Batman: City of Owls, Volume 2 — Court of Owls Conclusion

Welcome to The Pole Bag. Join us as we dig out

our latest comics and discuss them with a rotating

panel of the JCRN crew. So sit back and enjoy

this week's Pole Bag. Hello and welcome to The

Pole Bag. This is episode 77 and we are... This

is the penultimate episode of Batman's 75th anniversary

month spotlight here inside the pull bag I know

people I know I went crazy and Did 13 episodes

in one month and everyone's probably gonna stop

listening to the show because of this but hopefully

not hopefully there are some die -hard Batman

fans that really enjoyed the spotlight but I

am of course your host TFG1Mike, and not joining

me this time is Steve Megatron. He was here for

the volume one of the New 52 Batman Court of

Owls, which collected issues one through seven

of the Scott Snyder written series. I'm joined

this time from the Great White South, JT from

Saskatoon. Really? I could have made a brown

rice joke. Only you think that's funny, Mike.

Only you. It's the Great White North, thank you

very much. And it's indeed North White today,

because it's freaking snowing. Where the hell

is it snowing in Canada in April? It's Canada?

Man, there's a lot of things wrong with that

fucking country. Oh, because there's so many

things right with the states. Well, no, I mean,

look at who our president is, but yeah. nothing

about the political, let's talk about comics

books, shall we? Alright, so you previously heard

JT on the Beware the Batman chapters 5 through

12 and he is back now with me to discuss the

second part of the Court of Owls storyline, volume

2 for New 52 Batman, entitled City of Owls. Briefly...

very briefly if you can. What were your initial

opinions of the storyline and of the first six

issues? I like the idea that there's this secret

society cult that Batman for being the smartest

mother in the DC universe had no clue it was

there. So I was really intrigued by the concept

and the idea that they've got these like zombified

assassins. That do their dirty work. I mean,

there's a lot of stuff It's one of the few things

coming out of the new that came out of the new

52 thus far that Don't make me want to claw my

eyes out And it's a lot of little things like

the You got like Lincoln March who becomes kind

of like this de facto buddy of Bruce Wayne's

and you know, even badminton's like me, you know,

that guy's a good egg and then you got stuff

like where he Batman's so badass that he can

punch somebody and knock a single tooth out on

purpose. Which is what he does to Nightwing.

And then, you know, that kind of opens the floodgates

and you start learning more about the, you know,

the court and everything. Actually, one of the

cool things that come out of the story thus far

is they have a spin -off title called Talon about

a guy who was supposed to become one of these

assassins and he escapes and fights against the

court's... what do you call it machinations and

such like that so so far i've really enjoyed

the story and yeah the the part of what we're

going to discuss today actually hearkens back

to uh elements of the pre -crisis on infinite

earth dc which you know i'll discuss towards

the end of the show but i'm looking forward to

what we're going into today yeah um I find it

interesting that Batman would be, and I said

this last time around when Steve and I talked

about part one, I find it interesting how the

twists happen with him because at first he didn't

believe and then he witnessed it and realized

it and became a party to it and he then, oh my

god, how did this fly under my bat radar for

so long? No shark repellent can save me from

this. Alright, so the copy that's written on

the back of the trade here, for over a century

the Court of Owls has ruled Gotham City in secret

their reach. Inescapable, their power unstoppable

until they battled the Batman. Gotham's vigilante

protector managed to escape the claws of the

court with his mind and body barely intact. The

Dark Knight managed to win the battle with his

deadly new aggressors, but certainly not the

war. Batman was just the first part of the court's

conquest. Now they have their sights set on something

much bigger, Gotham City. These villains will

threaten all Batman holds dear. His secret identity,

his home, his headquarters, his beliefs about

both his friends and his enemies. With the court's

deadly foot soldiers, the Talons out to destroy

him, the Dark Knight and his allies must wage

an all -out war for survival against the most

dangerous predators he has ever encountered.

Dun dun dun! What a twist! Yeah. Well, that's

the one of the best things about this story is

like I said the fact that there's this secret

society that's Ruled Gotham and how is he not?

Coming on something like this before I mean They

mentioned and I think they mentioned the first

part how he tried to find the court as a kid

Yeah, and I mentioned in here too. Yeah. Yeah,

they mentioned in this one, too And it's just

you know, you just put it to his mind and then

you just by and large He went on his life unimpeded

by the court or did he? Mm -hmm All right, so

we open the trade and we get a really really

cool image of Batman being struck by lightning

And then of course we get The the covers here

and it's basically Batman versus the Talon who

will be revealed later Batman volume 2 the Sea

of Owls written by Scott Snyder, James Tinney

in the fourth also co -writer Greg Capolo, Jonathan

Galapion are on art as well as Raphael Elber

Kirkay, Jason Fabook, Becky Cloonan, Andy Clark

and others. Let's see, Batman obviously created

by Bob Kane. I honestly wish they would change

that. I really do. At this point, unless there's

enough members of Bill Finger's family to go

through the Jack Kirby BS that went through with

Marvel. I know, I know. I'm just saying, I wish

out of respect for the guy they would change

it, regardless of the legalities of it all. In

the trade, we have a previously on page with

the Batmobile at the top, and that's pretty cool,

because if you didn't go back and pick up the

first volume, I like how if someone's just gonna

pick this one up, they can just immediately,

hey, this is what's happened, this is what you've

missed, kinda go back and if you want to, read

it, but you don't absolutely have to. And I should

mention, I'm working off of, like I have all

these individual issues myself, and I... most

of them I got the combo pack so I'm working with

the digital copies. Which, you know, I spoke

about this in the Beware of the Batman. Marvel

and DC have really stepped up their game with

this whole the digital comic books, not even

the specifically like the Batman and all that,

like where it's the landscape style. And it's

like Marvel, every issue of Marvel, it doesn't

have to be the combo pack edition. You know,

you get like the digital download code, which

something that really helped me with this. Well,

see, here's the thing with DC. I'm not going

to sit there and spend an extra dollar to get

a combo pack when they could just do what Marvel's

doing and put the damn digital code in one of

their many advertisements in a single issue.

And Marvel's codes, they're only good for a certain

amount of time. So it's not like you're giving

someone Free comic forever you have to in order

to get it in order to get the digital side of

the Marvel stuff You have to get it before a

certain date I don't understand why DC won't

do that instead of just charging everyone a dollar

more For a damn combo that just oh god. No DC

jackasses Now tell us how you really feel like

Yeah, so issue eight is Attack on Wayne Manor.

It also features the story The Call. Now that's

one thing I do like about the trades. Like in

the single issues, I could give a crap less about

the backup story. Once the main story ends and

it says next on Batman or next or whatever it's

gonna say, that's it, I'm done. I really do dislike

channel 52. That's just dumb. I don't disagree

at all. In a more recent issue, I think they

had Ambush Bug giving the goddamn news. channel

52 and one of the more recent issues of a DC

comic that I read and I'm like oh my god seriously

stop yeah because I mean originally it was I

forget who the blonde was I don't think it was

Vicky Vail or something they had the the female

news reporter it might have been summer Gleason

or something like that I mean they had the the

news news chick they had this dude Vartox who's

some alien Superman came out in the 80s, there's

Ambush Bug and Calendar Man. And then they, during

the like forever evil crossover, whenever New

52 is like, you know, Calendar Man's gone missing

and then Vartox, they tried to make some sort

of a story appear in the installments. The thing

is, it doesn't add, it's a glorified advertisement

for what's going on in DC, but it's just dumb.

The only time I really appreciated Channel 52

was, well, there's two times. One, it's the local

news channel on Arrow, because any time the news

reporter shows it's like Channel 52, yes, we

get it. Also, Officer Lance's call sign when

he calls in on the radio, please, it's DC52.

from what he calls in, I thought that was cool.

But in the Earth 2 comic, which is ostensibly

the New 52 version of the Justice Society, they've

got different characters doing it there, and

it's more of like this underground thing, because

currently the forces of apocalypse led by Superman

have invaded, and it's very much like, you know,

the end of the Superman TAS where he... comes

in he's like for dockside and such like that

but yeah overall though it's just channel 52

it's just they had two pages they had to fill

and they weren't taking bids from like potato

chip companies or a soft drink or something to

put an ad there and see that's my biggest okay

that's and i'm not trying to turn this episode

into an after dark with with complaints about

ads but That's my biggest complaint. The Channel

52 two pages could be two additional pages of

story. I understand that puts more work on Snyder

and Capelo, but still, it could have been two

additional pages of story. Or a crazy thought,

a letters page. Marvel's been doing it, Image

has been doing it, it's not... IDW is doing it

still, so... What's the matter, DC? You're not

cool enough to play with the other kids? Yeah,

I don't think DC wants to hear from their fans,

especially with this whole Nightwing is gonna

be a Soviet soldier crap. Well, no, he's a secret

agent for United Nations You any what? No, well

futures in number. Well, I read you that solicit

last time. But anyway, it's an reality. Yeah

No, god, that's even worse of saying anyway.

Um Alright, so night of owls 701 p .m. Now Snyder

I like his writing. I love this story for court

of evils, but Obviously in this story he's taking

cues from year one Because that's exactly what

what year one did in in a sort of way year one

was This date at this time or this date on this

year, you know So I can kind of see the year

one influence and that's all well and good I'm

not gonna take a point off my score for the story

just because he uses something that was used

before But we start off with I've always believed

the best way to know the city is to stay close

to the ground To feel the cracks in the sidewalk

under your shoes the strange bright silence of

the park under snow and on and on and on You

know, so I love the art here the first two pages

of how Batman's basically taking us on a tour

of Gotham City I think that's awesome. I really

do. And then you see that Bruce Wayne has gotten

almost full Howard Hughes with a scale model

of the city and is in Wayne Manor. I like that

how it's all of a sudden Alfred turns on the

holograms and he's like, turn it off, turn it

off, turn it off. All I thought of was several...

I forget which actual cartoon it was but there

are several classic Might be Tex Avery tunes

or several Golden Age animation cartoons where

There'll be somebody that turns on a light turn

out that light. Yeah You know, that's that's

kind of thing and Alfred's just you know trying

to help Bruce with his injuries from What's happened

previously with you know fighting the court and

all that? and at this point he's just He's getting

into that headspace that a lot of heroes get

into when they you know get blindsided by a new

enemies You know, well, I never really knew Gotham

City. It was never really my city Yeah, he's

basically doing some self -loathing. Well, I

wouldn't say self -loathing, but he's Feeling

sorry for himself, you know, he's pulling a Peter

Parker basically But you know One second before

you keep going here. Um, you're now trying to

tell me that Bruce Wayne and Peter Parker and

Dick Grayson are all the same guy Wow, not that

at all Mike You know You know, just let me explain

just saying we're in throughout the many many

years of spider -man comics There's been many

many times where Peter Parker has been sitting

there and moping I mean, he's brooding. That's

exactly what Batman's doing here. It's just Batman's

feeling sorry for himself because he thought

he had it all on track. You know, he is the bad

goddamn Batman. He's protecting his city. He's

trying to rebuild his city. And then the carpet

vis -a -vis has basically been pulled out from

under him. So he's that mope right now. And,

you know, we got Alfred just he's trying to help

Bruce, you know, get back to himself and all

that. Oh God, you said Bat Mope, and all I can

think of, I don't know if you've read it, but

more recently, this month was the new season

two start for the Transformers comics and IDW,

and they launched this 4 -issue mini -series

called Windblade, and in Windblade issue number

one, somebody calls Ironhide Mopey, and all I

can think of is, thanks for noticing me. It's

just a dumb old tale, I don't - and now I'm envisioning

Batman as Eeyore as well, oh my god. Well, technically

Optimus Prime is Eeyore, or was, so... Yeah,

but that's what I'm saying, because Peter was

also Ironhide in G1, too, so, you know, Ironhide

is Mopi, so Eeyore is Mopi, all that stuff, but

anyway, continue. See, yeah, so I mean, it's

just that, you know, Bruce is... I mean, it's

like, anyway, it's like when Rocky got beat by

Clubber Lang in Rocky III. It's just, you know,

he's hasn't quite caught the eye of the tiger

yet again. And then he hears this bump and he

realized somebody's trying to break into the

mansion. It turns out to be. Not one, not two,

but. Well, I don't know exactly what a flock

of owls would be called, I know. almost a murder

it's like a murder of crows because they mean

to do some damage because there's a whole horde

of assassins coming after Batman and I do like

as he's fighting the first one in Wayne Manor

and it's the I love this talent he's like they

can talk they're not just like you know brains

kind of zombie but this talents fighting Batman

And he's like, oh, it seems you've got some moves,

Mr. Wayne. Well, so do I. And I love the bird

because, first of all, he's basically fighting

a James Bond villain because the talon pops a

blade out of the toes of his boot. And then Bruce

burns him. He's like, oh, maybe so, but yours

went out of style 200 years ago with a boot to

the face. And then he looks through the door

and it's like... Like you said before, like an

old Tex Avery cartoon of sorts. You get the eyes

in the dark of like all these other talents coming

after him. And you see Alfred's already skedaddled

down to the cave. And they're trying to track

him. He's like, sir, get in here. You can't take

them all. You need help. And while Bruce is dealing

with a bunch of talents, Alfred has one. As capable

as Alfred Pennyworth is, uh, Alfred gonna get

a whooping. I'm just saying, because Alfred can

fight, but I don't think he's that good. And

you see as Alfred has to deal with the one Talon,

Bruce has now gone up on the roof of the manor,

and he's, well, he's beaten one Talon with a,

uh, Weathervane, and basically... What the hell?

I didn't see that before. Okay. I missed that

where he got, when the first time I read this,

where he had a converted bolt hole hidden in

a chimney, which, you know, takes him down to

the cave. And I think one of the first things

about this first issue is the, at least what

I enjoyed about this first part of the story

was seeing Bruce fight out of costume. Oh yeah,

I've always liked when when Bruce fights out

of college. Don't get me wrong. He is the goddamn

Batman He is supposed to fight in his costume

But if you put him in a situation where any of

his villains not just the court of owls Not just

the Joker not just two -faced, you know Carmine

Falcone or whoever if you put him in the situation

where they know his secret Then other than being

really cool to see the costume, what's the point?

If they already know he's friggin' Batman, let

him fight out a costume for a while, and that

is absolutely amazing. Oh yeah, and the other

thing that I love about the new 52 Batman, specifically

the Batcave, is they have kept two of the most

classic touches, which is the giant goddamn penny,

and the T -Rex. And I think there's a Joker card

in there somewhere too, so... Yeah, I think in

any version of Batman in the comics there are

three things you need to have on the walls Because

Batman does love his bric -a -brac And you got

to have the giant penny you'd have the giant

playing card and you got to have you know the

GDT Rex Which specifically comes into play later

on as we'll see But I like you fight a fight.

Oh At least he didn't call him ace I know he

says correct but i i love where he's trapped

the talent under the penny he breaks it you're

breaking my arm and batman's basically like i

know you know and i love that i have to go back

because i'm not sure if you've reached this point

yet i think you did um but i well we gotta talk

about this bad suit oh like the one that he's

gonna the the armored bat suit that he gets get

the hell out of my house oh yeah oh i like that

they bust the move into the armory Which is basically

like a hardened bunker in the cave and they're

gonna what one of the core things that they've

I think they've figured out previously about

the talents is they're basically they're basically

lizards like the the compound that the court

has devised which is basically a combination

zombie serum plus regenerative Regenerative serum

is you know once you're injected with this stuff,

you know you come back from the dead and you

heal but you're not really human anymore but

you're also cold -blooded so Batman basically

kicks on the AC and he's gonna like a sub -zero

AC yeah he basically is like geez Mr. Freeze

was on to something with this yeah so they're

gonna drop the it to below zero in the cave and

then he puts on one of the most badass bat suits

you've ever seen. I mean, this is part... This

is basically a bat bot suit. You know, because

I love how they have like the slow open of the

armory and then you just see, you know, eight

feet tall, nine feet wide brick shithouse walk

out. And even with the... I love how the vent

on his face looks like a grin. Like it's it's

he's basically the size of the thing Yeah, you

know, you know the line of well, you do know

the line, but you know the line in Iron Man Why

don't you throw a little hot rod red in there?

Oh cuz that'll make it even but you know that'll

make it even better all as I can think of is

Batman threw a little Joker into his own damn

suit with the you pointed out the grid. Oh, yeah

like oh my god I gotta say though, I you know

in any media of Batman I Like the classic suit

and I don't mean the Adam. I like the Adam West

suit I do I like the blue and gray in certain

aspects, but after new adventures I Really dug

the black and gray and I loved what they did

with him in Justice League with kind of combining

black blue and gray for the Justice League suit

But I love seeing all the different variations

on a batsuit regardless of what it is unless

it's blue and gray like they just released Batman

Beyond 2 .0 chapter 19 this a little while ago

shouldn't say they just released it was a while

ago But they did a Lord Batman Beyond suit in

that, and it looks sick. Oh yeah. It looks amazing.

So anytime I can see a variation on the bad suit

that really grabs me is basically my point here.

I absolutely love it. Oh yeah. And I like in

the second part of the story, we go from great

Capullo's art to Raphael. you know should have

taken that the left turn at albuquerque uh and

i love uh i think in between the two like i like

capullo's art don't get me wrong i read spawn

for years uh his the one image comic that he

came on he was the second artist on this image

comic called haunt about a guy who's possessed

by his brother's ghost and develops ghost superpowers

um but uh so i like capullo's design but i really

I think Albuquerque's design is the superior

one because it's got this very steampunk, you

know, you know, it's got the rivets. It just

looks like this solid mass of metal. It just

looks like Batman's going to bring the hurt with

this thing. And it's, you know, he's standing

there all not saying a thing and the towns are

all like, oh, look, Bruce came out to play. You

know what? You know what elves do to bats, don't

you, Bruce? It's like we eat them and that's

like not in this cave. You don't Yeah, it's yeah

I Mean I'm loved like this is the most excited

outside of Batman eternal. This is the most excited

I've been for the near 52 Batman. Honestly is

this story? Everything about this story is something

that I have not realized or not known about in

Batman before Yeah, you know and it really brought

me in It really really did yeah I do like the

oh dang look on Alfred's face when he because

Batman when he broke the Talons arm He found

a micro drive that Alfred decoded and it's basically

he's found the hit list for like 90 % of the

city officials in town are gonna get taken out

by Talons, so that's if you get like the other

trades are like, you know Catwoman and Nightwing

and Batgirl and all that they only had their

one or two issues that dealt with With one of

the talents I mean and I think it was I I haven't

kept on in Batgirl or Birds of Prey But I remember

reading that I think it's the the talent that

Batgirl fights ends up joining the Birds of Prey

Yes, Strix. Yeah. Yeah, that's yeah. So I mean,

there's some stuff to come out of this But yeah,

you see Alfred's just like oh shit and he tells

Batman we get the you know the Three or four

page sequence of you know people being attacked

by the Talons Which is in an effort for I guess

the the court to kind of solidify their control

if they didn't already have control Mm -hmm because

I love how they got the one guy who's like the

the speaker of the City Council You know he he

draws on the talent he like fires off like two

or three times and well bullets ain't nothing

but a thing to the talents and the guys just

like oh crap so you know you know alfred puts

the word out and we get the cameo shot of the

birds of prey red robin oh my god i love that

so much i really do yeah and it's and it's it's

not so much that it's like that it's the way

that albuquerque rendered the traditional group

shot like this it's not like straight lines it's

you know almost like a fractured Fairytale sort

of thing. Well, no you look or shatter glass.

That's what I want to say Well, yeah shattered

glass, but if you look at it from If you look

at it from afar, it's almost Like Alfred is the

head of the bat and the rest of the bat family

images are its wings. Yeah No, I like that and

the other thing that I wanted to say is that

I kind of the one idea I like about rock the

red robin how Tim Drake was always his own character

in the new 52 yes I said something positive about

the new 52 don't let it don't worry people I

got lots to pitch about yet ladies and gentlemen

JT has just said something positive about the

new 52 you may all pass out from just a complete

and utter disbelief yeah no I know I've said

stuff before it's just I'm actively acknowledging

at this point but But yeah, Alfred just basically

gives the lowdown the courts going after all

these people you have to You have to deal with

this Batman stuck in the cave You know Alfred's

gonna keep the line open as much as as much as

you can and then Get you hear the banging and

the court is starting to break through like this

three -ton armored door to the armory It's like

they're going after Alfred. They're going after

Batman and You know Batman's like says come on.

You know he's very little like let's do this

and I mean really when you think about the this

entire issue like Batman just issue 9 is Batman's

walked out of the cave He hasn't thrown a single

punch if the entire issue basically happens over

the course of like 10 minutes From you know Batman

going out and kind of facing the talent somewhat

But you know, they nobody really throws a punch

They're just standing there posturing and then

Alfred cracks the drive and he broadcast this

to you know, the back family And but really when

you look at it, it really happens over the course

of like 10 minutes, which is something I thought

was really cool That instead of like, you know

the entire, you know 20 some pages of a comic

book where so much can happen. It's really Just

shows you you look at the art and everything.

It just shows you what's What how what happens

in such a short amount of time, but they make

it Extremely. It's also very important. You know,

it's not just like blinking you miss it. Oh Yeah,

no And that's that's the beautiful thing about

this or the end of issue eight. Sorry. I was

this Yeah, but that yeah bit. Oh Yeah, absolutely

and the Alfred at the end of it. God help us

all. Yeah Now the next one is Night of Owls by

Snyder, Kapilow, Glapion covers by Kapilow and

Is it Fco? Placenta? Placina? I don't know whatever

the the other cover artists. Yeah, the cover

is the Talon With hit talons in his eyes, and

it's basically Wayne Manor in red. Absolutely

love that. Yeah, it's striking and it's just

very minimal. It's not that there isn't detail,

but there's not a lot going on. It's just that

silhouetted look of Batman with the reflection

of the talons in the visor. Oh yeah, it's Batman.

Whoops, I thought it was a talon with talons

in the visor, but no, you're right. It is Batman.

You know, Wayne Manor in blood, basically, which

kind of reminds me of like the cover to Superman.

Is it 75 with the the bleeding F shield? Mm hmm.

And then you got it. I don't recognize the artist

on that. There's like a standard Batman cover.

You know, it's Batman swooping at you from somewhere

on high. He's an art. I dig it. I love the see

in the in the in the trade how they do the covers

is I'll talk about this once we wrap up the story

It's at the end of the trade, but the cover for

this story for for Night of Owls here is The

red the black and red and then the reverse of

it is a black and white version of that same

cover It's amazing. Oh, yes, absolutely amazing

capital does some amazing covers With the combo

pack like I specifically got the combo packs

for these Initially just cuz I was like digital

comics so and I just get the regular copies now,

but the combo pack cover I got is it's a white

version of that silhouette the bat helmet and

the reflection in Wayne Manor and with There's

like a splatter background. It's like red with

this black splatter like it's supposed to be

like blood and it just looks really kind of intense

but i mean from there we get into the what do

you call it a donnybrook a slobberknocker yeah

you know you can hear king and jr just oh my

god he punched him in the face because basically

with this bat iron man suit that he's wearing

he's got like these uh i guess heated It on his

gauntlets. He's got like these two massive spikes

on the back of it So, you know, these are gonna

do some damage and you see it where bad ben just

punches some dude right in the friggin face with

these things and it's on Alfred can't drop the

temperature fast enough for Bruce. Yeah, and

I'm not calling Alfred a pussy. I'm not But he's

acting kind of like a pussy here He's like master

Bruce gets back in the vault it the doors will

hold and Batman's like no I'm gonna whoop their

ass You know cuz Obviously Bruce Wayne if anything

has a lot of pent -up aggression and Just this

once he he doesn't have to hold back. I Think

this would be a good pullback after dark for

for this what I'm about to say here, but um Would

you Like ever get like I'm not saying you'll

not trying to speak to your character sir, but

if and when you ever have children Would you

ever hand them a new 52 Batman story or would

you ever hand them a Frank Miller? Batman story

or would you go more the route of like Greenland

in the animated series kids comics or boy the

bat like because my point here is is that Well,

I understand that cursing offends some people.

Majority of people, at least people that I know,

don't really care. And I like this line, but

there are times in comics that I don't like when

they bleep stuff out. Where Batman says, I said,

come on, you undead sonza. I get it. Don't get

me wrong. He doesn't want to curse. I get that.

What I really dislike in comics is when they

use... when they basically bleep or, you know,

use... Or they obscure what somebody's saying.

What the... because for me as a reader, it takes

away from the line. So do you think that DC is...

I mean, there's a lot of scary shit that happens

in this Batman book. Not just this one we're

talking about, but this series. There's a lot

of scary shit. so do you think that they need

to just cater to the adults with the main titles

and let you know the kids have their own you

know like scribble knots or whatever the hell

else I don't know I because I would rather not

see you know expletive deleted this expletive

deleted that I think something like this I I

would almost almost call it clever in a way I

mean, he could have said, you undead son of a

gun, you know, I'm not saying he was going to

say that, but if you know what he's going to

say, so it's kind of like that episode of that

70s show where Red, Eric and Kitty go to bring

Hi to live with them and You know reds like get

your effing bag and get in the effing car right

effing now It's all bleeped out and you know

what he's saying So it depends on what's being

said, but I mean something in this particular

instance I thought this was actually kind of

clever that it's like oh no this overall It it's

up to the writer. It doesn't really offend me

in any way But I mean by and large I mean in

addition all the scary stuff. There isn't a whole

lot of you know, noticeable cursing in Batman

comics. Well, right, and I'm not saying it needs

to be, you know, a knockdown curse fest. I'm,

in this particular instance, with him just stopping

and not saying it, that's fine. What I'm asking

is, do you think when, instead of just the stop

and say when they actually put dollar sign, dollar

sign, and exclamation point, like when they use

the onomatopoeia to do it, to express the fact

that someone cursed, do you think it should stay

that way, or do you think they just say fuck

it and just use the damn curse word? I don't

think it's really for me to say. I mean, if they

use the onomatopoeia, I mean, that's great, or

if they obscure it like they did here. You know,

but it's just, I can't honestly say, Mike, it's...

I'm gonna plead the fifth in abstain. So... Bruce's

vital signs are dangerously low. He's going to

black out. Alfred is going to stop being a pussy,

as JT called him earlier, and he's going to come

out and help Bruce. Batman's like, no. And he's

getting piled on by the Talons. And they're like,

you know, go ahead. Try whatever you like. Because

they're talking about trying to stop him. It's

like, hell, get a guard, Doc. And Batman's like,

actually. I already have one. Yeah, that it's

just like, boot to the face, dinosaur style,

because Fido brings his left foot down in like

four or five towns at a time, and he's like,

good boy. Yeah. And I do... And I love this part

of the story where it basically says... My ancestors,

they used owls to kill the bats. Owls everywhere,

but I forgot. The thing I forgot is, as soon

as the owls left, the bats, they came back. It's

just like Batman Begins! Was it Begins that he

used? Well, Begins and year one, it's just this

massive, just the bats are like, not in our house,

Malfoy. Now does yours does your Does your singles

have? Like okay after that page were the page

where it shows Fido. This has actually happened

to me twice. There's a black page after it Like

when I turn the page from where Fido is and where

Bruce says the bats they came back The very next

page is black in the trade. No just all Weird

but yeah, so apparently at this point the bats

come back They swarm the talons and it's just

enough to hold them as you see the ACs finally

kicking enough to bring them down. And then there's

the one... I love the fact that the one almost

gets away and then Batman just straight runs

them over. Because, you know, and of course Batman

had like some coolant. I think it was like in

a dart form or something. He tells Alfred to

use the coolant I prepared for Cobb, who was

like this talent that he had been basically experimenting

on. He was strapped to a gurney in one part of

issue eight, which I should mention, I thought

they skipped to the next issue, but the issue

eight was the art duties were split between Capullo

and Albuquerque, so my bad. Cub is Grayson's

great -grandfather. Yeah, which is that what

the twist Yeah, and then when you get into the

Nightwing side of the court of owls and how the

Haley circus was basically a Recruitment front

for the court and all that So you see Batman's

going out and this got batmobile I gotta say

It's okay like it I dig it I think it's cool

you know and we get as Batman's crossing this

bridge you know we see like the other members

of the bat family you know they go to they're

fighting other talents that Batman's gone to

rescue Lincoln March who's like this mayoral

candidate and I love the like it's not it's not

what it appears to be at all mm -hmm it's he

opens door mr. March and he's like you Bruce

Wayne and he pulls the trigger and I mean that

would have been like the best way to end this

issue on one hell of a cliffhanger and it turns

out that March was firing at this talon that

was behind the door and he's already been impaled

with a cord of owls knife yeah but he'll survive

well that or will he well he does well not at

the very end but for now he will survive yeah

So he passes off a vital clue to Batman and you

know he does like the heroic death sort of speechifying

and Batman's... Remind him that a better Gotham

is just one dream away. And then Alfred calls

in, Master Bruce, the Talons have been contained.

I have news on the other assassination attempts

as well. I know where they live, Alfred, but

sir, they came to my house. Now I'm going to

burn theirs to the ground. It's like, oh shit,

it just got real. I love that bottom panel where

he says that, where it's basically him and the

name of the city underneath his chin. I absolutely

love that. Where he's looking at the framed shot

of Gotham like that. Yeah, no, that was great.

And that's how it ends right there for that.

that issue because the next story is assault

on the court does your trade have the uh... backup

story with uh... alfred's father that's at the

very end okay that's i think is not the annual

no it's uh... in issue nine there's part of uh...

you know it's uh... it's a story entailing what

we could talk about briefly later on it's a sink

this Could have sworn where he's writing to out

where his father is writing to and for him to

have a better life And I think that might be

in the actual volume one. Okay, I think Just

to go over quickly. I'll just sum it up quick.

It's a short story That's a backup in these the

next couple issues of Batman called the fall

of the house of Wayne where I Forget what Alfred's

dad's name is and just look quickly here now

anyway alfred's dad will just call him that he

used to be the butler for the waynes it's at

a time where you know it's before bruce's parents

die and basically he finds out about the court

and it's told in kind of a pulp fiction style

flashbacks where out where his alfred's dad tries

to escape and he's written this letter and it's

part of the narration where he's warning alfred

like don't come to gotham and the whole time

he's being hunted down by one of the talons and

ultimately he loses his life and it's kind of

resolved and it does come back to it in the final

issue of the story which you know i'll bring

it back up there just to cap it off so we move

on to you know issue 10 or the next part of the

story in mike's trade and i dig the cover where

you see batman full costume he's got the the

owl mask in one hand he's got like the silhouette

of like You know the background allowing background

just looks kind of badass and intense That's

the cover for the tree. Yeah, and they got one.

I think it's Albuquerque's art where it's the

silhouette of Batman like you see his face and

all that but over his body you see like part

of the bat signal and there's some blood in the

ground and shattered owl masks and Batman looking

like he gonna hood somebody. Oh Yeah So, you

know when we get back into the story it's I Don't

they never named the building but it's basically

like this old money super rich residential sort

of a building where They discuss like the there's

a wooden gymnasium. They've got a zeppelin More

on the top of the building, you know, cuz rich

people dig zeppelins And you see that it's a

court -controlled building, because this lady's

getting off the elevator. It's got the symbol

of the owl on the doors. And she walks in, and

she sees her place is trashy. She backs in, and

she closes the gate, because it's one of those

old -school, almost cell -door -like, with the

metal gates and all that. And Batman stops her,

and he's like, going down. Yeah, that's awesome

and just right away she gets this attitude You

know cuz it's it's the rich Entitled villain

And it's pretty much you know she's holding her

pinky up and drinking from her teacup Yeah, it's

like you can't do anything to me. We control

the city And Batman's just like I'm taking y

'all down y 'all can't do nothing about it peace.

I'm out And I do like how after she she tries

to like, you know, puff up her chest in front

in front of Batman and she walks away or he walks

away and she's behind bars, basically. And he's

I love that line. He's like, I get used to that

view. And I just love that you see him doing

like. You know, does like it's like playing Arkham

City where he dies right off the top of this

building and then. you know spreads the cape

out and sails away into the night and you know

gets an update from Alfred that uh they can't

crack the uh they can't crack the court of owls

communications like their cell phones and that

but they can trace them and the talons apparently

he's got uh a cryovolt in the bat cave because

well why not it's batman yeah and and i just

love the sequences like he Batman Alfred's telling

him like what's going down and Batman just is

that one step ahead of him Well, he is because

this is what this goes back to him searching

for the court as a child Well, yeah where he

ends up was where he always it it was where it's

always been Yeah, so but I mean, you know, I

love the narration and and for me this is Page

10 where he talks about on a redo card who you

know Liam Neeson's role in Batman Begins and

at varying points he's been a part of Batman's

life as a true like one of the guys that trained

him as Batman, but I love how he Describes, you

know the process by which you where all the pieces

fall into place when you're figuring out a mystery.

Oh, yeah, you know, it's It goes back to this

old abandoned building where Bruce went searching

for the court when he's a kid And you know, it's

just well, of course This has got to be controlled

by the the court of vows because there's house

all over the goddamn place Like wooden owls carved

owls stuffed owls and he goes into this secret

meeting place which is one of the things about

the court like apparently there's like secret

rooms and all these old buildings in Gotham and

You know that most of them are in Wayne buildings.

Yeah that too and then he goes in and he sees

there's you you don't get it right away in that

first shot of the court sitting at this long

table but then you look and you see that they're

all they've all been poisoned they're all dead

we got to go back a page because i love the way

capolu and and galapion colored this for the

coloring and the art here is how he kicks the

door in Then how he enters with the debris. It's

kind of looks really smoky and oh my god That

is such a badass image of Batman Oh, yeah, like

just with the dust swirling about and all that

he's just like F you stuffed owl You know like

you'd see that he's like really p .owed Cuz I

mean just like I know you're mad all the time

Batman, but what did that stuffed owl ever do

to you? Cuz he straight -up just Breaks that

thing and then he you know goes upstairs. He

finds the dead bodies and everything and he's

like damn you and he goes to the next day and

he's reverted to Bruce well that mope Because

he's sitting there you know the sun's rising

he's like son of a bitch got away from me You

know, and he's caught he's all contemplative

and brooding and whatnot. He's trying to figure

it out and Then he starts, you know, he starts

rolling Oh, it makes sense now. Mm -hmm. He goes

to the the old home for kids and yeah, Willow

would home for children. Yeah, and You know just

basically talking about how this is like hell

on earth for kids with like neurological disorders

and such And he basically walks in on Lincoln

March, you know, he's come back as a talon more

or less You know, he's got the zombie juice in

him Technically he's no longer Lincoln March.

He's Thomas Wayne jr. Dun dun dun Which, yeah,

and in the pre -crisis, like, somewhere between

the late 50s and the early 70s, Thomas Wayne

Jr. was in the Batman comics, and he was Batman's

brother, but he was, like, basically messed up

in the head, and he was in a mental hospital,

and there were a couple stories I remember reading

about... that this was an actual character, but

it's one of the many, many things that got wiped

right off the slate when crisis happened. But

I mean, they're, Snyder's using it to good effect

here. We have, they have this great back and

forth as, you know, and I'm just gonna call him

March, you know, cause at least to give him a

name. Cause Thomas Wayne Jr. Oh, I don't think

so. but you know march is like egging batman

along you got to find the truth in the lie and

the lie and the truth and you know he's like

you know keeps egging him along to the reveal

that you know that i'm supposed to be i'm thomas

wayne jr your brother that never was from the

other side of the mirror you just you know he's

gotten full -on cackling super villain at this

point i mean he and i guess a little bit of uh

Tech envy cuz you know, he's got like this super

talon battle suit that was supposed to be made

to bad badass enough to take out Batman and You

know, it's Basically, he's gonna kill Batman

and he's gonna wait a while and come back. It's

like I'm Thomas Wayne jr. I own everything now

and It ends on the one of those great kind of

action shots where they're charging towards each

other No, I mean, Capolo has just... Capolo,

Albuquerque, all the people that work on this

book for the art. Simply amazing. That, that

court of owls suit, or the, the talon suit that

March is wearing, oh my god. That's just awesome.

It does look very badass, I mean, you got like...

you know the owl kind of face right in the chest

and then all the ribbing and everything coming

off of it and he's got spikes everywhere you

can see he's got like a shredder claw in one

hand with the two two blades popped out like

that maybe all that medals for making coleslaw

well everyone all the ladies do love a sharp

dressed man Wow. Okay. Let me ask you. Now, I

know Owl Man is a different character, but I

gotta tell you, this last page, when he says,

you know, brother to brother, owl to bat, I really,

like, this is Snyder's own version of an owl

man. Yeah. I think. Well, I mean, it's obvious

that that's what he's going for there. With the

with the design, but I mean not specifically

such but I mean that's part of the thing about

owl man that in You know was it earth? I think

it's earth three and the greater DC, you know

multiverses in Earth three where all the heroes

are villains and the villains are heroes like

there's Ultraman and Superwoman and out Yeah,

and in that universe owl man is Thomas Wayne

jr. Oh Yeah, that's true. So yeah And then it

goes back to you know Thomas this guy claiming

to be Batman's long -lost brother and Then you

go to you know chapter 11 or sorry issue 11 here,

and I love just the I actually ended up buying

The regular cover because the combo pack that

I got with the issue 11 had a different cover

But I bought the regular cover because I just

thought it looked bad as it's like Batman there

with his hands out to the side It looks like

he's walking through flames and some of the flames

look like bats Yep, and it's just I thought that

just looked badass Yeah, now this one now see

here's where in the trade Here's where they put

my brother's keeper, which is the main story.

Here's where they put the house of Wayne Yeah,

or the fall of house away. No, but the fall of

the house away where yeah you see that the court

is trying to use Alfred's dad to get Martha into

into place in their Machiavellian chess scheme

and he's like uh and as much as like I wouldn't

say Alfred Alfred was very concerned for Bruce

and that you know it's I wouldn't like I said

I don't want to call him a pussy but he's kind

of acting like one but his dad like and again

I'm not knocking out I don't mean to knock Alfred's

dad but the dude pussed out He basically gets

one threatening phone call and he's ready to

throw Martha Wayne to the goddamn wolves Yeah

Now what I will say that I find interesting now

I've I know we still have yet to go through the

main story here but with with the with the fall

of the house of Wayne or whatever there because

I'm so confused because I'm not confused. I'm

I keep getting mixed up because the more recent

story of Batman Beyond 2 .0 chapter 19 the title

of it is ruins of Wayne well the ruins of Wayne

so What is so irksome to me about the story even

though it says years ago? The whole time we've

been talking about this since this last issue

before we get to the one one now I've been trying

to figure out not necessarily how old Batman

is, but when his actual birth date was. Because

the story for the Fallout House of Wayne seems

to me like it was back in the 1800s. I know Alfred

isn't that damn old. Well, that's kind of a credit

to Albuquerque's art, I think. Just because it

has that very aged look to it. Yeah, I mean I

probably say If you're just going off the fact

that finger and and Kane and yes, I intentionally

put finger first Wow, that sounds so wrong You

know finger and Kane, you know had him debut

in 1939 Even if you want to say that that still

means that right now Batman is 75 Batman is basically

Dark Knight returns But at this point, I'm trying

to figure out where in this story That this would

have actually taken place. I just don't know

like what like the fall area you mean? Yeah,

like what era is it? Within a year or two before

Thomas and Martha get gunned down because Bruce

is about you know five six years old around which

is the age around the time that you know his

parents died so it's it's around that time I

think yeah so yeah you're right you're right

I just I wish instead of saying years ago they

would have said X number of years ago this you

know or a year before the death of the Waynes

or something other than just a vague Because

it's not just Albuquerque's art in the in this

it's The fact of it looks like what I've seen

in like something like gates of Gotham or gates

of Gotham actually was the 1800s with with Alan

Wayne with his his great -grandfather or great

-great -great However, many damn greats grandfather

Bruce Wayne's grandfather was I forget? Pretty

great kind of action Yeah But yeah, I mean, that's

kind of where, you know, where I thought it would

be. I mean, overall, the final chapter here for

Court of Owls, I really loved it. I love the

art. I love the story. I love the fall of the

House of Wayne, but there's... What is it? Is

it the annual? What is it here? I'm trying to

think. Yeah, it's the annual that kind of trips

me up. It really does. It just, I don't know.

We get into it there. Yeah. Because I mean, basically,

this issue, you know, issue 11 opens with, you

know, March and Bruce fighting. And I like, you

know, Bruce's story, you're not my brother, you're

a lunatic in a boot suit. I was done playing

nice a long time ago and then it's like the whole

time like march is just taking these punches

he turns it is it my turn now okay and then you

know you you see them like this suit's probably

like augmented in some way in addition to the

the the extra juice the zombie serum gives the

the talons you know because he basically punches

bruce through like three or four walls through

a solid brick wall and then, you know, Bruce

tries to hits him with the, what do you call

it, the zip line and they fall in. Then you see

the suit can fly and basically March flies off

in the city and there tells him like everything

that or not tells him everything, but he basically

shows all these points of interest to him, to

Batman. He's throwing Batman into him and he

gets into all this mirror analogies. And he's

basically showing him all these places that he's

gonna wipe off the map as you realize He's maybe

not gonna wipe these out He's just starts to

go mad because as you read as they go past his

church and he throws Batman into the bell You

just see the dialogue and March just gets increasingly

more and more insane You know and He tries to

end Batman by throwing him into the jet engine

of a 747 Mm -hmm Where you know, it's it's crazy.

It really is Yeah, and he's standing there. It's

like your big bro. Your brother's watching over

you just like always and then he tells them basically

how when you know what he's gonna do and I Love

how Batman is like you should You know watch

your own your mark says you should watch your

back and Batman's like good advice and You see

somewhere in the fight that he tagged him with

a small explosive That I thought was gonna be

meant to like drive March into the jet engine

Yeah, not so much luck and I guess his zip line

is like voice controlled or something because

he goes into freefall Batman because you know,

they blows March up and he jumps off the plane

and he says switch to high -velocity bat rope

now and I Guess any scream he he basically part

of the story It's it this has kind of been from

the beginning of Batman. This is only the first

year of the new 52 folks Bruce Wayne's got this,

you know Renew Gotham initiative and he's building

like this new like there's old Wayne Tower, which

is the design they had From from the 1800s. Yeah,

well the 1800s, but it's the the the Wayne Tower

that we had in like the pre -52 You know the

real DC in my opinion You know with the gargoyles

and everything and it looks all kind of old and

kind of steampunky kind of thing but he's building

this new modern Wayne Tower skyscraper he crash

lands in there and You know March shows up and

he's got this place. It looks like he's stuffed

like giant wads of bubble gum all over the place

with Micro cams, I mean it's plastic explosives,

but it looks like giant wads of bubble gum And

you know he's gonna blow this all up and you

know take Batman with him and then he'll dig

himself out of the rubble and return as you know

Thomas Wayne jr. And take over everything and

Batman pretty much stabs his eyes out with his

own thumbs Yeah, pretty much. And then he runs.

I gotta say though the The fact that the I know

the mask on on Wayne jr. Is the Is supposed to

be the owl mask from the comic -con thing that

actually came with the mask set I get it I don't,

as much as I love Capelo's art and Albuquerque's

art and Clapion's colors and everything else,

I don't like that the mask and the talon came

up to then show another kind of mask and then

marches. He's got like a cowl and then he's got

those goggles. Yeah, it's like, hey, let me steam

this punk for you. It just, it's too weird. And

don't get me wrong, folks. I don't dislike steampunk,

but it is like when that mask is up on that page

where he's like, um, well, this time I'll make

sure, you know, that Bruce stays dead. It just,

it looks too weird to me. Yeah. I wouldn't necessarily

call it steampunk, but yeah, it's, it's a little,

you know, kind of, what do you call it? Disconcerting

sort of thing. Yeah. So. And. I just love how

he blows up. He basically, it's like controlled

detonation, like he levels the building in its

own footprint. You know, and you see Batman running

and he gets out. And, you know, you see the whole

tower, Batman's narration is, you know, the whole

tower was destroyed to the foundation. He, I

guess other authorities dug through the rubble,

but he went through there. He couldn't, he didn't

find March's body. And even, uh, you see Dick

there and he's, you know, he's basically ready.

He's like, well, I'm planning on punching you.

And it's basically, it's like, you punch me,

I punch you. We solid bro. Okay, cool. Cause

basically Dick wants a shot at Batman for the

sucker punch where he knocked his tooth out.

And I know I've, I've, I've had this discussion

with some friends online and at the store that,

you know, a lot of people are like, Dick should

let it go. And I was like, it's like bro code

he gets one back yeah pretty much yeah yeah but

you see bruce is like brooding over the model

of the the city again and you know he's gonna

he makes mention he's gonna keep on with this

initiative he's gonna rebuild the tower again

that's like another billion dollars uh he went

to all the locations that he's aware of like

he went back to the labyrinth That he'd been

trapped in You know, it couldn't find any evidence

there. You see the the captured talents. They've

built a cryo prison in Blackgate Wayne funded,

of course and You know see all the other talents

are there and even Bruce like he gives Bruce

or he gives dick the story of how he knows he

had a brother and Basically, he was born with

like severe brain damage and he basically lived

for a night and that was it and he's like as

far as he thinks that's I did have a brother

for that brief moment but then Dick's but what

if he survived what if your parents you know

lied to you and even Bruce admits that you know

it could be possible that maybe that really was

his brother but you know without DNA And I think

that's one of the best question marks that hangs

over the Court of Owls story thus far, because

you still got Strix and Birds of Prey, you got

the Talon ongoing. Eventually they're going to

come back, the court's going to make another

move against Batman. But that's the one unresolved

plot thread that I look forward to seeing what

they do with it in the future, is whether or

not they bring back March and... you know it

could be like in the pre pre 52 where they had

a hush had Bruce Wayne's face and He tried to

take over Wayne Enterprises and claim. I'm the

real Bruce Wayne and He tried to shut you know

Batman out in the cold and all that so It's a

mystery that I look forward to them coming back

to in the future Yeah, and then it ends with

I'll be watching Always now. I do like that with

him with basically showing Gotham City within

his his iris I think that's absolutely amazing

and the fact that he's got like this special

bat What do you call them contact lens? Yeah,

because you see like the little bits on the on

the periphery of his Iris you see like the little

bits of circuitry in that but yeah, that's an

absolutely beautiful shot of like, you know Gotham

City and You know, you see the bat signal in

the sky and Batman will always be there. And

you know, we go to the conclusion, at least in

my issue, you get the conclusion of the House

of Wayne where Alfred's dad, you know, did absolutely

nothing the way the court said, and they've sent

the talent to take him out. And unfortunately

- Yeah, see that? That's the thing between the

single issues in the trades and the singles it

was broken up as as the one shots Here in the

trade instead of having the one shots after each

ish after the each the each of the three issues

It has it as all one story. Oh, yeah, and they

have at the end here like you you know It's after

its post -cortival And you know, I guess you

know, they're talking about I guess they found

some evidence to the You know that how Jarvis

you see on his gravestone their Jarvis Pennyworth

was however it was involved and It's just it's

a really nice kind of denouement like, you know

epilogue to the story, you know that they're

feeling Yeah, they're moving on Alfred's like,

you know, whatever misdeeds my father It's Whatever

it basically says whatever misdeeds his dad perpetrate

against Bruce's family you know he more than

made up for him in the end because he tried to

you know war at least tried to warn you know

Alfred about what's what has happened so I mean

that's the end of issue 11 you go your trade

has issue 12 and the annual right my trade has

well Thought issue 12 was the end I'll be watching

always and then my trade goes to Alfred's story

And then after Alfred's story it goes to ghost

in the machine Yeah, the ghost machines issue

12, which it's not a huge I mean just to briefly

summarize it. It's there's this girl named Harper

and her brother Cullen living in you know Gotham

and it's it's kind of one of those slices of

life stories you know, how are people in Gotham

affected by badminton sort of thing? Because

you see Harper, she got this special invite to

go to a party at Wayne Mansion. It has to do

with the Renew Gotham thing. And basically she's,

you know, she's like lower middle lower class

like that. So she's piling like some of the free

food into her backpack and Alfred comes up and

he's like, well, you can't leave the dessert

table without tasting the brownies. And right

here the the art on this issue is done by just

let me quick flip back here arts done by There's

Becky Clunen and Andy Clark and Becky Clunen

is doing the art for the first half of the story

basically I love the way she portrayed Alfred

here. Like this is Batman TAS Alfred like you

can hear Ephraim's voice Ephraim Zimbalist jr

Coming out of this, you know, it's got some very

smooth thing even almost get that sly wink and

a nod Where she's like, I just need to find the

door and he's like, oh right this way and you

know, they have a nice little conversation about

you know, what's going on and about Bruce and

all that and She goes home and she finds Cullen

Has been beat up because apparently Cullen's

gay we find out And no one really does anything

because they're in that part of Gotham where

everyone just minds their own business like you

see what happened He got attacked the back of

his head was shaved and they wrote Well, I'm

not gonna say it out loud because it's really

I find it to be a very offensive term You know,

I'm not gay, but I mean just really Yeah, they

thought that was a good idea. So Well, you know,

there's not a lot of things that DC has done

for good ideas lately. So The fact that this

is the beginning of the new 52 that doesn't surprise

me at all that they would Yeah, like this, you

know, they're you see Harper's kind of a tech

head and she's got this job working for the city

because they're out walking one night and The

boat the guys that assaulted Cullen come up and

she's built a taser Who I think this is gonna

be at least 30 or 40 thousand volts because she

tags this douchebag Jimmy Olsen clone at Once

that he's on the floor twitching. I mean hardcore

twitching and then the rest of them are gonna

You know assault them and Batman drops in and

basically touch them again and I'll hurt you

Yes, sir Like that sort of reaction then Harper's

got like this new obsession of like finding Batman

helping Batman. Yeah, she finds a Bat box, which

is something Batman's built into the power grid

to You know prop it up and help it in times of

crisis and all that which is I think that's a

subtle clue to the events that happen in year

zero you know the online like it's the new year

one, but It's not it's not done by Miller and

you know, basically she kind of sort of helps

Batman and Batman's like sure you did and So

he's got like this network of supporters. I guess

starting with this character and at the end of

it you say it's the zero issue because basically

it goes issue 12 then there's zero issues which

are basically year one and or origin stories

for a lot of DC characters which was a lot of

fun and then you get the annual which basically

is Batman Mr. Freeze sub -zero first snow I feel

a rant coming on, but I'm all I'm going to say,

rant -wise, is how could you fuck Mr. Freeze

up like this? Oh boy. Alright, well, ladies and

gentlemen, we're going to take a quick break

so JC can collect his thoughts. No, I'm good,

I'm good. And we'll kind of, we'll come back

and we'll kind of go through as to why he believes

they fucked up Mr. Freeze. We'll be back after

this. Oh my gosh, this is so great! The Iceman

cometh! Oh god. I would sooner take the Arnold

Schwarzenegger dressed like a shiny hood ornament

Mr. Freeze... than the hipster mohawk wearing

douche that we've got in the new 52. Take two

of these and call me in the morning. Even that?

And we'll get into it in the story here. I will

say really quick before we get into the story,

really quick, the cover. I love the cover, because

it has everything that... Ties into the storyline

of court of owls because it does have birds It

doesn't owls flying around that it has Batman

on a rooftop and it has the shadow of mr. Freeze

with his red goggles I absolutely love that.

I'm I'm really glad they threw that hot rod red

in there for his goggles. Oh, yeah No, that's

that that's that's it is a good cover. I will

say that Mm -hmm, but you know we get in here

and it's He's from Nebraska Nebraska I do like

the origin of his obsession with freezing in

that his You know, mr. Freeze is being interviewed

by a psychologist in Was it black gate because

I don't think they in the new 52 they have no

it's a Arkham asylum. Okay, it's so basically,

you know, he's getting like a psychological analysis

by the shrink and He kills the guy Pretty I don't

want to say brutally, but they're graphically.

It's just it's just straight -up just grabs a

guy snaps his neck starts working on the coolant

system to his cage and Effectively turns the

AC and Arkham Asylum into a giant -ass freeze

gun I'll say about his design where I don't like

it Well what I don't like is the goddamn mohawk

that's fucking stupid or something like Why can't

you just be like every other cold -based super

villain your hair freezes it falls out in your

bald? Yes, we'll see here's the here's the problem

I have with the whole cell scene here where the

guy says alright Victor. What do you want to

talk about time? Like the background of the cell

like to me when I see mr. Freeze and he has to

be kept in a certain Okay, sure, BTAS, he was

in a cell in Heart of Ice, but we're really kind

of comparing as Batman and Robin's Mr. Freeze

is the better of these two evils. I wouldn't

say he's the better, I'm just saying his origin,

which we'll get into in this story, is the B

and R version of Mr. Freeze is better than, and

his origin is better than this one's origin.

It's when we get to it. It's I I will say exactly

what I think and with his few swears as possible

But yeah, it's he I do like to design like you

see so you see the cold mist coming off the floor

You see the icicles sticking down. It's not as

over -the -top Comical as you would think mr.

Freeze's cell would be Like you know, it's damn

cold in there But I love the part where he freezes

the guards with this giant hose of coolant And

then he takes a slurp off of it like it's a garden

hose Yeah, you know and he goes on and apparently

he's inhaled a bunch of stuff because he just

spits it out and freezes The the next set of

guards and then he breaks into like the weapons

locker You know takes his suit back You see the

god the suit is awesome. I will say Yeah, no,

the suit is good. I do like the fact that, you

know, it's got elements of the Batman TAS Mr.

Free suit, like, especially with, like, the mason

jar on top of his head like that. And, you know,

then he's got his arms exposed, which to me at

least is kind of evocative of the Batman's Mr.

Freeze. You know, okay, he's like half Iceman

and he's basically in a giant almost a mech suit

of sorts where he's got mutant ice powers and

somehow getting mutant ice powers made him like

this brilliant Engineer because he was just a

jewel thief before and I'm kind of getting off

topic Even that origin is better than this one

You just turned Mr. Freeze into Bobby Drake of

the X -Men. Well, that's what he was in the Batman.

You really can't deny that. But yeah, so... Well,

that's what the Batman was. I mean, he just gestured

with his... There was no ice ray. See, that's

the thing. Okay, sure. I get it. Batman doesn't...

He abhors guns for what happened to his parents.

And... Technically... freeze gun isn't it's a

gun but it's not a gun that fires bullets and

that was one of the coolest things about btas

was you had mr. freeze in this really awesome

suit and you had him with his freeze gun and

every time they would do the freeze effect like

at the camera it's swirled out of the gun that

was awesome and not having a freeze gun takes

about a seven points off the batman or as ben

usually puts it the crap man there's a lot there's

a lot i liked about that series beyond certain

yeah no i know what you're saying so we got uh

mr freeze breaks into the iceberg lounge and

i like the fact that they they kept this element

of the penguin that he is more of this criminal

Mastermind, you know, he's got like the public

facade of being a nightclub owner and I love

to design like it's classic Oswald cobble pot,

you know top hat monocle It's this is pretty

much the design of cobble pot here is pretty

much You know, they're kind of Not okay. It doesn't

have the the likeness of a certain meredith but

uh it it's very much birch's meredith penguin

for the new 52 as far as the design and the style

i mean granted it doesn't have it you know his

his actual facial features but i like the homage

now let me ask you though since we're talking

about the damn penguin and i know penguins live

at the south pole You know, I get that and they,

you know, live in freezing cold temperatures

and they're around ice and all that stuff. But

it's always not really confused me, but it's

always been like, kind of like, what the kind

of moment? Cause you would think the iceberg

lounge, that would be something that Mr. Freeze

would do. Yeah, I mean, I don't think it's actually

in an iceberg, but yeah, I know what you're saying.

You think Mr. Freeze... The whole motif, the

whole motif of the ice and everything else, it

just doesn't, you know... When I see the penguin,

regardless of what version it is, it always just

screams, hey, let's go get in my giant duckmobile.

Oh, who didn't want to take a ride in that? I

know, right? But no, it's... I do like the iceberg

lounge like as far as a set piece for being penguins

front and all that it makes a lot of sense and

I love the fact that basically mr. Freeze just

busted here because you know Penguin controls

the black market. So of course he has mr. Freeze's

gun And I will admit the the the ice gun here.

It does look pretty badass And you see how cold

that the penguin can be where he's like, I'll

make the lava robbery look real Okay, I want

I don't want to be persecuted on your behalf.

So basically sacrifices his his minions And we

call that's a min. That's what minions are for.

I mean grew has enough of them And then we get

into the origin proper, oh boy, here we go and

The origin proper What's wrong it's not his actual

wife Like I understand one of the greatest things

about mr. Freeze and this is something they adopted

into the DC Comics proper After a while after

Tia Batman TAS came out is that mr. Freeze was

trying to save his wife You know, he developed

this cryonic technology Douchebag executive,

you know wreck some shit and now he's got to

live in sub -zero temperatures and his wife is

still in the cartoon his wife survived and was

eventually cured of her condition in the comic

books she was killed in a fight between Batman

and Mr. Freeze by Mr. Freeze himself but you

know his mind snapped and he blamed Batman for

the death you know that was a great powerful

motivating force but basically here the this

Nora that he's obsessed with is A woman that's

been on ice for like years that they've never

met. Oh, I see. He is basically, because of what

happened with his mother, because you see in

the beginning where she falls to the ice, and

that's where his obsession with ice began. And

it's basically, it's like this really reverse

Florence Nightingale thing where You know, he

falls in love with her and he's become she's

become this all -consuming obsession somewhere

his mind ticked over. Oh, it's my wife You know,

i'm going to save my wife and i'm not saying

it's it's not any less a powerful motivating

force But the fact that this guy is basically

a jacked up stalker And just like no and even

here you see any blame that he casts on anybody

else For his condition or what happened to Nora

is entirely his own fault because Bruce Wayne

comes in and like look I don't like what's going

on here. You haven't produced any useful results.

I've called the cops So what does Victor do he

throws a chair at Batman? which Hits a tank of

super coolant and that's where you know, he gets

mutated basically Yeah, I threw a chair at him

It doesn't sound as cool as I threw a rock at

it. It was a big chair. It was a big rock Yeah,

and then you see what I love about this story

though is really quickly. I love is is how Nightwing

and Robin are the two that find out about all

this stuff and confront him and I've said this

before many times this this podcast has been

going on for over Numbered episodes where we're

at 77 at this point But in total we're probably

over a hundred episodes all together between

after darks and origins and back into classics

all that stuff Since I've been reading comics.

I will never not loathe Damien Wayne, but what

I like about his Being in the new 52 is that

and I will defend this till the day I die Bruce

Wayne, while he might be his biological father,

emotionally could give a shit less about Damian

unless the kid dies, which he did. But every

time that I see Nightwing and Robin, you know,

hanging out or doing hero work, Dick Grayson

is more of a father to Damian than Bruce ever

will be. Well, he really really is I I won't

disagree with you at all there. However, if you

think you hate Damien Wayne in the comics Wait,

will you watch Son of Batman? Oh good. I can

guarantee you you will love Damien in the comics

after that. I Don't know. Well, yeah, so I mean

Nightwing and Robin have a little you know good

kerfluffle with mr freeze and he goes on upstairs

to get revenge on bruce wayne you know we get

the origin you see him waking up they they tell

him like you know he's you gotta be in this suit

all the time and batman is not above playing

dirty because he pulls nora out of cold storage

and has him has her just sitting there in his

office and then he Swings in through the window

and causes like another you know three or four

grand in property damage because I can afford

it All right now. I'm a meaning to bring this

up. Okay everybody since man of steel came out

Everyone always complains. Oh property damage.

Oh isn't bystanders. Oh this oh that oh my god

Superman didn't save all those fucking people

when he was going after Zod Every single superhero

robots... Oh, there's always property damage.

There's always property damage. There's always

going to be someone who might get injured or

killed. Not intent. I mean, it's not like Superman

is intentionally going over there to, um, you

know, kill that person. It just... Oh my god,

I am really so sick of everybody complaining

about property damage. Don't get me wrong, I

nitpick the fuck out of everything. I really

do. No. Shut up. Fucking Canadian. I nitpick

the hell out of everything. Don't get me wrong.

I will and I do. But shut up about the goddamn

property damage and innocent bystanders and everything

else. Superheroes and giant robots and fucking

Godzilla can't protect everybody Well, I would

say I would say we both got a rant this episode.

There you go Witnesses like Godzilla protects

anybody put Godzilla but you know vis -a -vis

I I do like I'm just saying the foreground product

is like a Batman can afford it be it looked cool

and see I just did it for somewhat comedic effect

but I love where he's facing off with freeze

here you see freeze has a freeze gun batman has

branding irons attached to his gauntlets because

he's straight up just like if you see it like

it's hot enough he could probably you know brand

a cow or something with those things that he

just basically that would be the most effective

tool against mr freeze the whole time we've been

reviewing this this this trade these issues Just

make Batman a goddamn iron suit without guns,

please just Fucking make a black and silver Iron

Man suit make the fucking space suit for Bruce

Wayne for you know iron Batman or Whatever the

hell cuz holy crap. We've had more Iron Man references

in this entire podcast than the entire lifespan

of the pull bag Especially my fault, but anyway.

Yeah, and I like that like Batman gets frozen

the gauntlets burn him out he Calls mr. Freeze

on his bullshit, and you know this is Nora field

she was born in 1943 she's old enough to be his

grand his grandmother and Yes, that's what that's

why one of my all -time favorite villains is

Mr. At least from the Batman TS is the way they

did. Mr Freezing You can't help but you know

what whatever mr. Freeze does is almost entirely

is almost justified Almost almost See, here's

the problem with this whole thing. If he's older

than she, like, and I don't mean if he's a year

older than she is or whatever else, but if all

this stuff happened with his mother when he was

a young boy and he's, say, 50, 60 years old and

this Nora is, say, 20 -something, I... I... I

don't know. I'm not sitting here gonna make a

commentary on how old people should be to be

in a relationship, but there are certain limits.

At least in my mind. I mean, you know, you wanna

look at, you know, may she rest in peace, but

you wanna look at Anna Nicole and the whole scandal

with her and the 80 -something -year -old way

back when. That creeps me the hell out. Like

sure, I would say for me personally a five to

six maybe seven year age difference either way

is fine But anything more than ten or eleven

years difference between two people is a little

Yeah, like I'll agree that's kind of creepy but

like I said, it's not The age difference in the

story. It's just the fact that you know, he's

basically this creepy stalker. Yeah, it's and

And that takes away from, like, even in the pre

-52 continuity with Mr. Freeze, like, he was

still, you know, he was more of a super villain

overall than he just had, you know, trying to

complete his research or freeze the entire world

or whatever he really wanted to do. But even

that, and I mean, he said at one point he sold

his soul to DC's Mephisto for increased power.

There's an entire... Entire storyline there.

Yeah, I'll tell you about it later. No, no, no,

no, I don't have time for that today, but You're

telling me DC also has Mephisto. So you're telling

me that both DC and Marvel They have are gonna

make ghost writing people. No, no not like that

Really tied into ghostwriter at all. They had

a character in the previous continuity Called

Neuron. He's basically a devil who basically

tries to corrupt souls and acquire, you know,

once he makes the deal and he can take their

souls and increase his own power. They have this

huge crossover called Underworld Unleashed where

a lot of villains that in order to, you know,

improve them for the 90s sort of thing, they

made deals with the devil. So Killer Moth went

from being Killer Moth to this horrible, it basically

became Jeff Goldblum from the fly. Sort of character

called Charaxes where he's like this giant mutated

man book or there were characters like the trickster

who sold his soul and he became like instead

of being the the short and fat joke that he was

became like you know young and svelte and You

know his intelligence was somewhat increased

so he could you know act on all these perverse

tricks or there are characters just like Lex

Luthor who just pretty much sold his soul for

Well, actually that actually benefited him in

the long run because at that point Lex Luthor

was like a withered old shell of himself after

pretending to be his own son and Mr. Freeze just

basically got an upgrade to his equipment and

his powers and You know, it was a 90s crossover.

I don't even think they remembered that happened

half the time afterwards So it's even that Mr.

Freeze was still Think a better character than

Creepy stalker man. Yeah, and basically this

ends with the flashing back to to his mother

You know how I love the first snow unbroken and

white and we flash back to his mom and you know,

apparently she wants to be a member of the genius

bar because They have an apple and she Assume

she carves it into her hand. I I think yeah,

she like cut I know she just cut bloody sir like

circles in her hand or she actually cut those

You know the like the flesh off her hand or something.

Yeah. Yeah See that well Victor was never right

in his head cuz I I don't care if it's a mercy

killing or not He killed his mom. Yeah, like

he he kicked his mom back into the ice Just like

yeah No, all right really quickly. Oh good good.

I just think just Screw you mr.. Freeze. Yeah,

that's a little All right really quickly before

we do ratings and final thoughts you got to go

over the variant cover gallery here in the trade

Batman 8 by Jason Fabe book and Peter Stegerwald,

Batman 9 by Dale Keown and F .C .O. Placigna,

Batman 10 by Rafael Albuquerque, 11 is by Andy

Clark and Tammu Moray, and 12 is by Brian Hitch

and Nathan Fairbain, I think is how you say his

name. I love these covers. I think they're really

cool. I think my favorite one is probably Batman

with all the out the the black and white one.

Yeah. With it's just the silhouette of the the

armored suit and all that. Well, it's the it's

him. It shows his face, but it's him with the

core. It's him with the owl masks all broken

up. Yeah. Oh, that one. Yeah. Yeah. That's the

one about the silhouette one with the bat batbot

helmet in the. Oh, no, no, no. I do like that

one. But no. Overall, for me, I love the Cordoval

storyline, both volume one and here in volume

two. I thought it was great. I thought it was

a nice little twist with the whole Lincoln March's

Thomas Wayne, or supposedly Thomas Wayne. So

far, out of the Batman stuff, I know coming up

next, we'll have a very brief discussion on Death

of the Family with myself, Steve Megatron, and

Jeremy Fine from Hunnic Outcast Podcast. But

so far court of owls out of the main Batman title

is pretty much the story to read in my opinion

If you're Joker fans, you know read death of

the family it but you know as The Joker said

in return of the Joker. It's sadly anti -climactic.

It really really is And then zero year we will

discuss that way past this Batman spotlight for

seventy five years cuz we'll get to it eventually

yep uh final rating for me I'm gonna give this

um four to five stars, which is really liked

it on the GCRN rating scale. There were times

where I kind of got lost in the story, not necessarily

saying that I didn't understand it, but it just

kind of there were times when I originally read

it. I don't know about a week before we did the

recording. I was like, oh, come on, speed up,

speed up. And then by the time where Bruce figures

out what's going on. Like when you figure, oh,

it is where it's always been. That's when I really

got excited. Oh, yeah. What about you for rating?

I'm going to give it like the solid four as well.

Like I really overall, I love the entire story

from volume one, volume two. It's and it's it's

perfectly set up this new. It's one of the few

things in. Oh, my God. A positive note about

the new 52. It's one of the few things that I

really do dig that they've done for Batman in

the new 52 in terms of like a new Villainous

threat that there's like this Secret society

out there. That's like not only it's something

that kind of expand to the rest of the heroes

into DC new 52 So, you know, it's it's a great

setup. It was a great story I like the fact that

they got the you know, the zombie foot soldiers

and the talons you know, which is like and it

like batman says for once i can i can play it

rough you know he can cut loose yep and that's

kind of reminds me of superman's speech in uh

destroyer oh yeah it's it's the entire world's

made out of cardboard which you know what as

i still prefer tim daly as the voice of superman

but george george newburn like Oh, dude, like

it's it's neck and neck, but I've I've like I

said, I just prefer the I love Tim Daly's version

But George Newburn made it his own Over the rut

over the run in the entire series. Don't get

me wrong. It's just That's an argument for another

day. So here inside the Batman 75th Anniversary

Spectacular, up next we're going to wrap it up

with Death of the Family. Where can people find

you online, sir? You can find me on Twitter at

JT from Saskatoon. You can also follow at GECastRadio

for all the other network updates and I am at

TFG1Mike. Until next time, make your great escape

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