David Wallace of MoonBase2 on Getting into Comics

This is Kevin Connelly, and I am the goddamn

Batman. Welcome to The Pole Bag's Origins episodes.

Join TFG1 Mike as he grills this week's guest

on just how they got into reading comics and

more. So sit back, relax, and enjoy The Pole

Bag. Hello and welcome to get another pull bag

origins episode I am your host TFG and Mike and

for those of you who don't know what the origins

episodes are it's basically where I either find

people that I've listened to for a number of

years on a podcast or where I bring my friends

on and I basically make them shrimps on a Barbie

and I grill them consistently on how they got

into comics this time around We jump across the

pond, and thankfully it isn't in a TARDIS. It's

in a floating DeLorean. We have Kal -El Prime,

David Wallace from Moonbase 2 and the Underbase.

Hello, sir. Hello, and while I may probably be

insulting the UK here, everybody knows that the

DeLorean was so much cooler than the TARDIS.

Damn straight. I'm sorry, but, like, flying DeLorean?

Come on. Hello, yes, I'm here. I would just like

to point out to all of the listeners, I'm sorry.

I have literally grabbed Mike and told him, yeah,

let's record this now, literally about 10 minutes

after agreeing to do this. So if it's a little

haphazard and a little bit all over the place,

that's just because I've basically forced him

into this. All over the place is what we do best

here at the Geekcast Radio Network. Fantastic,

then I should fit in. Alright, so I've heard

several of your Moonbase 2 interviews over the

years. I hate to admit it, but I'm not a regular

listener. But the underbase, I started listening

to that because I started reading Transformers

comics and I'm like... Why am I gonna listen

to these people spoil the crap out of this book

without reading it myself? Good! Yes! It should

be done! Don't come with me to the podcast if

you haven't read it. Yeah, yeah. And then again

I was like, oh wait, there's that other guy in

Illinois that twisted my arm from a shockwave

origin to reading all this crap. Not that the

Transformers books are crap right now, but uh...

But they were, let's be honest. Yeah, yeah. Damn

you, Mike Costa. So yes, we are here. We're going

to talk about Dave's comic origins, how he got

into it. So usually, generally right off the

bat, was there a specific family member, friend,

sibling, anything like that? gave you a comic

as a kid and said here read this and it got you

hooked on anything? You know what like as much

as that I'm sure a lot of people who come on

here have probably got these grandiose stories

about the first time they picked up a comic and

all of that stuff. I really don't. For me what

really happened was it was just kind of a happy

coincidence of things that I loved as a child

just sort of resurfaced in comic book form in

one way or another. So growing up, I didn't really

read comics. Most of the comics that we got over

here in the UK were comedy comics. Things like,

you may not have heard of these, but The Dandy,

The Beano. These were Dennis the Menace and things

like that. And they were... sort of magazine

sized comics and they they were funnies basically

they had you know a sticker gum on the cover

or whatever it is and you would buy it and it

would have puzzles and jokes and art competitions

and things like that and I hated them I still

to this day despise them I'm sure they're brilliant

for people but I just didn't I didn't get into

them but on the other side I was growing up with

things like Transformers, He -Man, Thundercats,

all of these great, amazing 80s cartoons, but

on top of that, I was watching the Chris Reeves

Superman movies, I was watching the original

89 Batman movies, and on and then moving into

that just as I was sort of growing up and and

sort of moving away from cartoons there was this

little thing called Batman the animated series

which a couple of people may have heard of I

think you might have mentioned it once or twice

around you know it's only 21 years old yeah you

know but that was happening and for a kid who

sort of really liked just like these crazy adventure

stories about essentially gods. Look at Transformers,

the giant mechanical robot gods. You look at

Superman, he is effectively a god. There was

these far out amazing things. For me, this was

just gold dust and I just absorbed it, but it

was never in a comic book medium. So yeah, that

was a long way of saying no. There was nobody

who gave me a comic book. I used to... My cousin

used to collect or read some comics, but I was

too lazy as a child. I didn't want to read as

a child. So if I would get a comic book, I would

look at the pictures and just imagine what they

were saying. It was still it was the world's

worst telly it was like still images And I was

like he says this and she says that and then

oh no hold on that doesn't work us Then he does

this so whatever this was me, but hey Yeah, you

know from it's something it's funny you mentioned

that because The current run of Batman Beyond

in the comics that's being written by Kyle Higgins

there was an issue where the you've seen that

series right i have yet i i don't know i'm not

entirely up to date because it'll be you know

i'm sure you're right you know the village area

right yeah okay there's a there's a issue that

was just released uh... batman going up against

rick and it was because the because the series

takes place after the events uh... it's all in

line with the animated universe and takes place

after that etcetera comes up again shriek again

shriek did something where terry could no longer

like basically he's deaf the most interesting

thing about that is how they showed that blank

word balloons uh... to show you a picture of

it because it was just it was just amazing so

it's funny you say that when you're a kid you'd

you just look at the pictures and make up your

own words is that that was that that's what the

reminder that uh... Alright, so what were you

reading? Are you alright? Let's get them. Yeah,

I mean look for me I was I was what teachers

at school would call a late bloomer I didn't

read anything like I read the cat sat in the

tree the cat Got out of the you know, it's like

I would read that stuff at school and I was like

I don't want to read like I was I was It was

very very difficult like for me to read I had

a lot of problems with like Spelling and reading

and writing and stuff growing up Like as a little

kid like by the time I got to about like 10 or

11 or 12. I kind of nailed it So I wasn't reading

anything and even to this day. I can't It's very

rare for me to read a book, a novel, basically

because I find them boring. I know a lot of people

will just be like, well, he's an idiot, obviously.

Yeah, that's fair enough. You can say that. But

from my perspective - Who are there certain people

that can and cannot read? You know, it just depends

on what it, you know, just like I started out

reading a whole bunch of book, like actual, yes,

people on the internet, there are actual physical

books still out there somewhere. You don't just

have to get them on your Kindle, damn it. Oh,

if only Amazon gave us a fee every time we mention

that. Amazon gives nothing. Yeah, exactly. But

yeah, I mean, no, I completely understand because,

you know, I was one of those people that was

into books more so than comics, and people know

the past 30, 40 episodes of this podcast, I've

said this. I'm one of those, and I'm kind of

getting the the just i don't have to go by this

but i'm one of those people that i have to start

at the beginning of the story so if i'm gonna

read batman six fifteen i'm gonna look at something

so you mean i should read all all six hundred

fourteen previous issues really seriously no

thanks so i completely get what you're saying

about not liking to read certain things are certain

mediums and that's fine you know it's hey it's

their own uh... Alright, are you Marvel or DC?

Okay, DC. There is no question it look again.

It was one of those things it was The Superman

movies, it was the Batman movies. To this day,

I will still say, when people turn around and

go, Marvel have owned the movie business for

the last 10 years and DC have been sucking. Yeah,

well DC owned the movie industry for 30 years

before that. So when you get to about 40 years

of movie dominance, then you come to my doorstep

with that kind of crap. No, like truth be told,

I was always a DC guy. Like Superman and Batman

are... Superman's the most important superhero

ever made, Batman's the greatest superhero ever

made. Like, end of discussion. There is no way

you can argue that. Whether you like Superman

or you don't, you can't deny the fact that if

Siegel and Schuster hadn't done what they did,

somebody would have done it, absolutely. I'm

not saying that, you know, somebody wouldn't

have done it, but would it have had the cultural

impact that it did? That's a big question. You've

got the Second World War looming. Look what happened

to comic books just after the Second World War.

If Superman had launched during wartime, it's

quite conceivable that you wouldn't have found

the massive surge in popularity that he had.

So it's fair to say that if they hadn't done

Superman when they did, superheroes may not have

been a thing. And Batman, just look at it, the

greatest rogues gallery in comics, the greatest

standalone stories ever, like, in terms of...

I would... I would be... It would be difficult

to find another character in written fiction,

whether it be prose, comics, or anything, to

have had the success, either Batman's had one

character in continuous publication for... Well,

Superman's 70 years old now, so he's going to

be like 70 years old next year. Well, 75 this

year. Sorry, 75. Next year for Batman. You keep

me right with this sort of thing. So 75 next

year for Batman. So continuous publication for

75 years. And if you say, name me one or two

great Batman comics, I'll say, I'll do you one

best. I'll name you 10 or 11. You know, the greatest

rogues gallery in comics, arguably perhaps the

most famous villains in comics, always has, with

perhaps the exception of Beware the Batman, always

had successful television series. Now, see, I

liked Beware the Batman. I don't think it's more

of... I think Beware the Batman's issue wasn't

with... Whether it was good or not to be successful

it was the fact that Cartoon Network consistently

screws up action cartoons and superhero cartoons

because they want to put their own crap like

Uncle Grandpa and Adventure Time and all this

other stuff on versus like so I don't blame the

fact that Batman whether Batman isn't currently

airing on television right now because It was

writing goods. It was just getting under you

know most TV shows take Five six years to really

get their legs, but networks nowadays don't even

let them no no any of the networks. I mean unless

you're somebody like AMC or BBC America or BBC

in general what whatever I mean, but like that

they don't give them the time that they used

to I think I think what's interesting like I

My comment there about Beware the Batman wasn't

based on the fact that I like it or I don't.

In fact, I haven't actually seen the last few

episodes of it. They're all sitting there to

watch and just haven't gotten around to watching

them. But it's more than just the fact that,

obviously, they've pulled a young justice on

us. And a Greenlander which is just yeah, and

this is this always makes me laugh. Everybody

has a go at Cartoon Network They're all like

our Cartoon Networks out to kill DC. Why did

DC enter into? Because Cartoon Network is owned

by Warner Brothers who also owned DC Comics.

It's like but Does what within this is somebody

massive companies? There are a whole bunch of

different people who are in charge of certain

divisions and it's like this whole thing You've

oh, well, why can't DC do a successful? Why can't

DC do a successful movie? Regardless of whether

you think they have or they haven't It's because

of the fact that the people that own Warner Brothers

pictures are not the ones that own Are not the

ones that are in charge of DC Comics and vice

versa. Yeah So yeah, like but to get back to

your point, I like I've always been a DC guy

primarily because I think Primarily because of

the fact that I prefer the idea of the myth,

the larger than life. If you get a lot of people

on, or if you listen to people talk about comic

books, you'll hear them say, the reason the Marvel

heroes were so much or were a breath of fresh

air, I won't say so much better, but were a breath

of fresh air was because they were real -life

people with real -life problems. Spider -Man

had to make the, and I'm sure you've heard this

example before, Spider -Man had to make the ultimate

decision of do I go to the left and stop Doc

Ock or do I go to the right and get the life

-saving medicine to save Aunt May? And that is...

Tragic decision -making that is great storytelling

Superman can do both and that's what I love about

him Stop stock -up and he goes gets the life

-saving medicine. I don't need like grandiose

human tragedy in in my characters. I mean Batman's

full of it, but like yeah But you know Batman

will always get the job done. It's never that

you're never worried about oh Can Batman survive?

This latest Death Trap. Yes, you can. That's

the answer to it. And there's something about

DC that just appeals to me with that. But Superman,

Batman, Wonder Woman and then Green Lantern and

things like that. They're all just amazing in

my eyes. That's not to say that I don't like

some Marvel because I was obviously growing up

at the same time as the Spider -Man cartoon.

The 90's Spider -Man and the 90's X -Men. Again,

which I enjoyed a great deal. Let's see, for

me, I'm coming back to those now. Like, yes,

I grew up watching that stuff with X -Men and

Spider -Man, but, like, I'm just, since I'm now

into comics again, or not again, but for, like,

the first time, full tilt, like, oh my god, I

have so much to catch up on. I now want to seek

out Dark Phoenix and certain Spider -Man stories

and etc., etc., etc., so that's, you know...

And the thing with, you know, you think about

rogues galleries like you were saying earlier.

It's like Batman has the ultimate rogues gallery.

He has the biggest. You've got Joker, Penguin,

Two -Face, Poison Ivy. when she's being bad cat

woman uh... you know it that's just five on one

hand i'm sure there's a you know a whole bunch

more than i'm not even thinking of a little talk

ventriloquists yeah you know scarecrow uh...

scarecrows all cool uh... tell you how cool bane

yeah yeah i mean You know and even if you want

to go with with new villains, you know, like

hush and things like that I think you know, despite

the fact that a lot of people rag on Jeff Loeb,

you know, he's a he's a great character and and

odds and odds dynamic like that but Because he's

more of an enemy of Bruce Wayne than he is a

Batman Yeah, which is a nice twist on the Batman

things. But yeah, you're absolutely right. Yeah,

so Batman has this huge rogues gallery 10 12

13 and all very individual very specific you

know obviously and I don't think you would argue

with this but his pretty much number one arch

enemy is the Joker but like when I think of Superman

I'm thinking Lex Luthor, Brainiac, Darkseid and

he has Pidlick. That's it. Seriously four people

That kind of, okay. Mixi is kind of like one

of those people that is just kind of annoying,

not really a real threat. Sure, you can count

Bizarro, but in some continuities Lex was the

one that cloned him to make Bizarro. It's just

like, who else can this god on this earth go

up against, other than someone like Darkseid

or Brainiac? I mean, there's not really, at least

to me, there isn't really a whole, you know...

Hell of a lot of villains out there. I mean that's

it go to that was the most beautiful thing about

the end of Justice League with destroyer is That

quote from Superman where he lives in a world

where he thinks he has to be careful with everything

you know and that was that was the inspired thing

about the the animated Superman series that Bruce

Tim and those guys did was the fact that They

really did just de -power him. You know, somebody

shoots a machine gun at Superman, it'll hold

him back. Because, why? It just makes it easier

to deal with him, you know what I mean? It's

like, this whole thing going on, you know, obviously

we've got Superman Batman coming out in 2015.

Just call it what it is, Justice League. Just

call it what it is. Because I'm such a big Superman

and Batman fan, I get this quite a bit from people,

and they turn around and say, so Superman's going

to fight Batman, and I say, have you watched

Man of Steel? Yeah? How does Batman fight Superman?

Like, at all. Like, and then when you get people

turn around and say, well Superman, Batman's

beaten Superman before, you turn around and you

say, no he hasn't. Like, in one comic book written

out of continuity by somebody who is politically

motivated to say Batman is anti -establishment

and so am I, and Superman is pro -establishment

and I'm against it, Batman wins and even then

the conceit that Frank Miller makes is that Superman

lets him go Yeah, it's like You know that there

is in hush Batman fights Superman Superman is

being mind -controlled by poison ivy and Is continually

fighting what he's doing so he's not unleashing

things But, it's one of these things where it's

like, Superman and Batman can't have a fight

because there's no way Batman would last three

seconds. I'm going to pull out a kryptonite,

oh I've been beaten. Have you read the current...

the new series the new number one for justice

league three thousand no not yet i haven't oh

my god i i won't spoil it for you but justin

justice league three thousand they're like the

batman and that is just like what i wouldn't

give for a good piece of kryptonite you know

that's it it's like uh batman i i would argue

you know when when people turn around and say

um and this is going way off topic and i'm so

sorry to all listeners but okay but When when

people turn around say superman's boring because

he can do anything I Turn around to people and

I say well Batman does everything does everything

all the time because More than anything and I

love these characters more than anything else

But this is like this is my inner Superman geek

fighting right is that nine times out of ten?

Every single time in a comic book unless it's

a big event or it's being hyped up All of these

heroes will generally come out on top They will

always do it like you know there's the people

people refer to Batman as bat God because he

pretty much is It's like he is he is prepared

for everything and you always hear people say

oh we'll give it enough time Batman could know

like Stop saying that it's like Batman doesn't

matter Batman will always come out on top because

he's freaking Batman because These are these

are imaginary characters. So it's like don't

tell me Superman's boring I don't have a problem

with reading a story of Superman going up against

Lex or going up against Brainiac or like I said

before even even going up against mixie at all

That's not my problem My problem, and this is

kind of on the Marvel side not the DC side, is

what I loved about what Dan Slott has done. this

year, is he took Peter Parker out of Spider -Man.

There are so many times, there are only so many

times I can take reading the misadventures of

Peter Parker going up against Doc Ock again,

or going up against Electro again, or going up

against Hydro -Man again. It's like, finally,

you've done something right here and taken Peter

completely out of the equation, at least for

now, and you've made the villain the hero. What's

putting... You're not reading that, are you?

No, I've read some of Dan Slott's early Spider

-Man stuff and I really enjoyed it because it

was... It was what I... It's what I thought of

as Spider -Man, you know. The traditional, I

know he's older sort of thing, and he's not married

anymore, but that sort of thing. There's the

love triangles running around and all that. And

I really did enjoy it for the most part. I thought

it was really, really well written. I'm obviously

keeping an eye on what's happening with the...

The superior Spider -Man and Doc Ock and things.

Okay, so you know that it's Ock and Spidey's

body, right? Yes, yeah. I just didn't want to

spoil number 740. Oh, no, no. Yeah, I knew it.

But the interesting thing about it is we were

talking about Batman having the greatest rogues

gallery in comics. Arguably, Spider -Man has

the second greatest rogues gallery in comics.

Oh, yeah. I frickin' can't stand Doc Ock. But

see, that's what makes Spider -Man so fresh now

for me. Like, I've seen the cartoon series, I've

read other, cause in the 90s that's how I kinda

got, like I kinda noticed comics was I was reading

several issues here and there of The Amazing

Spider -Man, I wasn't reading it all, but I was

like... you know, back in the day when bookstores

actually carried comics, you know, and there

was actually such a thing as a bookstore, you

know what I mean? So, I would read it every now

and then I'm like, okay, cool, but now it's like,

finally, something fresh, something interesting,

and it's an interesting way of how the villain

approaches being a hero, and how he's... doing

that and how the whole thing is that he's a superior

spider -man but uh... but you know i i've always

been a dc guy too i like i like marvel's characters

and i like their movies and i love the dc movies

as well but like like you said it's the problem

dcs is not so much that their past movies some

of them are bad not gonna say that they aren't

i mean come on that credit card come on you know

The problem DC has is Warner Brothers won't let

them explore other characters than Batman and

Superman. That's all it's been for 30 years!

Yeah, and hey, you know what? You wanna... You

wanna look at, uh, like, DC? Um... As much as,

um... You can look at the Chris Nolan movies.

and say they are brilliantly executed movies.

The Dark Knight Rises, whatever. Or you look

at the Superman movies and you say, well, you

look at the first Superman movie and you say

it's an excellently done piece of work. I would

argue that if you want to see DC done right,

you don't look at the big screen, ever. You always

look at the little screen. You always look at

the TV. Because... You know... The cartoons are

so much better fleshed out. They have never...

And this is something that's always gotten me,

especially about... In recent years, and this

is all thanks to the Chris Nolan stuff. That's

not Batman. Don't know who I don't know who it

is that they've got on screen, but it's not Batman

especially in the Dark Knight Rises he get it

is it is and I guess inherently this is a thing

with comic books because you're always getting

new creative teams on. It is always going to

be that person's interpretation of this character

that you are viewing. And as a creator, they

have a certain image of what Batman is and they

run with that. I, as a reader, have a certain

image of what Batman is. Now, this is why when

somebody turns around to me and says, I don't

want Ban Affleck as Batman, I go, I don't mind

because there's a good chance it's not going

to be the Batman that I like but maybe just maybe

they may do the Batman that I have in my head

which is effectively um Batman the animated series

Batman Kevin Conroy yeah Kevin Conroy yeah you

know or like the Arkham games for example now

like that's sort of my yeah yeah see for me it

was like okay Chucky from Good Will Hunting Is

going to be Batman Okay, I can kind of get behind

that I Like I wasn't in an outrage. I wasn't

at all. I I'm to the point now where I'm just

gonna wait and a lot of stuff now a lot of the

news items that come out now whether it's comics

film animated series, whatever it is, I just

sit back and I wait and see because I've jumped

the gun before on some stuff and I've gotten

pissed off about some stuff before and it's like

It's not worth it. I just want to see the damn

thing. I don't care. Yeah, that's I Don't I don't

think it's just this website, but I'm going to

call them out specifically because that's the

one I go to most of the time I Don't care what

TFW 2005 posts Location for filming are not news

stories. The fact that Loma Bay is gonna be in

China Or the fact that he's going to be in Russia

blowing up the Kremlin. That's not a news story

to me. Whatsoever. And it's like... I don't know.

But the thing with the Batman thing now, it's

like, it's all getting so out of hand. It really

is. Like, if you... Okay, say what you will about

the snapping of the neck in Man of Steel. Whatever.

I liked Man of Steel for how they told the origin

instead of doing what Superman did, Superman

the movie did, where they progressed it, like

starting at Krypton, goes to, you know, crash

lands, you know, spends all that time on the

farm, goes to... I like how they told that in

flashbacks. I thought it was a much better way

to reveal the story for an audience of today's

standards than it was the audience for 30 years

ago, but the events of that movie do not need

the sequel to be... Oh my God, there's all these

heroes in here. And oh my God, Superman's gonna

fight Batman. I prefer Superman and Batman to

be friends more so than adversaries to each other.

Like, sure. You know, you take World's Finest.

Three parts, Superman the Animated Series, movie

event, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. They

started out as adversaries and then they went

and became reluctant friends and then... the

dca you built upon that all of the course of

the rest of the series that they had i prefer

that and to see batman punching superman and

superman punching batman and breaking his ribs

are had all god i thought that's going to be

a fan outcry of superman breaks batman's back

in this movie but i don't think it was unable

to do in the last part of the city just dislocated

a disc or something like that. You know what

it is? That Will's Finest thing. I love that

three -parter, but whenever I think about it,

the only two things that spring to mind is I

absolutely love the bit where... Superman works

out who Batman is and then Batman just immediately

works out who Superman is. I love that bit. Superman

x -rayed him. He's like, why? It was like, you

know. And then Batman does the sneaky thing and

puts a tracer on him. And I still, I've been

trying to get a high -res screen cap. I can't

tell if Batman salutes him or gives him the finger.

But it's that, like, the only two bits of that

movie that I distinctly always remember is that

scene which I absolutely adore but I also love

the bit where Lex and the Joker sit down of the

conversation and Mercy and Harley Quinn are literally

just beating the hell out of each other in the

background. What was the progression of getting

into comics full -time for you? Went on a holiday

Let me let me just give you a brief say brief

backstory. It's never brief, but I Don't hear

in the UK. We have something called the British

summer beach holiday, which is essentially because

we're all Stuck on a tiny little island about

two hours away from an ocean or if less for most

people I guess It's literally a case of you go

down to somewhere else in the country you spend

a week to two weeks sat in a caravan next to

rain and cold weather and you have a good time

and one year this must have been i don't know

1990 1993 i would say i'm i'm i'm on one of these

holidays and I've I'm a big video game fan growing

up so I've got Super Nintendo and things like

that and I've got this video game magazine and

I open it up and there is In in this magazine

a game coming out called the death and return

of Superman Mm -hmm, and I'm just like There's

a Superman game coming out for the Super Nintendo

Fantastic excellent, and it showed you a couple

of little screenshots. That was about it And

you know back in them days there was no internet

kids it you basically had to wait until the next

month and prayed that they would mention something

else about it and So we're walking through the

high street one day, and we walk into a bookshop

with WH Smith people in the UK will know what

that is and and they on the shelf is the collected

first trade of the death of superman oh wow now

as a kid who and and like i know that like when

superman died in america it was like this big

thing it was like on all the news and all of

that stuff it kind of hit over here but it wasn't

it wasn't something that like I was aware of

at the time, but I'm just like, you have to buy

me this comic book. I need to understand this.

And so me mum's like, alright, we'll buy it,

so buy it for me. And again, I still don't want

to read at this point. Fortunately, the death

of Superman isn't exactly a difficult thing to

read on the basis of the fact that it's eight,

I don't know, seven issues of people punching

each other. And it just blew my mind. Like absolutely

blew my mind. And then from there it sort of

steamrolled. It was the death of Superman, then

it was the world without a Superman. And then

before I got the return of Superman, I found

out that the BBC had done an audio drama. We're

talking like over a span of a good couple of

years here. So the BBC did an audio drama of

the death and return of Superman. The video game

came out and so it was just this whole thing

was like built around that this one story arc

Which was like which essentially I guess for

comic books is is probably the I mean I I think

I'm still right in saying that the death of Superman

trade paperback is the most Sold graphic novel

of all time or the best -selling story of all

time And that was it really I mean there was

this big influx of stuff like that and then I

remember reading things like nightfall and then

I'm sitting in school one day like I've literally

started what for us would be secondary school

so this is about 12 age 12 or 13 and I'm sitting

there one day and I'm reading my Man Returns

trade paperback and a guy comes up to me who's

the same year as me he's just started and he

says oh do you like comic books and I said yeah

yeah and he was like oh I read comic books as

well and I'm like somebody else reads comic book

bloody hell and and me and this guy called Andy

we developed a really good friendship and he

he read a lot of different comics. He read a

lot of Marvel and things like that and he had

a lot more comics than I did. But one thing that

he did have was an almost complete collection

of the 1980s Transformers comics. And in turn

he was a massive Transformers fan as well. Like

again, it was not the case that I ever borrowed

any of him. I read like a couple of trades that

he lent me. But that was it and then Then I kind

of guess that I finished up school and Went to

college and this would have been around 2000

I guess so I would have been about 17 18 and

It must have been 17 and I walk into a local

comic book shop in in town where I live and lo

and behold there is Dreamwave's Transformers

comics and I picked it up I read it I absolutely

fell in love with it because it was like Transformers

were back and you know at the beginning of 2000

that was when everything started coming back

like Transformers came back it had never gone

away Beast Wars had been around all the way through

the 90s but Damn it, they weren't trucks, so

who'd give a damn? I understand when saying that

about Beast Wars how stupid it is to say it,

but that's the way... Oh God, there's an image,

I'll have to find it on Facebook, there's an

image of Beast Wars Optimus in his Optimus Primal

farm, and he's pointing at the screen like Uncle

Sam points, and we want you. He's pointing at

the screen, he says, Say truck not monkey just

one more time But but that was it though, I mean

it was it was it was this really really terrible

thought going on like Through you know through

me head which was basically just like nah. No,

I'm not interested It's it's not real transformers.

In fact, I probably didn't even realize that

beat was transformers, you know, it was marketed

over here is just Beast Wars and so I probably

wasn't even aware of it but the Dreamwave comics

came out and then one day I'm just in the comic

book shop and I see action no it was Adventures

of Superman now I can't remember the exact number

but it was Adventures of Superman comic and it

was basically a picture of Superman wearing a

completely different suit Basically standing

what looked like the bike out of Akira and I

was like, I was like, okay, this is interesting

and I bought it and that was it like Off to the

races ten years of just comic book buying and

within that ten years it went from reading Dreamwave

and Superman to reading everything pretty much

that DC put out On a weekly basis with the exception

of things like the Legion Because I can't stand

the Legion I'm not a fan of the Unless it's the

Batman Beyond universe. I'm not a fan of DC 3

,000, you know the year 3000 I just Because I

don't hear like I said before I read the Justice

League 3000 number one and When Batman is saying

what I wouldn't I would pay so much for just

one piece of credit I could hear Kevin Conroy

in my head with that, but it wasn't the same

design it was more of an armored like he has

the You've seen injustice, right? Yes. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. He has the the chin plate in his it's the

kind of like the Just I don't know I just didn't

didn't really yeah, but the the stuff in the

future like that far into the future Like oh

the Green Lantern Corps that no longer matters.

They're they're all dead in the future or whatever.

I just can't get into that It's it's going to

be really interesting next year when DC does

this futures end thing and they jump the new

52 five years into the future It's gonna be interesting.

I don't know if I'm gonna pick it all up and

I'll give it at least one or two issues, but

I'm to the point now where like if something

like I'm fine with what I have, like outside

of the whole excuse, oh my God, everything is

too expensive and oh my God, I don't have enough

money for this, this and this and this and this

as far as like my entertainment purchases. It's

like, I really have to put a sticking point and

I've Done to the point. I'm done to the point

now where stuff. I was reading earlier this year

I'm no longer reading because I just don't like

the way it's going so that allows me to add in

a couple of new things But it's like I'm I'm

I'm loving Batgirl and Nightwing those two ongoings

The new TMNT animated adventures, I enjoy that

Superior spot, you know, I and like I have several

things but it's like they keep coming up with

all this new stuff and I'm like, okay I just

can't yeah, that's what it's why I constantly

wait for trades and I'm not unless it's something

that I'm being super impatient about which it

really isn't unless again You'll sense a pattern

here unless it's bad girl a nightwing I'm not

really super impatient on any of the waiting

for the trade things anymore No, I mean you know

what the actually and this is This is probably

the the best thing that's ever happened to comic

books in I don't know the last 50 years or something

is the fact that Now it's all gone digital So

that means that if if you aren't enjoying something

And you don't think it's it's very good then

don't read it like when it comes to comic books

like literally don't because I like I say when

I said that for 10 years I read everything I

I read everything for 10 years it was a horrible

horrible dark pit of obsession to go down like

it didn't happen all at once you know it gradually

like but but I was I was blowing 150 dollars

a week on on comics because because and and this

is how bad I am Would be buying the six individual

issues over six months and then six months later.

I'd be buying the trade paper back Let's see.

I don't have that much of a collectors mentality

when it comes to singles. And I've told this

story on the show many times before. I will save

my singles until the trade for that series or

the trade trades that I want come out. I will

then take them back to my shop and get store

credit. So not actually spending any more money

than I already have because I'm getting it. I

know it's going to be at a lesser price. Like

if I take 10 books in there, depending on if

they can use them or not, they may give me It

just depends on what the books are and all that

stuff, but it's like, that's what I do is I will,

sure I'll... I'll have a stack of comics for

six months, and then if a trade comes out that

I really, really want, I'll take some of them

up there and see if they'll take them back and

give me store credit. Ah, you see, you're lucky.

We don't have the whole store credit thing here

when it comes out. Really? No, no, no. Like,

I buy the comics and then I buy the trades. I

mean, that's literally how bad it is, because...

But anyway, the point that I'm making anyway

before I go off on another tangent is that...

The reason, the reason I enjoyed it so much,

actually no, that's not the point that I was

making, the point that I'm making is that the

great thing about comic books now is because

it's all digital, if you're not enjoying something,

don't read it, don't buy it, and then go read

something else, and if you then six months down

the line have the compulsion like you mentioned

that you had, or that I have, which is that,

well I can't read this thing until I've read

that thing. Mm -hmm that six months later. You

can go buy the trade or you can buy it digitally

for a much cheaper price or wait till a sale

happens or something and get them all in and

You know, you're saving yourself some money So

if the story's not as good as you think it is

and it doesn't really matter because you haven't

paid full price for it Yeah, see that's that's

kind of the way I am now where Sure because of

not not specifically because I cover stuff here

inside the pull bag it's because I have the mentality

of oh my god I need to know what's going on I

need to stay up to date but at the same time

to actually enjoy the story six months eight

months later to get the trade I will the funny

thing is we're talking earlier about the Stephanie

Brown Batgirl stuff I can't seem to find any

of those physically no trade anywhere online

so comixology .com all 24 issues cost about I

think it's 50 bucks because they're $1 .99 an

issue so that's not that bad I haven't pulled

the trigger on it yet but potentially the Stephanie

Brown series will be covered in the pull bag

in the future I would recommend it the Stephanie

Brown Batgirl stuff is just amazing I don't I

don't get Stephanie Brown fans because they're

a bunch of psychos who only care about Stephanie

Brown. I get it. It was basically DC's equivalent

to like traditional Spider -Man. like classic

spider -man for a long time and DC have always

had a problem trying to get that character for

a second it would look like it might have been

blue beetles you know the new blue beetle or

whatever but that Stephanie Brown Batgirl stuff

really got the closest to it but then ever since

they they canned it all it was was just Where's

Stephanie Brown? When's Stephanie Brown coming

back? When can I have Stephanie Brown coming

back? And now that apparently she is coming back,

hopefully it should shut people up. Yeah. See,

I don't, unless it's not that I don't like arguing

with people about stuff I do, but unless people

share the same opinions or interests that I have,

I very like, I don't pay attention to fan outcry.

Yeah. Unless it's like, unless it's something

super serious, like, um, The new editor came

in and said, Hey, I'm the new editor. I want

to shake things up. Gail Simone hit the bricks.

And it's like, seriously, really? You're going

to fire one of your best writers just cause you're

someone new. You know, but yeah. So, all right.

Right now. We'll get to the giant robots later,

but right now, outside of the giant robots, what

are you currently reading? Okay, what am I reading?

I'm not reading a great deal. Just because, like

you say, life, budget, all of that stuff, doesn't

it? I am currently reading, as monthlies, I'm

reading Forever Evil. Justice League. uh... justice

league of america uh... the transformer stuff

obviously uh... the what else am i reading uh...

i'm i'm dipping in here and there with them with

things like uh... the new superman wonder woman

series and things like that but really like that

is it I mean it's a it's a massive cutback and

the new 52 kind of had a lot to do with that

to be honest so I'm not reading a great deal

monthly wise at the moment and certainly not

enough that I should be anyway yeah I would suggest

going it Like you said, if you want to go digital,

you can do it this way. I would suggest getting

the Batman Beyond 2 .0 digital chapters, because

that's in the animated universe that has nothing

to do with New 52, and it is really, really good.

I would suggest that. The Transformers stuff.

You've been reading it off and on over the long

course that it's had. come in fresh with just

the IDW continuity. I do want to, and I know

the, I know, I know the spotlights are IDW, but

I haven't, I've read several of them, but I haven't

read them all. I do want to eventually read them

all. But like, I didn't grow up with the Marvel

stuff. Like I was telling Ender way back when

we did his Origins episode, the only Transformers

book, or illustrated anything as a kid that I

read was some stupid book about Wheely and his

parents. That was supposedly suppose it's some

children's book. Oh, that's that's a he found

it for me and linked it It's going for astronomical

amounts on eBay or something or other but it's

it's some some stupid wheelie story that I just

don't care about anymore Especially at something

like 50 60 $100 for a damn children's book. So

you don't care how rare it is. Yeah So I came

in fresh with IDW and I was really skeptical.

I was like Don't know if I really want to invest

all this time money effort and this wasn't even

oh my god I have to get this for the show. It

wasn't even that it was before I had even really

Said okay. Let's let's do this and review it

for the show. I Was skeptical because I'm one

of those closed -minded Transformers people that

Don't just like one generation I like it and

I base my transformers fandoms on the cartoon

series like for me Everything except the unicorn

trilogy is fine here in the US So G1 That cybernet

space cube crap doesn't count G1 beast wars beast

machines animated prime so As a G1 fan, because

I know the IDW continuity is kind of G1 -esque,

G1 -centric, I'm like, you know, Ender was talking

about More Than Meets the Eye and talking about

Rodimus taking a ragtag crew and going off and

finding these mythical knights of Cybertron or

whatever the hell. And I'm like, ugh, do I really

want to invest in something or read something

that... Has characters I know nothing about but

then I realized wait if I started issue one I

don't have to worry about anything so and it

came to be where I was just reading more than

meets the eye and I was loving it because that

that book is Amazing like sure. I'm sure there

are issues with it I know people have problems

with it, but the writing in general for the most

part specifically to the new characters that

that most general Transformers fans wouldn't

know anything about was very, very well done.

And then Ender dragged me over into RID as well,

so I'm reading that now. I prefer more than meets

the eye over RID for the first 11 or so. I'm

not a politics guy at all. I don't get all politicians

are corrupt, whether they be giant robots or

not. End of story. At least in my opinion. I

know I don't like the political crap that has

happened. I get why it has happened and that

it has to happen for what's going on now, but

more than meets the eye for me is better because

it was like... as Ender always says, and I love

stealing his lines. It's like, James Roberts

did the best thing in Transformers history. He

said, let's take Rodimus and take all these other

guys and just leave. And create a whole new story.

It's kind of like G1 Season 3 done right. It

is. I mean, up until the start of the current

story arc, pretty much the conceit of it was

there is no such thing as a war anymore. And

for all of the... Reading Transformers comic

books as long as I have, especially going through

the Dreamwave era, it was always that case of,

I'd love to see a Transformers series before

the war started, but nobody ever contemplated

what a series would look like after the war had

ended. And that's really the magic of More Than

Meets the Eye. RID, on the other hand, has a

different take on it just because of the... The

nature of the story, like you say, it's more

political, it deals with the Decepticons and

things like that as it needs to. But yeah, I

mean, the Transformers ongoing series, the two

ongoing series, RID and More Than Meets the Eye,

you can't go wrong with either of them. They're

really, really good. No, and you really should

be reading both of them because they are both

very well done and I'm... I was skeptical to

get into either one of them at first because

I was like, ooh, I'm on a Transformers Prime

kick. Ooh, Rage of the Dinobots. Writers from

the actual show writing the comic, that works

out very well. Because there are times where

I will read an adaptation or a perfect example

and I still to this day probably will never go

back and ever read it again. Transformers, the

movie, the original movie, not the... blow them

up base style. That full on trade paperback,

the comic adaptation that IDW put out. If it's

not word for word, what happened in the film?

My specific problem with that trade is more so

that they'll have the line, Megatron must be

stopped at... No matter the cost and then they'll

have something else in the word balloon and it's

like uh, no Don't do that. Just take it from

the damn script. I I was exactly the same. I

Genuinely, that was it. Um, I One of the things

that always got me about that trade was the fact

that they did sell it um to a large degree on

on the conceit of we're going to show you things

that you didn't see in the movie and what we

got was basically an explanation of where the

rest of the assault combiner teams were and they

were all just fighting at the arc and I'm like

That's the best you can come up with, given the

amount of severe plot holes that were in that

1986 movie. That's the best that you've got.

I say plot holes. Well, sort of just like...

Yeah, no. I know what you mean, yeah. But yeah,

it's like... And then it was so weird... I don't

know, there was some pack -in comic or something

or other where it's... Rodimus versus Cyclonus

or some... Oh, that's what it was. The packing

comic that came with Rodimus, Galvatron, and

Cyclonus or something or other. I don't know.

It's over there on my shelf. It basically tells

some sort of other story that happened during

the events of the film. And it's like, what?

Yeah. What is it? I don't know. I'm happy with

where it's going. I'm interested to see where

it's going. What really. And we've. We're about

to talk about this in an upcoming our general

discussion episodes are called after dark We're

about to talk about comic book covers in that

but like oh my god I Had to I had to send a letter

to Santa to have him give me Beast hunters number

three sub because my shop didn't get it I don't

get that if if the companies say make sure your

shops know that there's a sub cover So that you

can get it is if you have a subscription to it.

It's like then I should get it I actually had

to teach my shop and don't get me wrong. I love

the people up there I really do I had to teach

them where to look so they could see the did

they had Was it more which which one has the

covers? Is it more than meets the eye 23 that

has the covers of the the sub was the the the

minicon combiner Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah They had

that on the shelf. They had three copies of that

on the shelf and it plain as day says cover sub

Not that I wanted that cover, but I'm just saying

it's like oh my god, and it's one of those things

where If I sit there and tell someone hey look

the company is saying that we're getting sub

covers for this I at least like the option to

see if I want the sub cover or not There's no

sense in me having it on my list if if it's not

even going to be made as an option for me to

choose But yeah, I don't know all right so the

Transformers stuff Do you have a preference?

between the two ongoings? Oh, the two ongoings,

my preference was basically whichever one I'd

just finished reading. I was so back and forth

the whole time about it. RID had a very much

more American -style comic book. The way it was

written, it was a lot more based on traditional

American comic books, which I prefer over British

comic books things like Judge Dredd and stuff

which basically more than meets the eye is it's

a very very British written comic But having

said that I remember reading things like more

than meets the eye issue 6 and literally coming

away From it and just saying how the hell did

he do that? Because you know, I still maintain

to this day and if anybody doesn't remember the

issue, it's the it's the issue where Ultra Magnus

goes crazy and takes Whirl and Rung hostage And

it is literally one of the best, if not the best,

Transformers comic book I've ever read. And I

still to this day, even though I got the script

from James Roberts and have sat down and read

the script that he wrote, and I still to this

day can't figure out how he was able to do it

in the amount of pages that he did. It's incredible.

It really, really is. But is that the one where

they are inside Magnus's mouth or something or

other? No, no, that's the annual. Okay. This

is Okay. Yeah, this is this is right at the beginning

This is just after they they've picked a boulder

Magnus and he he kind of goes crazy because he's

seeing overload everywhere Sorry, not Magnus.

Sorry. I'm saying Magnus and I mean Fort Max.

That's where the control lot lately I've just

been getting transformer names wrong and I don't

know why but it's yeah the one where Fort Max

goes crazy what I loved about that issue was

Rodimus and blaster oh you know like blaster

can you find a way to get in there and just you

know just the fact that Rodimus Prime is a well

he's not prime obviously just Rodimus it's the

fact that Rodimus is just dick. The entire series,

he's a total asshole. So I could never pick between

more than meets the eye of robots in disguise

for the most part. I remember once, I think it

was last year on the underbase when we did our

which is the better season. I said RID, but I

said RID on the basis that RID was ramping up

to its big season finale, and it was super exciting,

whereas RID had a very much more methodical and,

you know, steady pace, and it would move on very

quickly from one point to the other. But, yeah,

I mean, they're both very, very good. Right now

with Dark Cyber Drone, my favorite one... Alright,

I know, I know. Let's put aside the fact that...

IDW and Hasbro have teamed up to make it toy

pack ins and all that marketing junk. Let's writing.

Okay. My biggest surprise in Dark Cybertron is

and I could see this done with a Batman head

to the rod pod. I love that. I thought that was

awesome. Cause this, this version of Rodimus

is that arrogant. You know, I It's one of those

things where when they did the rod pod I remember

looking at it and and I All the way through more

than meets the eye James Roberts's comedy has

been like completely infectious and it's brilliant

And it is so hard to do comedy right in a comic

book Especially with giant robots. Yeah, well,

especially with giant robots. Comedy is so much

about pace and timing, which you cannot control

in a comic book. You've got to be the greatest

writer or greatest artist in the world to slow

a reader down or convince them to go at your

pace. So doing comedy is incredibly difficult.

And James has been a master at doing brilliant

comedy throughout More Than Meets the Eye. When

we got to the Rod Podbit, I was so desperate

to just know what the hell was going on that

I was just like, I'm not finding this entertaining

in the slightest. Just tell me what the hell

is going on. What is the point of this book?

Started getting really angry about it It is true

because I mean it's totally right. I mean, yeah

Rodimus is completely arrogant and completely

self -obsessed That he would commission this

this ship this deep sea diving vessel or whatever

it is But yeah, that's like if you think about

it and you want to connect it to other moments

in Transformers history It's a giant version

of rat traps underwater vehicle from Beast Wars

While there's fully pedals going and stuff like

that. Yeah, yeah. But Dark Cybertron, for me,

it's been a bit of a slog, I've got to admit.

I just can't get on board with it in the slightest.

The last issue that we've had... has shaken up

the status quo enough that i'm ready to go okay

we're now moving into the second part of the

series let's see where it goes from there because

now something has happened um but but my but

i think my biggest problem with it is and i've

expressed this on the under base is it is dealing

with a subject matter that i can't stand the

dead universe stuff has just been so mishandled

by pretty much every creative team that has been

Brought on board and I don't blame Simon Furman

because he got the the rug yanked out from under

him and he had to tie it up in a horrible horrible

way It was then brought back for the Costa run

and all of that and dear God That that all just

went completely wrong and now it's being brought

back again and I'm sick to death of it. I don't

care about Nova Prime There's so many random

Unanswered questions that I've got knocking about

in my head that the fact that we're just that

six issues in we really don't have any answers

and we know Through shockwave zone admission

that he's playing a completely different game

to everybody else. So we know that everything

that's happened so far isn't really going according

to how Nova thinks it's going to go, because

Shockwave's going to pull the rug out from underneath

everybody, and it's just, I'm just sitting here

going, just get on with it, and because it's

a toy pack -in, it is 12 issues, because there

are 12 toys to pack, and as a result of it, we

have to go with it, whereas something like a

standard event book from one of the big two,

Would be seven issues and We would nearly be

finished by now The only saving grace is that

for me with dark Cybertron is the fact that we're

getting two issues a month So it's not lasting

any more than six months Yeah, well see that's

the thing like The whole spark of this conversation

first started when I wrote a post on the Facebook

page about, after I had listened to the More

Than Meets the I -23 review, it was like... Yeah,

Dark Cybertron's moving. I love a lot faster

than Batman zero year is oh god Yeah, because

Batman zero year is 12 issues an entire year

12 months say like if they were really see that's

the other thing about comic releases I don't

I get it, but I don't get it, but like take Marvel.

They're releasing superior spider -man twice

a month Yeah, they were I believe they still

are Why can't we have? the zero -year stuff twice

a month, that way it'll be done in six months.

You know? You know, I mean the one advantage

with characters like with Batman is the fact

that if it comes along that they're going to

do a year -long story and you don't like it,

the one advantage you can always count on with

Batman is the fact that there are three other

Batman titles you can be reading instead. With

Transformers! You had one, then you got two,

but now they've all been brought in, so if you're

not enjoying it, I mean, okay, yeah, you could

go off and you could go read, you know, Beast

Hunters, or you could go read Regeneration 1,

but they're not! But if you're not... If you're

not interested in them and you're just interested

in the core IDW universe, then you're stuck with

this. You know, and this happens with characters

like Wonder Woman, for example. If you're not

liking the new 52 Wonder Woman, well, first of

all, you've got a problem, but second of all,

you're in trouble, basically, because there is

no other way to get that... Yeah, that character.

Alright, let me throw myself under the bus and

say, unless it's animated, unless it's Susan

Eisenberg voicing her, or unless it's the old

Linda Carter television series, I don't give

two shits about Wonder Woman in comics. You know

what? You would not be the only one. Wonder Woman,

I have always looked at it this way, Wonder Woman

is the biggest successful failure in comic books.

Because nobody really gives a damn about Wonder

Woman. Between her and Aquaman, I just cannot

get into the fact that they are kingdoms unto

themselves. Like a lot of a lot of some people

might not be able to relate to Superman other

than in They may not be able to relate to him

in the fact that he's godlike now that he's An

adoptee of Earth, you know that way, you know

sure everyone can most everyone can relate to

him in the fact that You know his home was destroyed.

He has to go find a new hole You know, there

are certain aspects of Superman people can relate

to and then there's this One massive aspect,

the fact that he has all these powers and nobody

else does. Well, most nobody, you know, general

people don't, you know. But Wonder Woman in Aquaman

is like, okay, he's a king. He's basically King

Trident, except he doesn't have a daughter named

Ariel. You know, well, Mira kind of almost mirrors

Ariel, but anyway, as far as looks. But Wonder

Woman is like, she's... She's from this all women

warrior culture basically sheltered from man's

world and As a male reader while you know the

dirty side of my brain is like, ooh orgy great,

you know fine Let's do this in the pool The logical

side is like yeah, I just there's nothing in

her universe and it goes back to rogue scholars

like we're talking about earlier Okay Hades or

whatever he's called nowadays or whatever the

hell, you know that or Like I don't know. I'm

just not into the whole Greek my home Greek mythology

thing at all. I don't know what it is, but it's

like unless Here's a series that I and I know

this won't happen now that she and Superman are

an item But here's a series that would have really

got me to read Wonder Woman Princess Diana and

Bruce Wayne End of story just like it was done

in Justice Lee was hinted at in Justice League

and Justice League unlimited That's a relationship

comic. I could watch or I could read, you know,

but like on her own I just don't care Me with

with Wonder Woman, I think it's entirely the

fact that I I do like Greek mythology and and

yeah like you know Wonder Woman I could totally

understand it it's like you know Aquaman yeah

I totally see where you're coming from like until

Geoff Johns until Geoff Johns redefined Aquaman

for the new 52 I didn't give a damn about Aquaman

either like some some comic books work some don't

for people Like and I suppose that's that is

the thing with the DC comics Is the fact that

because they're they're so not grounded in reality

that they are so fanciful that it can totally

take people out But yeah, you know like we were

saying earlier for me the animated adventures

or the animated stories or what I really like

about Wonder Woman and Aquaman the comics I just

have no real interest in reading them in because

I've been reading Injustice that's the other

thing I wish some comic companies would make

up their damn minds I thought the Injustice comic

was going to be a prequel to the video game,

which it is. Year one of Injustice is a prequel.

I don't have no idea what the hell they're doing

for year two, but I thought it was just gonna

be like a five -issue miniseries. How is it that

DC can make all their characters from these games

go on and on and on and have stories, yet IDW

cuts Beast Hunters to eight issues only? Seriously,

really? Come on. Uh, because... At the end of

the day, Hasbro have a very basic marketing strategy.

Sell what is current and ignore everything else.

The fact that we are seeing characters like Rattrap

and That's what I was gonna - What is the deal?

Okay, I've been reading all of More Than Meets

the Iron, Robots in Disguise. Am I just needing

to read them in trade and not singles? What did

I miss? Were they in the dead? How is Waspinator

and Rattrap even in this continuity? Because

Hasbro said these are the toys that we're making.

We want okay, okay. I don't want the business

answer. I want the story answer There is there

is on there really that literally is not the

story answer is is that? This character serves

a particular purpose in the story and I can make

them fit. That's fine However, the conceit is

that character still has to be there now I can

I can accept like I can accept the fact that

The more that meets the eye that the IDW is not

generation one. It's it's not yet It's not our

generation one. It's not it's not right. No,

I can accept that I just want to know how the

hell they got there Well, they they were just

off in space when the Great War was going on

they You know, that was just it they they then

come back It but yeah, absolutely. I mean, you

know that that's that's one of those things whereas

with actual comic book companies such as And

the problem with IDW is that IDW, all of IDW's

stuff is pretty much dealt on intellectual properties.

They go out, they find a property that is successful,

be it Godzilla, be it whatever, you know, the

fact that they didn't get He -Man over DC, but

I think that might be who actually owns, I'm

pretty sure that Warner Brothers... No, no, it's

Mattel, isn't it? It's Mattel and Classic Media,

I think. Yeah. But there's some weird thing where,

like, Warner Bros. owns the rights to the Masters

of the Universe movie. Yeah, something like that.

So Mattel can't make toys based on Frank Langella's

Skeletor, which is the only toy of the He -Man

classics that I would even be tempted to buy.

Now, I will say they did do something really

cool. with a character called Preturnia He -Man.

They included an accessory of the Cosmic Key,

a weapon accessory. So that was cool, but you

have to buy the figure which at 28, 30, 30...

I don't even... We'll be all here all day with

me talking about the current classics crapola

that they've got going on at Mattel. I would

say though that just on that... Passing observer

of what Mattel have done with the classics line.

I give them total credit and kudos because They've

stuck with it. It can't they've stuck with it,

but they don't fix anything. Oh, well, I Yeah,

I mean if you go into specifics and stuff, but

I mean they give you a frickin Castle Greyskull

That's pretty cool. Yeah, for a freaking enormous

amount of price. Oh yeah! It has to be that price,

but yeah. That's what happens when nobody buys

it. Yeah, that's true. That's Battelle covering

their own asses. You'd never see Hasbro do anything

like that. I mean, you know. No, that's up to

the third party companies. Yeah, well that's

it, that's it, you know. Alright, so for me even

before Ender dragged me in with his shockwave

teases from one of the meets the eye I because

I was so into Transformers Prime and I'm one

of those people that While I do recognize that

some people have issues with that cartoon series.

I Pretty much like there was a huge uproar about

the season 2 episode the the clip show Where

Fowler has to explain to his superiors and they

show all these clips of what's already happened

Everybody's like, oh my god, we're only X number

of episodes into the second season already doing

a clip show It's like who cares it's being written

Well, and it's the the story was, you know flood,

you know It was explained very well to these

superiors who had the government spirits who

had to know but like Because I was on such a

prime kick. I heard about Rage of the Dinobots

and I'm like, ooh, what's this? And, you know,

I picked it up and read it and read Beast Hunters

and Ender and I interviewed Marigrid and all

this and all that and I thought it was interesting

using the writers, every two issues, between

her and Mike Johnson, that they would each write

two issue stories. I thought that was interesting.

The ending, I liked except for the designs because

apparently... Augustine didn't get the memo that

Bumblebee is black and yellow now. Because Beast

Hunter's number eight is Bumblebee is in his

original design. It's a little nitpick, but I

enjoyed Beast Hunters and who knows where they're

gonna go for, you know, go forward from here.

To my knowledge, we haven't heard anything yet

about whatever new cartoon series they're gonna

come up with. I'm just glad it's on the hub.

Well, no, I mean... I'm just glad it's on Hasbro's

own damn channel, because that's another thing

that was... Oh, God. Animated Cartoon Network.

Oh, God. Now, there was a show cut short. Oh,

man. But, you know, the thing is, yeah, we don't

know what the next Transformers series is going

to be, because, hey, guess what? You're not going

to get it for at least a year, because there's

a thing called Transformers 4. coming out. And

again, this goes back to it. This is why you're

talking about Dan Slott's superior Spider -Man.

This is why, as much fun as you might be having

with Doc Ock running about as Spider -Man, I

guarantee you that within the next six months,

old Peter Parker's going to be back in the tights.

You know why? Because there's a thing called

Amazing Spider -Man 2 coming out. But Amazing

Spider -Man 2 takes place, it's supposedly based

around the Ultimus Universe. Yeah, but it doesn't

matter to, it doesn't matter to Marvel at the

end of the day. If you are selling a movie and

all of a sudden somebody and... To be honest,

this drives me nuts because I don't believe there's

ever any correlation between somebody watching

a movie and then suddenly deciding to go read

comics. I just don't think it happens. If that

one person, that one imaginary person is perceived

to be put off by the concept that Peter Parker

isn't actually Spider -Man, then... That story

ain't gonna fly much longer. And that's the problem

with all these people having to tiptoe around

all of this weird external media, which I think

has been a real benefit to DC, where when you

look at something like injustice, they've turned

around and said, here's this idea, it's a...

It's not a brand new idea, it's a cliche idea.

The bad guys are the good guys, and the good

guys are the bad guys. But we're going to give

it its legs, but we're going to do it just in

this little digital format over here that you

don't really have to worry about if you don't

want to. Which turned out to be like a really

massive success for them. And I will say that

that opening salvo of injustice was bloody amazing.

those first few issues uh... it was the first

two issues and oh my god hello superman basically

rips the joker's guts out uh... well i i wasn't

even thinking about that i was thinking about

like that the prequel the comic book where uh...

he thinks he's fighting doomsday and throws doomsday

up into space only to find its lowest lane and

his pregnant wife's pregnant wife that he's just

killed and you're like oh my god Things are going

to go bad. However, I did feel a bit perturbed

that Nightwing was killed by falling over and

banging his head. Dick Grayson deserves better.

Don't even get me... If you get me started on

what's going on with Grayson right now, I'm just

going to be... String of curse words and then

Dan DiDio's name. So do you think do you think

Dan DiDio is finally going to get his wish? I

hope not. Do you think he's finally going to

get to kill Nightwing? He needs to be fired and

somebody else with more brains needs to be brought

back in because the whole thing the only reason

why For me Nightwing is Dick Grayson whether

you like him as Robin whether you like him as

Nightwing whatever the only He is, and I know

Marvel have tried to copy this a little bit,

especially with that robotic black and red suit

with Superior now. Nightwing is the Spider -Man

of the DC Universe. As far as he is the everyman

character that most everybody can relate to.

Batman is this legendary figure who, sure, he

doesn't have any powers, but his greatest power

is his brain. Nightwing is his quote -unquote

adopted son and has learned everything from him,

but has a more free -flowing kind of attitude

Versus where Bruce is like It's not my problem.

You don't have the hug for the mission, you know,

it's like seriously really so I don't know I

hope to God Dan DiDio doesn't get his way because

a lot of stuff that I read from DC except Batgirl

and He -Man will probably get cut. I will drop

DC in a heartbeat if they kill Nightwing. I mean,

they've already revealed his identity, so there's

nothing we can do about that, but... Yeah. You

know, I know it's a conceit of comic books. It's

not real, but once you reveal Nightwing's secret

identity, The bat family identity is exposed

in less than the fraction it takes to do a Google

search That's the thing like why would you unless

they're gonna pull something and say oh well

This was all a dream or that which it isn't but

you know what I mean? It's like unless forever

evil never happened or unless they find some

way to erase This this villains. I'm sorry the

villains month was the worst some of the worst

comics I've ever read. And I've only been reading

full time since like late 2012. Like, I just,

there was maybe two issues out of all 52 that

I really, really loved. And I just, I get they

want to shake things up, but why not do it with

a much more useless character? Like how many

bat family characters are there? There's Batman,

Batgirl, Nightwing. Damien Wayne, which thankfully

they already killed that arrogant little Rachel

ghoul grandson off Jason Jason, I don't I don't

mind Jason so much but oh The other one one that

I've never read have no interest in reading batwing

Who the fuck is bat wings a damn plane dammit.

It's not a person, you know But it's like seriously

you have to sit there and screw with his, you

know, first adopted son to really get reader.

I'm telling you, if they kill him, they're going

to lose a lot of readership. They really are.

You know what? I. I don't think they will kill

him. I really, really don't think they will,

because. If. If you kill off Nightwing, you're

killing him off on the basis that he's the first

Robin. That's it. Now, let's be honest. You like

Nightwing. I like Nightwing. We both love Dick

Grayson. Um... Thankfully you added the last

name. Yeah. But... He's not exactly, like...

He is... If you say, well who is Nywing? You

say, the best way you can describe it to a lay

person is, he was the Robin from the 1966 Batman

show. That's what people know him as. They know

him as G. Willick as Batman. Like, you know,

holy... Holy rusted metal Batman. I mean granted.

Okay, that was um, that was probably forever

But you know, that's the point like is he's just

that kid So he has no real cultural relevance

anymore other than the fact that he was the first

Robin and guess what? They killed off Robin in

the 80s. So you're just Replaying the same old

trick. Um, so I don't think they're gonna kill

him off. I don't think they will because yeah

nightwing like Nightwing's a great thing and

all you would do by killing off Nightwing is

psychologically damage Batman which has been

done before and it was done for 20 odd years

up until the point where they brought Jason Todd

back and then he kind of got over it a little

bit. They've already psychologically damaged

him again because they've killed his own son

regardless of how I feel about Damian Wayne.

Damian Wayne was his own son so he's already

You know feverly psychologically damaged as it

is and the thing is Kyle Higgins He loves that

character just like you and I do and he's the

guy writing the character and He's the guy that

said okay like you said, you know when you think

of Dick Grayson, what do you think of? Oh, he

was the first Robin and You know now he's you

know night wing whatever but it's it's like I

love Kyle's writing of this character, like taking

him out of Gotham and putting him in Chicago,

even though Chicago is Kyle's hometown, putting

him somewhere else, anywhere else but Gotham

City or Metropolis, because let's face it, Nightwing

and Superman, no. That's not a team up that would

really, really work. You know, putting him in

Chicago, giving him his own story, kind of having

that old timey superhero feel. I love that about

the book now. It's it's great. It's it's taking

him. It's it's saying, yes, he is the adopted

son of Bruce Wayne. Yes, there is all this history

there, but it doesn't necessarily matter because

we're trying to make him his own man, not just

be in Batman's shadow or be under the cowl. But

yeah, I don't know they they better not kill

no no I don't think they will but it but it is

more the question of where do you go now that

the secret identities out Yeah, that that's see

that's the other issue. It's like okay if they

kill him What's gonna happen if they've already

revealed the secret identity, but I'm I'm still

holding out and wondering how Kyle's gonna tie

it up in the ongoing because it hasn't been mentioned

yet. Because we had issue 24, which is the end

of the the Tony's Tony Zuko storyline. What do

you think of that? the fact that Tony was still

alive. Um, yeah. Again, it was one of those things

where, like, you play on the conventions of the

Batman, you know, story and stuff like that,

but it was handled really well. And, you know,

Nightwing, again, isn't a character like that

particularly has a rogues gallery. yeah, and

if there's one person that you think of like

Well, if there's one person that a comic book

fan who knows Nightwing thinks of when they think

of bad guys It's Tony Zuko because he was the

guy that created Robin in the first place. Yeah

So yeah, I mean that was all good, but but I

think you know it ties in you know I mean we've

dealt with the Haley circus now. I I was not

a fan of the Court of Owls in this in this idea

that Nightwing was being bred from birth in Haley

Circus to become a member of the Court of Owls.

I despised it. I genuinely did. I was like, no,

just no, no, no. I can't really explain why.

I just just didn't like the idea. I like the

timeline of it all, though. I like the fact that

if Bruce hadn't saved him. That's what he would

have be like it's kind of like one of those things

of what could have been I like that aspect of

it, but yeah, I mean it's it's a little silly

Yeah, I just uh it you know inherently Batman

adopts a ten -year -old kid And takes him out

at night to fight crime It's so stupid. It doesn't

need, like, all these additional levels of, like,

well, he was actually being trained by a secret

cabal of evil owl creature monster ninja people

who have ruled Gotham for 150 years that Batman

is completely oblivious to because they're rich.

Uh, maybe? It's like, I'm pretty sure Batman

would have figured this out by now. Um, but,

but... I think my biggest problem with it is

that, and this happened in Court of Owls, this

happened in Death of the Family, and this is

happening in Zero Year to some extent as well,

is that whatever Snyder is doing on Batman, when

he says jump, every other person in a Batman

book has to jump. and it has to be a Court of

Owls tie -in, or a Death of the Family tie -in,

or a goddamn Zero Year tie -in. Look, Snyder,

I'm not a big fan of your Batman run. Stop dragging

everybody else's stuff in with yours just to

make it feel like an event. Basically, all Batman

has been since the New 52 is event after event

after event after event. Just tell a story. Really

tell a story and stop stop grandiosing It's the

return of the Joker. He hasn't been in a comic

for a year. Oh, yeah Given Batman's rugs gallery

the Joker doesn't have to come back for five

years and you could then you could say it this

there's something in it yeah, but What I was

saying earlier about the? The ongoing is the

ongoing hasn't caught up to forever. So, so we,

we, we had the end of Zuko story. We then had

the zero year issue, which I really enjoyed it.

I thought it was interesting. The fact that they

tie, they didn't really tie in, but it basically

mirrors kind of Bruce's experience of being at

the movies or at the theater or whatever else,

you know, as a kid. And what I loved about, and

this is what I've been craving from comics for

a long time, well, at least two years since I

started reading them, but everyone always says,

oh, Bruce Wayne, his parents were murdered, Thomas

and Martha Wayne. I don't know anything. I know

some stuff now, but I didn't know other than

that fact. I knew nothing of Thomas and Martha.

Same thing with, uh, with, with DeGrasse and

I knew nothing of John and Mary. And in that

zero year issue, Kyle, it's set up before they

die and they're in it. And I got to see them

alive and actually interacting with. with Richard

Grayson and and all this and all that and everything

else and I thought it was really cool it's like

finally some actual backstory that isn't you

know Martha Wayne becoming a clown um you know

uh as far as where Nightwing is going to go for

Unless they're going to do something stupid,

like kill him off and bring in Harper Rowe as

the new Nightwing, if that happens, I will drop

the book. As much as I love Kyle's writing, if

they bring in a female Nightwing, it's not that

I have an objection to a female Nightwing, I

have an objection to Nightwing being anyone else

but Dick Grayson. That's what my objections do.

So if they do that, I... I don't know. I just...

One way that I could see them going with this,

which I think would be kind of unique, but this

is entirely speculation on my part, is that Dick

Grayson is going to die, but only the identity

of Dick Grayson. Like, Dick Grayson as a human

being ceases to be. Because, hell, Batman can

do that sort of thing. You know, it's well established.

I mean, this is... pre -52 and not new 52 that

that the bat family don't exist in any database

like their fingerprints aren't on a national

register their blood is not you know nobody has

access to their DNA Batman basically goes out

of his way to make sure that none of them are

traceable and if he wants to make Dick Grayson

disappear then Dick Grayson dies, but Dick Grayson

then takes on a new identity, but continues on

in a way, shape or form. And in 12 months time,

it all gets resolved and it becomes Dick Grayson

again and it's a grand, you know, and that would

be cool. Because you don't need Batman having

the pathos of like losing, yeah, like another

soldier. Especially like a one that is so important.

And not only that as well, but... Like, he's

the original Robin, and I'm one of these people,

like I'm one of these people who, when they do

the new Superman -Batman movie, if they're going

for an older Batman, frickin' just give me your

ten -year -old Robin. Just put him in the movie,

just don't explain it, just say, this kid is

Robin, and like, go with it. Matt Damon's too

tall. Possibly, but, you know, like, just, I

just, I've never understood, like, because, well,

I understand it. It's ridiculous. The idea that

you would put this ten -year -old in a costume

and he would be just as good as Batman, who was

spent ten years developing to this point. But

he's a naturally gifted trampolinist. And how

does he dodge bullets exactly? But just go for

it, you know. But don't kill him, because he's

too important to the Batman mythology. But we

will see we will see how things go Yeah, we're

gonna have to wait and see and wait for the ongoing

to catch up to the forever evil event and I just

I Don't know. I'm really really on edge about

it. Yeah It's just it's not because why would

you allow Kyle to set him up in Chicago? Give

him this whole new story. Give him this whole

new cast of characters uh you know sure nightwing

himself doesn't have the biggest rogues gallery

but what kyle is doing is he's pinching off other

bat villains that have nothing to do with it

you've got to assume you've got to assume however

when you when you're saying uh you know uh why

why would They allow them to do this and why

would you allow them to do that? You have to

assume that DC editorial know what they're doing.

Which seemingly for the last 12 months has been

a bit of a dicey one altogether. Given the amount

of writers that have quit, left, sacked, fired,

rehired. You know, all on the whim of just editorial.

So, I don't know. They seem to have their stuff

together at the minute. And they seem to be relatively

going somewhere. I think Forever Evil's doing

a pretty amazing job at the moment of telling

a story that's already been told once before,

but they're telling it in a sort of unique new

52 way. And hell, any book that has Black Adam,

Lex Luthor, and Captain Cold, and Bizarro all

teaming up to save the day is a book that I kind

of want to read. when you said earlier about

the bat family isn't in any DNA database or anything

else first thing I thought of was in Justice

League Unlimited is and Manda Waller's like project

Batman Beyond began it wasn't hard to find Bruce's

DNA he left it all over town he left it all over

town not remotely what I meant I love that episode

Uh, oh god, epilogue is so good. And that's -

and that's what I think you'll really enjoy.

You'll have to start, not necessarily - you can

start from Kyle's run, but you could, if you

start from the beginning when Adam Beecham was

on the thing, uh - No, did Adam Beecham's - I

think I've read the first trade of that. Was

that the one where he brought Nightwing back?

No, that's Kyle. Was that Kyle? Yeah, he brought

dick old Dick Grayson. Yeah Yeah, I didn't know

Adams Adams run is where it's the 10 ,000 clowns

event Where it's Joker King I don't know because

well because before they went digital with these

comics they did They did like these they did

sort of miniseries of them three new 52 and they

were all right so I don't know but yeah I mean

I love Kyle's work so I'll probably get into

the Batman Beyond stuff but yeah it was it's

a pretty awesome run I mean you don't necessarily

have to read I just enjoy the first you know

the first part of Batman Beyond that happened

in 2012 which Batman Beyond 2 .0 or Batman Beyond

Universe, depending on if you're digital or print,

it picks up one year after the events of what

happened in that first part of the run. So you

don't necessarily have to pick up the first part.

I just think you should because it's interesting

with some of the stories that they have going

with it. Alright, so what is coming up on the

underbase, sir? Well, as it stands, on the underbase,

not a great deal because pretty much everything's

winding down. With the underbase, it's always

a Transformers podcast, and obviously we are

in the midst as we've been talking about... Dark

Cybertron. So we're re -reading that, or we're

reviewing that rather, and that's going to go

on for the next three months. And then we'll

just see how it goes, to be honest. Beast Hunters

is winding down, Regeneration 1 is winding down.

So yeah, it's going to be pretty interesting.

And myself and Chris McFeely are continuing At

some point in the near future our trip through

Dreamwave, we're having a look through that and

sometime in 2014 we'll be revisiting some more

of the classic Marvel comics. So hey, there's

still plenty of stuff to do with the underbase.

What about Moonbase 2? What do you guys got going

on over there on the planet that Holy shit didn't

blow up. Well, you know, in terms of the Moonbase

2 itself, Andy, Cobra Commander, and G -Wolf

V3 Mikey are pretty much just delivering as best

they can all of the news going on in the world

of Transformers. So yeah, with our typical British

flair and wit, we're definitely not reporting

on where Transformers 4 is shooting. You know,

because like you say, that ain't news. Yeah,

it really isn't. I just don't. Whatever. But

if you found out that they were shooting just

outside your house, would you not go find, would

you not find it newsworthy? Unless it was five

feet from my house, probably not. If it's not

within viewing distance of my window, I'm not

interested. Yes, and I have a very large picture

window in my living room, so... It's kind of

like that, I don't know if you're a fan of him,

but that Jeff Dunham comic, where he's like...

One of his dummies, Bubba J, says, yeah, I was

watching TV and all kinds of stuff was blowing

up and everything else and all these Christmas

decorations were around and then I realized,

oh wait, I was looking out my front living room

window. Jeff Dunham's got a comic book? No, no,

no. He is a comic. Oh, sorry, right, okay, sorry,

yeah. Slight miscommunication there, right. Okay,

that - Yeah, no. That would be kind of awesome

if there was a Jeff Dunham comic book. That would

be really awesome. All right, well, there you

go. Before I close this out, where can, if people

want to interact with you online, where can they

do so? I'm - Like, I'll be perfectly honest,

I'm a terrible person. I'm very lazy when it

comes to online and stuff like that. So, like,

the best way is through the underbase. You can

always send us questions and things like that.

Full Metal Hero, you can find all of the shows

there and things. I've got a Twitter account,

Kal -El Prime on Twitter, but if you send me

a message and I don't reply, it's because I barely

ever check Twitter, so don't worry about it.

But yeah, I'm sorry. really that many places.

I've got a YouTube channel and I kind of try

to update that. when I can be bothered. You see,

there's a pattern starting here. It's pretty

much when I can be bothered. So, yeah. For a

second there, I was going to say, wait, are all

Brits this lazy? No, no. Some of us genuinely

do enjoy work and things like that. I just enjoy

coming onto podcasts, talking randomly for two

hours. Hey, that works. I think we kind of kept

it mostly to comics, so that's good. I mean,

like, I could have pretty much got off on a two

-hour tangent about just talking about, you know,

the DC animated stuff with you guys, but, you

know, that's just the way it goes. I'll drag

myself over at some other point to just randomly

gossip about something else. Very cool. Very

cool. All right, that's gonna do it for yet another

origins episode here in the pull bag We will

catch you next time make your great escape into

comics Lex Luthor. The rat. Where's Lois? She

was here just a second ago. Probably scared witless,

poor thing. Don't worry. I'll have you out of

that thing in no time. Okay, let's see now. Do

I disconnect the black wire or the white one?

Don't worry. Lois, I thin you got some splaining

to do. Tuckie, if we're gonna be partners and

we're gonna be married, I don't want to be part

of the act. Lois, there are thins I do. You can

do. Me superman. Me superwife. Us super in trouble.

Could you hold this argument till later and get

us out of here? I knew this was gonna happen.

First you know who I am, then you want to fire

me. Next you're gonna fire yourself in the head.

Through the series, there is a scene in it, a

specific issue, which is amazing. Like, it's

one of those ones where you read it and your

heart literally just... It's literally the death

of Jonathan Kent, which has been done a million

times before, but the way it's done is just the

best thing in the world. And it was the one,

it was like one of two issues that they just

cut completely. completely out of that movie.

And I was like, you've just totally ripped the

heart and soul out of the book to make way for

evil fighting Lex Luthor business thing, whatever.

Superman is the greatest superhero ever made.

Superman is by far the worst superhero to read.

I totally believe that it's just don't like for

me Superman is and you know people can make fun

of me for this if they want to but Superman for

me is Tim Daly or George George Newburn depending

on if you're watching Superman the animated series

or or Justice League or Christopher Reeve in

the films, or Dean Cain on television, I don't

care what anyone says, Lois and Clark was something

very, very interesting to do with those characters,

versus just, hey, let's kill him. I would argue

it was something very good to do with those characters,

up until about Season 3, Season 4. I liked it!

I was like, finally! No Se - That's the one thing

I really hate, when it comes to Superman and

He -Man specifically, is... Finally, no fucking

secret whatsoever. That's like, oh god, the current

He -Man comics that DC's doing, almost everybody

knows that Adam is He -Man. No, really? Like

his entire, like his father knows, Tila knows,

like everybody knows that's around him that,

you know, and it's like finally... We don't have

to worry about because that was the like the

biggest problem with the filmations here I love

the filmation series, but that's the biggest

problem with it is oh I got it We got to make

sure the writers know about the secret and make

sure they don't you know reveal it and blah blah

blah blah And these people know but these people

don't it's like oh god And that's why I liked

like so close and Clark it's like fine make them

date if you want to have them get married fine

have them get married as long as she knows the

friggin secret cause let's face it terry hatcher

lois lane is no margo kidder lois lane terry

hatcher lois lane figure that shit out in a minute

you know what the the end of uh was it the end

of season two where he does the proposal and

she just says like who's asking clark and she

takes his glasses off for a superman that that

was brilliant yeah because that's the thing is

like While and I think you find this quite a

bit in the early First season of Lois and Clark

Lois is played for laughs an awful lot at the

expense of trying to find out yeah Superman But

it's it's when she it when she gets to like be

sort of with him That's when it was really really

good when it was just those two and even like

I think like even the the first season when it

when Superman's not really a big part of it It's

just her and Clark the example. I always give

is you know the episode where they first introduced

kryptonite And it's just them two in Metropolis.

It's a brilliant episode Because they they just

get rid of the whole Superman thing and whenever

Superman's not around She's brilliant. In fact,

she's probably my favorite Lois Lane. In terms

of just general casting, I think Lois and Clark

has the best supporting cast of any Superman

ever. You cannot beat Lane Smith as Perry White.

The best Perry White ever. You just can't. And

the funny thing is I think the first is it before

after that that premiere it no It was in the

same it was in the same year. I think When did

Mighty Ducks come out was 93? Yeah, it was the

same year It was so hard for me watching Mighty

Ducks and then going to see Lois and and then

seeing Lois and Clark as he plays the villain

He plays the evil coach in the mighty original

Mighty Ducks movie with it with Estevez and I

like a second That's no Perry White The supporting

cast was so well done. Of course they had that

hiccup with Jimmy. Yeah, you look too much like

Dean Cain, get out. He looks nothing like him!

He looks nothing like him. He might look like

a younger Superboy type character, but yeah,

no, he looks nothing like Dean Cain. You just

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