Trial of the Punisher Review

Now I like a little bit of grit in my cigar.

Welcome to The Pull Bag. Join us as we dig out

our latest comics and discuss them with a rotating

panel of the GCRN crew. So sit back and enjoy

this week's Pull Bag. Hello and welcome to the

pull bag this is episode 49 and this is the end

Frank Castle is going to jail ladies and gentlemen

or supposedly is This is the end of Punisher

month the first character month here in the pull

bag episodes 41 to 49 In the future years however

long pull bag lasts Depending on if you know

certain comic companies end up making me say

screw them because they kill a certain character

That I like no comments from the peanut gallery,

please. Thank you November every year at this

point. I think is looking like Punisher month

if we continue to do Punisher month I do know

that next year. We're already planning stuff

and character months from now on Will most likely

range from four to six episodes instead of almost

ten. I Am of course your host to join Mike and

joining me is the very sleepy Ryan the uneven

flow. Yo Are you alive? Alive. Yes, although

marginally say it anyway Yeah, and you know,

I've been making jokes about about Punisher for

a while now and one of the jokes I make is Those

Punisher body count guys always throwing my face.

Oh Nightwing sucks. Blah blah blah blah blah.

And while yes, you are correct, Ryan. That he

does suck, yeah. Shut up. Punisher does have

all the merchandising. Currently, he does not

have his own ongoing. Nightwing does, for the

time being, until I kill him. Bastards. Friggin'

Dan DeDildo. So, when I first heard of Trial

of the Punisher, I was on, I think I was on ComicList

.com. I was because I go through Marvel's listings

every every month to see when the superior spider

-man stuff is coming out and I saw this I'm like

what the hell is this and This really caught

my eye. I wish I had somehow could get the The

logo off the issue because that's a really cool

logo for trial the Punisher But yeah, this is

to issue mini This is leading up to I guess what

you what you would probably say is the resurgence

of the Punisher in comics because doesn't know

he had I mean he I mean like after The after

ruckus run ended. I'm not saying that Punisher

hasn't know this What this is for anyone who

doesn't know is a miniseries that was written

years ago, actually Really? Yeah, this was done

quite some time ago and just It was shelved and

this happens a lot in comics. There are entire

story arcs or stuff like that that get shelved

for a really long time and then just suddenly

sort of re -released as either, in this case,

it's a standalone sort of two -issue mini -series.

Other cases, it gets shoehorned into whatever

the character's doing at the time. But yeah,

this is actually pretty common. This was written,

like I say, a couple years ago. It's Mark Guggenheim

was the writer and the artist was, yeah, Leneal

Francis Yu. And I'll mention too, the art on

the covers, yes, is fantastic. with Sonny Cho

did the colors for it as well. And it was Lin

-El U who did the cover art. And the art inside

the book, too, by the way, is fantastic. But

yeah, this was done some time ago, and basically

everybody kind of forgot about it or figured

it wasn't going to start seeing the light of

day. I didn't know that. Yeah, it's not commonly

known, but yeah, it's... Because everything in

it well, I know I don't think it's this issue.

It's it's the second issue No, it is this issue

Where Guggenheim has a I guess you could say

a letter to the readers at the end of the book

and it's dated August 2013 So I'm sure as you

say this is probably thought of or created a

few years ago written a few years ago and then

he just went back and wrote the letter, or maybe

he wrote it then and just dated it now. No, I

mean, that's exactly what happened. Yeah, he

wrote this some time ago and did a letter of

reasonably recently. I love the cover. I really

do. I think that's great. It's fairly simple.

It's what we know Frank of. Frank has guns and

weapons and all that good stuff, and it's basically...

Him being the scales of justice like I said that

the emblem on here reminds me of all the judicial

seals and all that stuff you see every you know,

you watch a Hate to say this but you watch an

episode of law and order and you see all kinds

of you know Courtroom seals and judge seals and

all that and that's what it reminds me of I absolutely

love the cover of this Yeah, it's really well

done. It's it's very well done The story, you

know, we kind of commented, I think it was in,

I think it was last episode. Yep. 48 or we might

have said it off air. I don't remember. The story

pretty much reads like, like a law and order

episode where part one is the setup and part

two is the payoff. Yeah. I mean, part one, uh,

the punisher goes to a police station and drops

off the tortured corpse of an assistant district

attorney. And for some odd reason that gets some

attention and he is arrested the rest of that

first issue contains conversations with him and

either Police officers interrogating him or his

lawyer and that's Sort of it. There's not a lot

that happens in that first issue and you know

again, we've kind of talked about it in the Previous

issue and we're talking about Rukka that I thought

I don't think any of us actually were a big fan

of the first issue It was just kind of mediocre.

There wasn't a whole lot to it Everything kind

of clicked into place a lot better with that

second issue, but I remember when I read the

first one I thought this has the potential to

kind of be a mess Depending on where they went

with the second issue The whole time I was reading

this because I read this about a week ago before

we recorded this episode and And then I relook

I looked through it right before we recorded

just to kind of get a better grip on the art

for both issues and What I love about the art

in issue one is how Frank's POV on the police

station is you know your your your normal police

station you know he walks up to the desk sergeant

you see the desk sergeant and then when the desk

sergeant is looking at him it's just him in a

white background it's like i love that that that

style of and then you know you get to one of

the other pages or you get to the actual the

title page it's just um it's just him with the

bag in the white background and you have the

title and all the all the credits and the paint

the page next to it has the police police basically

you know taking him down and it's just a white

bag i think it's amazing how they did that instead

of having a rich, full color, full environment

of a police station lobby. You just have it whited

out and have all the characters defined. I really

like that style. I think that's a great way to

have a Frank Castle takedown. Well, they're able

to use that style because of the setting a lot

later on, too. And yeah, the characters are really,

really well detailed. And a lot of the later

stuff is, you know, it's Frank in a room talking

to somebody. So it's a mostly white or blank

background because of... that there's always

reasons for it so I mean I'm not saying that

that's a bad thing or bad choice actually good

choice and yeah the characters are all really

detailed the faces are really well done it's

some of the best art in a Punisher book which

is funny because I mean we're coming off of the

Roko run which again had some of the best arts

in Punisher books Know it looks good. I was really

impressed with that of the first issue That was

easily what it was the most sort of impressed

with was that Was the artwork Let's see for me

the whole time I was reading this story I'm like

this could be the next not saying it would be

it probably won't be but this could be the next

Tom Jane Punisher Well time I was reading Frank's

monologue I heard Tom Jane's voice in my head

Because this feels like something is that the

whole setup and and and then when we get to the

payoff an issue too as far as How his plan went

through it just reminds me of something that

that version of the Punisher would would plan

out and plot kind of like the whole take down

of the Saints Well his yeah, and I mean the first

issue Again like to nobody's surprise It would

be revealed that the district attorney who act

was dirty Like I say, that's not really surprised.

It's also not a surprise that it was sort of

like all his plan because Well again, that's

fairly obvious. You don't wander into a police

station and get yourself arrested just because

so Yeah, there were questions that the first

issue brought up and it just It didn't answer

them or necessarily point towards them either.

So I guess maybe that's another reason why I

wasn't a huge fan of it. But it works really

well with the second issue. It's just I read

this as a weekly series. I read issue one when

it came out and then picked up issue two when

it came out. Yeah, this is one that would be

opposite. I picked up issue one when it came

out. I shelved it Yeah, wait until issue two.

Well, I think it would probably work a lot better

as a read better together and That's one of the

things is that I don't know that this is gonna

get released as a trade because it's only two

issues They'll have to pair it up with something

if they ever do it may just not get released

as a trade I mean that happens every once in

a while but who knows hopefully they'll pair

it up with something and I really do like Guggenheim's

letter at the end you know basically him thinking

of you know what would it be like if Frank was

ever put on trial for his crimes and and that's

that is really really cool now issue two It's

a good thing he's in cuffs. Yeah, I like the

cover art again. It's solid I kind of prefer

the minimalist stuff of the first cover This

one's a lot more cluttered, but it still looks

good and it's kind of nice to have a contrast

Between that first one and this one Yeah, because

you know as we said this is pretty much a setup

for You know the first that you know, it's like

and followers kind of thing, chapter one, chapter

two. And I like this. I think it's cool. I'm

really surprised. I don't, we'll look through

it when we get to the art, but I don't remember

him being in the skull shirt when he's actually,

I think he, isn't he in an orange jumpsuit? Yeah,

pretty much the entire time. The only time he's

in the shirt is in flashbacks. Yeah. And as far

as the second issue, I love how this begins.

Basically with Frank Castle dossier, that is

awesome. And then of course it goes to the title

of the book and then the credits. But I thought

that was really cool how they did that. Yeah,

and I mean the first thing they do, they go straight

back to the courtroom. And I liked... the art

here a lot better and I thought it flowed better

with the, I should have mentioned this, in issue

one there were some really neat scenes of drug

dealers or mafia people or basically bad guys

or police officers, et cetera, et cetera, telling

tales of things the Punisher has done while he's

on trial to sort of point to whether or not he's

mentally capable of standing trial. They continue

in an issue too, and for whatever reason, the

artwork here is a whole lot more striking. They

tell stories about him first hunting for somebody.

Then, fairly unsurprisingly, the next person

we get on the stand is Matt Murdock, who's better

known as Daredevil, talking about a meeting he

had with the Punisher, although he tells it sort

of from Matt Murdock's point of view. There's

anybody alive who doesn't know who he is at this

point in the Marvel universe, but anyway Again

artwork really good through this and I really

liked these flashback sequences But again, I

wonder why they work so much better in the second

issue than the first Because in the second issue

you're having events explained to us You're having

like especially when we get later you know when

frank is is revealing the the plot and and what's

going on it works better here than it did in

the first issue because in the first issue like

why did you do that when you do that you know

it's like what is going on you need the second

issue to kind of fill in the blank there's that

but i mean just the individual sort of flashbacks

work a little little better and i mean looking

at it to think part of it is as well as uh...

The flashbacks, there's a little more exposition

to them than there was in the first issue, which

usually I'm not a huge fan of, but you kind of

need it for them to make sense. Also, the flashbacks

in this issue tie in to the overall plots a lot

more than the first one did. There's also that.

Yes in the first issue Frank monologued a lot

because Frank Frank to me is you know I know

I think it was you might have been Jake or Dane

I don't remember somebody said he talks too much

and he very rarely talks to me Frank is one of

those people that when you read him He is a monologue

read. It's the internal monologue He has usually

because he's alone if he's talking it means that

he's talking to himself a lot of the time Right

and I like that because he is that loner because

he doesn't interact with a lot of people Yeah,

he generally works alone at least now. I mean

he used to always have like micro and the van

and stuff I'm not a huge fan of but Yeah, and

the most recent years he is pretty much always

alone And he's crazy, but he's not to talk to

myself all the time crazy so Yeah And again the

story he basically, you know For those who haven't

read it. Well, there's 17 minutes in or so of

this podcast Why are you still listening because

we're gonna spoil the hell out of this right

now He's doing this because as you said the DA

is dirty the ADA that he killed was dirty Yeah,

not surprising whatsoever might I add? Yeah,

no, no But what is surprising is before he kills

him what the 88 gives him on a criminal? He's

after yeah a criminal that is looking for was

described earlier in one of the early flashbacks

in issue two Yeah Yeah, and he basically gets

arrested and goes to court because that's the

only way he can Get to this guy. Yeah, who's

doing like service in the court? and a juror

in another case that happens to be going on at

this time I Love the escape It's like you want

to remember something it's best to write it down

because the whole Frank Castle Einstein relativity

piece of paper at the end of the issue comes

into play here. Yeah, that was at the end of

issue one and we didn't know why he was writing

it or anything. It just seemed almost like a

throwaway, but... Well, he did say it was his

to -do list. He did tell her that it was his

to -do list and, you know, Frank's gonna have...

I don't want to say it like this, but it's the

only way I can... think to say it is he basically

has Dr. Scratch he basically has doctor handwriting

to you know he does his own codes and does his

own thing you know people who aren't gonna really

recognize that he's you know and I love how how

it shows in this issue the paper and what the

codes are and then what he does you know to follow

that mean the story is just solid the art is

is amazing and It's just classic Frank everything

clicks into place at the end really well and

Yeah, I mean I was surprised by this in the end

like I say I read the first issue And at best,

I mean, I'd say it was okay. But really, yeah,

everything's kind of clicked into place with

that second one. It worked really well. I would

like to... Obviously, he's fairly busy, since

he's a full -time author on other things. I'd

like to... Wouldn't mind if Guggenheim ever got

the shot to write the character again, but unfortunately,

it's probably kind of unlikely at this point.

I mean, Frank's... And since the master is returning

next year... Yeah, I mean Frank's getting a ongoing

again and so I mean we'll see maybe they can

Bring him back. But yeah No, this was solid and

like I say it was written a couple years ago.

So it's been shelved for Some time so I don't

know how eager he would be to work with Marvel

again and wait to see how many years it takes

for stuff to be released but That final page

is absolutely amazing with him shooting the gun

at you and then the skull being in the background.

Yeah, being sort of like drawn in in blood in

the background. But no, overall, I really dug

this. I mean, I've dug most of the Punisher stuff

that I've read for this character month and this

is really cool because like I said, the whole

time I was reading both of these issues, I had

Jane's Punisher in my head. You know, the story

is great, the art is really great in certain

places, and how it's done, and how point of views

are shown. I don't know if the Punisher's a character,

because how in the past, Ryan, how have the ongoings

gone? Has it been like... Issue one is the introduction

issue two through four is the first three arc

story, you know kind of like chapter one How

have they gone in the past with the ongoing?

They rarely bother reintroducing him in a lot

of cases But I mean it all depends on the writer

and it depends on how they use them. I mean somebody

like Ennis wrote Frank as Almost a secondary

character in a lot of ways. He just kind of shows

up offs people that kind of thing Depending on

the issue. There are other arcs that focus solely

on him Aaron focused pretty much solely on the

Punisher Which was interesting because not a

lot of writers try that anymore And I mean you

read Rucka where yeah, he's all again. He's almost

sort of a secondary character but yeah, he's

he's almost a ghost or a legend yeah, although

later on it was kind of nice because he In the

later issues, he finally really talked and interacted

a lot with Rachel. That was the other thing.

Ruck actually gave him somebody to talk to. That

makes it easier for him to speak. The reason

why I ask about how the previous on -goings have

gone because the only thing that I can ... Equate

on goings to is you know stuff like Batman or

her well Batman specifically or superior spider

-man specifically both Scott Snyder and Dan Dan

slot have Dan slot specifically with spot a superior

spider -man has two or three issue arcs Yeah,

he'll have maybe one single issue in there for

me after reading all this Punisher material over

the last month. I really like it when it's just

Something like trial where it's part one part

two the end like you don't need to worry about

What's coming up next? six issue arcs are Sort

of have sort of become the norm for Frank Okay

Okay. Well, I like those kind of single story,

you know kind of things for myself As far as

the character goes uh... overall people if you're

fans of the punisher which hopefully people like

uh... international salmon you know matthews

and all you guys on publisher body counts uh...

facebook group or listening to this episode go

get this it's you know the first issue might

be a little slow in places but it's it's building

to what happens in the second issue it's it's

really solid and uh... who knows if we'll get

the uh... get to see it in trade form So yeah,

pick up the issues before they're gone. Yeah,

pretty much. All right. Well, it's been a pretty

short episode here for episode 49. We're going

to take a quick break, come back with final thoughts

and readings on trial, and then stay tuned until

the end because there's a special end clip at

the end of this podcast closing out Punisher

Month here in the Bull Bag. We'll be back after

this. This is 80s Action Sensation on Schwarzenegger.

And I'm here to tell you about the podcast I

produce called Punisher Body Count. It's the

net's best Punisher podcast, but don't take my

word for it. Listen to the hosts. Punisher Body

Count is a work in progress to listen to this

great show. You can find this on iTunes. Just

search PunisherBotDecount or come to our website

PunisherBotDecount .com All right, we are back

here inside the pull bag. All right, Ryan, Trial

of the Punisher, issue one. What are you going

to rank it? Well, the Punisher didn't have a

beard, so I can... Oh, wait. No, that wasn't

me that did that. No, I mean... You want individual

issues Reviewed because I mean on the whole I'd

give it a four Four stars out of five For both.

Yeah for both. It's really good. But just the

first issue just didn't grab me And the second

issue really kind of like made everything come

together Part of that is just how It was written.

I mean it was meant to do to be this way. So

I mean I sort of feel bad about Not really liking

that first episode or first episode yeah first

issue, but yeah, I mean I'm gonna do the same.

I'm just gonna rank it as an overall story and

I'm gonna give it a four as well. I wish it was

in trade I would actually probably Raise it up

a little better because I think it would read

better in that format. I mean hope like I said

earlier I mean, hopefully they find a way to

release it with something but maybe as sort of

an add -on to the first arc of you know, the

new ongoing whenever that is ready for trade

release You know Alright, well that's gonna do

it for us here in the pull bag and that's gonna

do it for Punisher Month episode 50 next time

around is the bat books 25 the zero -year tie

-ins yay For now I am TF2 and Mike with Ryan

the uneven flow Hey, we're listening. We will

catch you next time make you a great escape into

comics I leave this as a declaration of intent,

so no one will be confused. One. Sick Vis Pacum

Parabellum. Latin. The boot camp sergeant made

us recite it like a prayer. Sick Vis Pacum Parabellum.

If you want peace, prepare for war. Number two.

Frank Castle is dead. He died with his family.

Number three. In certain extreme situations,

the law is inadequate. In order to shame its

inadequacy, it is necessary to act outside the

law. To pursue natural justice. This is not vengeance.

Revenge is not a valid motive, it's an emotional

response. No, not vengeance. Punishment. You're

still here? It's over. Go home. Go. All right,

so Punisher Month here on the pull bag has come

to a close. Before we give final thoughts on

the overall coverage, Jake and Dane, why don't

you give us your impressions on Trial of the

Punisher since Ryan and I just closed out that

coverage. It was good. I liked it. I think it's...

There we go. Oh, sorry. I think that it's a good

wild ride. You know, it starts off mediocre.

It puts some seeds early on and then reaps them

really well at the end. I think the listeners

should definitely pick it up. I don't know if

they're going to make it its own trade, probably

not for only two issues, but maybe they could

throw it in some other Punisher trade. But I

think it's fantastic. I mean, what can I say?

And as far as final thoughts on the overall character

month, the first character month here in the

pull bag, I enjoyed most of what I read of The

Punisher. There are just certain things that

I... What do you mean most? You didn't give anything

a failing grade, except for the 2004 movie adaption.

Well, I think we can all agree the movie's better.

But I mean, like, okay, Welcome Back Frank is

something I could read a couple years down the

line. Something I could read every day. Yes,

we know. Canada's number two Punisher fan, we

know. Number two? That's foolish. Oh, sorry.

Who's number one, Wolverine? No. Come on. Come

on, Jake. No, it's kept to Canada. That's who's

number one. You know, I mean, I enjoyed it, but

like, I'm not going to go back and read a lot

of the stuff. It's not that I dislike the character.

It's just I've read it. I'm ready to move on.

Well, how many books do you actually reread ever?

Other than Nightwing. Actually, I haven't rewritten

any of the Nightwing stuff. That's because how

many really good Nightwing trades have been released?

Oh, yeah Shut up. I'm thinking of a very round

number Yeah, as in a circle. Oh, sorry. Yeah

Overall, I'm glad we did this I'm glad it was

Punisher as the first character is kind of this

experiment of character month because he's awesome

Yes in the future character months are gonna

be much shorter so we don't have to do two episodes

a week And I think it's kind of fitting that

we're gonna wait one year and do Punisher month

November 2014 again By then there will actually

be Punisher trades out since yeah, I Do know

what there should be because he's getting two

series in February Know it was a joke. Gee There's

nothing worse than a pedantic nerd. Am I right?

Man, that's painful. How do you put up with them

like week after week? He does know he gets so

literal. It's it's painful. It's like talking

to a wall But I couldn't do a show without him

he's awesome he's great It's been a pleasure

having the body counters on with us. I Don't

know. I mean, it's not really it's next year.

Well, I'm not sure what we're gonna do next year

I do know I would like to make Punisher kills

Marvel Universe at least one episode of next

year. That'll be an interesting debate If you

want one to just absolutely mock, why don't you

throw space Punisher in there? Oh Well, we can

talk about suggestions afterwards actually we

should have we should have him do nightmare at

some point I think that would work. Yeah, that

was on my mind too. Yeah We will talk about suggestions

off air Ryan any final thoughts on the old one.

There's another one. Oh anyway I had a good time.

I mean, I love The Punisher. It's weird. I think

out of this, at some point, there's going to

be some sort of a debate about what the future

of the character is. We've talked off air about

what I've heard and what I know, but I mean,

yeah, I love the character. I hope he sticks.

Well, I mean, he's going to stick around. I mean,

I mentioned it before that the merchandise guarantees

he'll be around forever, but I hope there's more

than that. But yeah, we'll see. And I will say,

because we're at the tail end of episode 49,

approaching 50 episodes here in the Pull Bag,

that in the future, as of January 2014, I'm going

to try to at least get one general topic discussion

episode out a month for Pull Bag, starting from

now on. I'm sure we can always come back to these

discussions as far as general stuff. Jake and

Dane, any final thoughts on the overall spotlight

on The Punisher? Was really glad to do this with

you guys and I had a ton of fun And it was really

great to get on the different perspectives from

you guys on the Punisher It was just a really

good time. I feel like we all learned something

Yeah, this was very horrible things Yeah, we're

all terrible people. I learned that keep the

pact We must never speak of what occurred on

these shows. We must never speak of what this

train wreck ensued. I really enjoyed doing the

Punisher Month for a lot of the reasons that

were just said, and I hope that some of the pull

-back listeners who maybe have passed over the

Punisher or maybe thought that that's not the

character for them, I hope they pick up one of

the trades we've talked about. You know, maybe

they like it, maybe they don't, but I hope we

haven't ruined the character forever. I don't

think we could. And if you find you like the

Punisher, maybe you should tune in to Punisher

Bonnie Count. And if that's not your cup of tea,

try out Dan and Jake at Classy showing up on

a monthly to bimonthly basis. Whenever you guys

watch movies. Yeah. Or no, it's whenever we read

weird, random stuff. Also true. Yeah. Yeah. Like

comics that are. Comics that are too intelligent

for you. Do you mean me specifically or the audience?

Wait a second. Wow. That's taking my whole insulting

Canada thing to a whole new level. Too indie

for you. Alright, we will catch you next time.

Make your great escape into comics. Too indie,

hipster punisher issues. Oh, I like the Punisher.

You probably haven't heard of him. No, I haven't.

He hasn't had his own series in two years. Who

is he? Ouch. Ouch. Well, that wasn't seven minutes

of hell. You just heard the latest episode of

The Pullback, GCRN's comic book review podcast.

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