out. But I think, uh, so NXT takeover

war games happened on Saturday and it was quite

good. And then survivor series, which we'll get

into was good overall. And so I think that sort

of helped reinvigorate me. I'm going to be blunt

about this too. One thing that really helped

to be on perfectly honest. I'm so happy Jinder

Mahal doesn't have the title. I don't know he's

got a rematch. I know and I sort of half feel

bad because actually his lead -up when they were

you know faking people out including me thinking

that it was gonna be Jinder and Brock he actually

did a good job like he dropped the I'm an evil

foreigner and that's why you all hate me stuff

yeah and actually let himself be More than one

dimension and it so he started to improve But

then of course they put the belt on AJ and I'm

never gonna complain about that because he is

Fantastic. No, I'm not gonna use the other It

starts sounding with an F, but it spells pH to

describe him. He is but anyway I'm super happy

about that so that helped a lot and uh seeing

a Brock match that was really good and competitive

helped a lot too which we'll get into and some

of the other stuff uh I'm gonna be blunt again

I've always been a fan of Owens and Zane and

turning Zane at Hell in a Cell and really injecting

some life into him and his character and giving

him something to do made me really happy. I'm

still not big on the fact they have Owens as

a coward. I think he works better as an evil,

heel kind of guy, but whatever. I still enjoy

him and he's one of the better reasons to watch

SmackDown. And yeah, so I mean, I've started

enjoying things a lot more after it just seemed

like a lot of the stuff I enjoyed was kind of

spinning its heels. And we'll get into some of

the other stuff that I've enjoyed because a lot

of them are on this show. So absolutely. For

me, the biggest thing. Finally, the shield have

come back. Yeah, I was gonna get into that on

the show, but yes, I definitely enjoy that as

well. Although for real this time after sort

of a false start due to illness. Yeah, we've

said on this podcast before, we do not wish any

of the performers any ill will or anything, but

all of that news about like 16 or 17 different

people all getting the same virus at the same

time was... Little Ironic I guess you could say

But yeah before we forget that there were some

firings. Unfortunately. Well, yes there were

away So, I mean the most notable one I'd say

overall was Emma which was surprising I don't

wish for anybody to lose their job. So when I

say this it's not because I want to see her gone,

but They kept, you know, Dana Brooke and some

of the other ones that need work. And I would

argue that Brooke is not as polished as Emma

was. Emma's a little more versatile, but for

whatever reason, they gave her the hook. And

again, you know, that's not to say that I want

to see Brooke gone. She's young and she's getting

better and these things take time. But you could

say the same stuff about Emma and she was further

along. Mm -hmm. That was just weird to me. Yeah,

I don't know which one of the two of them has

been with WWE longer But like I remember Emma

way back before Santino left because they had

the whole Yeah, Emma's been around and been with

the company for quite some time. Yeah, and that

was just a little crazy Yeah, and I mean, so

yeah, I'll go back to that group. I guess Darren

Benjamin I like Darren Young. Sorry, Darren Young.

Geez, not Shelton Benjamin. He's back. I was

going to say, wait a second, he's back. Sorry,

Darren Young. He had issues getting over, and

to be blunt, he got hurt a lot. And that's really

unfortunate and not a good mix. But you know,

again, he's another guy. He's not old. You know,

he can leave and come back much like Shelton

Benjamin, who I mixed him up with, apparently.

And so, yeah, I mean, I wish him the best. And

then Summer Rae, Summer Rae is not really a wrestler.

No, she's not. I don't think she's ever really

been a wrestler. I don't even think when I was,

which I don't anymore, I very rarely did. It

was more Mike's thing, Dodd's thing than mine.

When I saw her several times on Total Divas,

she was there just for the quote unquote reality

of the program. She wasn't there for behind the

scenes training, like when Naomi was on there

and that kind of stuff. Like Naomi would actually

go, we would see her go do training and things

like that. And I think Summer Rae was just there

for the eye candy or whatever. Yeah. And I'm

not trying to diminish her. She did some work

on TV, she acted, that kind of thing. But yeah,

I mean, the days of the characters who are just

there to look good are pretty much done, it seems.

You know, we just had six women called up this

week on Ron smackdown. Yeah, absolutely Sorry,

one return five call -ups but yeah, and they're

all wrestlers various degrees of Experience but

they're all pro wrestlers. And so yeah the days

of sort of the models are gone and speaking of

which I guess on the opposite side and you know

listen I've said I wasn't a fan of the guy but

they released James Ellsworth and you know what

He did a really good job with what he was given,

for the time he was given. He did what he was

brought in for, and you and I weren't big fans

of him. I know a lot of people who weren't, but

good for him. He got to live his dream. He got

to work in WWE. He did everything they asked

of him. He did well with what he was given. You

know, he was asked to act, you know the way he

was it's not on him that we were kind of tired

of his shtick at one point So, yeah, I'm you

know, I don't wish him I'm not gonna sit here

and say I'm glad he's gone. I'm glad he got the

opportunity and was able to kind of live his

dream and get there because I mean let's be honest

too in terms of you know when he works in indie

show or stuff like that now he could make probably

make a much better living than he ever was going

to before so I mean good for him I I don't want

to say this is gonna come out wrong oh geez already

tell it is I'm glad I'm glad they future endeavored

him and not sent him back to NXT for more training

because or whatever because I don't think that

like they did that with with Enzo and Enzo actually

can do that he can go from being on the main

roster back to NXT to further his character to

further his athletic ability Ellsworth you couldn't

have done that. Yeah, I would argue, I mean Enzo's

world's ahead in terms of character. No, he absolutely

is. But I would argue it seems like there's not

a whole lot of hope for him in terms of wrestling.

I mean, I don't know, so I don't know how it

is he's carrying 205 live. Just because I'm kind

of sick of his stick now, maybe other people

aren't and that's why he's able to carry on Right,

but he's also not a good enough wrestler to back

it up at all, especially against some of those

guys in 205. Yeah no he's not like I always saw

Enzo as the mouthpiece that's what I saw him

as was the mouthpiece character like he was not

meant to be the wrestling part of a tag team

or whatever like and what the heck did they let

Cas go cuz no no Cas got hurt Oh Bad tore his

knee to shreds. Oh, that's right Yeah, remember

it was in a match against Enzo and he went to

kick him ends of college You know as he was supposed

to but just when Cass got hung up in the ropes

before going down. Yeah something It's been a

lot of bad luck in the last little bit too with

people who were destined to kind of go on their

own and get a big push too because it happened

at NXT TakeOver where Drew McIntyre, formerly

Drew Galloway for long time WWE folks. But I

mean, he is so much better than he ever was and

he's just, he's amazing on the microphone. He's

a great wrestler. He's got the perfect look.

and then yeah the poor guy in a championship

match which he was the champion in you know tears

is uh i think it's his bicep if i remember correctly

and it could be anywhere from a few weeks to

a full year depending on the severity so blah

that stinks wish him the best but i mean he's

been through way worse than this i mean he got

canned from wwe And did such a good job away

from it. They desperately wanted him back. So

That's pretty impressive. Yeah did Bobby rude

come up right after Brooklyn three Yes, yeah,

he came up on the smackdown just right cuz arid

the original plan here folks was we were going

to do an nxt takeover episode of the podcast

we're gonna do takeover brooklyn three and i

actually did watch this um... that was a good

paper view i think the takeovers are good because

just it's very basic storytelling but there's

nothing wrong with that like it sounds like an

insult but it just kind of works and Yeah, there's

less emphasis on fancy production and that kind

of thing. Absolutely. But yeah, leading up to

Survivor series, I'm kind of, I mean, they're

going back, we'll talk about it at the end here,

but they're kind of going back to that storyline

now with the whole Zane Owens thing against Shane.

But I like that they finally went away from Kevin

constantly. badgering Shane for a while like

I'm glad they kind of dropped that because Survivor

series was coming up and oh my god under siege

oh so cool steve's a doll movie yeah no no yeah

no so so cool and just to see like under siege

was the first time that I probably Will ever

admit this will ever say this and actually mean

it the first time I've ever actually enjoyed

the new day and You guys can listen to the last

26 episodes of this show over the last two and

a half almost three years now I have never ever

said anything, but negative things about the

new day because I just don't this isn't a great

segue to Oh Into what into Survivor Series? Yes

match absolutely And I watched the pre -show.

It was not good. No. There were no fans and the

Alliance Matt Hardy match was thrown together.

Enzo and Callisto match. I mean, Enzo match is

a good bathroom break. And listen, I love Breezango

and I love Owens and Zayn, but there was no heat.

The crowd was not there yet. It was only sort

of okay. So anyway, we opened up with Survivor

series. There's 14 minutes of Packages here though.

Yeah, there is like when I mentioned that NXT

It's kind of nice that they do sort of very basic

storytelling the packages like that are a great

example They're much shorter versus, you know

14 minutes of video before a match Seems a bit

excessive maybe like uh... okay so yeah for us

it does and i get why they do it though they

do it for those of the people that are watching

that don't will make i don't know if all let's

say for example ten thousand people or however

many that fill whatever where was served services

was not wasn't in staples where the hell was

it used in I don't know how many off the top

of my head feel like normally WrestleMania and

it's WrestleMania it's special I get it it's

different but normally WrestleMania they have

something like anywhere between twelve and seventeen

thousand people or something Maybe not all of

those people that go to the live events watch

every single thing I know you're gonna say that

but my argument to that by the way would just

be Then why show the videos or talk about it

before the matches again? That is true you really

only need it once you don't beat me over the

head or even worse now I don't remember them

doing it in this pay -per -view, but in past

ones they've replayed the same video package

on the same pay -per -view that drives me nuts

when they do that. Yeah, that's a little crazy.

My attention span's not that bad. Aw, come here,

kitty cat. You're so cute. See, folks, his attention

span is that bad. Nah, I'm just kidding. So yeah,

we opened with Shield and New Day. I'm just gonna

jump to that. And this match was really awesome.

So this was perfect because I mean the loss doesn't

hurt the new day the shield should have won Yeah,

but it doesn't hurt the new day. They still got

to look tough and competitive The match itself

was quite good. Everybody got to do things Everybody

got in their offense and everybody looked great

It wasn't jaw -droppingly great, but I also have

nothing bad to say about any of it So no and

and the whole the only thing I don't like about

the current new day shit stick going into this

Against the shield was oh you guys broke up once.

You know just give it six months You'll be broken

up again, and one of you will be on a chair like

not like They've derived there. They may not

be wrong Let's hope not. I mean damn it. We just

got him back, but like okay. Yes, Seth and Dean

both have been champions I think Roman was a

champion for like five seconds at least once

yeah, I mean he's a isn't he isn't in Intercontinental

now anyone on monday anyone monday so okay but

what i'm saying is between the time that they

first came on the scene to the time they broke

up to now like all three of them have been champions

to me it's better to leave them as a team that

would that the team that will come in and just

run house you don't need to have them as tag

champs or whatever like you can have one of the

week will be really interesting i don't think

this could ever happen is all three belts on

the men's world yeah wait who is the u .s. below

no that's callisto isn't new the u .s. is on

a is on the other show be it's baron corbin and

i was record What I was going to say well what

would be interesting is if the shield are on

either show one of them is champ like WWE or

Universal Champion one of them has Intercontinental

one of them has US but obviously the US and Intercontinental

belts are on different shows now So that would

have been an interesting way to have them all

3b champions while they're still the shield Yeah,

you're right. There's nothing like Totally epic

to write home about this match, but just seeing

the three of them work again And like I said,

I just I have nothing negative to say about it's

fantastic. No. Yeah, absolutely Then we get the

traditional survivor series five on five women's

match This served its purpose really really well

in that The story being told was that Oscar is

an ass -kicking machine and the rest of the match

was sort of almost a throwaway to do that and

in that sense it worked because I mean one of

the problems when you get this many people in

a match is making you got to pick your spots

because not everybody's gonna be able to look

good and it kind of sucks that Bailey and poor

Becky Lynch who's kind of been on the receiving

end of a lot of beatdowns lately but you know

they became the first ones to be eliminated and

that's really unfortunate but i mean somebody

had to go you know to get out of the way to tell

the story and we'll see that we'll see that again

in the finale so i don't think this was a great

match but it did what it was supposed to do so

in that sense it worked i have a hard time saying

a lot negative about it because it did it told

the story it was clearly supposed to Absolutely

it did and Asaka looked really really good like

I wasn't even sure like I didn't I know they're

not gonna bury Asaka at all cuz um she asked

anyway Oscar she kicks a lot of ass in general

and she was the NXT women's champion for the

longest time yeah and why would you bury somebody

that just came up like I can see if she'd been

there three or four months and wasn't really

taken but she's a kick -ass woman and it's you

know yeah give her give her the win or let her

you know get the win from the other women and

she could beat the shit out of me like that's

for sure You'd enjoy it too much. Probably not.

As I'm spitting out my teeth. Hey, we can call

you the Canadian version of Cesaro. Yeah, minus

the athleticism and talent. Also, I think he's

a better speaker than I am and that's with the

mouth guard, but anyway. No, I mean, it did work.

Had to do and I mean she was the story of this

they found a way to get Naya out without her

being pinned with the Countout which by the way,

when's the last time we saw a countout? It's

been a while When's the last time we saw a countout

in a women's match? Like the last time I saw

a countout was was like the Uso countout stuff

that happened when they just left or when Miz

has done countout stuff in the past and he's

left but like seriously though when's the last

time you saw a wwe women's match countout whether

it's a singles match whether it's a tag team

whether it's a whatever like you don't see them

very often if at all um just absolutely amazing

uh and i can't wait to see what Oscar does even

more in the future Then we had Baron versus Miz

for the US title. Oh look time for a bathroom

break So Miz for quite some times been the best

heel on TV period he was really strong on smackdown

then he moves to raw and I'd still say he's the

best heel on raw But man, these two just did

not gel and corbin corbin can be really strong

when he's with the right people but the right

people was not news this was just kind of that

it felt like a tb match i guess is yet and it

did and honestly since baron lost money in the

bank most of his matches have felt just like

tb matches like i like baron i think he's a cool

guy he's got some cool moves and he's got an

interesting character but they're not really

pushing him too much they're just kinda shuffling

him around ever since he lost the suitcase or

the briefcase or whatever kinda yeah they gave

him the belt a bit of a consolation prize now

it looks like they're gonna push him further

because he had an altercation with bobby rude

which by the way i think is a mistake because

i think it's gonna leave rude dead in the water

but we'll see yeah let's hope not uh... i was

really hoping after this we could go back to

the Miztourage versus the Shield, like Miz and

the Miztourage versus the Shield, if the Shield

and New Day thing is done. Because again, and

we've talked about this, like Seth and Dean,

you know, played out the whole will they, won't

they get back together thing for as long as they

could. And then Roman was just over in hater

country, because everybody hates him. That was

the other thing. He's like, oh. cheers i kinda

like this i've got a missus uh... i thought that

was hilarious uh... they work well together it

was well with pretty much anybody though so i'm

curious to see where he goes now because i mean

he lost the title the roman uh... if he's gonna

feud with them or what is one of the issues they

have is Without Brock there, whether Brock's

a good guy or bad guy, they don't have a lot

of heals there. I mean, Kane is a part -timer

who's kind of feuding because they don't seem

to know what to do with Bronn. Yeah, but see,

I like Kane versus Bronn, though. For me, I mean,

there's no nice way to put this, but I mean,

Kane's best days are long past, and I can't get

a taste of corporate Kane and that run with Seth.

out of my mouth either. That was not a good...

That was great. Yeah, it wasn't great at all.

But see, that's the thing here with Brawn. Like,

I think that's... Yes, you're right. Kane is

up there in age and things like that. And he's,

you know, he should be on his way out, maybe,

potentially. But I think this is re... reenergized

him to the point of hey I was the original monster

character kind of thing and maybe so but I think

the other half of it is just that brawn as Much

as he's learned in the past year or so and as

you know He's gotten so much better than I ever

thought he was gonna be and you could argue that

he's one of the top guys Actually, I would say

he's one of the top guys and he's one of the

top attractions period for them But he needs

to be in a match with the right guy yet. He's

still not at the point As much as I hate to say

it the lesnar stroman match was kind of a dud

They basically just traded finishers Yeah, and

that was about it. It wasn't long and that kind

of thing So, I don't know. I just think that

came in his prime I think would have had no problem

kind of carrying him and doing stuff, but How

much does he have left? And I mean, he's in the

middle of a mayoral race in real life. I just

don't know if... I'm just not a fan of the whole

part -time stuff and we're gonna get into it

with Cena in a bit too, but I'm not a fan of

just bringing somebody back just to make other

people look good really quick. You know, they

appear and they're pretty much gone. Yeah, you're

right. I mean, the angle's not done yet. I'm

complaining about something that I haven't even

seen, so I should probably just shut up. I mean,

I've liked Braun ever since the Wyatt family

split because, like, the Monster Among Men kind

of, like... I've never really been a fan of the

Monster characters. Just hasn't been my thing.

but I really dig him and all the stuff they set

up for him like that whole garbage truck thing

like wow I know that was obviously very staged

but damn you know it was just super awesome so

up next we've got the Usos versus Seamus and

Cesaro Um Seamus and Cesar are a really good

tag team, but like I don't see them I Don't know.

I don't really see them doing much right now

Like they've got this little feud with the Usos

and stuff But they're all separate shows so it's

done. Yeah, that's yeah The thing was so Cesar

and Seamus I think are a really good tag team

They work really well together, but there's not

a lot of competition on raw right now And that's

one of their problems. The Usos have, they've

set up Benjamin and Gable for the Usos, so I

think they have somewhere to go after this. And

the Usos, by the way, have been just... Utterly

fantastic this past year now their stuff with

the new day has been terrific They've just been

on a whole other level and I'd say Cesaro and

Seamus have been just fantastic to their stuff

with the shield was great But you can't have

them feud with the shield forever. So That's

gonna be their issue. They need to pull somebody

up out of the raw tag roster and give them something

to They need to give Seamus and Cesaro somebody

new to work with Obviously no offense meant to

Dean and Seth were amazing. Oh, no. Yeah Well

with Dean and Seth now doing the shield stuff

and the way I see the shield as I said earlier

is I see them not net they are a Team, you know

an entity within WWE, but I see them more as

the people that come in and screw things up for

somebody else. They're not out to get the championship

-type stuff. Not for the tag part of it. If each

of them want, like I said before, an actual championship

belt for individuals, fine, but tag belts, it's

just... just doesn't seem like it'll work well

it's one of the problems too with raw in particular

because they've got a guy they've got a belt

that's essentially not never defended and not

there and you know whatever you think of brock

and what they do with them it just i don't know

i feel like it kind of hurts to not have the

belt there although having said that too uh See,

I kind of want them to add belts, but not to

the men's side, so I don't really want any new

ones or anything Just for the record a friend

of mine Pitched the idea of there should be a

women's tag belt Tag belts I should say on each

brand especially with them adding more people

from NXT now. That's not a bad idea No, that's

a very good idea and what is so funny that you

bring that up is the one of the women that came

up from nxt was someone we saw in the may young

classic part one sarah logan which we'll get

to someday yeah we will we'll get to it anyway

so we then had the queen versus the goddess man

this was a good match because so i think i've

mentioned it a few times that bliss has been

a little in a green will say and she needs the

right people to work with and Apparently Charlotte

is the right person to work with Charlotte's

really stepped up her game And I think it's interesting

or at least it's interesting me Yeah, she's done

a lot of her best stuff now as a face right and

That's harder at least for most people than being

a heel and to be fair with her. It's probably

Easier to be a heel because I mean she's a flair

she's got years of the name and She's got all

of this different stuff her father was able to

do etc etc that she can play off of But she's

not able to use that when she's being the good

guy so and she doesn't really well she's an Excellent

wrestler, and she's gotten much better on the

microphone as the times gone by She has very

much so and I think like you say like Alex is

kind of green But she can probably learn a lot

from Charlotte and them feuding makes like okay.

I know it's not gonna It's just gonna be this

because they're on two different brands, but

if they were on the same brand and feuding like

that to me would be an interesting storyline

basically Queen versus goddess who came first

yada yada yada Alex is gonna have really good

another really good veteran trainer now with

page back though though who's been wrestling

for quite some time, so You know what the sad

thing is, is when Paige came out and Tom Phillips

is like, oh, and she's not alone. She's got,

I really thought that Alberto was gonna come

out with her. I know, I know, but that's really

what I thought was gonna happen. Anyway, but

yeah, Charlotte wins this one, so it would be

interesting to see if they do another one with

these two at the next, what is it, Royal Rumble?

that's the next two brand pay -per -view i think

yeah but there may not be crossover there's rumors

that and i don't think it'll happen because i

don't think they have quite enough but there's

people that have talked about will they have

a woman's bed uh raw rumble for the first time

ever which is an interesting idea The rosters

aren't quite large enough. They'd have to call

up a good number of people from either NXT or

call up some veterans who have retired or just

haven't been around WWE for a while. But we'll

see. It's weird. It's crazy to me to see how

far they've come in a fairly short amount of

time. We went from, I mean, we were just talking

about it that We've gone from the models That

really can't wrestle and that's not what they

were there for To they're actually wrestlers

You know, they've gotten to do a TLC match or

sorry a Hell in a Cell match They've gotten to

do hardcore matches It's really interesting to

me it's sad that it took this long but yeah,

it's nice to see finally at least absolutely

it is yeah then there was AJ versus Brock this

was kind of one -sided like fantastic no no it

is a fantastic match I'm saying in the very beginning

very one -sided towards Brock because he was

just throwing AJ around like a ragdoll In the

very beginning of oh, yeah, but I'm that's part

of the story is that AJ was able to overcome

And of course because under threat of quitting

Brock's gonna win No, I think this was the right

call. I don't I think a loss so the thing with

Brock being an attraction unfortunately is the

fact that bronc is an attraction and because

of that him losing hurts way more than AJ AJ

can withstand pretty much anything and part of

it too is his character because you no offense

to him because he looks fantastic and is in better

shape than I will ever be but he looks like a

guy you could believe can lose and he looks like

and it just because of that I think it doesn't

hurt him as well as the fact that he's more than

good enough on the microphone and in the ring

to make up for anything so I think it's just

the right decision because when Brock loses it

needs to be a colossal deal If AJ were to win,

I don't know if that makes him a bigger star

or not. He's already a ridiculously big star.

And he's more than talented enough to make himself

a big star on his own. He doesn't need somebody

to make him a bigger star. So I think it was

the right decision. I think it's interesting

to me. I mean, watch them watching the match.

Brock was obviously into it and wanted to AJ

to look great Because I mean watch how he sells

he sold the holds the calf crusher Better than

he sold anything undertaker did to him. No offense

to undertaker, obviously Yeah, but I mean he

really looked clearly liked working with AJ yeah

And it's too bad that they're on two different

shows because The feud between the two of them

would be awesome a rematch would be nice. Yeah.

Well Yeah, i'm curious what they do with uh brock

next because yeah, they don't seem to have anything

lined up for him But yeah, this was a fantastic

match I think this is one of the better matches

i've seen this year I don't know if it's an absolute

sort of match of the year Pick but it was very

very good Yep, absolutely and then we have the

five -on -five traditional survivor series men's

team rovers smackdown so you're much pretty much

made the evening for me it was my mention the

night and i loved it uh... this much not so much

uh... what i said earlier about in multi -person

matches you pretty much got to pick and choose

who you wanna look good They made Stroman look

good. He was kind of the story. But they also

made the older guys hang around a bit long. Yeah,

Sino was there as a part timer. He pretty much

came out to deliver a couple AAs and then get

eliminated. So with him, my question would be

who did that serve and why bring him back just

for Basically a cameo He really didn't set anything

up for for the future or anything he just oh

Gave a couple A's and got pinned. I don't think

it does his character any real good or anything

He was just kind of there. You could have gotten

pretty much anybody to be there Yeah, pretty

much like if it's John Cena who's a 16 time champion,

whatever you think of him, etc, etc He should

be a big deal. He shouldn't just be a guy who's

there to you know, do two moves and that's about

it Yeah, I mean John is you know He's 15 years

into his career He's if he's gonna be a part

-timer they need to do kind of the Brock thing

though. He should be a big Yeah, not just hey,

let's just shove them in a match Yeah, that's

that's what I was gonna say. It was that he is

essentially a Brock Lesnar type. That's what

it should be. If he's going to go part -time,

because he's even said, you know, hey, you know,

I'm not going to be able to do this forever.

I'd like to, you know, he's, he's, you know.

In 15 years, we've seen him work more than most,

if not everyone else on that roster that's been

there, whether it's five minutes or five years.

John has done a hell of a lot more in and out

of Ring than most people. and he deserves to

be that quote unquote legendary status or brock

lesnar type status thing um not just and they

they tried which is so stupid Stephanie is like

belittling Kurt for not because of the whole

thing now free agent John Cena He's not on either

show he can go either way Like they tried that

and then the whole storyline switched because

Triple H is coming back and I swear to God I

hope you saw I don't know if you saw this on

Facebook when I posted it, but I'm like The Raw

right before Survivor Series when they're like,

oh, name the fifth person. If you're not going

to do it, as soon as Triple H was in Kurt's face,

I'm like, oh, hi Walter White, hi Season 5 Walter,

because I swear to God, it looks just like Bryan

Cranston. Obviously a bigger, more buffer version

of Cranston as Walter White in Breaking Bad,

but I'm like, damn Triple H. That this was a

change of plans or anything. I'm pretty sure

this was the actual Plan it's just they wanted

to set up The Jason Jordan stuff. Yeah, he's

inevitably gonna turn on his dad and That's kind

of what this match was was a lot of setup Yeah,

my issue is just that it didn't do anything for

so many guys. So continuing down the list I don't

think it did anything for Cena it really didn't

do much for Orton, but And whatever there to

be honest at this point it didn't do much for

rude or Nakamura I mean Nakamura is another guy

who they should be building a sort of an attraction

and Rude is so new Anytime they kind of get him

beat down or anything like that. I think it hurts

is his credibility and then switching over to

team raw Oh boy, alright, there's no nice way

to say this, but Angle and Hunter at points just

looked kinda old. Yeah, every time that Kurt

is shown from the right the right side of his

face is Shown towards the can't like towards

the television screen towards the camera that

thing up on his tent the part of his skin up

on his temple that kind of Juts out like whatever

scar that is or whatever injury that was like

It makes me think the guy has cancer. I know

he doesn't have that's been happening for years

to be honest. Okay, well Yeah, but like yeah,

I mean both of them looked like they did really

looked a lot better in the match although you

know sound of decent amount of it out with the

shield, but having said that he and hunter in

real life worked basically a full week of the

schedules before this i think they just got beat

up and kind of run down like the both of them

haven't worked for quite some time yeah i can't

imagine stepping into a wrestling ring ring and

having full matches for a week after not doing

it in forever and then going okay it's time for

my pay -per -view debut for the first time in

x number of months or in the case of angle over

a year yeah that's crazy i'm impressed that they

were able to do it so i'm not trying to bag on

them it's just something that kind of hurt this

match and just to finish off the raw side uh

i don't think they did a lot too i mean they

tried to further the battler joe stuff Mm -hmm,

but I don't think it did a lot for them and Lastly

Braun was the big star which was the smart thing

to do I'm not saying there's anything wrong with

that but you've got a lot of guys who are basically

older or part -timers in this match and I feel

like they hurt some of the ones that are around

all the time in rude Nakamura Orton and Balor

Joe Yeah, I think the only cool thing for me

with this match was John and Randy actually working

together because normally they're in feuds with

each other. I thought that was really cool Kurt

you're right between him and Triple H Kurt looked

better when he was filling in for Roman as the

third member of the shield. He really looked

better. It looked like he was ready to go. He

did very well in that match. But this, he just

looked like he was ready to go to sleep. Hey,

we can bring back CM Punk. No, not really one.

He looks Yeah, he looks like he had an injury

on his leg too and apparently did and that kind

of thing. It just kind of built over that week

of Coming back so that hurt him as well. And

you know stuff like that happens Yeah, I do.

Yeah having said that I definitely look forward

to seeing angle in the ring again I hope for

both he and Hunter's sake, because it feels like

it's inevitable the two of them will have a match

too, I hope for both their sake that they sort

of, and I'm sure they will, they'll continue

training leading up to it. These guys are way

smarter than I am. I don't need to tell them

what to do physically. Basically what I'm trying

to say is I'm sure the next time the two of them

are in the ring, they're going to look way better

than here. I'll probably end up eating not eating

my words necessarily just forgetting about the

performance in this match so yeah and that's

the thing like do I want to see Angle and Hunter

again yes what I don't want to see happen is

this whole oh Stephanie's gonna fire Kurt because

Kurt didn't do his job like in the storyline

of it like yes if he's not doing his actual job

yes fire the guy but the whole storyline thing

of oh if you don't get this done if team raw

doesn't win you lose your job yada yada yada

I hate that crap rose back to the whole Stephanie

is gonna fire somebody yeah meanwhile on smackdown

I think it's more interesting that it seems like

Shane and Daniel aren't getting along yeah and

he kind of got the wild cards in Owen and Zane

yeah that to me is more interesting than raw

where it feels like we've seen that story before

that yeah stephanie's mad at somebody who wants

to get rid of somebody but and see here i thought

with the return like as soon as triple h came

out and announced that he was the fifth member

of like oh great the authorities back yay uh...

no with shane and brian i don't know what brian's

current health situation is But like for one

match Shane and Brian versus Triple H and like

having basically Commissioner whatever obviously

Stephanie's the Commissioner couldn't really

work But like I would like to see Kurt and Triple

H versus Shane and Brian that would be cool Yeah,

I gotta think though that if Brian's coming back

I'm not trying to insult Shane or anything, but

I got to think if Brian's coming back And it's

gonna be a one more match kind of thing. He's

either There's just better choices. I think a

lot of people love to see what he would do against

Lesnar I Think a lot of people love to see him

finally blow off his stuff with the Miz which

was long -standing or What about Brian and AJ

is obviously a huge one. I think there's a lot

of better choices. Yeah, I'm just saying if somehow

something happens, he ends up back full or part

time and change the start. I think that works.

That's OK. Yeah, I mean, yeah, you're right.

I'd like to see, you know, the whole Daniel Brian

Miz thing. I think that's cool. um the um yeah

oh no wait no that won't work damn ah this stupid

brand separation crap i mean to be fair if they're

gonna do if they're gonna do anything with daniel

and or cain like at one of the team up pay -per

-views have team hell no come back but obviously

that's not gonna happen to be fair this is pro

wrestling where you can just arrange whatever

you want really i mean that's true if they want

a match they find a way to make it happen you

just change the story people get fired quote

-unquote on tv and wrestling all the time and

somebody brings them back or yeah there's a loophole

i mean there's always ways to write around something

and I'm not trying to it's not just wrestling

either. I mean TV shows do the same thing too

Hey, these characters work better together than

the ones we got let's change the script Yep,

absolutely Overall I very much enjoyed Survivor

series. It was a hell of a lot better than TLC

or Hell in a Cell the only difference is I think

Kurt as I said before Kurt did better at TLC

with shield than he did in the in the Survivor

Series match Yeah, and overall it is nice to

see him back though. I mean his story is a great

one of redemption overcoming a lot of obstacles

Absolutely on a scale of zero to five stars,

what would you give Survivor Series? I'll say

a high four Yeah, I'm right there with you like

four or four and a half something like that.

It was really really good I'm interested to see

what the smackdown thing is for Clash of Champions

how they're gonna handle that Because I always

felt the jilt on built on gender. Don't put the

belt on gender no offense to gender but if he

keeps doing the a the I'm an evil foreigner and

then be the I Need the Singh brothers to interfere

in every single one of my matches and they end

the same way No He's just not a very interesting

champion like I get it They need the India market

kind of thing like we've talked about before

they need those numbers, but oh my god please

stop doing i'm an evil foreigner like get rid

of the same like have something else with the

same brothers make them concessions stand people

i don't care just something else something different

something where they don't have to interrupt

his damn matches for him and oh god yeah no um

At this point, I'd rather see Baron be the WWE

champ. I mean, I like seeing AJ, obviously, but

if there was a choice, and that choice didn't

include AJ, Baron, hell, anybody on the SmackDown

roster. They have a few choices. I think AJ Nakamura

would be a smart one to do eventually, or AJ

Owens, if they continue with that, although I...

Anyway, I can't see that happening Owens kind

of in the doghouse and if you watch the Kevin

Owens 365 which is fantastic and I highly recommend

Yeah, we're gonna You'll be pretty sure that

as long as Vince is around Kevin's not gonna

Be champion probably not a big fan. We'll say

that kind of sucks Yeah, I don't know how he

managed to get on his bad side that bad but whatever

and Then all the recent and then all the recent

stuff. So anyway the which you know, you bring

up Vince and everything else and January is raw

this 25th anniversary It was see the undertaker

I'm hoping for you know Somebody you know Else

as well considering as I think that is pretty

much died down You know Hulkamania come on I

know Vince can hold a grudge, but come on Maybe

I mean at some point. It feels like it's inevitable.

He'll get forgiven Yeah, I don't really want

to go to this We will I mean the issues there's

certain Guys and things, you know, obviously

Now he's gone, but obviously something like what

happened. I really don't want to get into any

of this I'm just gonna skip over it and stop

that sentence right there Alrighty then some

of the long timers I would like to see back though.

I definitely like to see Austin Joe up See, okay.

I get it that this pay -per -view was not in

Dallas, but since it was in Texas and I was really

surprised that Austin didn't somehow show up

here because it's Texas. I know Houston is kind

of Booker's town or whatever, but that's the

other thing. We have to talk about it every episode,

folks. Not just in this pay -per -view, but before

the before Raw and SmackDown, the go -home shows

for Raw and SmackDown before the pay -per -view,

and the after shows, the shows after the pay

-per -view, almost all of the commentary team

sucks. even graves made a couple of mistakes

like even graves made a couple of graves i can

overlook as he's the best out of both teams but

like booker and coal is just michael calls was

his edge it seems to have progressed a bit or

at least he's having a tough Tough last little

bit and that happens. Yeah in Booker's defense

will say this he had you know, the hurricane

Which and no, I don't mean Gregory Helms, but

he had the hurricane come through, you know,

his hometown and everything So yeah, no, I can

understand him being distracted that kind of

thing. Absolutely. It's not been good No, it

is the survivor series stuff with five people.

Are you kidding me? Yeah, that's... The hell

was the point? That's a terrible idea. Okay,

so there were five people on the English -speaking

table, then you had... what was it? Six other

people? Two for whatever country, two for this

country, two for that. What was it? Oh, and don't

forget, for us English speakers, we also had

the panel they kept going back to. So you got

five commentators. You've got a panel of Michaels

who, to be blunt, I mean, Shawn Michaels didn't

really care about being there. I love him, but

he just was kind of like, yeah, whatever. Doop

-da -doo. Yeah. although to be fair if i were

him i would do the exact same thing see now this

would be interesting to me i don't think they're

gonna set this up at all i don't think this will

ever happen if it does i will eat my words but

what i would love to see one last run for dx

and have them go against the shield yeah i can't

see it for michaels yeah obviously not but like

yeah The issue with Michaels is a health one.

I mean, that's true. Hard to overcome. Same with

I'm, you know, I mentioned the undertaker will

be on the 25th anniversary. I'm curious what

capacity are they? Is he going to come back again?

I mean, I can't see it. I don't know. You know,

he didn't look great last time around, but We,

I know I personally have, and stupidly might

I add, written him off before and he's come back

and had solid performances so you just never

know. For all we know, he was sick or he got

injured before the Roman match or there's all

these different factors. And to be honest too,

Roman's gotten better since then as well. It

might have been a combination of things that

just didn't turn out. I guess we'll see. And

I mean, I stand by what I said back then, too,

which is just I just don't want to see the guy

get injured or worse in the ring, too. Absolutely.

No. And we've said this before, too. We don't

want to see anybody get injured. But it's one

of those things where it's an anniversary show.

It's a pretty big anniversary show because it's

been 25 years since Monday Night Raw debuted

this coming January. I want to see as many people

back as we possibly can get, whether it's in

a working capacity, whether it's in just like

a special farewell thing, or whatever, just anything.

Like, I mean, I don't know. Alright, so that's

gonna do it for us I think, unless you've got

anything else you want to say. Nope. All right,

we're gonna get the heck out of here coming up

we've got Clash of champions again, I'm not sure

I'm pretty sure there's gonna be a raw pay -per

-view in December, but I'm not sure I'm getting

married December 6th. So Yeah Might be a little

late. Oh funny Funny guy who's everybody knows

whenever a cake is brought out in a wrestling

ring. Somebody's going in through it Where's

Santino when you really need him? Um, what I

would like to do is I want to do an episode on

these 365 shows Yeah, that'll be good. So for

anyone who doesn't have the network or watch

it those Some of the table for three that some

of these back Behind the scenes things they're

doing are really interesting The 365 thing I

believe and you can correct me because I have

only seen it recently for ads for it It's basically

the year in the life of whatever Superstar they

choose like Kevin Owens like you said earlier

There's a Kevin Owens one. Who else have they

done for 365? 365 Owens is the first. The other

ones are part of the 24 -7. They did the Kurt

Angle one, which was really interesting, where

they followed him around just before his return.

And they've also done Finn Balor, which covered

the span of time after he got injured to when

he comes back, which was also fascinating. Okay,

cool, so we'll do 365 and 24 7 so that'll be

cool Yeah table for three is interesting it ride

-along seems interesting, but it depends on who's

in the car It can be good. It can be not so good.

Not so good. Yeah, so Different stuff coming

up from us as I said earlier in the beginning

of the show We will be doing the second part

of the May Young classic as well because I do

want to watch that Finish that off because the

first part was really interesting We're gonna

be able to find you online sir at night beat

I Am at TF2 and Mike on Twitter. You can follow

at geek cast radio and at this we can geek on

Twitter. I Think we're gonna get the heck out

of here and we will catch you guys next time

here on mayhem mics. You just made the list All

clear