Love and Capes Volumes 1-2 Review

Hey, this is Tom Zoller, creator of Long Distance,

and you are listening to the Geekcast Radio Network.

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inside the Pull Bag with Back Issue Classics.

Hello and welcome to the Pull Bag. This is another

Back Issue Classics. This is episode 44 of Back

Issue Classics. Of course, I am TF2 and Mike.

And making his return here inside the Pull Bag

is Jesse W. Jackson. Hello, sir. Hello. Thank

you for having me back. And I am just it's always

fun to hang at the Pull Bag. Yeah Today we are

going to be dealing with a heroically super situation

in comedy by the title of love and capes Written

by Tom's all are written drawn colored all that

stuff by Tom's all are absolutely We're gonna

be covering volumes one and two in this episode

There are four total volumes volumes one and

two deal with dating life dating a superhero

dating a normal person and then obviously engagement

and married and everything else so I Feel like

we should be playing that that old song first

comes love Or at least the newlywed game theme

song, right? Yes. Yeah, I'll have to see if I

can dig that up. Or I could just grab Billy Rosewood

from Beverly Hills Cop 2 when he hums the dating

game theme song. But you could also do... The

do you want to know a secret from the Beatles

because that's the first trade and going to the

chapel is the second trade Yeah, exactly So love

and capes as I said, it is the heroically super

situation comedy from Tom Zoller It's about superhero

who eventually dates a normal girl and we open

up with the first issue here I love how they

lay this out where the characters in the story

are pointing to a newspaper about the Crusader

Then the instead of having like a credits page

or you know most comics will just have in the

very beginning they'll have like a created by

page it actually has written and Written in photos

by Tom Zoller. I thought that was hilarious How

they work it in absolutely and if you have not

taken time To read the small print on the newspaper

There is a couple of end jokes thrown in there

that Tom talks to the readers about. Yeah, he

throws in a whole bunch of stuff. He even throws

in his email address. Yes, he does. Dude, it's

a little on the nose. I don't dislike it, but

I'm just thinking, oh my god, that's a little

on the nose, don't you think? Well, and the whole

point is, it reminds me of the credits on Monty

Python and the Holy Grail, where they keep going

on and on. And there is several times when he's

like, Are you still reading this? What's going

on? Go away. So very much fun. I love the joke

on the price, though, for the paper. $1 .25,

still a bargain. Please don't use the internet.

Yes. Which is even more funny now as newspapers

continue to really, really suffer. Mm -hmm. Yes.

So, Mike, we have talked about this before. You

came through Love and Capes through long distance,

correct? Long distance. And when we did your

Origins episode, I had yet to dive into Love

and Capes. But I have since done the first two

volumes. I have the other two. I have volume

three and volume four as well, but I have not

read those yet. And I, you know, when I interviewed

Tom, he said, Oh, it's set up to, you know, to

be a joke every four panels or every, you know,

whatever, you know, whatever he says. And I'm

like, Oh, okay. That's, that's cool. That's cool.

And it just, he needs to do more stuff. He needs

to do more of his own stuff. I, when I interviewed

him, he said that, um, by the time loving capes,

cause it It's no real secret. It's on the cover

of the fourth trade that they eventually have

a child. So, you know, it's not really a spoiler

to say that. He said after that, he was like,

well, what else are they going to do? I just

don't know. And he moved on. I'm hoping he's

going to do more long distance at this point.

But Love and Capes, it really, it really still

holds up to today. It really does this is not

a comic that Okay, sure a lot of the references

date itself, but I mean It's still hilarious

to read this book. So I was gonna ask you that

I was lucky enough and I could not find the email

but You know Full disclosure Tom and I met in

1999 at a convention in New Orleans and he and

I kind of Connected and it was a lot of fun.

We both were big sports night and West Wing fans

and a couple months later When I needed some

artwork done at my office. I reached out to him

and he and I you know did a negotiation. He did

some artwork for me and then a couple years later

he flew down to Dallas and he did caricatures

all day. You paid for him. He had a going rate

and he stayed at the office and he said it was

the first time he felt like he'd gone to a Tom

Zoller museum because someone had complained

that we didn't have any artwork on our walls

so I came up with a bunch of motivational quotes

and you know, don't let the fear of striking

out stop you from, you know. going forward, there

is no try only do or do not. And, you know, and

I stole that from you. Yes, he did. And so, yeah,

I did. I, you know, we did a lot of quotes and

and he did artwork for him and we printed them

out and we had them in big poster boards and

frames. And then he did different T -shirts designs

for us. And, you know, he's sitting in my office.

and ready to go start caricatures. And somebody

walks in wearing a t -shirt that's got his art

on there. And then we go into my contact center.

There's stuff. And he's like, this is bizarre.

So we've been friends a long time. And he emailed

me and he says, I have an idea of a new series.

He had done Raider, which was his spy novel.

And he said, I. I really want to do a romance

comic he says kind of like That my superhero

the British comedy where most of the superheroes

would be offline and I think this will be fun

and so he did the first one and It you know was

fairly successful and then he did a second one

then he did a third one and It was weird because

at this time he wasn't doing it in a regular

time. Just every few months he would do an issue.

He'd save up the money and go. He was freelance,

but he was doing a lot of corporate work and

other stuff. I remember he started selling issues

in Dallas and a year later he came back and all

of a sudden people were coming up to his booth

going, you were here last year. I really liked

Love and Capes. Do you have more books? And he's

like, yes, I do. And it's been a really joy for

me as his friend to kind of watch this roll on

and go. So I'm glad you've enjoyed the story

and think it It holds up because I think It's

not only funny, but I think it's a really good

story it is and a sweet story it is very much

so and When I say hold up, it's not just the

fact that you know They make a reference to something

that happened seven or eight years ago or however

the heck long, you know It's like the very first

page after the newspaper where mark and abby

are sitting in the in the diner cafe wherever

they are i don't know and you know she's pointing

at the newspaper and she's like mark they use

their instead of their in the third paragraph

these people are supposed to be professional

writers and i'll just laugh at that so much because

that's not just happening eight years ago it's

still happening today people still do that so

that's what I mean it it holds up because it's

not just stuck in a time capsule there are certain

things there are certain references that might

get stuck in a time capsule but overall the story

oh man it is so good so we run into this whole

thing of You know, she's paying attention to

mark, but she's not really paying attention to

mark She's more concerned with the newspaper

and he's like I Spilled some syrup on my slacks.

Yes. I'm gonna go to the restroom and clean Yeah,

and so Tom, you know Much to as I pick at him

sometimes and and I promise not to be too fanboy

ish about him, but you know, he said You know,

as the writer, he sets the format up from the

beginning. Eight panels on most pages and every

fourth panel is a beat or a joke. And it starts

out from very early. And it's a clever joke,

you know, where he says, you know, most people

aren't as. You know attentive as you are as you

know, he goes saves and comes back and she doesn't

notice at all, right? It's just really really

fun. Yeah, absolutely and Even the you know,

I would assume this is their first date It's

somewhere I guess maybe they've been dating a

while a month maybe or so they've dated enough

that At this point, and this is really important

to the series, is Mark, who is the crusader,

says, I want to tell her I love her. But if I

tell her I love her, I need to go all in. And

if I'm going to say that, then I've got to tell

her who I really am. And I think that goes against

most superhero tropes. But that's one of the

reasons why I think this book works is you don't

get the afterwards. Well, how could you have

kept this a secret from me? You know, after they

they have a little bit of discussion on that,

but they talked about, you know, we had just

started, you know, seeing each other. Right.

And we're at the point now where he wants to

tell her that he loves her, but he sticks four

other words in the middle of the I love and you.

And she did notice it because she is thinking

about it. So he goes off, flies off to Chronopolis.

And we meet dark blade or Paul and at this point

When I was reading and I'm like, okay this It's

the Incredibles. It really is You've said that

before That's really interesting Yeah, I of course

think Crusader is Superman Dark blade is Batman.

Yeah, and absolutely from my DC background, this

is the You know, yeah the silver age where Batman

and Superman are friends and I love the idea

that Paul and Mark are best friends and they

share coffee and conversations all the time Absolutely,

and the only reason why I make the Incredibles

reference and Tom is the I've seen him say this

that you know he is a fan of Brad Bird and Yeah,

you're right. It is more Superman Batman Silver

Age But just the whole thing with him Mark with

Mark dating Abby with Dark Blade essentially

being I Want to say easy third wheel, but he's

right around that area little bit sometimes Because

he's he's always the friend that that obviously

he's Mark's best friend but they Tom makes it

clear in later in a later issue that That Mark

slash Crusader is only friends with Dark Blade.

He's not actually friends with Paul The the alter

ego because that's the other thing you got to

juggle what these whole things is the alter egos

So we meet Charlotte, Abby's sister at Abby's

business, Abby's Books and Coffee. I love the

way he did the art. Some of the backgrounds that

he's done in here are just great. Yeah, I totally

agree. And one of the things that is very seamless,

but once you start pulling back the curtains,

Tom really does a lot of basic storytelling.

You know, within the first page or two, you know

your character's name. You know that Abby owns

a bookstore. You know, by page three, you know

that she has a sister. You know that. Mark is

an accountant. It is he sets this up. Seamlessly

as you're talking and and I think that's really

good storytelling It is it is and We pretty much

end up getting to the whole Secret thing right

away. Yeah, I Don't think and this is my opinion

not fact is You know, the he will they or won't

they was not something that was a story Tom didn't

feel like telling. And I I really applaud the

fact that they are a couple. And the idea is

the relationship gives you enough, you know,

story ideas and enough comedy that You don't

have to have that whole drama of them breaking

up or being worried about breaking up. There's

enough in the relationship. Right. The whole

point of it is figuring out what the relationship

is. That's the whole point of the series or at

least of this first trade is that they started

dating. they're going to, you know, figure out

what's, you know, what's it all about and whatever

else. And just some of the stuff that just happens

in here is just absolutely amazing, folks. I

really, really dig it. I think outside of Mark

and Abby, I think Abby's sister Charlotte is

my favorite character out of this first trade.

You know, Charlotte is an amazing character.

In a lot of ways, I think Charlotte grows the

most in the series when you go from where she

starts in the first trade all the way to the

fourth. It is really well done. Paul, as Darkblade,

grows very interesting too. Tom the writer has

a lot of fun with you know, Paul being the world's

greatest detective but unquote and that's a running

gag and and it keeps You know mark as the Crusader

like how did you know that is is a pretty funny

thing? Yeah, that is so the Batman trait. I mean

it's That that is where I see Batman and Superman

in in in dark blades ability to Basically just

detect the future without even having to jump

into a DeLorean absolutely Because we all know

the DeLorean is the best way to travel through

time I might argue the TARDIS but go ahead through

time. Yes through time not time and space through

time Okay, good deal the My favorite panel in

the trade here one of them is When Charlotte's

trying to guess And we get to the last he's a

crusader and he flew you to Maui and Abby's just

like We're a superhero girlfriend ever That is

so funny and so You know and they have fun with

that later where You know We find out that he's

super fast. So they end up going to Maui to sunbathe.

And she comes back with a tan. And that's how

Charlotte figures out because she keeps wanting

to know what's going on. And then later, we see

Mark the waiter again. Mark goes, oh, did you

go midnight tanning? And yes, oh, that sounds

fun, you know. And Mark's looking at her like,

was that really that hard? That was wonderful.

And then I love I love the effects Zoller puts

on. You told your sister. Yes. Like the super

yelling is just absolutely awesome. It was so

funny. Absolutely. I did want to share that If

you're in the trade paperback if you go to page

18 This is the page that I've been lucky enough

to go to a lot of conventions and work in Tom's

booth and When he's pitching the book he will

go to page 18 and It's the what's your weakness

page And he will say, if you read this, this

is a good feel for the book. Right, yeah, this

is the page with Amazonia and Abby. Now, page

18, maybe I got it wrong. Let's see. That's what

it is in the trade. OK, maybe I have a different

trade. Yeah, 18 is the. So it's the page it says

so mark you have a weakness. What kind of question

is that? so it okay, okay, and He will show that

page to People visiting the booth and I will

not spoil the joke, but he says if this gives

you a good idea of what's going on What did you

think of Mark's parents? Mark's parents are essentially

Jonathan and Martha But they are They're Jonathan

and Martha from Lois and Clark, yes One of the

things I love about Mark's mom is that especially

in the early issues everything she said was could

be taken both ways like, oh, she's not skinny

like your last girlfriend. And she's saying as

a compliment, but Abby could be, oh, so she's

calling me fat. Or I don't mind that you're spending

Christmas with your family this year. And the

implication could be. I'm warning you that I

better have Christmas next year or it could be

I'm already assuming that you will be back next

year for Christmas. So I love the idea that Tom

and a lot of Amazonia's dialogue in the early

issues are about that too, where they could be

read both ways that if Abby is paranoid, she's

going to say, oh, what's, you know, your mom

doesn't like me, but you know mark or something

could hear no no no that isn't what it's been

at all which comes back to this is a a deeper

book than what it may appear it's funny but this

really is handling relationships and the real

world of dating and try to get things um i think

really well done absolutely it does I think the

only character in the entire series to the to

the point of you know the first few issues in

volume one here once we eventually meet them

that I just can't stand is the brother the sportscaster

brother oh my god I want to kill that guy I think

it's interesting because I agree with you. I

think part of that is by design that this is

a character that Mark doesn't necessarily like

and I think that's very typical when you're involved

with a relationship and you meet the family.

There's always one or two that you go ugh. Don't

know if I why do I need to be you know? Why do

I need to be part of this family? And it's also

I think it really puts a good line on the frustration

of being a superhero that No one knows what you're

doing You know and I go back to you know the

Superman movie with the young Clark Kent where

he's telling Glenn Ford, who's playing pocket,

I could score a touchdown every time, every time.

And, you know, all Kent and the greatness of

Glenn Ford says, I don't know what you were here,

but I know you came here not to score touchdowns.

But there is a frustration where you're good

at something and you can't let your light shine.

You have to deliberately Be less than what you

want to be to for you know a bigger reason it

goes back to When Superman finally is able to

break out of his shell at the end of Justice

League unlimited in destroyer or he says to Darkseid

Well, we have here. You know I I live in a world

where I you know If I touch, you know, if I touch

something, I could break it. And you know, what

we have here is a rare opportunity for me to

show you just how powerful I actually am. Yes.

Let's go. And it's like one of those things.

What I love when, when Tom writes this is, um,

when you get to this scene where he's at the

coffee shop or not, he's at the bookstore in

the coffee shop, talking to the kids. And one

of them asks them, Mr. Crusader, did you read

Colin books when you were a kid? Absolutely.

I love comics. So why don't you have your own

comic book like Dark Blade? Dark Blade has his

own comic book. I love that. And it slowly becomes

with their friendship, with Dark Blade and the

Crusaders friendship, it's like, how come you

get all these breaks and I don't? Well, it's

simple. Bruce Wayne's rich and you're not. Even

though I know his name is not Bruce Wayne in

this, but again, yeah. You're absolutely right.

I also, I think it's very interesting to bring

up that when Abby and Mark are trying to convince

him to this version of J .K. Rawlings, you know,

the D .M. Hawson is, you know, this famous writer

that was supposed to be in Abby's bookstore ends

up not being able to show up. And they're all

concerned about all these kids that are going

to be there screaming and yelling. And he convinced

she convinces Mark to make an appearance. And

this is the first kind of risque joke that Tom

makes. And it's where he says, I'm fine, fine.

But if I'm wearing a costume today, you'll be

wearing one tonight. Yeah, and I thought that

was very funny and very interesting I also like

that Mark doesn't share his secret origin and

that be kind of becomes a ongoing joke Right

that it's often talked about and they really

don't ever give his origin Because You know,

I think Tom lets us readers determine ourselves

What this is because it's gonna be better what

we come up with and when anything he could yes

Absolutely So we we get back to the Liberty League

satellite and he abby's up there on monitor duty

with with the crusader and lo and behold amazonia

shows up and she's on her way to the holidays

with her family on her planet and just wanted

to stop by and you know bring him a christmas

present and It's like, wow, you can immediately

tell that the East Abbey and Amazonia are not

going to get along. Kind of a fun story, and

Tom has shared this in different interviews,

but he had not planned on Amazonia to come back.

The idea was in the first issue, the joke is

Your ex you find out your your boyfriend's ex

is you know, basically Oprah and you know a supermodel

combined, you know Amazonia's a Wonder Woman

type but in this world she's you know, she's

also incredibly rich and and successful and she

doesn't have a secret identity and she's just

one of the most glamorous people in the world

and But the audience loved her and so that's

why he had her appear in the Christmas issue

and then You know when they do the Valentine's

issue and he's doing this other things because

the audience just really embraced her and She

is a wonderfully Fun character She is she is

And one of the things I like about this is because,

and to a certain degree, Kurt Busiak in Astro

City does this as well. You do a stereotype or

an archetype and you bake the story and that

way you don't have to spend a lot of time, okay,

I get it. Dark blade is Detective and doesn't

have superpowers, but you know he's Bruce Wayne

and Batman and Mark is Superman type he's very

you know Boy Scout ish and helping and then You

know so you get these kind of short hands that

help you tell the story stronger But it it is

not It is truly just a shorthand. It isn't a

copying or cheat Yeah Absolutely, so we're at

Christmas they meet they meet the parents No

pun intended. Yeah, thankfully thankfully right

They go back to Mark's They go back to, no, they

go back to Abby's apartment or Mark's apartment,

I forget which one. Yeah, back at Abby's and

he gives her the present he was gonna give her

and it's a day without powers because she wanted

him all to herself for a day. So, again... a

lot of this series, at least in the first two

trades, because I haven't read the other two

yet, but at least in the first two volumes, it's

very Lois and Clark. And I'm not saying that

in a bad way at all. I absolutely love Lois and

Clark. I love Lois and Clark. New Adventures

of Superman more than most anyone I can think

of, because everybody else seems to think that

show is a travesty. Yes, it has a few bad episodes,

but... Overall, the overall story is just absolutely

amazing. Well, and he's mentioned that in the

pitch that Thomas said, you know, it's Lewis

and Clark without the sucky parts. And I do think

that there is a lot of beauty to, you know, the

idea of. Well, it's your first Christmas together.

So you've kind of established that, you know,

they dated long enough that they're in love and

they told each other they love each other, but

they haven't. It has been less than a year that

they've and he leaves that fake. So I think all

of us have done that in a relationship going,

OK, it's our first Christmas. I need to hit a

home run on this present and they embrace like

this guy can create diamonds with his hands.

What do you get him and what do you expect him

to get you? So very, very interesting. The second

issue pretty much ends with, you know, Merry

Christmas, Merry Christmas, love you, now go

save the day. And he flies off. This is why I

love Charlotte. The third issue in the trade

opens up with, I hate my sister. Oh, I absolutely

love that because at first she's basically talking

to a teddy bear and later on in the series we

find out that She and Paul eventually start well,

they set them up on a date But that doesn't exactly

work because mark isn't friends with Paul the

billionaire. He's friends with dark blade the

You know, I am vengeance. I am the night. Yeah,

I am dark, but you know, I mean so What I love

about that is Charlotte and Darkblade are essentially

best friends after their little date there. And

it's just so cool. It is. And I think one of

the things that I did like about this is they

didn't. They without going through a cliche.

you know, they kept them going from they're not

a relationship and for but it wasn't like sad.

It was just they could talk about each other

and how, you know, a happy couple at times can

be very irritating. And, you know, we've all

been there. So I think that it sets up in. you

know, no spoilers, but that friendship continues

throughout the series in such a nice way. Yeah,

it is really, really cool. I do like that they

do the whole trope of, you know, one of the characters

that's a friend of the superhero ends up, and

in this case, it's Abby's sister Charlotte. Charlotte's

dating a super villain! Yes. I thought that was

hilarious because Normally, it's it's usually

the main female character that ends up somehow

Doing that right? but Tom really does an excellent

job with taking all those superheroic tropes

and Basically turning them on their ass. Yes

the most part I agree And again his art is just

Absolutely fantastic. Now, he will tell you that

he does not feel that his art, and he hates looking

at his old art, he really feels like that issue

12 is when he started getting a little better

at this. He did a lot of work. He did some studying,

read up on a lot of drawing real lives and doing

some work on this. um to get the feeling of this

um he has often said at conventions that he'll

never get a tattoo because one he would have

to do something he designs himself he would not

put anyone else's art on his body and he knew

that in three months he'd be unhappy with the

artwork uh because he always is unhappy with

his artwork and uh after the fact So I think

that was pretty cool. I think it's also interesting

that because of this, at this point he wasn't

on a schedule. Tom was self -publishing. This

was an independent book that he kind of worked

around holidays and also You know, he did a couple

of free comic book days to help promote the book

and gave away issues. Right. Well, in the beginning,

you know, you know, you got to start somewhere,

right? I mean, you know, you got to and you still

have to continue to put in the legwork and, you

know, whatever else. But, you know, I mean, once

IDW comes calling, just go with the flow. And

did he share with you on his on your with your

interview about how he got a trade paper back

through IDW? I Don't remember if I do and if

you guys I will we will certainly I know Tom

would love to come back and join you but the

He had done the first six issues and was really

happy with them. And he happened to run into

through a friend of a friend, Harlan Ellison.

And Harlan Ellison said, well, why aren't you

going to put this in a trade paperback? And he

said, well, I've got to find the money. I've

got to do it. Well, why don't you just have IDW

do it? I'm probably telling the story wrong.

And Harlan Ellison picked up the phone, called

the publisher IDW and said, hey, I've got this

book. I think you guys should do a trade paperback.

And the publisher of IDW has said this on his

blog. He went, OK, if Harlan Ellison tells you

to check it out, we do. He said in. I started

reading and I said, oh my God, we should be doing

this. And that's how he got his first publishing

deal. And then, you know, the second trade and

all these have been individual issues and on

their IDW banner and then put together. So, yes.

Right. Yeah, absolutely. I just I just love these

stories, folks. I mean, the first trade alone.

Yes. It's just got so much good stuff, and the

story is so... It's... It's so... I don't want

to say revolutionary, because not many comics,

you know, start a new revolution, but, you know,

for... you know a superheroic romantic comedy

thing this is pretty evolutionary that they're

that he's doing this he's writing this these

adding these characters making the story progress

despite the sixth issue it's like they've really

found a mold he's really found a mold for the

story for the arts you know there's no this isn't

you know I want to single him out, but I'm going

to do it anyway. This isn't DC Comics with having

one writer and 12 artists, or one writer and

three artists, one doing the current time, the

future time, and the past. This is all Tom. It's

all consistent art. The characters look great.

The backgrounds, for the most part, the backgrounds

of this are fair. I don't want to say they're

simple, but they're, I mean, like, you know.

I think one of the things, he developed a style.

The word balloons are kind of transparent. He

does not spend a lot of time on background. There

is a lot of people talking, but that's his Aaron

Sorkin influence. The idea is this isn't a book

about superheroes. The superhero stuff kind of

goes off stage. The idea is this is about Mark

who is an accountant and happens to be the most

powerful man in the world. Abby who owns a bookstore

and is in love with the most powerful man in

the world. And what my wife loves about this

story is she says that Tom draws quote unquote,

real women. They look normal. And the stories

are things that make and I hate to say the word

of, you know, real world, but it is realistic.

You know, do you like your in -laws? You know,

you just talked about Quincy is a royal pain.

You know, introducing the X's and how do you

do and back and forth makes it is it is a. And

the idea was that, you know, each issue is kind

of an episode and then the six of them make up

a season. So you get multiple storytellers, you

get each of the four panels where you get a beep,

you know, you get a kind of joke or a smile.

but you get a whole story and then all six of

them together kind of tell a bigger story. So

it is. Complexity in the simplicity, right? Yeah,

absolutely. I totally agree with you. The cool

thing about the trade, and this is one of the

reasons why I love the trades, because I'm looking

at volume two now going to the chapel when he

does the introduction. And he basically lets

the characters do the introduction. It's just

so hilarious. I just love that so much. The back

and forth, back and forth on the introduction.

Yeah. Just absolutely love that. And yeah, you

get all the fun of Well, you know, how's he gonna

ask her? What's it gonna do? Then You know, okay

planning a wedding and how do you make that happen?

And there is And then one of the things kind

of jumping ahead that I A lot of good artists

and good writers are bad businessmen And there's

a lot of good businessmen who are not very good

writers or artists. And Tom somehow finds a way

to do both. And I remember him reaching out and

saying, hey, to me and other friends, I'm thinking

about inviting people to the wedding. You know,

and you go, what do you mean? Well, you know,

if you want, you can go and pay. And I will draw

you, I've got to draw the crown scene anyway.

So I will put you in. So like there is a scene,

you know, in the wedding and he did two different

covers, but there's Linda and I. He did a character

of Linda and I were in the wedding. And so, you

know, Tom's mom paid for all the family to be

there. And, you know, and so. It was a nice way

to include your fandoms, your fans, but at the

same time help market the book. You mean Tom

with the book. Yes, exactly. And as you talked

about, the name of the second trade is going

to the chapel with a picture of him carrying

her in a wedding dress. So spoilers, they get

married. Yeah, I mean it like I said, and I'm

not saying this in a bad way at all because I

love Tom's work like I do It's very on -the -nose

comedy and that's that's fine. It's absolutely

fine. I think I Almost did a spit -take with

issue number eight's cover I Love that when I

first read that it was a good thing. I wasn't

drinking anything Because it's Darkblade and

Tom on issue number eight. Arachanerd on number

four. Amazonia on number six. Even Steelworker

was on number seven. I'm the lead character's

best friend. Where's my cover, cartoonist boy?

Yes. Fine. You've got the cover. I absolutely

love that because by the time issue seven ends,

they're flying off there. You know, they've,

they've gotten most of the wedding stuff handled.

He's done the proposal. Cause part of the part

of issue seven was he wanted to do the proposal

the right way. And all of issue seven is him

in Charlotte, Mark and Charlotte, you know, she,

you know, Charlotte's like, Abby's not going

to like a Christmas day proposal. Just don't

even, don't even try. But when I saw the cover

to issue 8, I'm like, oh my god, that is just

priceless. Because essentially, he gets to draw

himself into his own book. Now people, again,

might think that's too on the nose or whatever

else, but it's still kind of funny because it's

bringing his world into his creation's world.

I mean, it's kind of like the Tiny Toon Adventures

characters getting kicked out of the Acme Acres

by Montana Macs. It's the same thing, you know,

where they interact or Buster and Babs interact

with the cartoonist that's drawing, you know,

that's looking at the stuff. So just absolutely

great. Really, really love it. And then the whole

thing of dealing. Folks, this isn't just a wedding.

This is a super wedding. You have to do a hell

of a lot more. than just the regular stressful

wedding stuff. Right. Because you can't with

Abby's family. You can't tell them. You still

have to keep up the secret identity thing. Yeah.

And, you know, there is a whole discussion about,

you know, he wants Paul. Also known as dark blade

to be his best man because he is his best man

but you know There he you know Paul talks about

it. I can be there Because you know the paparazzi

have seen me dating Charlotte in the past So

that makes sense, but how do you explain? that

You know mark The accountant is friends with

you know, Paula Croy You know international,

you know Playboy, right? You can't Nope. Yeah,

so I mean if I really want to get analytical

here, I guess you could say he's his accountant.

Yes But I mean, that really wouldn't work, and

that wouldn't have been good for the story. The

way that Tom comes up with it and the way that

he explains it really, really works. And it's

funny because... You create your own in the story

you come up with you serve the story. It's like,

okay Because I can't do that that gives me something

else to do and he uses that to Give you know

one of your least favorite characters a chance

to shine right Mike Yeah, but that's funny and

it is it is very well done Because Quincy does

eventually come around. I mean, he's not always

a douche. And I have been, you know, by the way,

we, you know, we both tweeted out that we were

going to talk about this and asked for feedback.

And we got a lot of people reaching out to us

and saying, you know, hey, are there is there

going to be more loving capes? You know, are

we going to? you know since um... you know see

i don't know if he's gonna go back to it because

uh... like like i said earlier he told me in

the interview that they're married they have

they have a kid what's the next story gonna be

having another kid yeah and you know i mean that's

and i mean don't get me wrong i would love to

see him do like maybe a weekly strip or something.

Think of it as Emmett and Clara and Jules and

Vern. The further adventures of the... what's

Mark's last name crap yeah the further adventures

of the Spencer family or something like like

he could do something like that on his website

where he just puts out like a panel or two but

as far as a whole other series I don't know where

and I haven't even read volume 3 and volume 4

yet I want to eventually so we can cover it but

you know I just don't know where it could go

from there I'm not trying to be negative about

it at all I don't think you are and I think he

I've heard him answer the question enough and

It is interesting to see at a convention Right

now his You know he is getting a lot of information

and a lot of Traffic to his booth because of

his pony work my little pony work and he loves

doing that but Most of the conventions do say

people come up to him and go you have new loving

capes and You know and he sits there and he says

I would love to do that But I don't know He in

you know He doesn't want to write just for the

sake of writing it because people want it. Right.

And I respect that. Yeah, I wish people would

take notice of and we I don't necessarily know

if it'll be you and I do it. It might be somebody

else and myself that do it. But I wish people

would take more notice of long distance. Yes.

Long distance is amazing. It's essentially if

you've ever been in a long term relationship

or a long distance relationship, I should say,

and you're both geeks about things. I mean, for

crap sake, you know, Carter is an artist. Lee

is a rocket scientist. Yeah. I mean, it's essentially.

Penny is not an artist by any means. It's essentially

a role reversal of Leonard and Penny from the

Big Bang Theory. It is and he's gotten a lot

of good press from the work on long distance

and you especially have been very vocal about

how much you like it and I thought your interview

with him was amazing to cover it. I do know that

he's got a couple other ideas. Yeah, so do I.

And we're not going to reveal those. Right, exactly.

So I know he wants it. I have been on him. And

going back to my DC fanboy days, where they used

to do the 80 page Giants, and you had all the

stories. I said, what I think you should do is

do. Two or three page stories of some of the

backing characters, you know, like Quincy having

a story or The housekeeper, you know Dark Blades

housekeeper, you know, I don't know. Well, that

would work. But okay. Yeah You know the The guy

who works at Abby's bookstore, you know some

of the other characters Would be an interesting,

you know kind of give the supporting characters

their day in the Sun So, I don't know he's you

know, we're gonna see what he says and what happens

and we'll go from there, right Yeah, absolutely

I do know, like I said, I've been trying to get

people to notice, and I know we're talking about

love in caves here, but I've been trying to get

people to notice for long distance since I first

read it. And I told him in the interview, I said,

I've read all four of those issues, I've read

the entire story at least eight different times.

Yes. Because I sat here and I wrote a full on

spoiler series review for my website, geekcastradio

.com. And I would write about a scene. I would

say, OK, this is what happens. This is what I

like. This is what I don't like or whatever.

And there wasn't a lot that I didn't like. But

it's one of those things where. more people need

to check this series out but anyway back to loving

capes we're up to about issue 10 here yes and

this is about the point where abby wants superpowers

yes so so she's essentially i don't want to say

she's a flip -flopper because she's not but she's

essentially you know earlier she wanted mark

to have she wanted to have him without his powers

for you know just one day And now she feels that

she needs in order to fully understand mark if

they're gonna be getting married and all that

She needs to understand what it is like to be

a superhero. So she goes to dr Zam attack or

whatever his name is and she's like, yeah, I

just want powers that's all And Again, what Tom

does here is simply amazing because he takes

one episode of Lois and Clark and turns it into

a whole issue of comic books. Yes. It's just

hilarious. I absolutely love it. It is very interesting

and also very poignant that You know, this is

a this is a quote unquote funny book. He is telling

a humorous story and but he is not afraid to

pull your hearts a little bit. Right. And I think

it's amazing so that we can do this. Yes, absolutely.

So. I think my favorite part about this whole

issue is... Abby's got the powers, now she needs

to find a costume. Yes. The costume changes are

simply amazing. Yes. When it hits on Amazonia,

she's like, I'll just delete that from memory,

you should do the same. Yeah. Yes. 270s. No,

just no. It's absolutely love. Yeah, it is very,

very funny. It is really an interesting thing

how he does this. You know, they make a joke

about, well, what's she going to use her name?

And, you know, they ask Mark, well, I used Crusader

was my high school mascot. What was yours? The

Cougars. I'm not going to do that. So awesome.

Yeah. I love the interaction between Darkblade

and Amazonia. And by the time that panel ends

and Mark and Abby show up and Amazonia is like,

Lord, I hate irony. It's just so fun this this

series is just so fun to read folks Yeah, it

is and I want to stress that it is a really well

done story He does do some very interesting storytelling

in this with the wedding If he tells a little

bit in the afterwards where, you know, and there

is kind of a an interesting, you know, superhero

twist to the wedding, which is kind of nice.

Yeah, absolutely. It really is. And I mean, really,

they're all superheroes. Well, most of them are

anyway. And you have to figure out. how are you

gonna deal with that with the with the regular

people at the wedding as well yeah and it's just

so it's just so easy and I love how um I love

how Abby um Basically gets stuck in in Paris

Absolutely Because what we didn't We didn't really

say was Charlotte has gone off to Paris for some

job or some Some something she's there for school.

Yeah. So yeah, one of the things that I really

like is The characters change and move and So

in the very beginning, in the very first episode

issue, Abby makes a point about, well, maybe

you should have finished school. And so they

bring up the fact that, you know, she's now going

to finish school. And that's right. That's really

cool. that they're they're actually going to

let them do that. So I think, yes, but it is

kind of a real world problem of, OK, what do

we do if I'm stuck? I don't have a passport.

You know, what do I do? And all of a sudden you

get and this is, I think, for marks, you know.

Mother kind of becomes the fun of Okay, let's

you know, I'm gonna show you this and I we're

gonna fix this so that's really well done Yeah,

yeah it is it's very well done as the second

trade progresses they they come a bit closer

to the wedding, but they also have to during

in issue 11 yeah in issue 11 where Abby has her

powers during one scene in this she actually

could not save the bridge right and you know

we see how that affects her we see Mark being

supportive because he's been there before but

he points out to her that you can't always save

everybody and Once again, we go back to where?

The crusader makes the appearance of the bookstore

and the young person asked, you know my I Can't

remember now if it's the mom or dad but is really

sick. Can you help them? and Mark can't and he

tells Abby that's one of the reasons why he didn't

want to make this appearance because as much

as he can do and as much as he can help you can't

save everyone and Mark Wade has been very open

about when he writes Superman that's the catch.

that Superman is the most powerful man in the

world and he couldn't save his parents. He couldn't

save his home planet. And that guilt lives with

him forever. I also think that Superman understands

he can't in the world of DC. You can't save everyone

no matter how hard you try. And I do think that

it's just... Mark feels that pain. Mark feels

that and is going, gosh, what can I do? So I

think it's just wonderful how Tom shows this

and does it. Absolutely. It's just so good, folks.

And I know I'm skipping around to different story

beats and everything else, but you kind of have

to. I don't want to full -on spoil this because

I really think everybody should be reading this

book, this series. No, I applaud you, Mike. I

totally agree. You know, there's a lot of great

jokes to do. Also, oh no, we were we were not

gonna spoil all of the jokes There is a you know,

there is a journey in this first two books Tom

also does a great afterwards where he talks about

in both books kind of the stories He gives a

little bit of reason what he's doing he does

describe how the kind of draws back the curtain

and says, here's what I was trying to do, especially

with the twist in the wedding scenes. So I think

that's really cool and definitely worth having

that to do. Absolutely. Which wedding cover are

you in? I'm are you in the one with him in those

in the Crusader costume or the tux? You know,

it's been so long. I think I'm in the tuxed one

Let's look real quick I May be let's see one

two three Let's see And I'm in yes, I am in the

one in the Crusader outfit we are One, two, three,

four, fifth row back on the right side. We're

on the bright side. If you pull, we're number

seven. So blue and orange? Yes. OK. Yeah. That's

what I figured. Yes. Awesome. Yes. And I love

just the sweetness of this story. Yes, I'm in

my little tie -in glasses, and Linda's there.

And it was very cool that you got to do it. And

by the way, when he signed the trade paperback,

Jesse, thanks for the toaster. Abby and Mark

will love it. Yeah, that artist boy, he's funny.

Yeah, that cartoonist think he's thinks he has

jokes. Yes. So issue 12 here is all about the

day before the night before the wedding and everything

else and the whole tradition of the bride and

groom can't see each other and everything else.

And we get to the point about the dress and all

that. We see that Abby and Amazonia have to try

to get along for the most part. Yeah, they really

do. And I think that one of the things that this

book does, it's not afraid to make, even though

they're capes, you know, real people. And that's

what's really nice about this. And they do make

a Amazonia in a lot of ways, right? Yeah, very

interesting. Yeah, absolutely. And then the twist.

I was so not expecting the whole alternate Earth

thing or alternate dimension thing. Wow. And

just having to see it, and it's really, it's

not only alternate, it's more of time travel

than anything. It is alternate, but it's more

of a time travel thing than, than anything else.

And it's just so awesome. He essentially turned

the Abby we know from our time. He essentially

turned her into Linda Lee. Yeah. Could see that

he essentially turned her into 1984 Linda Lee

Supergirls alter ego Which I absolutely love

I just find this so hilarious That that he went

and did this it's just so good yeah, I Totally

agree, and it is just a lot of fun that they're

enjoying themselves and doing this. It's just,

yeah, it is well done, and I know we're kind

of gushing over it like a bunch of fanboys, but

we are. But it's just so, like, okay, there isn't

anything in here that I can nitpick at all. The

art is, you know... Because it's Tom. It's not

Tom on the writing and somebody else on the art.

It's all Tom sensibilities. Even at one point,

he throws in a millionaire joke. It's just one

of those things where I think that... I'm kind

of glad that I read long distance before I started

reading this series because I've now seen where

he's gone and where he's come from. So, you know,

like, okay, long distance, that's his second

series. And obviously it's completely different

characters. It's his art style, but it's you

put love and capes and long distance side by

side. And I know the long distance straight is

coming out soon ish. Um, you put the long distance

trade, the first trade against the first or second

trade of love and capes. And it's like night

and day because it's two totally it's Tom, but

it's he did something so different between the

two series. Well, and I, I think he really tried

to do that. Um, the long distance is a straight

romantic love story. Yeah, and you know Love

and capes is a sitcom, you know, he there's a

lot of in jokes. You can see dr. Who and Martha

in sub seeds he'll do in the episode the scene

where There's a bottle of wine showing the cover

of issue five It is JB Bordeaux the year 1959.

I was born in 1959 and JW is a lot of times I'm

called. So, you know, he put the J in there and

put my birthday as kind of a Easter egg to say,

you know, hey, Jesse, I'm thinking of you. You

know, there's none of that in long distance.

Long distance is him saying, Want to make a romantic

comedy a romantic movie not a comedy and You

know, I agree with you. It is it's the next step

and I am eagerly waiting to see You know which

where's he gonna go next? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah,

I When was loving caves originally published

I don't remember off the top of my head I know

That it was oh man Okay, so this is around 2010

according to the back of the second trade so

yeah, so it is It is five years old, but it doesn't

matter the only reason why I was asking and I

think this happened afterwards I noticed two

names in the wedding registry that I did not

expect to see there. Yes. Dwayne McDuffie and

Charlotte Fullerton. Yes. And I was wondering,

and I'm sure Tom will comment on the website,

because I will point this out to him, was this

before or after Dwayne sadly left us? I think

it was before he passed away. I do think he was.

I do know that Tom was very upset. by his death.

They had become friends through conventions and

it was something very very, it affected him a

lot. So I know that I've got emails from 2009

where he is sending me Page of the wedding so

therefore, you know, you know, this is at least

2007 2008 when it started Gosh it seems weird.

It's been that long. Yes It's it's crazy but

love in capes folks go pick it up. It's It's

so good. It really is if you're if you're anything

like what? I am when I want to read a really

cool funny comic especially if you like superheroes,

I mean Yeah, what I'd like to share is Too often

You hear people say There's nothing new. There's

nothing original in comics. There's nothing original

in movies or you know, I just I'm bored and I

will tell you both Love and Capes and Long Distance

are fresh takes. They are not totally different.

They are using the structure of a romantic story

or a romantic sitcom. But it is fresh and unique.

And the it is absolutely amazing that you will

you will be glad you read this. You know, as

in, you know, you talked about it, Mike, in your

original interview with them, you know, you kind

of picked up loving, you know, long distance

and went, oh, my goodness, this is this is amazing.

And so I say that to our Dear listeners that

it really is something that you're gonna go.

Wow that that is really cool. Yeah I'm I'm looking

now. I know not everyone is into the digital

comics and that's fine Yeah, you don't have to

be I get it sure I don't know what the print

costs are on this because I haven't looked that

up. But if you go to comixology .com You look

at 11 caves volumes 1 2 3 & 4 because they're

Comixology did these, I don't know if it was

Comixology, the way they sorted them or if it

was IDW, the way they submitted them, but each

volume or each story arc is its own, like, they

don't just have one Love and Capes section with

all four volumes, they have four separate sections

with four, it's almost like they're four separate

series kind of thing, which I... to kind of see

if that was the case. 11 capes, volumes one through

four. Probably, if you buy all of them, volume

one is $5 .99, two and three are $7 .99 each,

and volume four is $11 .99. So you're paying

just under $30. Now I know a lot of people don't,

or might be just over $30. I know a lot of people

don't want to do that with digital comics, but...

I'm all about digital these days. I just am.

It's just so much easier for me and I've said

this story before and other pull bags are nearly

for your history now that I used to find myself

when trying to read trade paperbacks not because

I was bored with it or anything but i would find

myself sitting in my chair falling asleep and

the book would just fall out of my hand because

i was so so tired or whatever um so i mean you

know finding love and capes digitally was just

amazing i'm trying to find the print versions

here i'm sure tom has them On his website or

something like that, but Yeah, I he does he sells

them Amazon has them he usually has all the trades

at a convention Coming to you near somewhere,

you know, he will definitely You know loves talking

about him and sharing I have gone digital with

my novels, but I have not made the plug yet on

comics though. I know a lot of people do. I love

it. Specifically, and I know there are a ton

of other apps and everything else out there,

but specifically comixology .com because they

have what they call the guided view technology.

And especially with something like Love and Capes,

it's so awesome. Like you said, it's usually

eight panels. It's a joke every fourth panel.

And if you read it in guided view, it's like

reading it storyboard style. So you're taking

it one panel at a time. I've just now opened

volume three of Love and Capes. And it's just,

you know, It zooms in, it zooms out, it focuses

on various things, and it's just so... It's just

so good. I cannot say enough about... ...comicsology

and their guided view technology. It's simply

amazing. Absolutely. And I really do would love

to hear... from listeners after they check it

out what they say it is I Just think you can't

go wrong. It is absolutely wonderful Yeah, loving

capes from Tom Zoller absolutely great And there's

there's geeky things here, I mean there's there's

superhero things here, but there's also you know

funny references and obviously like I said you

know his his plan is the jokes every fourth panel

and everything else and the jokes really work

there was one panel I forget where I screen capped

it but he Abby I think it's either in volume

1 or volume 2 I forget which one it is she compares

him to beta Yes. And he's like, did you just

compare me to a outdated video format? Yes. You

know, it's that kind of it is. And she, you know,

he says, well, I did say better quality. Absolutely.

And I will will I'll end my part with a story.

So we're at an early convention and the book

had not he may have had five or six issues. It

was still fairly early and a guy comes up talking

to Tom a little bit and the wife is there and

you could see very clearly. That she's come to

this convention Because she lost a bet supportive,

you know, she has no interest in doing this whatsoever

And I can't remember it was me or Tom It probably

was me because Tom was talking to the husband

and I said do you Do you read any comics at all?

And she goes no, I don't read any comics at all.

I don't get them I said you will like this comic

She goes, really? I said, in fact, I will tell

you, by the first issue, are you guys coming

back tomorrow? And the husband said, yes, we

are. I said, OK, I will give you your money back

if you don't like the first issue. She goes,

really? I said, yeah, I really believe that strongly.

So she buys the comic, and they go on another

way. So the next day, the doors open. And she

marches and this is how I remember. She's marching

to just cutting through crowds straight to his

booth and said, beeline. Yes, I love this. I

need the next issue. Yeah. And the husband is

mouthing. Thank you to Tom. And so I kind of

say that, too. I'm not offering to pay back everyone,

but. Loving Capes is a good book to give to your

significant other who doesn't get comics, be

it the male part of the relationship or the female

part of the relationship, it doesn't matter.

Your significant other, if they do not like comics,

Loving Capes is something you can give to them

and say, just read the first issue. If by three

or four pages, if you're not captivated, fine.

And I think they will be pleasantly surprised.

Wouldn't you agree? Oh, absolutely. And like

I said before, between Lois and Clark, The Incredibles,

there's so many different referential things

I can say about it. that it reminds me of this,

it reminds me of that, you know, that kind of

thing. I won't, I won't saddle Quincy with reminding

me of, of Incrediboy, but essentially that's

what he kind of was at first. But 11 capes, ladies

and gentlemen. It is amazing. It really, really

is. It's something you should at least try. Now

that it's in trade paperback form, I wouldn't

even say try the first issue. I would say go

out, get the first trade. If by the end of the

first trade, you're not hooked. Well, then you

just have no sense of humor, but you know and

you just said they've got the Trade the first

one in a really competitive price, right? 599

yeah, you know for six bucks you get six issues.

That's essentially a dollar an issue, right?

The other ones, volumes 2 and 3 are $7 .99 each

and volume 4 is $11 .99. I don't know because

I don't know how Comixology does their pricing

or whatever. I'm not sure how that, you know,

whatever. But for six bucks, folks, it's worth

that price alone, if not more. I mean, it really,

really is. Uh, you know, I don't want to sit

here and say, I wish he would go back to it because

I know that as we already said, he kind of doesn't

want, I don't, I don't want to say this and doesn't

want to, but he doesn't want to just go back

to it for the sake of going, like you said earlier,

um, for me at this point with Tom. And I know

I'm beating a dead horse here, folks. I need

more long distance. That was not enough. Four

issues was not enough, Tom. I'm sorry. I loved

all four issues, but it wasn't enough. Yeah,

and I also think that, you know, you and I are

going to be there wherever he wants to go the

next one. Whatever his next. Whatever his next.

you know story he wants to tell we're going to

be there and i think you'll give you it'll be

well written it'll be fine and uh... you know

it's going to be a great ride absolutely uh...

alright so i think that's going to do it for

us here inside the poll bag uh... we are going

to beginning to Teenager Ninja Turtles the next

couple of weeks Joe Reed and I are gonna do a

giant size episode where we talk about TMNT 47

or 49 which is the end run of the stockman swarm

arc and Then the week after that we're gonna

be tackling the double sized TMNT 50 So that's

what's going on there. Where can the people interact

with you online sir? I am at Jesse Jackson DFW.

If you follow me every once in a while, you'll

get to see someone include me in some kind of

political debate and I get to reply to him. No,

I'm the Jesse Jackson's obsessed with Bruce Springsteen

and Doctor Who. And I can be found on Storm in

the Castle, my podcast that I co -host about

Castle. Speaking of. Tom Zahler was a guest this

summer and we talked about the season, the last

season of Castle. Next stop everywhere, a Doctor

Who podcast. And my newest podcast is Set Lusting

Bruce, a podcast all about Bruce Springsteen

and his fans and his music. Absolutely. You can

find me on Twitter at TFG and Mike. You can follow

at GECast Radio on Twitter. You can follow The

Pole Bag on Twitter at The Pole Bag. Head on

over to geekcastradio .com. We are in the middle

of some site changes, some layout changes, some

design changes. We're going through that. Coming

up in June of 2016 will be our seven -year anniversary.

Oh my god. Wow! Thankfully, thankfully no one's

broken a mirror yet. So make your greatest game

in the comics and we will catch you next time!

You've just heard the latest episode of The Pull

Bag, the GCRN's comic review and discussion podcast.

There are several ways to get in touch with us

and leave feedback for the show. You can visit

the website, GeekCastRadio .com, where you can

comment on the episode and all of our different

podcasts. You can rate our show on iTunes. Be

sure to leave us feedback. Call the voicemail

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email feedback at geekcastradio .com. Follow

us on Twitter at Geekcast Radio. So until next

time, make your great escape into comics and

unleash the geek in you.