Star Trek Picard – The Road So Far

Hello and welcome to you future imperfect. I'm

your host Captain Phillips and joining me is

I'm also a captain aren't I or lieutenant commander?

I don't know what I am your commander. I promoted

you From a place that I no longer pay membership

dues because I kind of forgotten they never sent

me an email Good job on notifications. Anyway,

I'm Mike the bird man dog glad to be a part of

it Now throw them under the bus in any way shape

or form. And what am I? What's my rank? I think

I promoted everybody to like either lieutenant

commander or commander just because I wanted

to like anarchy in the system. Okay well I'm

doing a mutiny and I'm declaring myself field

marshal. Field marshal Alex. Murder of pigeons.

What else? I had a whole bunch of stuff to my

name. Well it's funny because I have... Oh, we

have six members one more person dropped off

the face of the earth We should all be captains

of we're all on one ship and it's just it's like

why are we all? Well, it's like Scotty was a

captain Spock was a captain Kirk was the captain

and they were all on the Enterprise a Everybody

else was a commander But yeah, it's it's funny

because I mentioned to them I'm like you should

probably You know, send notifications when they're

about to expire or and they're like, well, that's

the chapter's job. And I says, yeah, except you

don't let us actually contact the people because

we can't see their emails in the back end. Well,

they don't forget they are old people that expect

that we are meeting up like weekly or monthly

in person. Oh, it's funny. Yeah, it's a correspondence

like it's not supposed to meet up in person,

but they. Yeah, so they they say you I don't

know if oh, yeah I told you guys in the direct

message They they were thrown a fit because they

got a new commander of Starfleet and they changed

a bunch of things and they're still waiting on

their database transfer over and The Academy

just kind of major overhaul. They're still working

on Making things so that they're easier to answer

and you're not playing like oh Let's answer 50

essay questions with things that ultimately don't

matter Where somebody's gonna get you on semantics

and be like, oh you don't get a perfect grade

because you didn't have the exact answer So they're

gonna be like true false and like multiple guests

and everything like that. So it'll be you know

easier to find fun I see an essay for one of

them and I'm like, nope. I'm like skip. I'm not

gonna do it and If you want if you're getting

promoted to Admiral it's like a doctorate right

like you should have a dissertation or some like

you it shouldn't even be like even right or wrong

answers it should be like like a real school

where you just have to make your case and if

the rest of the panel thinks yeah that's right

then you graduate yeah well they the thing is

is there so many classes in there though you'd

have to take almost everything to be but the

only way you get promoted is if you take some

kind of a leadership role like beyond the captain

Like that's the first time I joined was like

20 when was it Mike that it was the sponsor?

No, like 2012 13th somewhere in there did they

actually pay you They gave me free membership.

Okay, five dollars. Yep. So five bucks. I'm like,

all right sure Yeah, well did they mail you the

package? Yeah, yeah, I actually had the full

package They switched everything to PDFs now

so they don't send you nothing I joined when

I think I paid like five or ten bucks to get

the mail package version and I still have it

somewhere. They have like the original when I

joined Was I on? Had field or something. Yep,

and that's what I'm still a part of and we was

on there and I was like, okay So what do we do

and they're like? Well, we don't really do much

and I was like this was like almost ten years

ago I'm like what and I remember going to some

of the lessons I did some of them way back on

my old account like I had a different email even

back then So that's why I like like I guess unless

they wiped out the old profiles when I went to

sign up it would it said I didn't have a profile

already but When I was going through the stuff

like it was already outdated then because the

movies had already started up and Changed. Oh,

yeah. I remember people asking how did the new

movies go into it and the official response back?

Then was those movies aren't canon It's like

they kind of are and everything moving forward

is And their response was, it's not real track.

I'm like, oh, you're those people. It's funny

because they don't have anything discovery on

there either. They don't not yet. They don't

have anything for for the short tracks. They

don't have discovery. They don't have I imagine

they'll have the card because they're all like,

they're all over his shit. They'll be on the

card. No, but they're still going to be mad about

something, but. Yeah, but they yeah new thing

that they were touting was they had integrated

the archer stuff and I'm like wait that show

Ended like six years ago and you just put stuff

in Yeah, they're a little slow behind the times

they're finally closing down their Yahoo and

Yahoo groups and everything and The Google groups

and all those those groups that nobody uses because

everybody's on Facebook and then it's funny because

They're they're they finally get like a region

website for for region 13 And it's like super

lame It's a one -pager so there's like not much

there Which honestly doesn't matter is parlay

into the real like the meat of this we're gonna

talk about the show Are we living in the current

Picard world where Starfleet is failing rebellion

Starfleet is failing and when and we're like

Well, this isn't the Starfleet. I remember Starfleet

isn't Starfleet anymore. Oh, my God. That's basically

what we're getting at. We are living in it. Yes,

we're living in the Picard unit. We're living

in the prime universe in Picard's timeline. So,

yes, if you guys hadn't gathered by now, we are

going to be talking about the brand new series,

which is airing on CBS All Access, though, CTV,

sci fi in Canada and Amazon Prime in Canada.

and Amazon Prime and Canada. We're talking about

obviously Picard, which is as of this recording

aired three to four episodes. We're recording

before the fourth one has aired. So don't know

what's happened, but obviously there will be

spoilers abound. So deal with it. You've had

weeks and opinions will be unbiased. And well,

I guess let's kind of start the discussion off.

Where do we go from here? So maybe we should

start at the first episode. Or do we start at

the short track? The short track? Yeah, that

would make sense. Let's start because that's

sort of, you know, that bridges the gap, right?

It kind of takes place at that timeline of like

14 years before he is retired. I hadn't seen

that short track. OK, so you want me to sort

of recap because I actually watched it yesterday.

Yes. It is my favorite of the short tracks, by

the way, all of them. And it is, it looks, it

starts out like an anti -bullying PSA. A girl

is late for school because one other girl sort

of trips her and beats her up and she misses

the bus or the space bus or whatever. The space

shuttle, school shuttle, whatever. She gets to

school and then they start doing, you know, tit

for tat, hitting each other back and forth and

getting in trouble. They end up having a huge

fight. All the while, the Peter Gabriel song

Heroes is playing. And then as they're fighting

and rolling around, everything gets really quiet

and they hear sort of like, you know, what's

going on. They look up and they see both of these

girls, their parents worked on Mars. And they

look up and they see Mars is burning and exploding

on fire and all the teachers have no idea what

to do. And then it cuts as they're standing together

crying. Oh, geez, that's intense. It is, but

there's also very little talking. So it's all

played with emotion and with the scenery and

the music yeah the only lines of dialogue i believe

in it are from the teachers when they get in

trouble yep and and then it cuts to the news

program uh and it shows in the news uh uh admiral

picard's reaction reacts to uh to mars disaster

and then it cuts away so yeah it's it's very

intense and then that Of course, you know, you

get into the first episode of Picard and, um,

it was kind of interesting how they, they decided

to launch it, having it on the enterprise D.

My guess is that's the draw people in to kind

of give them sense, a sense of familiarity before

they launch into proper stuff. Yes. You remember.

You remember how all good things ended? Yeah,

he decided I should have done this a long time

ago, played cards with the crew. He finally comes

and plays cards. How does the show begin? He's

playing cards. So it's sort of a familiarity

thing. It's like, well, how it ended, it begins.

Exactly. It's like, it's like we jump forward

now 20 some odd years and this is where he is.

But then you're like data. And the first thought

that comes into your head or at least mine was,

oh, did before, uh, you know, actually assimilate

the the neural network and no well I knew they

weren't gonna bring data back as before because

in the trailer they even showed the disassembled

body of before so I figured it was gonna be a

dream sequence plus the fact that they're on

the Enterprise D in ten forward playing cards

and the ship was destroyed And he's wearing his

first contact uniform. I didn't think about that.

When I was seeing it because I was just mesmerized,

I didn't realize it wasn't the E. Yeah, it was

the Enterprise D because you see the D and then

it goes through the window and then you see him

sitting in 10 forward and then he's playing cards

with data as he remembered him before he died.

the whole thing where they're going back and

forth and bantering and it was a little rough

where data was trying to act like data, like

where Brent Spiner was trying to act like him

because he wasn't quite as like quirky as data

was normally. I think they wanted him to stay

still because they used that de -aging software

that they invented originally for X -Men 3. Remember

that? That's got to be almost 15 years ago now.

When they did that, To DH Patrick Stewart in

the flashback scene And then now it's basically

used in like every movie the most famously. I

think recently in the Irishman It was used to

DH De Niro, but it's gotten a lot better Yeah,

it's gotten a lot better, but you have to be

for a TV show budget. There can't be a whole

lot of movement So I'm assuming he had to keep

his head as still as possible Well, it wasn't

that it was that he didn't have the quick quirk

with the neck type stuff when he was thinking

Because that kind of quick movement costs a lot

of money to animate if they're gonna be superimposing

it on top of them The thing is is he didn't it

looks like they didn't even de -age him. He looked

aged. Oh Because they changed it. It was the

the original trailer He was de -aged on a couple

of the the footages, but they actually reversed

it and it just gave him to an extent his To an

extent but he's Well, yeah, cuz data was a lot

thinner when he blew up and he was even and he

was still thicker then than he was You know on

the show and not to say that he's fat by any

means But he was always a very very thin man

Like when he was like Brent Spiner when he was

a stand -up comedian and all that stuff super

thin. Yeah super duper thin So but later on in

the other dream sequence not to jump forward

I did notice that they did the aging software

better and he had better movement there So I

feel like that was a scene done later I would

not be surprised. I don't know the order, but

if this opening scene was literally the first

thing they shot, it probably was because they

probably had those uniforms on hand as well,

because that was the most recently used thing

on everything. But. The other thing that kind

of triggered it is when they were going all in

and everything, you know, just playing the cards

and then five red queens showed up on data's

cards and kind of broken from his dream sequence.

you know, knowing that something wasn't right

and then data disappears. And I was almost thinking

that those and this is kind of floating around,

too. But one of my friends at work was stoking

the fires on the message groups on CBS and in

Star Trek, the card groups, because I said, you

know, you could almost infer that that's like

insinuating Q may eventually show up. You think

that you want me to hit you with my conspiracy

theory? Sure. That it's not. It's not Q. That

it's five Borg queens. Oh, that makes sense too.

Not that there are five, but that there have

been five. Two of them are dead. Is this data,

spoiler, the data's daughter idea of these being

twins, is it not data's consciousness necessarily,

or is it data's consciousness mixed with the

Borg queen? Yeah, that could be because if judging

by almost by dates, you know They did technically

assimilate him in first contact. Well and the

idea that they're working on a Borg cube, you

know, it's revealed in the episode The idea,

you know Queen, you know multiple Queens is or

the idea that they're all the same suit You know,

there's clones involved there Their clones of

the same suits are so there's these two girls,

but are they're actually five Or are they connected

by some sort of hive mind because they're all

the same It all ties into little things and they're

the writers for this are not The kind of writers

that would just put something in for no reason

or it's like they could have put whatever we

could have been You know five Kings. Why did

it have to be Queens? So yeah, yeah, I feel like

red hive minds Yeah, or five, you know five connected

identical women Well, then they kind of call

one of one of them being the destroyer but yeah

So there's that and also, you know heap saying

that oh, she has a twin, right? Well, mm -hmm

when you know moving forward plot wise for I'm

assuming pretty much everybody listening this

has seen it, right? So there's no we don't describe

every detail but when they move forward to dashes

apartment the very first thing that the Assassin

say is Where are the rest of you? Not Where's

where's your sister? Where's the other? And that's

the only time that's mentioned And then these

the only later on they say oh they're made in

pairs But that's a very deliberate line. Where

are the rest of you? That is true. Yeah, I didn't

I didn't catch the the where are the rest of

you but I did think it was kind of interesting

how the now if you haven't read the prequel comics

You don't get a full picture of the two Tal Shiar

Romulan agents that are with Picard kind of as

his bodyguards and working on the farm Yeah,

like there that was the thing I didn't quite

get like I knew immediately Like I ended up watching

it once and then I watched the second run through

with my brother because he's like I'll watch

it on my own But you watch it with me because

he's not as big of a Trekkie as I am like, okay

And he really likes it and he goes the first

thing he says is are they Vulcans? I'm like No

immediately and he goes. Oh, yeah, cuz they're

they're showing too much emotion. They know how

to talk to people I'm like One knows how to talk

to people and also they can get angry and one

does not and they're kind of smarter Yes, that's

basically But in showing them like like they're

the first you make it makes it seem like oh,

they're basically his like Personal support workers

or like groundskeepers and then it turns out

no there is frickin bodyguards. Yeah, and they

Have you either of you read the comic? No, unfortunately.

No, okay. There was one. Yeah. So anyways Blanchard

was supplying me with that so I'll have to pass

that along but it basically jumps back to when

Picard and Raffy are trying to Take all of the

the Romulans and all of the other life off of

the planet like the other humanoid type creatures

Because the Romulans are like no, we don't want

you to save them and then so Essentially one

governor of one of the outpost decided. Oh, we're

gonna take over the USS Verity, which is Picard's

flagship, which is the Odyssey class starship.

That's the same as the Enterprise F and like

Star Trek online So he left the Enterprise to

go command the Verity. And they catch up with

LaForge, who's now commander of the Utopia Planitia

shipyards. And he's developing all of the starships

around Mars to excavate the Romulan people. And

so he's working with Picard on this. So he too

left the Enterprise. And it doesn't say anything

about where the ship is. They're not there anymore.

So anyways, Rafi and Picard are taken hostage.

And then these two Tal Shiar agents had gotten

the local life forms to basically break them

out of jail. And this governor had already taken

over part of the Verity. And then Picard's crew,

of course, subdued them. uh when picard managed

to get back there but the the two tal shiar agents

more or less um joined forces with him because

they could never go back to the tal shiar because

they kind of had um relations with each other

which is against the tal shiar code apparently

and so they they were they had nowhere to go

and picard's like uh so what do you know about

wine or you know about grapes or something and

so that's how it ends and Okay. So, so yeah,

they looked a little bit different, but then

when you get them in in this, it adds a lot more

depth to their personas. So I had to explain

this to a few people that hadn't read that prior

to watching. That's kind of cool. I like that.

You almost would have been nice if that was discussed

on like a talk show before the like, remember

they did was, you know what? That should have

been a short track that should have. Yeah. Like

it could, it could have. I don't know if it would

it would have dug into maybe some of their sales,

but they could have literally done a motion comic

to show it off. Like, yes, have it voiced, have

it voiced by those actors and show that as a

short track shortly before or literally even

make it part of the first episode if they wanted

to or like an extra feature or something. Yeah,

it would have been nice, but unfortunately they

didn't. And so what did you think about the the

new the doctor of cybernetics. Alison Pilt? Yeah.

Is she married to Scott Pilgrim? Yeah. Isn't

she married to Jay Baruchel or somebody? I don't

know. Oh, I know her from Scott Pilgrim. Oh,

and the movie Goon and Goon 2. Oh, I forgot she

was in that too. She's a little out of place.

Some of the actors seem not that they're like

the wrong. She seems the wrong age. She she looks

too young even though she's like 40 Like she

no she's not yeah, she is I'm pretty sure I'll

double check 34 is she yeah, okay, so she's not

Yeah, she looks young though. She looks like

she's still probably she looks 25. Yeah, that's

I would agree but She's a decent enough actress.

It's not a problem. It's just she seems a little

a little out of place like It's the kind of role

you would have figured they'd cast somebody in.

It's like 50. You know what I mean? Not old,

not young, but you're still the leader in your

field. Then I guess she was technically the second

foremost authority on it. Behind Bruce Maddox.

Yeah. When we eventually see who Bruce Maddox

is, I'm assuming he's going to be an older person.

Well, I would hope it'd be the same actor. If

he's still alive. Because you never know I Wonder

if he's done what dr. Dr. Soong did in that creating

an Android body and Transferring his consciousness

because there's a novel where dr. Soong does

that and he creates like a lifelike Persona of

himself and then data he transfers data his consciousness

into the body. How about instead of that? He

transfers consciousness, but he's what if he's

the the mother represented in dodges communications.

Like he's using a holographic subterfuge to kind

of hide his face. To hide his face, or that is

who he's chosen to look like as a digital entity.

He's the father in creating, but he's the mother

in nurturing. So he's basically playing both

sides, but that's why he also is like, go to

Picard, even though she never mentioned Picard.

Exactly. Go to Picard, he'll help you. The way

the mother reacted was a little too panicked

for an AI robot, or an AI program, or a fake

memory, or something like that, or an implanted

thing. The mother behaved like a scared parent

would behave. Makes sense As far as I'm not the

only thing I'm not a big fan of and again, it's

a bit of an epic It doesn't bother me too much

but the swearing in it it It seems out of place

now does the one thing to consider is they are

not on a Federation Commission ship Working as

basically a naval officer on duty, which is what

they always were On the original show and you

obviously you couldn't swear and in the movies

they could if they wanted to but they didn't

but Well, unless they were in the real world

like the voyage home um, but um, even then that

was you know miles wearing dropping f -bombs

in front of the card is odd but at the same time

I understand why because They're all none of

them work for for uh, you know, well the admiral

did it Yeah, the commander the cnc. Yeah was

also talking to somebody who's non -commissioned

anymore true uh so like i can understand i can

get both sides of that it's a little you know

odd but again things have to move forward it's

also trying to establish when he's saying that

this isn't starfleet anymore starfleet doesn't

stand for what it used to it's also not just

talking about starfleet in society itself so

they're they've moved passability in a lot of

cases. Well, there was an interview, one of the

people involved in the show. I don't remember

specifically who, but I remember the quote fairly

well. They said, you're never going to get rid

of swearing. It's basically a part of human language,

part of human culture. And it's just something

that's just not going to go away. The main reason

they couldn't do it back in the old days was

because of the FCC. So as they're doing it because

they can. It's the same reason Discovery did

it. Remember, they would say things like, damn

it, like it was a big deal. Damn it, man. Yeah.

Or or go to hell. But no, the sheer fucking hubris,

Picard. OK, it's just it's like, all right, that's

a little out of left field. All right, lady.

Some shows used to push the boundaries even at

that time. Like we're talking like 90 or 91.

You have Simpsons episodes where they're saying

whore. So. You know enough like I was what made

me think of it was I saw the clip of Homer making

his makeup gun And he fires it in Marge's face,

which you could not do on TV now And then he

fires it in her face and she looks in the mirror

and he goes Homer you have it set to whore And

then he and then he goes just one second Marge

and he shoots it she makes it miss it he hits

the wall and Then Lisa says dad women aren't

gonna like getting shot in the face and he goes

honey Women will like what daddy tells them to

like. And that was considered just a ridiculous,

you know, the over -the -top screwball comedy

then. They got away with that in 1991. It doesn't

surprise me. They used to push the boundaries.

Star Trek was all about being inclusive, so they

wanted to get the widest audience possible. They

wanted children to be able to watch it and ask

questions and learn from it. So I get where they're

coming from. This is a little different story.

Children aren't paying for this streaming service.

I've got some problems with this show, and I'm

just going to lay them out very, very, very quickly.

I know some people who work in the Star Trek

community on some various projects, and they

did point out some very interesting things to

me about this. The swearing does seem unnatural.

I'm willing to let that go. As we've just discussed,

it's a cultural thing, and because they can push

the envelope, why not? I noticed this with the

Daystrom Institute specifically, and I know this

was a production choice, so I'm not as willing

to let this one go. In the 24th century, that's

when this takes place, right? Am I right here?

Late, late, late 24th century. Yeah, I don't

think in the late, late 24th century they have

exposed HVAC, but that may be just me. Also,

when they're on Starships, do you remember how

in Star Trek you used to go And doors used to

make the whooshing sound. They don't do that

anymore. Again, that may be just a small oversight.

New ships, maybe they don't need to. Yeah, that's

true. Like I said, probably just a small oversight

or something they could explain away by saying

something like that. And it's just it's little

things here and there. There was something a

friend of mine pointed out to me. They're doing

a shot of planet Earth from orbit. And the light

map looks like it was taken today. And for comparison,

this person showed me a light map from season

two or three of The Expanse on Amazon Prime.

And he's like, Mike, what do you notice differently?

And he's like, look at all the development or

light around Lake Michigan. I'm like, oh, that's

different. And he's like, look at Florida. Half

of Florida is now underwater. And he's like,

oh. That's because of rising sea levels. And

he's like, you're telling me nothing has happened

on planet Earth in a couple of hundred years.

He's like, oh, that is interesting. That is kind

of lazy. I get it because television budget and

nobody probably thought of it. And it's just

it's little things. When the nitpickers get to

me, I start to notice it like I like Picard,

but I don't love it just yet. That being said.

Yeah. That being said, there are some elements

of the show that I think are fantastic. When

they reference what happened on Mars, that was

interesting as hell, explaining how they built

a fleet of androids to go help the Romulan evacuation.

That was cool. And then there was something about

this that kind of rubbed me the wrong way. The

Federation member planets threatened to pull

out of the Federation if they went to go rescue

the Romulans. And that doesn't seem very Starfleet

-ier Federation to me. What I'm guessing is,

is they're trying to make it tie into Discovery

going 900 years in the future and having only

six planets left in the Federation? It just seems

off. What I see in that is a couple things. One,

a lot of these Federation members joined the

Federation out of fear of the Romulan Empire

expansion. That is true. They these are people

that have been at war with them or the Romulans

had basically destroyed them or forced them to

join the Republic and They had joined to specifically

escape them so I can understand why especially

they said it was a lot of the newer Members didn't

want to be a part anymore So like this it was

never gonna rock. I mean it might have it might

have messed up Falcon a little bit but As far

as like it wasn't gonna destroy the Federation,

but there's a bit of that, but it's also trying

to show that maybe the Federation has grown beyond

its means. Well, yeah. Well, it's something to

be said because if you look at the Federation,

there's been the battle of of Sector 001, which

was the Borg, there was the Dominion War, and

the Federation moved from being a fleet of discovery

and science to a military organization. And even

some of the writing is very inconsistent with

that, because Starfleet is very different from

the Federation. Like, they're two different branches.

And it's just, it's weird lore inconsistencies,

as it's been explained to me. And when I think

upon that, they can say, yeah, the Federation,

they're not this type of asshole. Starfleet,

maybe, but not the Federation. It sounds like,

even though the Romulans are supposed to obviously

be Rome, like the old Roman Empire, but it sounds

like what's happened here is you've got a civil

organization, the United Federation of Planets,

that has grown beyond what it can manage. And

the branch of government that handled the defense

and diplomacy, which is basically the military

faction, has had to grow more militaristic to

fight threats as they grow, and now they're growing

apart. Yeah, that's a pretty good way to look

at it. The Federation has grown beyond what it

can handle on its own, and Starfleet is more

concerned with policing than peacekeeping. Makes

sense. Yeah, and the other thing is... There's

another inconsistency that I don't know if anybody's

noticed. They say that, you know, they have before

broken down in their tank there. And they say

that, yeah, his isotronic brain more or less

couldn't handle data as information and just

basically crashed and everything was lost of

data. That seems like a really easy cop out way

to kill them. Well, I wonder there's there's

two ways to look at this. One is it's a cop out

way of not resurrecting data, but it's also likely

which which is the cop out way or Maddox dumped

his memory somewhere else and told them that

it was a failure. That's maybe a possibility

that maybe data is living off the grid. I just

don't think the I just I don't think certain

show writers. are that grandiose in their thinking.

I think we're going to be surprised along the

way, but I don't think we're going to get a grand

payoff. Well, this is this is my my thought on

it. They're bringing back the holographic doctor

for season two tentatively, and they're bringing

back whoopee. The other the other thing is I'm

being that the holographic doctor knows the ways

of the holographic, you know, the those type

of the hologram people. I'm wondering if that's

gonna play into season two and that they could

possibly bring data back as an instead of an

Android as a hologram How great would it be if

you know, Brett spider doesn't want to be in

the Makeup and anything anymore if they basically

turned him into the computer for the ship Well

that would happen in the original comic for the

2009 movie where they they had the current timeline

and they had Jordy basic basically running the

enterprise and had data as the captain. But he

also integrated himself into the central computer

system of the enterprise. And so he could make

himself be a hologram and run the whole system,

but had his physical form like sitting in the

command chair. And while Picard was like an ambassador

to the Romulans, Vulcans, whatever, and Spock

was trying to save the planet. That would be

interesting, an interesting way of doing it,

or they could end up pulling from the memory

data where Noony and Soon returns. There's a

novel called Cold Equations, The Persistence

of Memory, which says that he survived his death

by transferring his mind into an Android body

far more human in appearance than data's. And

that they could have them without makeup and

not have to do the aging, just make them look

like Brent Spiner. Exactly. And so basically

I've dumped his memories from before into his

own body. Because it says that in this book,

more or less that, you know, because data's memories

are in before. He's unable, like Dr. Soong is

unable to complete the new body he had been attempting

to construct for data due to a Borg invasion

in the brain. So he transferred data. in all

of Soon's memories and a new ability to use contractions

into Soon's Android body so that data could look

human and basically operate human. What's happened

to Lore? That's what I'm wondering because they

have not touched on that. How messed up would

it be if he's behind all this? That's that was

my other thought is because before they're not

that clever Well before his time is destroyed

in a you know, basically tore apart in a box

LOL is the other one that data basically gave

to Starfleet to play around with So the daystrom

Institute and lore they did the same thing. So

I'm wondering, you know where the other two androids

are plus julia tainer His his mother that was

that looked human and in basically bled and had

all these other positronic ways of looking human,

which was the most advanced Android that Dr.

Soon had built. So there's definite possibilities

with all of these different aspects of the Soon

type robots. What if it's not Data's brain that

they've reconstructed in its lores? And that's

why they're saying that they're the destroyer.

It could be and it would make sense to because

the new androids all of a sudden Went against

their own kind, you know went against the the

Starfleet Crew that they were supposed to be

helping and I and you can see the the eyes flicker

It would make sense that that lore took them

over Like like basically he's high like because

their positonic brain should technically be very

similar that the idea is he's basically hidden

his own Synapses in like a Trojan virus That

activates we can see Laura doing that Pretend

to be data for long enough to basically screw

over all the organics Like I could definitely

see him doing that So that you know, that's again

the first episode they you know zoom out show

that it's a Borg cube reclamation site and This

that's the episode Mike that you said we weren't

super interested in right or is it the second

one? Yeah, the the first one was some interesting

setup for the world Had some good possibilities,

but I wasn't I wasn't in love with it number

two was a lot of setup Which is fine because

that's what it should be you should be doing

we should be doing a lot of world building Filling

in the blanks number threes were like, okay now

I kind of give a shit So took a few weeks, but

all right. I like the the Romulan fight in Picard's

house and where the tells she our agents were

basically like whooping on them and Picard was.

And then that Dr. Girardi took out the last one

and was like pleading, like, take me with you.

He's like, he's OK, right? Romulan was Romulan

disruptives don't have a stud setting. He's like,

oh. And Picard's like I like you you like tea

or Earl Grey yes I like that the there's the

new ship captain his holographic doctor is Him

him with a more Irish accent and then the other

one. He's got a holographic version of him. That's

the Navigator emergency navigating hologram Yeah,

and he's like, oh you should be happy Picard's

here because he he was the you know, the one

that talked to the queue He's the one that did

your hero. Yeah Yeah, and so like it was it was

really funny and he's like, oh shut off and But

I think and I wonder what Raffy's Other side

is cuz like, you know, she's playing him in some

degree So I'm wondering if she's doing it to

get reinstated or if she's got an ulterior motive

against Starfleet and the Romulans Because she

said she's she's going with them to for a trip

and then she's getting off. Yeah, I'm getting

I get the feeling That she wants I don't think

she wants to hurt Picard as much as you know,

she pretends that she does I think she's trying

she wants to probably Find what's his name as

well? Maddox Maddox. She probably wants to kill

him Like I think she's she's there to basically

she's a mole some kind She's like I'm going to

kill all you know all anybody that Screwed me

over and I feel that he slighted me by destroying

my career by you know, whatever reason Yeah,

there's gonna be something like that involved

Yeah, and it looks like after the banning of

Synthetix in 2385, which is 14 years before Picard

starts, because it's 2399, that Maddox went missing.

And it's funny too, the head of Starfleet security,

the Commodore, she's actually a Romulan agent

because the people were like, oh, it's a Vulcan.

They have double eyelids. Why is she wearing

sunglasses? And then the showrunner goes on on

Instagram, Michael Chabon, and he goes, or Chabon

or whatever, he goes, maybe it's not a Vulcan

then. Or maybe they just thought it looked cool.

Yeah. Well, they showed, you know, the whole

thing with other people. So it's I'm guessing

it's a Romulan. It makes sense. Yeah, there's

what it's it's not very transparent. I mean,

it's very transparent in that way. But I think

some some areas it's very like Easy I almost

feel like the show is a more realistic extension

of the episode Episode 25 of season 1 conspiracy

instead of it being Parasites taking over it's

Romulans. They've been not and I'll bet you it's

not just Romulans I'll bet you that there have

been different agents from different because

they've expanded so big it's been easier to slip

people in yeah, like I would not be surprised

if if it you know, he ends up exposing the Romulans

there and they find out there's more agents from

something else. Well, they said that Jean Vash

or whatever, which is like the secret secret.

I mean, I'm like, who who knows how many strategic

moves have been made by multiple parties? The

changelings. I one thing I do like about this,

how they've explained the Romulans have this

fear. of artificial intelligence. They openly

say the Romulans only use their computers to

do basic math and navigation. They have a fear

of AI. They don't allow their computers to extrapolate

on information. They have to manually program

every calculation they wanted to perform. Which

me you know what something I said this to Alex

before Star Trek Picard has more in common with

Mass Effect Than it does with Star Trek. I can

get that and I kind of like that also Yeah, very

much like Battlestar Galactica the the 2000 series.

Yeah, and that's not a bad thing It's just different

because you remember the Galactica only survived

because they refused to upgrade it to a networked

You know ship it survived because things were

it was analog Yeah, exactly like the the the

Battlestar Galactica literally was one of the

last analog battle stars It wasn't hooked into

the computers and that's why all the Vipers that

fought against the side Cylons were all old models

that were mothballed because they weren't networked.

They literally had radios. That's how they communicated

like old radio. Which I always thought was something

really cool that the 2000 series did really really

really smartly. Yeah I almost feel like that's

sort of that fear of artificial life is very

similar to what they're showing what the Romulans

have. Yeah, it's almost like how the the quarians

are afraid of the geth in Mass Effect. Like they

created artificial intelligence so great it overtook

them. And I have a feeling there'll be something

in Romulan history created something so great.

They had to destroy it for fear that it come

back. Is it going to be revealed that they invented

the Borg? No, I don't think it'll go that far.

No, because they said they've been around for

thousands and thousands of years. Yeah. Although

I could see them maybe touching on maybe something

else from weird Star Trek lore, but I don't think

feature or something. I wonder if they'll make

reference to something like that, but I can't

see them touching on anything super, super deep

because part of the problem I have with this

show is because it wants to find a new audience

while still attracting people like us is it has

to be accessible enough that Joe Blow can get

into it, but it has to appeal enough to us nerds.

I mean, hell, listen to us right now. We're explaining

we're talking about this on a podcast. So clearly

it's worked. But on one level, I think I don't

think it's going to get as deep as we're thinking.

I mean, okay, wait, wait, wait. It's not like

it's not like Doctor Who. Doctor Who has been

consistently on the air for a long time. Star

Trek. People had fought for Picard to come back

for years, right? Like usually what like a decade

or more people wanted another movie after Nemesis

to sort of finish the series and then it didn't

happen. Yes. Exactly. So it took a long time

convincing him to get Patrick Stewart back on

board, pretty much when they backed up the truck

full of money to his house. And he couldn't for

a while. He was locked into that Fox contract

for all the X -Men movies for quite some time.

And it wasn't like he would do big budget X -Men

movie, then two or three small pictures, big

budget. And he was always scheduled for something.

Now he's big. Other than this and at some appearances,

he is slowing down. He's turning 80 this year.

Yeah. You know what I mean? There's only so many

more. You're not going to get 10 years out of

this program with him. We might get five or six

if it goes really well. And especially if instead

of 10 episode seasons, if they shoot 30 episodes

straight and then split it into three seasons,

we can maybe get several years out of him. But

there is going to be a point where he could literally

be next year. He could be like, I'm getting too

tired. I can't do it anymore. He has said he

wants to keep doing this as long as he can he

sees this is He said it's they'll keep renewing

it. This is where he'd like to retire So good

for him, especially if they can tell can you

know good stories throughout but they were spiners

71 Well, they're all getting there. I think Jonathan

Frakes is like what 68 something like that. Well

and Shatner's 89 He's that dude's gonna be 105

though He will never die that don't crack and

and he he somehow has the he's he's gonna be

like 90 and he has the energy of somebody who's

60 I know well, he said he said he wants he he

got approval to shoot a show and in space once

he's gonna take one of this first space flights

like Trips and then and then he's like and then

if I die up there, it doesn't matter They should

find a way to get him in into some sort of trek

whether it be in a hologram Whether it be in

one of the dream sequences that Picard has Like

have him, you know have a dream sequence where

he's sitting at a table and it's and it's the

cabin from generations or and then and then he's

like, you know and reiterating his line of don't

let them take don't let them promote you don't

let them take you off the bridge of the ship

because when you're there you can make a difference

Yeah, and or you know how you work that in season

two you bring in Guinan You have some sort of

he sees dying and talks to guy and above and

then he either has a flashback or somehow The

Nexus is involved because technically he never

left the Nexus You can leave the Nexus, but you're

still there. Yeah, right at some point in time

So well, what's funny is you have to almost die

in the regular world to be able to come out of

the Nexus Yeah, I guess yeah weird but I but

the other thing that's really weird about the

show is an episode to you like he his doctor

is from the Stargazer And, and he's, they've

alluded to, he has this degenerative disease

in his brain, but, um, they haven't named dropped

it yet. But it's not the same disease from all

good things. Isn't that something they didn't

say? They didn't say, but it, it has the way

they're making it sound is it sounds very similar.

That's what I think it's good. Timeline wise

in all good things, doesn't it? Was the flash

forward 20 years or 30? No, it was 20. Yeah.

So it's about right. It's about the right time.

Different events have happened and and the thing

was his crusher said that he had Traces of it

and he says well the future is a very long time

You know, I think I have a feeling you'll see

me for a very long time It's what he said like

after he was checked. So essentially it's alluding

to the fact that he did get it Yeah, so fine

cool Which means that he's degenerating faster

to the point where he's going to expire on the

show at some point. They'll probably kill him

off. Or they'll hold that. If the show keeps

getting successful, they'll hold that till he

decides he can't work anymore or gets sick for

real. And they'll work him out. And that's how

they'll end the show. But without getting gloomy,

what I wanted to say a little earlier is about

the Romulan fear of AI. I wouldn't put it past

them. to change the lore slightly or add to it.

What if the great divide between both races of

the Romulans and Vulcans is due to AI that they

created together? I think that would be okay

to me. Think about it like this. The Vulcans

were the geniuses that designed the matrix of

the brain, the logic board, the logic of the

AI. And the Romulans gave it the emotions and

the algorithms, and it tried to basically kill

both of them. And that's what they split. The

Romulans hated the Vulcans, vowed to never use

AI ever again. The Vulcans purged it from their

history and devote their life entirely to logic

because look what happened when we let emotions

take over. That would make sense. And then you

then we go like a couple thousand years and enough

time has passed that the average Romulan average

Vulcan don't even know the story. That would

make a lot of sense, actually. I mean, I guess

because I kind of want to wrap this up. I have

hope. to the series. Now that things are finally

get going, we're finally going in the space.

We all heard the line. He's going to say it.

He's going to say it. Engage. And he smirks.

And then the Dr. Girardi smirked. No, there's

no made it. There's no make it so yet, though.

Give it time. He'll say it. He'll say it when

he meets Ryker. So there has to be a Q episode.

It's that make it so number one. They haven't

released the numbers for the show. and it's going

to be interesting how they calculate it. I imagine

they're going to spin it however they want to

spin it into something very positive. It's probably

the most watched thing CBS All Access has. Oh,

yeah, definitely. They said it is the number

one show. Don't be surprised if because I believe

is it Netflix in Europe and the rest of the world?

I think so. I think so because that's how Amazon

Prime said that in Canada. said that it's one

of their most watched things, and it's not even

a show they made, but they have exclusive rights

to it. And it's probably on the old Space Channel,

CTV, Sci -Fi. It's also on Crave. It's probably

the most watched thing. Like, that's funny how

you can watch it on Crave, Amazon Prime, and

Canton. We have two different streaming platforms

for it, as well as Terrestrial Cable. So it's

probably like the most watched show right now

up here, overall. If you look at the production,

if you were a little on edge about the direction

and stuff, because I wasn't a big fan of the

crazy amnesiac who happens to be a ninja, like

born identity type thing that was going on in

the first couple episodes. But I feel if there's

any changes that are going to happen to the show,

it'll happen in these next two. These next two

are directed by Jonathan Frakes. Well, and he's

building his crew too. Yeah, he's building screw.

Jonathan Frakes is directing it. You know, he

directed it was a couple episodes of the TV show,

two of the movies he acted with Picard in 170

was 178 or 176, 177, I think something like that.

Episodes together. You know, they've known each

other for years. And plus all the movies they

did together that he didn't direct even if anybody

is going to make the show feel like Trek directing,

it'll be Frank's, it'll be Frank's or one of

the original next -gen people that might come

on board. But I don't think anybody would have

the uh the like camaraderie with like Patrick

Stewart if anybody's going to bring out the most

Picard you can get out of Picard it'll be him

yeah hard agree hard agree on that one I mean

it's set up some interesting things with this

with this Romulan mystery that's going on with

the Romulan super secret police with the Borg

reclamation project which I've got to say fantastic

special effects. They're good practical. Oh,

yeah, definitely. So you want to win my heart?

My final thing. So I have I don't care if it's,

you know, what episode it comes out, if maybe

it's the episode finale of the season. have them

be in danger have there be a space dogfight slash

fight where there's no way they can win and then

i want fucking captain wharf to come in in the

defiant for some reason he's defected they have

a defiant or something and he comes in and then

it ends with like them being beamed aboard or

you have or you have captain jordy laforge on

the uh uss challenger yeah you know what i want

i want someone to die someone named important

to die show me show me that the stakes are high

enough in this show that that they give a shit

yeah honestly kill someone like Wesley give you

give me something important you know what you

know what if you really want people to like fans

to get in on it what you have is you have two

people okay this will piss you off mike though

you have two people within starfleet that contact

the card and they're like we know something's

happening something's wrong within starfleet

similar to a conspiracy and have both of them

die and have it be Barclay because have him not

believe him at first because you know he's had

his his issues with mental health yeah and then

have Picard uh find out they're like they're

they're broadcasting something on on you know

the star fleets and blah blah blah on television

or whatever it is he turns it on and it shows

uh uh accident on way to so -and -so thing uh

admiral jane way lost and have that be the other

person that was going to contact them. See, yeah,

I'd be okay. I mean, honestly, if you want this

show to get taken seriously, if you want to hook

people for season two, it's not just enough to

get the holographic dollars, not just enough

to bring back guidance. No, you show the show

has balls, has grit to exist in the 2020 television

landscape. You take a chance. You want people

to stay subscribed to CBS All Access. You have

to prove that this is event program. Here's your

season finale. If I was writing here's not Barclay.

Janeway contacts him, says, something's wrong.

We know who it is. There's something in Starfleet

that's happening. Something in Starfleet. He

sends information on that they believe. He figures

out who the security officer is, an agent. The

mole. And he's like, I have to talk to somebody

I trust. Admiral Janeway responds on a secret

channel and says, I'm coming to you. Don't put

it at the very end of the episode. Put it halfway

through so you're not going to expect it to be

the finale. Janeway starts. up on a shuttle towards

him, they're basically going to beam her on,

and the ship explodes right in front of them.

Yeah, just kills her. Yeah. Honestly, do that.

I'm willing to sacrifice Janeway if it means

the show will have balls and have teeth. And

we're not talking she comes back miraculously.

She's in the pattern buffer or something. No,

she's gone. Like she's on screen. She's on screen

with them talking, saying, all right, give me

docking coordinates, and boom! And she's gone

on camera. Yep. Do it. And I'm not saying that

to be clearly basically the only Admiral that

would be there had his back is now gone and Starfleet

is Starfleet is poisoned and he's like, what

do we do? And that's how you end the pretty much

Yeah, that makes sense So I guess Steve, what

are your final thoughts on this? I really enjoy

what I've been seeing so far in how it's been

building I've been enjoying the the way that

it's been kind of fleshing itself out. I am looking

forward to more familiarity with it But that's

going to come with the episodes and with time

and the more they they start Kind of ingraining

some of the the old cast back in with like seven

and Hugh Moore and Ryker and Troy and I'm assuming

there'll be another data Show -up point. It's

some it's some moment in the season. So But yeah,

I enjoy it overall so far, but I still have a

few things that I'm curious about as it progresses.

You guys? Yeah, I mean, ultimately, you've got

my attention. Now hold it. You have seven more

episodes as of this recording. Don't play with

my emotions. Don't waste my time. Or if they're

going to play with your emotions, play with the

right emotions and stick with it. Make it worth

my while to stay subscribed. I will speak with

my wallet. Yeah, and as far as I'm concerned,

to me, it's the best trick. I'm the guy that

liked Nemesis, but I will admit that I did too.

It was not. It was better than insurrection.

I didn't say much. I liked aspects of Enterprise,

certain episodes here and there. It got good

in the fourth season. But then I like the first

Abrams movie. Despise the second won't watch

the third because it looks stupid. There is actually

really good compared to the second. The opening

is the stupidest CG bad. Oh, OK. I agree with

you. Yeah. Here's the thing. I own it in 4K.

And I can't bring myself to put it in my player

Had to have them like I have to have the best

quality copy of Star Trek so yeah anyway Discovery

hated the first season, but would watch it not

hated I was mad at how they treated the lore

second season Not so bad About the same quality

as as the later seasons of Enterprise after they

fixed some of the issues It's at least as good

as the Abrams movies You know what I mean? Like,

this is by far, in my personal mind, the best

trek since first contact. Yeah, I would agree.

I agree. I'm not saying it's better than, I'm

not saying it's better or equivalent to, it's

the best since. It's more watchable, I think.

Yeah. So we will definitely come back to talk

more Picard as the season rolls on, probably

closer to the penultimate episode where we will

see where things are definitely leading to. So

definitely check back in with us in a few weeks

to talk more Picard. Maybe how about we do like

three shows beginning? This is the first three,

then we do the next three and then we do the

final four. I like that. That way we can sort

of cover it all. Works for me. That would work.

And then, of course, they've been pulling some

interesting things in Star Trek Online where

they're incorporating Seven and various other

fun aspects. Has Picard decanonized Star Trek

Online? Yes. That's what I figured. Only only

incrementally in ways Because data exists and

start in Star Trek online, although they never

show him. There's a scene where he's where Sela

is arrested and He's you can clearly tell it's

him walking because he goes in and shows the

hologram of Natasha Yar to her and because she's

like tell me about my mother and So he's he sits

down with her in an interrogation room more or

less and That's that's the gist of what you get

about data being alive But like they don't actually

like come out of their way of saying it and Picard's

never shown up in the game or Riker or Any of

the main line super cool? They've had war if

they've had legit. They've had Laforge. They've

had you know data quasi show up Troy Riker Picard

and Crusher have never shown up So that still

leaves the possibility not knowing what's going

on there. But yeah, the Romulus thing still happened.

It doesn't say anything about the synthetic band

or anything like that in Star Trek online, but

I'm sure they'll add it. There was nothing there

about it. So this this time period that they're

exploring, other than the brain war happening,

you know, somewhere around that time period,

nothing has really happened. So and then their

their relations with the Klingon Empire destabilizes

during this time and so like in 2399 They're

no longer friendly with the Klingon Empire. So

until and until 2410 Imagine I was just thinking

because all this the show has me thinking so

many different ideas that could be done. That

would be cool What if again, you can't trust

anybody in Starfleet, so he has to use back channels

So, for instance, like how does he acquire transport

through a certain area? Well, he has to talk

to Quark for somebody that's a Ferengi. That

would be cool. And it's like, well, you know,

what if basically DS9 characters start showing

up, you know, from, you know, what if he has

to deal with Cardassians to get through somewhere

because they can smuggle them through? If they

brought back Garrick, I'd be pretty happy. I

would love Garrick to be in there. We can't have

Odo, unfortunately. But and then you want you

want to do something something interesting Have

the only person that he can go do for help is

he has to contact Ben Cisco Somebody who hates

him With his with his finding a crew of people

that hate him. Well, you know, I'll just say

this before we finish out the show. I just reviewed

the Gamma Quadrant book for Star Trek Adventures

from Modiphius. They actually mentioned Cisco

and that book, those books are considered canon

by CBS, though obviously they can decanonize

them at any time they wish. But according to

the books, Cisco is technically not dead because

according to Kira, he will see him again. So

his status is still unknown as of the end of

the Dominion War. What I was thinking was, how

does he transport through places? Well, he goes

through Worf, and Worf uses his DS9 connections

to get him places. Yeah. So we'll have to wait

and see. Yes. So anyway, Steve, take us out.

So until next time, live long and prosper.