Ranking the Best and Worst Star Trek Pilots

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obviously keep it locked into this week and geek

net today's topic is more of a roundtable Discussion

so as such we will not have a L cars this week

and nor a replicator But I will have reviews

coming up for Star Trek Enterprise season 2 on

blue and The Captains close up and personal also

available on DVD. So I guess before we go any

further let's introduce today's topic. I got

this idea from I think it was from Twitter and

I'm not precisely sure what someone said but

just kind of triggered this line of thinking

that what are the best and what are the worst

pilots for the Star Trek series, because the

pilot episode should grab you, get you hooked

in, try and get you interested immediately. And

I think some pilots have aged better than others,

and some of them suck and some of them don't.

So I guess with that in mind, let's start with

what are the worst of the pilots so far? Then

we'll get to the best. Well, I mean, you know

the original series kind of had like a mess in

terms of pilots It goes I'm certainly a good

well, I mean just because you know there there

was the original pilot with Pike But if I'm not

mistaken that was kind of like turned down by

the studio and they had to go back and sort of

retool some things So whether you count that

pilot or the other pilot, but we talked about

both Yeah, you see the original series pilots

when I watch them I could not get into them and

I tried And I feel like a bad Trek fan because

I don't like the original series. I really don't

But but I like the original series movies There

there's some you know, the original series is

you know, it's all hit or miss But you know there

I like it. There's definitely a lot of good ones

in there. I I kind of agree I The pilots are

kind of a mess only for the fact that you have

two of them and one of them happens to get double

air things during the show One in the beginning

one in the middle and it's Kind of interesting

to see the original take of what it was going

to be and then what it actually turned out to

be and I have to agree with you Mike that I enjoy

the films much more than the original series,

but I also have to agree with Leo that there

are really good episodes in there, but it's few

and far between, honestly, because a lot of it's

got a lot of the 60s cheese to it. Yeah, there's

just... I think what I don't like about it is

the pilot, it feels like a relic from that time.

And the other pilots I find are not so much...

Mean you can tell it was made during the 80s

or whatever. That's fine But there's something

about the original pilot says I just I cannot

get over I mean I do like the characters in it

though But I can't get into the universe if that

makes any kind of sense. I Was honestly, you

know with the where no man has gone before You

know the the second pilot if you will I was kind

of hoping that that's where they were gonna go

with Star Trek into darkness, honestly I have

to agree. Now, do you think... Do you think the

pilot is what sucked people in the Star Trek,

or do you think it was after four to five episodes

they started getting more interesting and that's

when people kind of caught on? Actually, does

anybody have the ratings for this episode perhaps?

That'd be remarkably curious to see if a lot

of people tuned in or didn't at this particular

time But like I said, I feel terrible calling

it a bad pilot But just once again just couldn't

get into it for whatever reason you're gonna

laugh when you hear what I think one of the best

pilots is Because it's convoluted as fuck. I

don't know Mike. What do you what do you think

is the best? I think the I really like Voyager

You know, I just rewatched a lot of the pilots

recently for this podcast and I have to say that

as a pilot Not judging it on anything else or

or anything that came after it or anything like

that Voyager is a really good strong pilot It's

too bad. It kind of petered off immediately after

that and it gained some momentum again later

But like I said judging on just the pilot Voyager

pilots really solid there's that stakes are high,

you know, there it's really, you know, it's really

interesting There's a lot of stuff going on like

yeah, I mean one of the strengths of the Voyager

pilot I think is they basically they made The

stakes real like the pretty much right out of

the gate. We are 70 ,000 light years from home

a good chunk of our essential staff is dead and

we've got these marquee people on board. I really

like that, although I do agree with you. The

series is a lot of up and down along the way,

but it's still my favorite Star Trek series.

Well, we'll probably talk about this probably

next year about the strengths and weaknesses

of Voyager. So, okay, what should we say is the

next worst pilot? Because I think Enterprise

actually wasn't bad. No, I think Enterprise wasn't

bad. It kind of brought you right in. I mean,

God, and Ninja. Honestly, most of the pilots

really aren't that bad. I mean, the next -gen

pilot, I don't know. It was a little slow. Yeah,

that would be my one complaint about TNG is pilot

is it was slow although it's weird though my

opinion of it has changed over the years when

i first saw it i didn't like it i saw it again

in theaters last year loved it well i think it

also had to do with the fact that as the production

went along with tng it got a lot better and the

the colors got more crisp and the detail got

more crisp whereas in that original pilot it

still kind of had that aged feel of the original

series whereas the later shows had modern production

styles to them. I'm just, you know, because we're

trying to, you know, see which one's the worst.

I'm just trying to like nitpick. Like that's,

you know, like, you know, it was it was an enjoyable

episode, you know, encountering Farpoint. But

like, I mean, you know, it was a little slow.

Now, what would you say is slower, that one or

Emissary from DS9? Because that's another one

I found kind of slow, too. Yeah, and it's definitely

a little weird and slow. So, I mean, I guess

those two would kind of be towards the bottom

and Voyager and Enterprise would be towards the

towards the top. Yeah. OK. Which is kind of weird.

Well, I would say that part of the reason why

TNG may feel that way is because Roddenberry

was still heavily involved, whereas the later

three series did not have him involved whatsoever

because obviously he'd passed on. Yeah. So, I

can see how it's kind of that way. The only nods

I can say to the TNG one would be the fact that

it introduced Q, it put Mankind on trial, and

kind of made them accountable for all their actions,

and it had a passing of the torch with Dr. McCoy.

Yeah. Now, when you look at the casts for each

of the pilots, maybe that's something we could

take a look at, too. Which one had the best cast

to start and the best on -screen chemistry? chemistry

to draw you in. And I think TNG wins this one

hands down. Their crew felt very coherent right

from the start. Well, there was also a background

between all of them. Most of them had known each

other ahead of time, other than like Riker had

known like Dr. Crusher, but didn't know Picard,

but Picard knew Crusher. So I mean, it was kind

of like a round, round circle of Trust that was

going around that everybody somewhat knew each

other or had heard of each other through somebody

they knew So it was a little bit more cohesive

whereas you get into Whether it be Enterprise

TS9 or Voyager They're working with groups of

people that never worked with before So it's

very strained relationships I'm gonna have to

I mean I mean judging on on just the casts At

the beginning of the series because you know

that that's the thing is that you know as the

show goes on They the characters evolve some

people go some people don't you know? So but

as far as like just the you know this group of

people that you're watching right out the gate

to draw you in It's definitely next gen and the

original series I think because I mean that that's

a lot of what the original series brought in

general was you know good characters and stories

and they they were kind of an interesting group

for the time and definitely the next gen crew

you know they you definitely they're they're

very you know like like you said kind of you

know group of people that have worked together

and like have sort of charm and character and

i think one crew that i i mean despite the fact

they were all pretty much strangers as this was

the maiden voyage I think Voyager's crew seemed

very familiar and very warming at the start of

its pilot, too. Mostly with the Starfleet members,

not so much the Maquis people. But definitely

felt a warmth from Garrett Wong as Harry Kim,

definitely Captain Janeway, who's Kate... Kate...

Kate Mulgrew really liked her performance in

the episode. However, though, one of the performances

I didn't much care for in one of the pilots is

going to DS9 and Emissary. What's the name of

the guy who plays Cisco? Avery Brooks. He felt

very wooden to me in that one. And I don't think

he got comfortable until late season one in that

role. I think I don't know. He may have just

sort of been on defense I mean he was kind of

wooden but like you got to think he was put into

a situation that he didn't like his character

didn't want to be there Like he was immediately

put face to face with the person that he hates

most Which is Picard. Yeah, like, you know due

to reasons and You know so I mean yeah, I could

see him like towards the end of the episode when

he does be like Oh, I do want to be here He does

actually warm up, but I can honestly understand

his woodenness due to the scenario Okay, so well

and one of the one of the interesting things

is to is you could also kind of argue that Tng

is better in the sense that Yeah, it had one

kind of passing of the torch of McCoy, but even

if you omitted it, it still stands on its own.

Whereas DS9 and Voyager piggybacked off the previous

series. Yeah, DS9 definitely piggyback as far

as it's you know, it was definitely was tied

into the wolf 359 You know from best of both

worlds and you know all this kind of information

So I mean as far as standing on its own. Yeah,

I would definitely say Voyager a little bit more

can stand on its own I think than DS9. Yeah definitely

Now as we move on through this discussion, where

do you think? In terms, if you had to remember

one pilot, if you could only preserve one of

them, which one would it be and why? That's an

entirely different question. It would have to

be the original series. I mean, just for, you

know, historical purposes. I would, you know,

which one would you choose out of the two? the

cage or the where no man has gone before. Probably

where no man has gone before. I don't know. That's

really tough. Can I cheat and say the menagerie?

For myself, I would probably have to go with

the with. tng once again because of historical

but because i think it had a more interesting

cast and and honestly a big reason i would choose

it is because of q john john lansing because

star trek never had a villain like that really

no that's definitely a good you know it would

be my second choice now which one would you destroy

wipe from existence wipe from the memories of

mankind The animated series. Oh my god, I completely

forgot about I Wasn't gonna bring that one up

to me that one doesn't even count I was just

using that as a as a cheat again. No, honestly,

I like the animated series So it's actually you

know, the animation is really bad, but the stories

are really good You know, they got all their

did the original actors and you know, we need

people to update that animation Yeah, I know

somebody make that a fan project. I want the

audio track That's exactly what I want to see.

I want to see the audio tracks from those episodes

reanimated. Somebody make that their pet project.

That would be awesome, man. You probably couldn't

kickstart it, or could you? As long as you didn't

sell it. I don't know. I don't know if you could

kickstart it, but you could take donations. Yeah,

because I know, because we've talked with a number

of Star Trek kickstarters on here with Renegades

and Star Trek Continues. That's fascinating.

Somebody take Leo's idea and do this. Because

that would be fucking awesome. Man, I'm just

sitting here just imagining the possibilities

because I can't wait to see what they would do

with the giant Spock episode I don't know. I

mean, there's there's like said there's a lot

of really like the the material is good It's

just the animation is really bad And I think

that's what kills series the most is the animation

although some of it is Hilarious though, but

obviously you want to take Star Trek semi -series

as opposed to busting a gut laughing But we're

getting off topic there. Yeah, but for me I don't

I don't really know which one I would I mean

I would probably kill that one too, but It's

difficult for me to decide which one to preserve

because I'm I'm a huge fan of the the original

series cast But not so much a lot of the series

itself Whereas TNG I can honestly say I love

most of the series and the cast itself, so I

think I'd have to give it to TNG So that's the

one you're gonna kill? No, that's the one I'm

gonna preserve. Okay. The kill, I'd say Voyager

just because I did not like the caretaker thing.

Once it got past the DI and then the trapped

beyond everything and then having to work together

and everything, I hated the caretaker role of

that whole episode. I didn't so much mind the

caretaker, I just wish they did more with it.

Because I felt the combat angle was a little

weak. It could have been more but I don't think

they quite knew what to do to set it up as like

a long -term Even season arc because once they

destroy the array like oh fuck guys. We're kind

of stuck here. Yeah Although they didn't meet

a female caretaker at some point in the first

season I think maybe it was second season, but

I know they detected something with caretaker

energy signatures or something Need to rewatch

this series again. It's been it's been a little

while since I watched the earlier seasons of

that the watch the watch it all but Yeah over

the course of time over the course of time. I

watched a lot more of it recently My wife has

forbid me from watching the show in the house

Because she's like She just gets mad and now

she's yelling Will play that when you're sleeping

you watch For me I would I I feel terrible saying

this but I would probably get rid of DS 9s Because

I think they could have done more with that Personally,

but then again DS 9 for me doesn't really catch

on till the end of the first season then I really

liked it I mean, they all take a season or two

to kind of gel Which is weird though. They had

to become cohesive and they had had to evolve,

whereas that first season they still don't know

what the heck they're doing. Yeah. Well, okay,

maybe that almost brings up something entirely.

Looking at these shows, we all just said it takes

a season or two for things to get rolling. In

television time, that's an eternity. That's a

shit ton of money you're pouring down a hole,

hoping it gets better. Do you think this is unique

to maybe Star Trek? Because some shows have a

fantastic season one after another, but Star

Trek, it seems to take a while for everything

to get moving. I would kind of say that, yeah,

I would say Star Trek needs that second season

in order to kind of do something interesting

with it. I mean, if you look at season two of

the original series, you get... You get like

a mock time, you get Mirror Mirror, The Deadly

Years, The Trouble with Tribbles. I mean, there's

a ton of good episodes in that second season.

Yeah. Whereas, you know, the first season, yes,

some of them are good, but it's like they still

don't know where they're going. And then you

go TNG, you know, Elementary, Dear Data, Shizzoid

Man and, you know, Matter of Honor, you know,

all different. You get a couple cute ones. I

mean you get a you get a bunch of different good

episodes every season, but I find that Once they

hit their second season of the shows. That's

when the stuffs actually starts getting moving

With the original series is an exception because

it were only ran three seasons I thought that

kind of next -gen Voyager and DS 9 And Enterprise

really started to hit stride around season 3

I would agree, too, because I think especially

TNG really gets good around season three, four,

because you get best of both worlds, yesterday's

Enterprise. No, I Borg comes in season four,

doesn't it? Four or five. Four, I believe. Like,

I think. I really think Star Trek is. Or maybe

it's serialized science fiction, because the

same thing could be said for The X -Files, for

example. There were good episodes in the first

two seasons, but after three it starts to get

really good. Yeah. What about now, I've only

gotten part of the way through Babylon 5. Does

it have a strong first season, for example? According

to most people, as far as giving advice for watching

that show, a lot of them will say watch the pilot.

Skip the first season and then just go straight

to season two others would others would disagree

with you But I've known several people whose

advice has been watch the pilot skip the first

season watch season two. Oh Wow, so I kind of

wonder if serialized science fiction is just

one of those things Where it takes a while to

get wrong because you have to establish universe.

It's not so much It's because you have to build

universe and you have to build characters at

the same time Whereas if you set something in

quote -unquote the real world you can focus more

on characters as Opposed to establishing the

fictional setting for it. I'm sure that that's

a contributing contributing factor Yeah, because

I look at shows like say Breaking Bad that had

a fantastic if short first season it hooked you

in immediately That's what they are starting

to do sometimes with those shows, you know, like

Star Trek, you know, it's even with, you know,

its first seasons were like full 20 some odd

episode, you know, things as we're something,

you know, a lot of these shows now get like a

six or a 13 and they kind of like, okay, are

you, do we want to still throw money at this?

You know, they might extend the first season

or they might just say, okay, well, that's your

first season and your second season, you'll get

twice as many. Like the Walking Dead, I think

I'd like six episodes and then its second season

was like 13 Yeah, and that's a show that once

again took to its third season to get good Although

in relation that was after 18 episodes So not

really a full real television series or season

quote -unquote the standard being 22 to 24 depending

and I kind of wonder if that's maybe a trend

in television where they're gonna go towards

the short season model because it does cost less

in the end and they can measure where they want

a series to continue or not. I've definitely

seen it a good bit lately. Sarah Connor Chronicles

also had one of those kind of short first seasons.

Wasn't that shortened due to the writer's strike?

It might have been. It was right around then.

That's a show I wish it actually finished. And

it's funny, the guy who wrote the show and created

it says he'll never tell people how it was supposed

to end. Yeah. I want to get this guy really drunk

and make him tell me. I really want to know.

Hopefully he's holding out hope that he gets

to tell his story one day. And that's his maybe

it's he's being superstitious. He thinks if he

tells anyone, then then he'll definitely never

get to make it. I think it'd be really cool if

Netflix were to pick this up. And actually, maybe

that's an idea. Follow me, my friends, if you

will. Do you think Star Trek would be more successful

on network television right now, cable being

AMC, HBO, Showtime, et cetera, or Netflix, Amazon

Prime, Hulu? Like with their model of just dumping

the whole season at once? Yeah. So that might

be expensive with a show like that I Don't them

ever doing that only because shows like you know

like the orange is the new black That's a cheap

show relatively to that you compared to Star

Trek and to dump it on there. Whereas And also

not to mention the fact that Paramount and CBS

would never let the reins go so would have to

be on a CBS station right, but do you think it

might be more successful because You can you

get immediate metrics from this because Netflix

can see how many people are watching anything

at any given time. They can even provide this

data in real time. But the problem I see is that

people would either a blitz through it or just

go right past it. Whereas there would be not

really a lot of I would see people forgetting

about it sooner. Rather than later where as if

it's actually airing week to week. Yeah, it's

the kind of a pain in the butt, but a Keep you

enticed to watch more of it throughout the year

so you don't actually forget about it for the

next season to air Whereas if you watch them

all one load and they dump them in like say January

you have a whole year before another season I

Mean they would have to do it differently, but

I mean I agree that's Think would probably work

better with the standard television model for

that particular, but I don't know I'm sure that

they could Do something to make it work with

the other model? I just don't think that it would

be as strong necessarily Because I'm really curious

what's going to come out of some of these web

series that we've talked about with Star Trek

Renegades wrapping up filming I think today or

tomorrow as of this record being Wednesday October

16th And Star Trek continues, I think. Yeah,

they've got their first episode out. They're

trying to do their second one now. I don't know.

I mean, I would like to see a new pilot come

out for a new series. I think In the Darkness

did pretty well at theaters, didn't it? Yeah,

it did well. I mean, not necessarily critically.

It did well to begin with. Yeah, it didn't do

as well, I don't think, as the first film. Do

you think, now I know we've talked about this

before, pretty much over a year ago, is the world

ready for a new Trek TV series or do we need

to keep building it, kind of like how Marvel's

doing it, building the universe and then creating

a TV series around that? I would love to see

Star Trek back on television, but uh... I think

it would have to go cable, I really do. I can't

see CBS or NBC or any of these big networks picking

it up. It does not gel with the rest of their

lineups. I mean, even SHIELD, as fantastic as

it might be, it's still fairly grounded. I think

the closest thing to sci -fi, real sci -fi, is

Almost Human and the Tomorrow People. And Almost

Human doesn't premiere for another month, and

it looks like futuristic Robocop. Which is cool.

Well, the thing I - Well the thing I see yeah,

I kind of agree that it should go to the like

a cable station just for the fact that it would

be bigger budget and kind of less of reality

TV or Yeah, how many these or cop shows? Competing

with it, which let's face it. That's what the

crap that everybody watches now I mean I could

see doing well on possibly AMC, but AMC does

a lot more of the serious dramas whereas Trek

is more sci -fi drama type thing. So I think

that it wouldn't match there either But again,

I don't see CBS lighting up the rains then if

they were I think they'd be stingy and want to

hold it on their own station Or air mount or

CBS something that they own Rather than let somebody

else have the the rains on it. Well, I want to

say that there was a service I think Warner Brothers

was trying to launch for just their own catalog

very much like Netflix But I don't know if it

ever launched or not. And now the catalog is

big enough for Paramount CBS to do their own

stuff. I just don't know if it would pull in

as many subscribers as, say, a Netflix. Because

a lot of people love the fact that Netflix is

on there. It's consistently big. So that's why

I'm wondering why a Netflix might work. Because

people will go back and blitz through shit. And

I wonder if that might be a good thing, as long

as you insert advertising into it somehow. I

mean, I haven't seen... Which is kind of hard

to do in a Star Trek type setting to work in

that product placement. If you have it... If

you put it just at the beginning of the episode,

this episode of Star Trek brought to you by Doritos.

Or something give them 15 seconds do a little

clever commercial with Transporting Doritos and

like a transporter room or something and the

Romans wanted or whatever that could work and

you find a company who has Familiarity with it

or you sell different products. I know there's

like a star trek in the darkness watch or something

I think I saw as a piece of merch this year So

there is enough merchandise and licensing could

actually do it But once again, we don't know

and I and I guess we're kind of straying away

from topic here But I think it's an interesting

concept when we think about pilots and Star Trek

Because there have been some good there have

been some bad So we're nearing about the half

hour mark and I wonder if we've taken this discussion

as far as it could go So I guess guys let's go

around What's your favorite pilot and why? We'll

start with Steve. Okay I almost knew that was

coming but I would say TNG more so for the fact

that you get a new enterprise with new gadgetry

introduced like the holodeck the battle bridge

with the separated saucer the introduction of

Q who remains to be a pain in the rear for TNG

DS9 and Voyager Because of this you get a pretty

diverse cast You get a lot of humans you get

a betasoid you get a Klingon and you get a droid

And a blind guy that has special technology that

allows him to see so I mean, it's it's a lot

of diversity in the cast but you you also have

a lot of It's a lot of diplomatic and political

and even like Human rights type stuff that kind

of is starts getting brought up even with subtle

hints at the first episode I mean, they're not

there and then it also calls back to the original

series with one character, so There's there's

a lot kind of meshed in there Even if it's subtly,

but it kind of leads into Iran uh you know like

I said earlier based on just the pilot you know

not judging anything else um I gotta go with

Voyager I really I really enjoyed it rewatching

all of them recently like like I said this the

stakes were high you know they they were just

killing off characters left and right you didn't

mean literally any one of those characters could

have gone at any time you know it was It was

the the premise was exciting You know and they're

like I had a lot of like seemed like a lot of

motivation and direction and stuff So yeah, I

would have to go with the Voyager for me. I'm

gonna have to agree with Leo Once again, I just

it's the pilot that felt the most well paced

however Enterprise is leading up there too because

it wasn't it was no slouch it felt Exciting honestly,

I might have gone closer towards Enterprise,

just based on memory, if I had not re -watched.

Like I said, I just re -watched the Voyager Pilot,

and I was like, wow, you know, that's... It was

exciting. It was really good. I mean, not just

exciting, but like I said, the premise was neat.

You know, it was just, yeah, it was well done.

Well done, Pilot. All right, guys, and what about

the worst? Which one do you like the least? I

guess I'll go back. Going first again. For me,

it's kind of a toss -up between DS9 and Voyager.

Voyager, again, I really didn't care for some

of the premise and I didn't care for the whole

caretaker thing. I think that the original, how

it kind of, when they were... intercepting the

McKee and go through that specific wormhole,

and then that whole dilemma of losing half your

crew when being stranded 70 ,000 light years.

I was impressed. I just didn't find the rest

of it interesting. But at the same time, DS9

is heavily based off of a particular episode

of TNG. And then it was a lot of just kind of

it was almost too big to kind of figure out what

the heck was going on in that episode. so I mean

for me it's kind of a toss it between the two

and then Leo what's your least favorite um you

know as big of a I mean you know DS 9 is my favorite

series but it definitely did I think have a weaker

pilot but I might honestly have to go with the

original series on this just in terms of pilot

because I mean the show was starting out they

I mean It wasn't just like, you know, building

off of the back of established Star Trek canon

and establishing that show. This show was literally

paving the way and they really didn't even know

what they were doing. You know, The Cage is interesting,

but it definitely had a lot of things to work

out still. And Where No Man Has Gone Before,

you know, it wasn't all that strong if you count

that one. So yeah, just in terms of pilots probably

the original series for me I'm gonna go with

DS 9 on this one simply because I was bored to

hell For a lot of it were while there were some

cool setups and cool mods, especially to the

battle of wolf 359 I found a lot of characters.

I just didn't like I didn't like Kira. I liked

Odo and Everybody else was it took me a while

to warm up to them And that's where I think that

lies. So guys, that's pretty much gonna do it

for this edition of Future Imperfect. We're gonna

be back on October 30th on Devil's Night to talk

about the best and worst series finales to kind

of bring this discussion full circle. So anyway

guys, I really hope you've enjoyed the show.

Once again, be sure to leave us feedback. I would

love to hear your guys' opinions. So feedback

at thisweekengeek .net, subject line, Future

Imperfect. or we have a voicemail line at 817

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Imperfect, we have been... Steve Megatron Phillips,

and that sci -fi guy, Leo Thompson. I've been

Mike the Birdman Dodd saying, live long and prosper.