Interviews – S.A. Bradley – Author and Podcaster

Hello and welcome to Geekcast Radio Presents,

an interview that will also be syndicated on

Alter Geek and Studio 2009. I'm one of your hosts

for this evening, Steve Megatron, and joining

me is my usual partner in podcasting crime, TFG1

Mike. Hello. Coming to the studio tonight is

Scott Bradley, and if you're not familiar with

Scott, he's a podcaster knowledgeable in all

things horror. The host of the Hellbent on Horror

podcast, and he's also the author of Screaming

for Pleasure. And if that's not enough, he's

been featured on Sci -Fi Wire and many other

media places. Hello, Scott, and welcome to the

show. Hi, folks. Thanks so much for having me

on. Yeah, thanks for joining us. Yes, thank you

for being here. During the high holidays here.

Halloween, that is. Oh, yeah, yeah. Perfect timing,

too, you know. Yes. We usually have a good sense

of timing around here. Well, it was also beneficial

because your contact I met through podcast movement.

Oh, wonderful. Yeah, Sarah, right? Yeah, and

it was great because we were watching a couple

of different panel things, and then she reached

out to me, and I was like, oh, yeah, totally.

So, yeah, that was kind of a... A work in fate

for the time of year it is. It's amazing how

it happens that way. I do find that if you open

yourself to whatever's going on out there, you

tend to find people who are at least curious

about what you're doing. Yeah, totally. So, Mike,

without further ado. What were you going to say,

Scott? I was just basically going to say that

I find that with doing a horror podcast, whenever

I speak to people about Hellbent for Horror and

they ask me what I'm doing and I say, oh, I talk

about all things horror. Half of the time it's,

oh, wow. And the other half, it's like, oh, isn't

that nice? And what I find is that in both directions,

whenever I have a conversation like that, whether

someone really likes horror or they don't, we

talk about the same amount of time, about 20

minutes go by. before we realize the time has

passed, because it's a very passionate subject,

whether you like it or not. You find that you

probably have distinct opinions about it, and

I find that a lot of the people who listen to

my show will start... getting in touch with me

by way of email and they'll start the email by

saying, I'm not really a horror fan, but, and

they somehow stumbled upon what I was doing and

just starting a conversation is what I usually

try to do. And it's amazing how much you can

really get into that passion, that geek passion

that goes through any kind of pop culture, but

it really does. There's something universal about

horror that people definitely have an opinion.

Yeah, that's actually funny because some of us

on this network have a higher or lower opinion

or are kind of indifferent in general on it,

but it is true. Everybody pretty much has an

opinion on that one genre over many of the others.

Yeah, I think the genre is I'm a genre guy, first

off. And I like to say that I've always been

in love with the cinema and that I love all kinds

of movies. My heart belongs to the horror film.

And it's because it connected with me very early.

And I like to say that people have a first kiss

with horror and sometimes it doesn't go well

and sometimes it does. And that passion can.

color how you look at the entire genre. I find

that people who dislike horror tend to look at

it from the movie that they hated or that they

were scared by. And they assume that all of horror

is going to be that. And people who are huge

fans tend to think that all horror movies should

be exactly like the one that they love. And that's

the only thing that horror is. And both of those

ways are quite limiting. The reality is horror

is truly universal. There's a story out there

for everyone. And I assure you that it isn't

all about gore. It isn't all about dread, and

there's some story out there that is waiting

for you to be able to be a release from the pressure

cooker of life. That's certainly an interesting

way of putting it that I've never thought of.

Yeah, exactly. So as we get started, could you

tell our listeners a little bit about your background?

Sure. Well, I am an author, a speaker, and a

podcaster. As mentioned before, I have a podcast

called Hellbent for Horror. I'm here to remind

you that you used to love horror movies and you

secretly still do. And that podcast is about

everything that's related to horror. I talk about

horror as art and social commentary. I talk about

movies and the books and stories and even music

that shaped me. I like to talk about how music

is a lot like horror as well or vice versa. And

all of that stuff shapes horror as a film style

and an art form. Culture changes art. Art changes

culture. And the book, Screaming for Pleasure,

How Horror Makes You Happy and Healthy, is a

love letter to all those things that go bump

in the night. But not only that, it's about how

horror reinvents itself to reflect each generation's

anxieties. There can also be healing as well

as thrilling. I think that horror is one of the

most diverse and beautiful storytelling styles

that we have. It may be one of the oldest storytelling

styles. It's also tailor -made for allegory.

It's tailor -made for metaphor. It really allows

us to talk about uncomfortable subjects that

we'd never sit to watch in a straight drama.

So it allows for this visceral exploration of

what makes us human. It talks about the emotions

that sometimes we don't want to look at, the

Jungian style of the shadow self, having a healthy,

safe handshake with that part of us that everybody

has. It gives us a place to confront our own

monsters that can't be ignored. A lot of times

we look to science fiction for allegory and metaphor

as well, and horror goes on the other side of

that. And I think horror and science fiction

ask two specific questions of the human experience.

Science fiction asks, how are we going to live?

live with technology? What is it going to do

to us? And horror asks, where are monsters from?

And the answer is almost always right between

our eyes or in our heart or in our stomach. It

tends to come from us. Wow. Or the internet.

Yeah, and the internet. Well, it kind of bleeds

both, you know, sci -fi and horror. Yes, I took

it as hybrid vigor is one of the great things

about horror. It's like, I look at it as like

Frank's Red Hot. It goes with everything. You

basically just put a dash here and there. And

horror is like a magnificent mutt. It allows

itself. Hybrid vigor is the idea of mutt versus

a purebred. Purebred would be the thing that

you know what it's going to be. It's very dependable.

And it does have its issues. If you continue

to do the same thing again and again and again,

it kind of destroys the gene pool. The idea of

hybrid vigor is your mutts get together and you

find the best of all of those breeds coming together.

you have something surprising. And horror does

mix with comedy. It mixes with science fiction.

It mixes with the drama westerns. You can find

anything because it's not really about a setting.

Horror is an emotion first and a setting later.

It really is all about what kind of emotions

it can evoke from you. And so I look at it as,

yeah, science fiction and horror, they're strange

bedfellows sometimes, but they really go together.

very well. Alien would be a great example. So

what specifically drove you into the genre? Was

it a specific film? Was it a certain type of

music? What was it that kind of drove you into

it? That's a great question because I was a scaredy

cat as a kid. I was afraid of everything. And

I grew up as a child. My parents were in a fundamentalist

Christian cult, basically. They thought that

the world was going to end in 1975. It didn't.

So that was kind of embarrassing for everybody,

I'm sure. But it was one of those things where

we are afraid of everything. I was taught to

be afraid. And early on, I saw a movie that I

shouldn't have seen. And so I saw this movie

that was out in the 1970s called Don't Look Now.

And it's not very well known except for in horror

and art films. Actually, in those areas, people

are big on this film because it has one of the

most disturbing beginnings to it. And it's about

a couple of parents who unwittingly let their

child drown in the backyard. And it was this

really artistic, very strange, surreal, time

bending storyline. And I saw it when I was eight

by mistake. My parents were in process of getting

divorced and they were having arguments and they

just basically gave me the TV as a babysitter.

And we just happened to have a home box office

when it was very early, when it was just starting

out. And so this movie was on in the middle of

the day and it shouldn't have been on. And I

watched it and I went into shock. It was a child

about my age. drowning and the parents running

out trying to save her and this very weird look

and i was i had nightmares for three nights in

a row but what ended up happening was i kind

of felt like for the first time i felt kind of

seen the thing that was scary wasn't that a child

drowned that was of course kind of frightening

but the thing was parents couldn't save the kid

And so I suddenly realized, you know, at that

age, obviously, I'm not articulating this. But

what I got was that I was suddenly calm about

how I could not control anything in my life.

I mean, the fact that I was in this religion

where demons were in every closet and my parents

are getting divorced and my life is splitting

apart. I didn't understand any of it. And it

was out of my control. But all of a sudden, being

scared was controllable. It was controllable

by watching a movie that allowed me to look at

the things that were frightening me and endure

them and make it through to the other side. And

I always had the choice to shut it off. And for

some strange reason, that worked for me. And

I found that there's a contingency of people

who love horror films that had experiences somewhat

like that, maybe a little bit older in their

life. Whatever it was, they felt connected to

the extreme of a horror film. And it really does

come down to I don't want to do these things,

but I do enjoy the experience of finding myself

being able to endure the uncomfortable thing.

And I like to look at it in that Jungian way,

which is that we all have a shadow self. It is

this thing that is boiling inside of us. We have

the personae, which is the face we put on to

be liked, like what I'm doing right now. But

then there is the shadow self, which is that

internal little lizard brain. And it's there

for everyone, and it functions. It has a function

for us. It allows us to know right and wrong.

It allows us to have a conscience. But it is

something that needs to be indulged every so

often. If you ignore the shadow, Jung says you

do that at your own peril. In other words, if

you ignore the fact that you have this thing,

sooner or later it bursts to the forefront. It

is a spoiled brat. And the next thing you know,

you're getting divorced. You're in trouble for

embezzling, whatever it might be. That dark side

takes over. over. And so the horror film and

other ways of working with the shadow is like

a safe handshake. It allows us to examine this

part of us which feels dark and say, OK, I accept

that that's there. I'm able to get over some

shame about that, perhaps. Whatever it might

be, the horror film allows me to have the ability

to look at things that I may not want to look

at in the bright daylight. But the horror film

allows me to look at what's happening in my culture.

At any given point, if you look at the horror

films from even the 30s onward, even the worst

ones, the ones that only showed on drive -ins

at midnight, those movies do stamp the time and

the history of what's happening in the culture

at that moment. They need to know what makes

us anxious. So they will exploit what is anxious.

So you can literally see how it's almost like

an exorcism. It's like music. Music isn't something

that you intellectually get. You might talk about

it later on an intellectual level. The first

thing you do is you feel. What does it make you

feel? And horror does the same thing, because

sometimes I think you will find that the intellect

is part of the problem. You know, somebody asks

you what's wrong. You go, I can't articulate

it. I don't have an answer for you. But you can

feel something in music and it can change your

feelings and your emotions in one note. And I

think the horror film allows us to exercise some

of that nasty stuff on a very primal level. And

it also allows us to think about it later on.

And so that's a little bit of the kind of thing

that I really enjoy about horror. And yes, I

think about it a little bit differently than

some folks do. I think that's great, though,

because you have a. unique and interesting perspective

to it where, like you mentioned earlier about

how some people are just in the blood, guts,

and gore area of it. Other people are in, you

know, whatever other, you know, the more sci

-fi part of it kind of thing. And you're just

kind of like, all of it makes sense and matters

at the same time. The thing for me is, as I said

off air, I saw the first Nightmare on Elm Street

film when I was six years old. My parents had

been divorced for four years at that point. They

divorced when I was two, so I didn't really have

that whole – I just knew I was going with my

mom and I went to see my dad on weekends if possible

kind of thing. And my mom just let me – I've

said this on our network here for the last 12

years many times. My mom let me watch anything.

It didn't matter what it was. And half the time

she was watching with me. I wasn't – watching

it alone, unless she fell asleep on the couch

and Robert Stack was scaring the crap out of

me on Unsolved Mysteries. Because Robert Stack

was that kind of person and that kind of actor,

too. He just, you know, says, I can't deal with

that now and you jump out of your skin. So it's

one of those things for me where this is interesting,

talking to you and hearing your aspect of something

that, while I have a healthy respect for it,

It's also my thing of it really isn't my thing.

Right, right. And I don't tell people that they

must watch horror films. I don't think that's

a prerequisite of life. But I do think that a

lot of times when you have an experience like

you've had, it was terribly valid, right? And

I had the same thing, except I went in a different

direction. I was scared of it, and I wanted to

see it again. I was somehow fascinated with that.

weird emotion that I felt and it was somehow

a purgative for me. But I will say that what

ends up happening when you do have a scare like

that, like my wife is a sci -fi fan. She's an

original Trekker, right? And so she was like,

no way in hell am I watching horror films. And

I remember when we were dating all those years

ago, Nightmare on Elm Street was, weirdly enough,

the movie that I decided to take her to. And

she kind of went into a fugue state, just kind

of went into some kind of pupa. But she was like,

I don't need to ever see that again. But after

spending some time speaking with me, I was going,

you know, you're probably watching horror and

you don't even know it. Because horror is such

an incredibly broad. genre. It really does go

across all the different kind of storylines.

And what defines horror is it's a terribly subjective

thing, right? What scares me may not scare you.

What interests me may not interest you. And there

is still room for the horror experience. So I

look at it as I make the definition very, very

broad. If you look at the dictionary version

of what the definition is of horror, it's an

intense feeling of fear, disgust, terror, or

dread, dread being a very important word in that.

And so I say that a horror film is a movie that

gives you those intense feelings of either revulsion,

fear, terror or dread. And so that opens it up

quite a bit. The idea that a movie like Robert

Wise's The Haunting from 1960 is a horror film

as much as the Texas Chainsaw Massacre is or

Gremlins is a horror film. We don't like to think

of it as a horror film sometimes because it's

fun. But the reality is, if you look at it. where

it is going and what it wants to do is try to

scare you. It gives you a resolution at the end,

but there is a, you must, at least what I do

is I ask why, why does the filmmaker wish to

use the tropes of horror to tell its story? And

if it wants to tell this story, what does it

want you to go home with? What energy does it

want you to go home with? So what I basically

get at is that there are multiple styles of horror

film that people watch and they don't think of

it as a horror film. Alien sometimes is considered

a horror film. Sometimes it's not. The original

Frankenstein is a horror film. The book is a

horror story, but it's also a science fiction

story. It depends on which direction you want

to look at it. But I find that a lot of times,

whatever scares you first or mars you first,

you assume that that's the depth, breadth and

scope of the horror film. And the reality is

the horror film is much more diverse. than many

of us will give it credit for. It's the redheaded

stepchild. It does all those things we don't

want it to do. But that's its form, right? If

we're talking about, say, Joseph Campbell going

into the woods for the hero's journey, the woods

don't come to you. You must go to the woods.

And the woods and the scary place where he loses

the dog are important to the hero's journey.

And therefore, as far as I'm concerned, the horror

story is as well. You don't have to dwell in

it, but there is something to be said about it.

finding the story which is going to be of interest

to you, all the way back to, you know, The Legend

of Sleepy Hollow by Disney, all the way up to

the most crazy torture porn that's out there.

It all falls under, for better or for worse,

the horror umbrella. And I think that it is telling

important stories about us. And the funny thing

is, is that for me, I'm going to relate this

to Steve as well, because for him, he's more

of he out of the two of us. He's the diehard

Trekkie. I'm more of a casual Trekkie where I

grew up watching Next Gen. I'd seen a like I

have not seen all of TOS and I probably never

will. I just at this point in my life, I have

no interest. But hold on. So for me now, though,

with horror. I feel like I'm more of a lurker

than anything else because I try to find the

most tame horror films in the world. Like The

Hand That Rocks the Cradle and Freddy's Dead

the Final Nightmare. I think we can all agree

Nightmare on Elm Street Part 6 was not exactly

super scary. Right. There are wonderful... dread

-inducing horror films. I can give you a list

of movies. There's a movie in 1987 called Lady

in White you may enjoy. It's funny that you mentioned

Trek because a number of the films actually are

horror movies. As well as there are standalone

episodes of multiple series that are that. They

may not be blood, guts, and gore, but they analyze

some uh part of the human psyche in a weird and

creepy way oh yeah yes dr who almost all of dr

who is science fiction and horror melded together

and dr who is right it's an interesting thing

i don't know if you folks know anything about

dr who or watch it but uh They have a Christmas

show that comes out of the BBC every year. People

are like, why is that there? And it's like, that's

an old time honored thing in England. And it

used to be here as well, which is that there

used to be a Christmas ghost story that would

be told. That was tradition. And part of that

tradition is the Scrooge story. And I'm forgetting

the name of the story all of a sudden. But that

comes out of this idea of Christmas Carol, right?

So A Christmas Carol is a ghost story. And it

is a time loved, but it comes from like M .R.

James, who was an old time writer who used to

come up with these ghost stories and they would

tell one traditionally around Christmas. And

so the idea of Doctor Who comes from that. And

Doctor Who is this. character from another planet

who takes people on these trips, kind of like

the guide on the ferryman on the River Styx,

for lack of a better analogy. But he's usually

with monsters. He's usually taking on monsters.

And so people talk about when they were kids

watching Doctor Who, even though it's mostly

called a science fiction story, that they would

hide behind their couch watching it because you

have the Daleks, which are exterminators. You

have the Zygons that are these. sucker -faced

monsters. Most of the time it's dealing with

space ghosts of some sort or space monsters.

So there's a great persuasion towards horror

in science fiction. And like was mentioned, Star

Trek has many. episodes like that the concept

of q anytime they're going up against gods or

creatures that consider themselves gods uh you're

you're falling into the the myth of the horror

story and i think it's kind of interesting and

intriguing why i like both or like uh the borg

yeah the borg are absolute nightmare factories

right in fact uh i i was like thoroughly transfixed

that's what helped me get into the next generation

even more i was like oh my goodness look at these

guys And so why do we go there, right? Because

there's something to be said about us when we

look at the Borg. What do we not want to be?

Invasion of the Body Snatchers. There's been

four versions of Invasion of the Body Snatchers

over the decades, one for each interesting decade,

I guess. And each of them talked about what was

happening in our culture. It was all about losing

identity, losing what we are. What makes me me?

What makes you you? Is it our personalities?

Is it our memories? And so I'm really, I'm always

intrigued by that kind of thing. And I think

science fiction and horror mixed together really

gives us a lot of possibilities. And I think

movies like, and stories like Invasion of the

Body Snatchers land purely in the horror milieu.

They use science fiction as a way to separate

the myth from the reality of what's happening,

like McCarthyism or commercialism, the me generation

and S and things like that. Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, that's definitely, I think, part of what

creates that draw with people. Yeah, I like to

think so. And if I'm talking too much, as you

can tell, I don't have a problem talking. Let

me know when you want to ask a question. I haven't

been talking for almost a year at this point,

except in short bursts, so I'm about ready to

explode myself. Like I said before, I'm kind

of on the fringes of horror. Honestly, I'm more

into not full -on horror comics, but I realize

that because of the company that I work with

or have worked with in the past, Xenoscope Entertainment,

who does the Grimm Fairy Tales comics, I'm fine

with all of that because it's magic and horror

and everything kind of all in one. I'm fine with

that, but it's just something about TV and movies

that the horror genre is just... respectfully

backed away you hit on something really important

because I talk about horror not only movies I

mean most of the time I end up speaking about

movies because that's what everybody basically

touches on it's it's the most it's the mashed

potatoes of the world of entertainment movies

but the thing that I like to say is you know

i wasn't watching horror movies and r -rated

films or anything when i was a kid i was reading

so comic books Tales from the Crypt. Some of

the early Batmans or the Batmans from the 70s

had some really horrific ideas in them. There

was Creepy Magazine and House of Secrets. And

the Dracula, the Marvel run of Dracula, which

was absolutely magnificent, done by the great

Gene Colan. He was one of my favorite artists,

that is. And all of those were truly great. great

and they were absolutely terrifying but there

is something that is different between reading

a book and watching a movie you're kind of on

a out of control train when you're watching a

movie whereas a book you're willingly putting

your toe deeper and deeper into the tub every

page that you're reading and you have the opportunity

to stop at any time but you also have the two

-edged sword of it is that your mind will think

of things far more horrible than any effects

budget could possibly give when you're reading

something that is a book. But that's the quiet

revolution. I was in a household that was highly

fundamentalist, right? So there were many things

that I was not allowed to do. But my dad was

functionally illiterate. And so he looked at

books as homework. And I ended up being someone

who was a reader. So he never understood why

anybody would read a book for pleasure. And he

looked at books as very toothless and tame and

boring. He had no clue it was in books. And that's

where the quiet revolution happens. All my bad

habits, all my nasty thoughts came from books

first. That was the first corruptor. And so when

I went to the library and I started I started

in science fiction, I started Asimov A and just

worked my way through. But I found the horror

section kind of lost myself in there. And all

of that stuff was where I got so many of. the

ideas and it's a interesting place to go i think

it's just as enriching as any horror film it's

another way that you can have your dose of horror

and deal with it well you know comic books are

a wonderful in between the novel and and the

uh and the film absolutely i remember and you

you you probably remember this as well uh one

of the books that scared me so much as a kid

in reading was john belair's the curse of the

blue figurine oh nice yeah i'm like oh my like

like that book gave me nightmares uh it really

really did and it was and you're right the reading

of horror of horror is i think it whether it's

comics whether it's actual reading books and

just leaving it up to your imagination i think

i had read a short story in 88 when i was eight

years old that then gave me a nightmare of a

wolfman in my closet the next thing i know i'm

being rushed to the hospital because i had a

seizure oh my goodness yeah I was just about

to say that it's a great starter for folks, anybody

who's listening and it's like, well, I don't

know, maybe I'll be interested in reading something.

But I would say go to anthology books because

the investment of a short story is not nearly

as much as it is for a novel. And a good short

story is like a punch to the chest. And it can

be truly chilling. And then you can release yourself

into the next story if you so wish. Even old

stories, ones from the 40s, I find can be very

appealing. There's one called The Man from the

South that probably everybody knows and they

don't know that they know it. But I think it

was a Roald Dahl story. And it was about... couple,

a woman and a man down in a bar in some seedy

area in South America. And there's this guy,

this diminutive fellow in a white suit. And he's

the couple are sitting there and they're kind

of brash Americans in this place. And this guy

keeps flicking his lighter lazily. And this man

in the white suit comes over and he goes, I will

give you my car if you can get that. lighter

to light 10 times in a row without failing. Do

you feel strongly about that? All I ask, and

if you think that you're really tough, is I want

to be able to have you tie your hand down with

your pinky extended. And I will take a knife

or a hatchet and I will cut off your pinky if

you miss a beat. Do you feel like you're a gambling

man? And it becomes this whole story of wits.

But it's all about can he light this thing 10

times? That story is ancient. And yet when you're

reading it. As improbable as it sounds that anybody

would get into that, you are completely engrossed

in it. And there are tons of old stories like

that that can really chill you without even having

to go to ghosts and demons and monsters. Absolutely.

Absolutely. So with you having this book called

Screaming for Pleasure, what are some gems in

your book that people can hope to uncover as

they dive in? Well, what I talk about a lot is

trying to, first off, I mean, it's called How

Horror Makes You Happy and Healthy. Well, how

does it make you? healthy, right? It's happy

and healthy, but it's not going to cure lumbago,

right? I'm talking more about trying to find,

and it's just like any kind of geekery, right?

It's the idea of finding your passion and feeling

complete in that passion. So when I talk about

making it happy and healthy, it's talking about

the little things in life, really the emotional

release that you can have through a horror story.

You can find a way to take a look at some of

the darker sides of it. yourself and come to

terms with that. Find out that it's okay. Find

out there are no bad emotions. They're just emotions.

There are bad things that you can do around those

emotions, but the emotion themselves are not

out to hurt you. They're there for you to be

able to figure out a good way to live your life.

But there's also the idea of a sense of play.

So many of us as adults lose a sense of play.

People who are geeks, fellow geeks, understand

that a sense of play will stay with you as long

as you keep with your passions. Horror is just

as much a viable place to find your passions

as anything else. You also find a tribe, right?

You're able to find people who have the same

kind of feelings as you do about story. And if

you are gravitating towards a story that a lot

of people tend to look down their nose at, you

kind of find that you have a mentality. of really

feeling a kinship with people who are in that

same boat. So if you're feeling a little bit

better about yourself, you find that you get

yourself a community, you're able to find a sense

of play, it sounds like you have a pretty good

life. And that's what I think happens with horror.

So I talk a lot about how the first kiss is in

you, and we all have our own corruptors, and

at some points we find ourselves in science fiction.

Sometimes we find ourselves in fantasy and romance.

Sometimes we find ourselves in straight drama.

Sometimes we find ourselves in football, right,

in sports, another geek art that is just somehow

more socially acceptable. But at the same point,

it is a geek art to put someone else's name on

your jacket and your jersey and walk around and

extend the virtues of them. There's not much

of a difference between that and a Klingon badge,

quite honestly, as far as I'm concerned. It all

comes from a concept of having passion. So I

talk about whether it be movies or be music.

or it be books, there's something out there waiting

for you. And we kind of need it. Horror has been

around since the beginning. The first campfire,

I like to say, and I talk about that in the book,

where the first story is the elder around the

first campfire going, thank you, everyone, for

being here. Praise the earth. Praise the fire.

Praise the animals and the food that we have.

We are all family. We are strength. We are strong

together. Thank you for all being here, tribe.

And the second story is, whatever you do, don't

go into those woods. There's a monster in those

woods. Stay with us. Don't go out there. So that

means that the horror story is the second story.

It's the cautionary tale. And the cautionary

tale is important to our growth. And so I look

at finding that thing that speaks for us. Why

is horror so old? Because I believe it fulfills

a need in society. It's not a cultural need.

It's not a social need. It's a human need. We

have a need to be able to question the brightness

of the light. The only way that you have shadows

is through light. So being able to go into the

darkness and finding the thing that is actually

affirming is a lot of what I talk about in there

as well. But I, of course, talk about lots of

movies and I talk about a lot of nasty movies

as well as sweet movies and movies that deal

more in dread. than they do anything else. And

in case you guys wanted to have a list, I was

trying to figure out what you might want. So

we all know the old movies. And if you're a horror

fan, there's plenty that I could talk about that

you're like, yes, I've seen those. A lot of horror

fans will say that there aren't any good movies

now. So what I did is I made a list of the movies

that probably not only show the broadness Of

storylines that horror can take and the styles

that it can take. But also, these movies are

only five years old or less. Oh, wow. And I've

probably got 30 of them that you could watch.

Oh, wow. That have different styles to them.

And movies that are more horror, that are straight

-up horror that you would normally expect, movies

that are more psychological, movies that are

Hammer films. If you folks know anything about

Hammer films, they're old Dracula movies from

England that had big castles and women and bodice

rippers, basically. They're wearing those wonderful

dresses that show off a little bit too much cleavage.

Those kind of movies with a high romance factor.

more about the psychological dread of guilt and

grief. One of the things that I think is really

interesting about horror movies now is that they

are dealing in the unpopular, uncomfortable emotions,

putting those into the main characters. So it

used to be where it was, well, I'm just an innocent

guy kind of walking down the street and what

happens? There's an ax murder. But now there's

movies about cowardice. There's movies about

grief. Lots of movies about grief. about how

hard it is to be a parent. And these are the

monsters. These are the stressors that are in

these movies now. And I find it great. And there's

still the science fiction side. There's still

the demonic side, the monster movie side. And

because we have streaming now, as well as cinema.

as well as what's on the internet, as well as

YouTube and Alter, which is a part of YouTube

that's all devoted to horror. There are so many

different avenues. There are so many different

streams. Whereas maybe in the 80s, you could

say, ah, most horror movies were slasher films.

And they were, because there were only a few

areas that horror was coming from. Now people

are able to watch Asian horror films as easily

as they could a movie that was made. in Canada

or in the United States due to streaming services

like Amazon and Netflix and Shudder, which is

a 24 -hour, 364, all horror, all the time channel.

And that channel will show you all the different

styles that are out there. So if we were, like,

to say, to look at 2015, just five years ago,

we've got a movie like Crimson Peak, which is

a Guillermo del Toro film. Most people know at

least the name Guillermo del Toro. He's the king

of the monsters. But he made a movie that was

basically like an old Hammer film about a romantic

cursed love and ghosts inside of an old mansion

up on the hill that has this weird tendency to

have iron deposits come up through the snow.

So it looks like blood all the time around it.

It's one of the most beautiful films that you'll

see. Very melodic and lyric. It's not going to

scare you. It's there to enthrall you. with the

poetry of horror. And I think the poetry of horror

is very important to speak of. There is a way

to speak about the untantalizing portions of

our lives, the things like abuse, child abuse,

and death. that can be turned into something

romantic through the poetry of horror. And so

Crimson Peak is very much a supple, delicious

bouquet of visual imagery. And then there's a

movie like The Invitation, which is about the

death of a child and cults. And it is a very

disturbing story of a father who has divorced

his wife. She has left him for a long period

of time because of the death of their child.

And all of a sudden he gets an email from her

and a phone call. It says, I'm back in town.

I would love to have you and your new girl come

to see how I'm doing and that I'm OK and that

I found friends. And she ends up having been

involved in a cult and she's trying to get him

involved as well. And it is this story where

you're not sure through the entire film. Is he

paranoid? Is he having flights of fancy? Is he

so uncomfortable being around his old love and

having the scabs torn from the death of his child?

Or is there really something truly diabolical

going on inside of this house? It's a really

interesting story. The Witch is another one that

came out that same year. The Witch, or A New

England Tale as it's called, is a story that

tries to show itself as if it is happening in

the 1600s, back when we have nothing but Puritans

in the world here in the United States. And it's

just the colonies. And we have a family that

leaves the village because the Puritans aren't

pure enough for this father. So he decides to

go out and do some homesteading himself. And

while he's out there, he brings all the superstitions

of witches into the woods where he lives. What's

interesting about The Witch is it can be looked

at in two different ways. It's either a movie

full of supernatural or it is all about a family

slowly going crazy in the isolation of the woods

in a world where the only reality is the Bible.

These are all happening in the same year. The

Lazarus Effect is a story about the acid tests

that the CIA were doing back in the 70s and 80s.

And that's been uncovered now. But this is a

whole story about maybe that opened up a different

dimension. Maybe acid highs and the trips that

are there are really a portal into a different

place. What if whatever you saw actually stepped

out into the real world? Very interesting idea

for that. And ghost stories, demon stories. There

are stories in just one year that go across the

idea of suspensors, real world situations, movies

that are. You are here happening as if they're

on camera. You have movies that are coming from

different eras. You have horror that is based

in the supernatural demons. You have real serial

killer types. You have movies where it may all

be happening inside of someone's head. And there

are movies that are happening not only in the

United States, but are happening across the world.

And that's one year. And that's just half of

the movies. that I could talk about from 2015,

let alone where we go from there. And so there's

almost an endless fountain. of story ideas that

horror can do. There are tropes, there are cliches,

but there is always a way to transcend them.

And the good thing about horror is it never throws

anything away. It's kind of like the great garbage

collector and it turns things into art by, by

continuing to change everything that it touches

into a new storyline. Absolutely. Yeah. In a

year where this year has kind of been horrific

for most people, earlier you mentioned a movie,

I think you might have mentioned this off -air,

I don't remember, that looks like it was done

on Zoom. Talk about that a little bit. What was

that movie? Oh yeah, that's great. So Host is

a movie that was made in the UK. And it's entirely

done on Zoom. So one of the things that Ahar

is great at is that, like I said, it doesn't

throw anything away. It can't help but comment

on what's going on because it is already working

in the world of fancy. And it is already working

on an idea that the rules of physics don't necessarily

have to apply. You are allowed to take a look

at the world through a distorted mirror. And

so horror tends to be the place where a lot of

what's going on in the world first breaks into

popular culture. And so this movie Host is basically

shot on a Zoom. And so there's a Zoom meeting.

Each of the actors was responsible for recording

their part. So just like any Zoom meeting, the

movie starts with people slowly coming on. It's

where horror gets very interesting. We are so

used to the lexicon of what movies are supposed

to look like, what YouTube is supposed to look

like, and what Zoom is supposed to look like.

Those are visual styles that are now part of

cinema, whether we want it to be or not. There

has been so much that's happened on Zoom that

we are now very much acquainted with the look

of a Zoom meeting, where it used to be something

that would be tacky. Maybe the lighting didn't

look great. We now make, like found footage films,

we now make concessions for that because that

is part of our reality at this point. It doesn't

have to look like it's a 35 millimeter film that's

done perfectly. So using all of the limitations

and the expectations that we have around Zoom,

they created a really interesting horror movie.

One of the things that they did is they created

a time bomb that's in the movie by... using one

of the free versions of zoom in other words your

movie is only going to be an hour and 10 minutes

long once they start the interview and start

recording there is a timer right they're going

to run out of time so no matter what is happening

on the screen you are aware that you may not

see what happens to everybody you may not be

able to find out what's going on and that adds

attention immediately People are using fake backgrounds,

green screen backgrounds, and all that becomes

integral to the story. So people are coming on,

and they're all getting together because they

can't get together. They're in different areas,

and one of them wants to do a seance. So they

ask a friend who's the hippy -dippy one out of

them to bring an actual medium. to the thing

and of course they're making jokes about it they're

doing all this stuff and the woman says light

a candle you see everybody lighting the candles

and she's taking it very seriously the person

who's invited her is taking it seriously but

many of the friends are openly mocking this person

and that person's trying to uh do this as nice

as possible they have a lot of Fake jumps in

the very beginning where you're like, oh, my

God, is this where it's going to go down this

traditional path? And it's not a new story, right?

We've had the idea of a seance going bad from

the very beginning of horror films. And yet putting

it in this new vein puts a sense of immediacy

to it. There is a feeling of not acting that's

happening, which adds a certain feeling of you

are there. You're watching it probably on your

computer. You may be watching it on your TV,

but you're not in a movie theater. So already

you have this square, which is a little bit different

than going into the cinema. You may be watching

it alone. So suddenly you are in that Zoom meeting.

And what ends up happening is one person makes

fun out of the undead, right? Whatever has decided

to come. And perhaps, perhaps it is finding its

way through the technology and showing up in

everybody's house. And what it does is it does

not do anything huge. It uses the technology

that Zoom has, people picking up their laptops,

walking into a dark room, and just the idea of

how unnerving it is to be watching a bunch of

people who don't look behind them, but you are

seeing behind them the entire time. And so all

of these little things that are the essentials

of like chat and people just dropping off because

the Wi -Fi gets weak, having a noise happen off

screen, having fake backgrounds, having people

putting on. Oh, my goodness. I'm forgetting what

it's called. We have like fake rabbit ears pop

on your face while you're doing it. Having those

little things become integral to. the scares

of the plot, and that there's a ghost in the

machine. Now this thing is in there. Makes for

a very interesting horror film that speaks directly

to the quarantine times. And there are a couple

movies that are speaking to the quarantine times.

There are movies that came out a while ago. Horror

has been talking about this for quite a while.

Knowing full well that we were dodging bullets

for many years, the avian flu, all these things

over. We just barely missed the pandemic over

and over and over again. We call it zombie apocalypse,

call it whatever we want. But we have been talking

about nature or the things that we can't see,

the mighty microbe. giving us a history lesson

reminding us that we're just kind of renting

here we're renting space on this planet it's

really theirs and uh that anxiety has come to

uh ahead during the quarantine and so several

of the films of the past even going back to the

zombie films of this uh the late 70s uh they

Speak to where we are right now in our cubes

and our cognitive dissonance where we are in

an apocalypse where there's still takeout. What

the fuck? Oh, I'm sorry. I'm not sure if I can.

It's perfectly fine. It's perfectly fine. But

yeah, we were in this area where who would have

thought that the apocalypse would have such cognitive

dissonance that we would still have our essential

workers wouldn't be firemen and policemen. It

would be the Amazon. truck driver. That is the

weirdness, the carryout person. Somehow, this

is the essential worker in this mad world that

we're in right now. And so we have this just

enough normalcy to kind of not realize that we're

in the middle of a quarantine until we realize

that we're in the middle of a quarantine. And

that's where anxiety comes from. And that's where

horror thrives. So movies like Host, I think,

are speaking directly to the times. Almost to

the minute of what's happening right now. Absolutely.

So what are your top three suggestions of things

to check out this season as we come upon Halloween

here soon? Oh, well, if I were to, one of the

things that I want to do is cater to what I'm

hearing from you. which is that you don't want

to have a bloodbath. You're looking for something

that would be more chilling than absolutely terrifying,

and yet still be in the realm of horror, where

you can feel that poetry. And I had mentioned

a movie earlier from the 80s, and that might

be a little bit too old, but it's a movie called

The Lady in White, and it's a ghost story. And

it's set in, I think, New Jersey. But it is a

wonderful, old fashioned, romantic ghost story.

But it also it's not just a ghost story. It's

also about a serial killer. And it's also about

the civil rights movement. There's a lot going

on in this one little horror film that nobody's

ever heard of. There's also what I would say,

if you become intrigued in. Just putting your

foot into the depths of horror a little bit.

Stranger Things is a great place to start. It

has the nostalgia of the 80s, but it has a very

Stephen King feel to it. I've heard so much and

I've heard so many people try to tell me, oh,

you have to watch Stranger Things. You love the

80s, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, yeah, but

it's a horror show. I'm not into horror. And

yes, I know that there are episodes that are

less scary than others and everything else. And

I've seen various things. It's just that's one

of those shows where I'm like, I need to wait

until like 2025 if we're still here. And the

show's already been canceled and nobody's talking

about it for me to be able to sit down and reel.

Oh, five years ago in 2020 when the world was

ending, you guys were right. I should have watched

this then. Well, I will say that the thing that's

interesting about and what really good horror

does often is it disarms you from the horror.

It gets you involved in the characters. And the

great thing about Stranger Things is that the

horror kind of sneaks up on you. And it's not

super powerful. It's not gory. Have you seen

the movie Poltergeist? Long time ago, yeah. So

it has kind of the essence of poltergeist, where

there's a child who's missing. And it's the friends

who are coming to try and rescue. So it has that

kind of feel to it. The Goonies, you could see

it as the Goonies or Monster Squad, another horror

film that's more about kids uniting. It's not

nearly as terrifying as something like the new

version of It, which wants to scare you and does

a pretty decent job of it. Stranger Things is

more about the characters and the dilemma that's

there. You can call it fantasy at certain points,

but it certainly has its heart deeply steeped

in horror. allows you an entry if you're not

a horror fan like my wife by having the characters

be nerds right geeks from the 80s they're into

dnd in fact a lot of what happens has to do with

their passions you know perhaps the monster somehow

is related to the dnd game that they're playing

There's the idea of arcades. A lot of what goes

on in the 80s and malls becomes very important

to the story, but it is the fabric. The thing

that kind of like a Stephen King book, people

always, I think why many Stephen King movies

fail so bad is that they focus on the heart.

The reality is what makes Stephen King stories

great are the characters and how we are in internal

dialogues with those characters. What is said

or thought on the interior of those characters

is what is indelible of those stories. It's really

not about the big plastic monster that comes

up. And so the evil of the men that is in the

Stephen King story is what's important. And I

think the same thing happens with Stranger Things.

You find yourself. thoroughly invested in all

the characters and everybody, including the adults,

are nerdy. And if you grew up in the 80s at all,

you will know these characters. What I love about

it is it's not the 80s of like some kind of wonderful

or even the Breakfast Club. Those were kids that

were obviously from the richer parts of the suburbs.

The Stranger Things kids are the ones that shopped

at Sears. Right. The parents and the adults have

weird haircuts of the time. They all went to

super cuts. They didn't go to hairstylists. It

wasn't the time of the day glow colors. It's

really that wonderful moment that happened in

the mid 80s where everything was awkward. We

weren't in the 70s anymore and we hadn't yet

fallen into the Michael Jackson glam. We're in

this spot where people are wearing Keds and people

are riding motocross bikes. BMX bikes and you're

staying after school with the science teacher

and the science teacher has a pocket protector

and he's just as geeky as you. And so you get

all those feelings and you're invested long before

the monster appears at tentacles. So that makes

the monster more believable, right? Yeah. There's

a very short, there's this movie in its sequel.

Uh, FX and FX two with Brian Dennehy and, uh,

Oh my, my boy, Brian Brown. Yep. Plays, uh, Raleigh

Tyler. Who's this retired effects, you know,

horror effects, man. I love that movie more because

it's more of a, like a mystery cop thing than

horror. But the fact that he's a retired effects,

you know, horror effects person. I absolutely

love that. Um, tell us a little bit. Okay. So

your book is currently out now. Yes. Yes, you

can get it at Amazon, any of those places. But

if you're kind of a book lover and you're a little

geeky like me, if you go to hellbentforhorror

.com and you go to the book page, the ISBN number

is there. And if you have a local bookstore that's

struggling to stay alive amongst all those Amazon

folk, all you need to do is take that ISBN number

and you can order it through them. And that helps

out the small book lovers and small bookstores.

So as I've been listening to you, sir, over the

last hour of this interview, I'm wondering why

you did not record the book for Audible, because

I would love to listen to you read the book to

me. Well, it's so funny that you would say that

because I am in process of trying to do that.

So one of the things that I want to do is put

that out. I actually have. I've been going to

conventions of recent, virtual conventions, and

I'm going to have a book reading tomorrow, actually,

at the Torrance Library. And if you folks want

to, you guys actually, are interested in going,

I can see about giving you the Zoom address.

But I'm going to be reading 20 minutes of one

of the chapters from my book. It's going to be

a video version. So basically I made a mini movie

and it's about my father and I going to see John

Carpenter's The Thing in 1982 and how that movie

was. That was a spot where horror split between

generations. And it was obvious that there was

an outrage from one generation and a, my goodness,

I feel like I got hit by a car, yet I'm really

excited to the younger generation. And so that

is me reading from, and I'm going to be doing

more and more of those. But yes, I'm going to

be doing that tomorrow. I think it's 24 minutes

long, the video. And it's about the experience

of bunches of fathers and sons showing up at

a movie theater in Wilkes -Barre, Pennsylvania,

assuming that they're going to all have a bonding

experience. And it ended up being damn near a

riot. Dads were so upset. All right, before we

let you go, how can our listeners find you online

and the various projects that you have coming

up, if there are any that you can speak about

besides the ones you just mentioned? Well, very

good. If you're interested in finding out more

about what's going on, you can go to hellbentforhorror

.com. It's also the Facebook page, Hellbent for

Horror. You can find that on Facebook. And in

Twitter land, it is Hellbent Horror. You can

find me on Instagram as well. But if you go to

the website, you can find all the podcasts. They're

all available. There is a YouTube page, so there

are video versions of those. Some of them are

actual full videos, and others are just the audio

with a little bit of a background. that's there.

But on my page is an events page, on my website

that is. And if you go to the events page, you

will see where I'm going to be. Most of them

have kind of finished up because I'm super busy

during October. And once Halloween comes, it's

time to rest a little bit. Although I do have

lists of my horror movies for Christmas that

I like to do. You can find that I will be at,

like I said, the library. But that's going to

be happening tomorrow. It probably won't be.

This won't be recorded or out there broadcast

by then. But if you're interested in finding

out a little bit more about the book, if you're

interested in finding out my speaking engagements,

if you're interested in just listening to the

podcast, hellbentforhorror .com is the best place

to find everything. That is all roads lead to

Rome. And so all roads lead to Hellbent for Horror.

And I'm more than happy to answer questions that

are posted to me on the website as well. Awesome.

Awesome. So we would like to thank you, Scott,

for taking the time to chat with us here in this

Geekcast Radio Presents interview. Thank you

so much. It was a pleasure. And for those that

are listening, you can visit the website and

see how you can connect with him and discover

more about his book. And until next time, unleash

the geek in you. Get it? Screaming?