Bat Books Issues #29

This is Kevin Conway, and I am the goddamn Batman.

And now all this gal wants is to settle down

with her lovin' sweetheart. You and the Joker?

Ryder Rooney! I've never seen you laugh before!

I don't think I like it! Cut it out! You're giving

me the creeps! You little fool. Welcome to...

The Pull Bag! Join us as we dig out our latest

comics and discuss them with a rotating panel

of the GCRN crew. So sit back and enjoy this

week's Poll Bag. Hello and welcome to the Poll

Bag. This is episode 60, that's right. One year

of the podcast, we're already up to 60 episodes.

Whereas it took GCR five years to get to 60 episodes,

that's alright. Delays, delays, delays. I have

your own studio on mic and joining me is Steve

Megatron. Hello. Hello. And we are going to be

talking about the Bat Books number 29 issues.

This is the second to last time we will be doing

single issue coverage here in the pull bag. Be

listening to the year two changes episode that

will be coming out. here soon, right before Marvelous

March. And you'll get all the details there.

So I think we're just gonna dive right in. And

we're gonna start with the one that I just...

I'm gonna start off with the worst one. Batman?

Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Scott Snyder. I just

don't like the zero -year story. I love Greg

Capil's art. Just don't like the zero -year story

and I find this cover is Really it could have

been so much cooler At least in my own personal

opinion because I like a certain movie that has

a certain question mark over a bat symbol It

would have been so cool if they could have worked

this question mark over the Batman logo Allah

Batman forever Riddler. It would have been so

much cooler But it's a stick I mean There's nothing

like if I saw this because I I have Batman on

my Like I have Batman inside my pullback at my

comic shop, so I Don't really look for it on

the shelf, but if I walked into my comic shop

and saw this I'm like oh Okay, Batman 29. That's

not exactly the most enticing cover at all. It

doesn't really grab me at all I don't know. What

do you think of the cover? I think it's pretty

bland I mean, I'm not trying to say anything

against Scott Snyder or Greg Capil. But I don't

know. I just I don't like all the black around

it. I kind of get why they did it that way. But

and then the filling in of the Batman emblem

at the top. But I would have thought that maybe

surround it and then have the interior be blank.

Or green. Yep. I don't know. They're just me.

I don't know. I think the symbolism here, and

I could be wrong, I think the symbolism of having

a black cover with the green. Well, the black

cover really is part of the Zero Year Bat, because

they do this whole embossed thing with the Zero

Year Bat logo at the top. I think the whole point

of it, this is the final chapter in Dark City.

So there is that let's get into the issue and

we we open the book and we see Basically what

I assume is someone's gonna shoot the Waynes

But it's the it's actually the the poster that

they are standing behind they're sitting in a

bench and the posters behind them Gotham don't

be afraid to join us the GCPD As I said before,

Scott Snyder, Greg Capilouto is on the art along

with Danny Mickey. I don't know. So the story

basically opens up with a flashback with Thomas,

Martha, and Bruce. And they're basically talking

about the movie and they're talking about...

Basically Thomas is trying to instill in Bruce

of you know I mean a guy using what he has to

fight for people who can't always fight for themselves,

so You know he's in he's trying to instill a

lesson into his son from the events of the film

You're still there yes, okay sure crap and then

so we get out of the flashback which I it was

either a flashback or a dream sequence because

Batman busts out of some graveyard and he looks

the suit looks weird maybe it's the effect of

busting out of all this this bones and dirt and

everything else but it just I don't know what

do you think of the suit on this page I don't

know it looks a little strange but it's also

supposed to be the raw suit no no yeah I understand

it's supposed to be the raw suit but the raw

suit has looked better than this in past issues

I can't tell I don't like the raw suit I don't

like it until it's evolved and he has the gauntlets

instead of the purple gloves yeah true I don't

I don't condone choker gloves for Batman. I mean,

I thought it was a nice little nod at first,

but after a while, it's like, like I said a couple

issues ago, it makes no sense. If he's trying

to sneak around, you're going to see somebody

with purple gloves. After all, the glove don't

fit. Yes, exactly. So we go to Commissioner Gordon

and Commissioner Loeb. They're flying around

in a blimp during a storm. Why would you fly

around in a blimp of all things during a storm?

They thought it had helium. It's a helium storm.

Helium can still explode, you know. I know. um

now is no he is oh wow a bat blimp really a bat

blimp I'm sorry I don't care what kind of preparations

I Don't pull your Joker laugh on me, Dan. I don't

care what kind of... I don't care what kind of

preparations you make on any vehicle. I don't

care that you are Batman. A Bat blimp is not...

Any police blimp are not gonna survive in a storm

with red lightning. It's the goddamn Batman and

they got us censored. Yeah. Yeah, and that's

the other thing. They censor it there, but they

don't censor it later Like seriously this isn't

an issue that is put in the kids shelf you know

that right people Yeah, they actually have kids

specific comics now Yeah So the Commissioner

is trying to warn some another officer, but the

officer isn't listening to him Commissioner Gordon

is trying to work with Batman to They're basically

trying to stop Riddler from turning the power

back on And Batman has to make an impossible

jump which is basically a cool Red homage to

Dark Knight returns. Did you see that? The what

with the Dark Knight returns? The the where Batman

has to jump like 50 feet and The red lightning

is behind him and he's got the gun out the guns

out to do the grapples. Yeah That's a cool little

homage to the Dark Knight returns with the lightning

only it's red now with his shadow Mm -hmm. So

I kind of dug that for the art I'm sorry, ladies

and gentlemen zero years. There's nothing enticing

about it He tries to stop the... Oh god, what's

the character name? I don't know what the hell

that thing is called. Oh god, it's Hellfern,

that's what it is. It's someone named Hellfern.

So this whole book basically reminds me of Batman

Begins because it's Gordon and Batman working

together for the first time. The only thing that

was missing was Gordon driving around the Batmobile

trying to shoot stuff. At least in this comic.

Again, I like the art, but the story just...

It's too much back and forth and I wish they

hadn't introduced this super giant monster serum

type thing. I would have preferred if the villain

in this outside of Riddler would have been Manbat,

because these things are just weird to me. Whatever

Hellfurn was doing, it was just super, super

strange. And we don't even really get closure.

in the story I mean because I know Savage City

is starting next month in issue 30 um but like

there's just because there because I don't think

there's a oh no there is a next um uh at the

end of the book it basically flashes back to

young Bruce screaming help and they do mention

the story does mention here of him falling down

into the cave but it mentions that when his parents

are still alive like it happened before they

died so how the hell does that work even though

this is the new 52 origin of Batman and next

is Savage City what did you what do you like

about the story if anything Don't really even

know man this I hate this villain for one. Yeah

and then to it's just I Don't know like I was

fine when it was just the Riddler, but then you

add this to it Well, this has been going on and

this has been a dual thing. I know I mean, that's

what I'm saying if you have both Yeah, and then

the Riddler does end up, you know decimating

part of the town and Activating it riddles and

So basically what you're saying is zero year

is like spider -man 3 too many villains Well,

I mean it's not even that it's just I mean I

understand zero years intentions Mm -hmm But

Honestly, it's I just I don't know I think I

think the whole zero year I wish they would just

keep going in the continuity rather than keep

going back. That's why I'm going to enjoy Batman

internal so much more than this. That's why I

enjoyed Detective Comics more than I enjoy this.

So, speaking of which, Detective Comics number

29, Gothtopia, the final chapter for Gothtopia.

Now I do believe this is John layman's last issue

Because I think it next month with issue 30 a

new creative team takes over Yeah, I believe

I read that as well The cover for this The main

cover is Batman Looking at all the all his his

friends that all have scarecrow masks on what

do you think of the cover? Definitely creepy

Yeah, very creepy Yeah Very very creepy so this

third act of the story is basically Scarecrow

and the bat family versus Batman Yeah, I Think

it's funny how they give like the weird Batman

or like the scarecrow twist everything and then

Batman kind of looks all ruffled and You know

you have all the different villains standing

there, but Yeah, they They they basically show

that Batman kind of didn't really have a choice

than to go with scarecrow Yeah pretty much um

it creeps me out to see the bat family women

in the scarecrow masks it just it looks weird

it looks like they have um they don't even look

like scarecrow masks to me even though i know

they are it looks like some weird version of

a bondage mask i've seen entirely too many uh

world's worst tenants where they've barged into

apartments where there have been bondage shops

and apartments so the fight the fight basically

begins here actually the fight began four hours

earlier so They kind of do a flashback I like

this. I like the art. I don't know if I'm gonna

keep up with detective I know I'm not gonna keep

up with it in single issue I'll wait for the

trades after issue after this issue probably

an issue 30 But it is I did really like this

story. I thought this story was very well done

I think it's funny that Batman's actually just

pretending to be under Yeah uh the entire time

uh but he has to do things just to prove that

he's under and he's like they they are right

not to trust me he's i'm not under scarecrow's

control crane's ego has always been his blind

spot he desperately wants me under his control

but i have an antidote i've taken the antidote

yeah Oh my God. Scarecrow, and I don't think

it was intentional on Layman's part. Scarecrow

pulled a unicorn, dude. You belong to me now.

Yeah. I can just hear in my head, in some sick

twisted voice, Kevin Conroy saying, I belong

to nobody. Um, again, love the art. I really

did enjoy this storyline. I thought that the

goth -topia storyline was interesting. Um, I

thought what Scarecrow was doing was great. Uh,

and just the way that he reused the toxin was

very, very interesting. Cause we, there's only

so much you can see with Scarecrow. Fear Talks

and Fear Talks and Fear. There's only so much

you can see with that. I absolutely love Scarecrow's

little speech about fear, how fear will consume

you, it will destroy you. Absolutely love that.

And again, the art, oh my god, the art in this

issue is so amazing. What are your oh did you

like the Batmobile? In in this issue, yeah It's

after it's after everything and crane is Is back

in what I assume is Arkham. Yeah, I'm assuming

so It's at that bottom panel. We'll figure out

exactly where he is. He'll come back to reality

Yeah, yeah, it is Arkham because it says Arkham

Asylum Rehabilitation Center as he's driving

away. That Batmobile looks like a cross between

so many different things, a cross between BTAS,

a cross between the 86, the 89, absolutely amazing.

And his Batplane is like that from Arkham Origins.

Yeah, that is so awesome. I think what I love

best about this is the epilogue story with Catwoman.

I thought that was really, really well done.

And then what I can only assume is Clayface is

the final page. I'm all where Batman says I'm

always ready. Next, the new creative team and

a new adventure. I really enjoyed Detective.

I enjoyed the Goth -Topia storyline. I thought

it was very well done. Well, it was original.

not overdone yeah like zero year so yeah I was

very pleased to see how it went yeah I was absolutely

enjoying it all the way through there was nothing

about the goth topia storyline that I did not

like I'm interested. I'm gonna check out the

new creative team like it with issue 30, but

like I said After that, I'm probably just gonna

do it in trades Did you have a chance to peruse

back girl or I assume you're gonna do it as I

do it now Because I haven't Did you get a chance

to read 28 at all no last issue no, okay, basically

this The way Gail Simone is doing Batgirl is

sometimes it's a two -issue or three -issue arc.

It's not these overall, you know, year -long

arcs, etc, etc, etc. And issue 28 set up this

new villain called Silver. And he has a tie to

iVampire. And the cover for Batgirl 29 is Batgirl

allied with Strix against the menace Silver and

It's basically Batgirl and Strix against Silver

with some sort of wolf in the background. I really

dig the cover I think the cover looks really

really cool And we basically pick up where Where

we left off in issue 28 where The police are

trying to arrest Silver and his trusted companion,

Miss Targa. And what they don't realize is that

he is seeing Strix and Batgirl as vampire bats.

And I gotta say, Fernando Passeron, who does

the pencils, and Jonathan Glapion, who does the

inks on this, and Blonde does the colors, they

have an amazing design on this it's not really

a full splash page but it's a full full page

with the conspiracy of bats really interesting

different designs of portraying Batgirl and Strix

as vampires very very cool and uh So that they're

trying to stop the police and silver from doing

something that they're going to regret And silver

is going to basically cut himself Which is not

a good thing And then so he he cuts himself He

says I bid you a good evening gentlemen tell

your masters. I'm coming for them Because he

believes that the conspiracy of bats is that

there are vampire bats everywhere in Gotham not

just that Batman and his Bat family are the conspiracy

of bats But that all of them are So we then go

to You know miss Targa and and silver With You

know them, you know bad girl basically saying

hey look this isn't over yet and she goes back

to her little van and calls a Nightfall Because

nightfall was helping her find this little girl

Yeah, and and Strix is basically saying if girl

hurt I kill do not try to stop and Batgirl's

like promise me Mary promise me you will not

do that and it's so sneaky of Strix to do what

she does she does write down promise so Batgirl

sees that but as they go out looking for the

girl the the paper floats down and it says promise

to kill so that's not exactly a good thing and

there's actually a twist here because i didn't

even see this coming i thought that that silver

was one of these villains that assumed everyone

everybody was a vampire and this had the other

thing and then not everyone else is believing

him at all And he drinks holy water. He's drank

holy water his whole life and it's to help ward

off the vampires and Batgirl and Strix find his

place and they go in and again passer in and

Glapion and blonde on the inks colors and pencils

Great Batgirl and Strix designs looking like

vampires Do you see that page where they get

into the house? I mean, that looks really cool.

That's a Batgirl costume that any guy would love.

I mean, it basically combines a Dracula -like

costume with sometimes how Batman does his cape

at the bottom around his feet. Absolutely love

that. And Strix just looks out there. Yeah, it's

oh, it's so friggin cool So we get this story

Silver tries to cut on Marion and Batgirl basically

slugs him. Hey jerk. Don't cut on my partner

And she says the girl hot stuff tell us where

sissy chastain is or this is going to be a nightmare

of a night of pain to remember and he lunges

at her and it's a it's a whole back and forth

and We actually see something that That I was

not expecting that the girl actually is a vampire

That was funny Cuz the girl leaps out with claws

You know And everything else and then Andrew

Bennett shows up I vampire And he basically That's

where we get the explanation of Silver saying

that he drinks holy water and You know Batgirl

and Strix leave and She says okay Strix it's

agreed right from now on we don't fight the undead

and Strix writes agreed next the Midnight Man

Now I don't think the Midnight Man is next because

there was an update in the solicitation that

in for issue 30 Marguerite Bennett who wrote

the zero year number 25 is gonna be doing issue

30 So all of the Simone stuff that was supposed

to be issue 30 31 32 is kind of like backed up

to 31 32 33 I don't know why they did it that

way, but they did And then All we have left in

this episode of the Bat Books is... Nightwing.

Kyle Higgins, final issue of Nightwing. The cover

here is Nightwing versus everybody. You've got

the prankster in there, you've got... the shapeshifter

from a couple of from from last issue you've

got did you see your protege in the bottom left

my protege yes which is really really interesting

Russell Dauterman is on art again for this issue

I really love this narrative. I love when Kyle

does narratives like this where it's just dick

monologuing. I absolutely love that. And because

this is Kyle's last issue, he wanted to send

this out with a bang. And basically, the story

is, it's continuing from 28 where they have to

find the girl Jen because Mr. Zazz has kidnapped

her. But the whole time that... they're doing

this the the important thing is Dick Grayson's

inner monologue in this issue it's so well written

I mean Kyle does such a good job he says you

don't want to be hurt anymore you want someone

you want to be someone stronger so you try on

different people until You find the right one

and I even though I'm I prefer Eddie Barrow's

or Will Conrad or Brett Booth's design on Nightwing.

I like Dauterman's design here. I think it's

really cool I don't think the mask is as cool

as when Conrad was doing it, but We go to Mr.

Zazz where he's cutting himself for some unknown

reason. Maybe he has... Well, every time he makes

a kill, he cuts himself. Okay. Well, I was going

to say maybe he has Wolverine powers, but okay.

I don't know a lot about the character. I'll

freely admit that, so... He's not supposed to

have a goatee. He's supposed to be completely

bald, but that's just an iteration of him, though.

Yeah. Yeah, I see all the cuts on his body now.

Yeah, okay So Jen is basically hunting this guy

down and she stole Dicks Eskimo sticks. I think

that's how you say that I could be wrong, but

she stole Nightwing's nightsticks essentially

and She wasn't expecting that Nightwing would

put a tracker on his own nightsticks And we get

more monologue from him and it basically says

it's turned out different than how you imagined

your friends have changed as much as you have

you wonder if that's somehow your fault if you're

the reason things fell apart if you should have

done something different and it's it's so interesting

the imagery that they use between Dick and Barbara

between Don't that's not the who is that guy

is that's oh that's supposed to be Zuko I think

And then we go back to Jen attacking or trying

to attack Zazz and Then we get a really cool

page and again the monologue You start to question

what you've become What you could have been What

some say you should have been and that whole

I don't think I've ever seen him in this It's

just so awesome Dick Grayson as a talent. Well,

this is my my wager since Have you spoiled yet?

What happens to his fate? No. Okay. I guess we

can go ahead and do that. In Forever Evil number

six, Dick Grayson dies. They kill Nightwing.

Jeff Johns and Dan DiDio, more so Dan DiDio than

Jeff Johns, got his way and they killed Nightwing.

I don't want him to become a Talon. Well, this

is my guess. How Jason Todd came back Through

the Lazarus pit, right? I have a feeling That

not only is Damien Wayne at some point gonna

come back that way but I have a feeling that

Dick Grayson is gonna come back through the talon

method and Eventually take back up his mantle

eventually That's my thought on it Does the tail

have this method of bringing people back from

the dead as well? No, I know I just I think the

whole thing that I loathe about the fact that

they've killed him is that Just it's not even

the fact that they killed him in the story it's

the editorial with DC, and the politics with

DC. Kyle had so many cool things that he wanted

to do. He wanted to give Dick amusement mile.

He did, and then the Joker blew it up. You know,

he wanted to do all this stuff. He wanted to

take him to Chicago to, yes, Dick Grayson still

has the origin of. He was the first Robin. He

was Batman's first adopted son. He still has

that, but he can be his own person in Chicago,

and he wanted to explore the Chicago fallout

of heroes, and I really wanted to read that story.

Like, after the Zuko run, I really wanted to

explore more of the relationship between the

city of Chicago and superheroes. I really, really

wanted that. I get it. They're not doing that

now. And I think this ending is okay. Like I

said, I really love this page and I think it

looks really cool with the owl basically spitting

blood onto Dick's head and it's all the owls

around him and him as a talon. I like that, but

I still wanted what I can't have and I know I

should probably just get over it now, but still.

I just don't like the way DC handled the fact

that Nightwing is... No more. Going in a different

direction. Yeah, six feet deep. Quiet, you. So

he does find Mr. Zazz and he does find Jen. And...

They have a really really knockdown dragout fight

again really enjoy the art by by Russell Donovan

I think it's some of the best Nightwing aren't

we had at least for this side Now I will say

the the page after the battle when he's talking

to Jen When they're on the rooftop there at first.

I thought he was in the blue Nightwing costume

But it's, well, if you look at it from afar,

if you look at that far shot, it does kind of

look a little, of course it looks like blue jeans,

but just when I first saw that, I'm like, oh

wow. And he basically gives her his mom's bracelet.

And he says, and you know - I haven't made it

anymore, I'm dead. You jerk. he says and you

know you can totally call me anytime this isn't

goodbye or anything she says okay and so we get

that parting shot and then he texts Sonia to

go out to uh uh to go out hang out whatever and

it it ends on again an amazing shot I want this

as I'm gonna have to find this and put it as

as my desktop because it is so cool his final

monologue here is forgive me folks it's taken

me everything I can hold back to not cry during

this episode it's always been about catching

people when they fall and the title of the story

is safety net and it's him basically revealing

that his his nightwing suit is under the under

the sweatshirt and what it reminds me of actually

is something that Tony Silas who is doing the

Batman Beyond stuff did he did a mock -up of

Terry McGinnis in this kind of style where Terry

has the bat suit under his trademark jacket.

Nightwing number 29 was an emotional rollercoaster

for me. I absolutely loved it. I thought it was

great. The art was really good. The story was

amazing. I didn't know how Kyle was going to

end his run because he's not doing the issue

30, but simply amazing. You talk because I'm

going to have to take a breath here. Being that

I haven't really read a whole lot of Nightwing

the little bit that I have read I I've enjoyed

it Again I'm not too familiar with character.

I'm just kind of sad that they're ending and

killing off this character because he's I Feel

anyway such an important part of the Batman mythos

Like the Damian Wayne, I was glad that they killed

him just because it didn't really matter, ultimately.

But Dick Grayson is such a cemented part in the

Batman mythos that I just I can't fathom him

not being there anymore. Oh, yeah. And I think

I think coming from. fanboy perspective like

Kyle Higgins did that he truly nailed the character

he did just like he's doing on bat beyond he's

doing it again with I mean there did it first

with Nightwing mm -hmm I mean that's just it's

I don't think we're gonna see I mean, obviously,

we're not going to see the character again for

a while, but I just I find it kind of unfortunate

that they've decided that there's no more stories

to tell with the character at the moment. When

it's such a rich character, especially with moving

him to Chicago, that was probably the best decision

they could have made if they were trying to separate

him more from Batman. It gives him more breathing

room. But being that they've done what they've

done. They. put the kibosh on that entirely too

early oh yeah i completely agree um it just you

know it's not even the fact that they killed

him or if they're gonna kill him and then bring

him back or what it's not even that it's the

fact that his series is ending that they couldn't

allow kyle to do what he wanted to do That's

one of the reasons why My bat titles are severely

gonna be cut back my DC titles altogether are

severely gonna be cut back. I'm only giving Because

Kyle is now on the Batman eternal team I will

give bad eternal eight issues the first four

issues I think are John layman on there and then

I think the next four are gonna be Kyle's along

with Snyder and whoever else is writing the stuff

with them. I think James Tinney in the fourth

is on there as well. I don't have the creative

team in front of me as far as who's on it, but

I'm just not really happy with the way DC has

done this. I'm happy with the way Kyle has written

it and the story that he has told, but I just,

I don't like how they, I don't like how Dan DiDio

Basically is getting his way. He's one of the

nightwing dead for the longest time and they

even killed him off in the old universe You know,

I just don't understand why it always has to

be him that dies. I Don't understand why they

have to kill any of them to begin with Yeah,

it's kind of like, you know, they'll never marry

any of them But anyway, that's a whole other

topic for another show entirely character blah

blah blah Yeah, all right, so That's gonna do

it for the bat books this time around Stay tuned

for a special announcement in between this episode

and episode 61 because that's where we tell you

about the changes in year two of the pull bag

Make your greatest game to comics. I am TF2 and

Mike with Steve Megatron Phillips We will catch

you next time. I'm not hearing this You've just

heard the latest episode of the pullback the

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